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Wargroove |OT| Advance Wargs
- Thread starter hersheyfan
- Start date
And we're off! Immediately, I'm thinking of how to balance 2v2 - should team 1 go first, or alternate players? If both 1 go first, then only team 2 needs the "bonus" due to FTA? If alternating, then idk. Balancing 4 players is AN unknown to me as well because 3rd and 4th are clearly more disadvantaged.
Or, I can just not sweat it.
Or, I can just not sweat it.
I'm mostly finished with the campaign. I just need a few more stars to unlock to the last stage. I didn't really like the campaigns in the Advance Wars games, but the campaign in this was pretty fun.
Unfortunately Arcade mode is wack, mainly because the enemy AI is just not good when playing against you on an even playing field:
-AI doesn't know how to reinforce (so when their commander is low on health, they just kinda run away then sit there.)
-AI doesn't prioritize building capture nearly as much as they should (there was a grey tower literally 5-6 spaces away from their barracks that they never took and let me take it uncontested ~10 turns in)
-AI over-prioritizes sending their entire army to the general area of your commander
-AI seems allergic to Trebuchets, only ever building Ballistae instead (not sure why this is tbh...) Nvm.
-I don't think they know how to use transport units (one map both teams start with a wagon, but they never used it for anything other than a meat shield)
The biggest problem is that the AI straight up does not see buildings unless they can reach them that turn, so their map control game is plain awful.
Unfortunately hard mode does not make the AI smarter, it just gives them 200 income per building, which you can still quickly overtake because they don't go for buildings.
Unfortunately Arcade mode is wack, mainly because the enemy AI is just not good when playing against you on an even playing field:
-AI doesn't know how to reinforce (so when their commander is low on health, they just kinda run away then sit there.)
-AI doesn't prioritize building capture nearly as much as they should (there was a grey tower literally 5-6 spaces away from their barracks that they never took and let me take it uncontested ~10 turns in)
-AI over-prioritizes sending their entire army to the general area of your commander
-I don't think they know how to use transport units (one map both teams start with a wagon, but they never used it for anything other than a meat shield)
The biggest problem is that the AI straight up does not see buildings unless they can reach them that turn, so their map control game is plain awful.
Unfortunately hard mode does not make the AI smarter, it just gives them 200 income per building, which you can still quickly overtake because they don't go for buildings.
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Was today Sigrid day?
90% of my battles today was against a Sigrid lol.
Her groove is devastating, the full heal is more devaatating than her killing an unit actually, I'm inclined to say it's kinda imbalanced.
Thankfully her groove meter fills so slowly that she doesn't have many opportunities to use it.
My main's groove (Ragna) suffers this same problem and I don't consider it nearly as good as Sigrid's
90% of my battles today was against a Sigrid lol.
Her groove is devastating, the full heal is more devaatating than her killing an unit actually, I'm inclined to say it's kinda imbalanced.
Thankfully her groove meter fills so slowly that she doesn't have many opportunities to use it.
My main's groove (Ragna) suffers this same problem and I don't consider it nearly as good as Sigrid's
When I hit "save and exit" after finishing a mission, it sometimes puts me back at the last turn of that mission when I try to enter the game again. Any way around this for the moment?
Jesus that 4th Caesar sidemission with the naval combat is torture. Didn't have problems with any of the other missions until now, but I already lost 3 times on this one without getting anywhere.
Wow. Started trying to mess with triggers to make slightly different maps. Anyone Want to test a scenario out I made? It's supposed to be a skirmish, but in order to add triggers I had to make it a scenario. Hopefully it works as intended. Main gimmick is taking properties nets you a small militia to act immediately. All are visible (so you know what you access) except for the middle tower. For each commander that takes control they get a single dragon spawn - and can't buy anymore after that, so you gotta protect it.
Still tuning it a bit. P2 starts with an additional building for income. Still undecided.
I can't wait to start making more scenarios and creating a campaign with branching paths and different endings. The tools here seem really fucking good. I glanced at the cutscene editor but had to quit immediately. So much Chroma Squad vibes, which I spent dozens of hours making episodes in that game with similar tools.
Still tuning it a bit. P2 starts with an additional building for income. Still undecided.
I can't wait to start making more scenarios and creating a campaign with branching paths and different endings. The tools here seem really fucking good. I glanced at the cutscene editor but had to quit immediately. So much Chroma Squad vibes, which I spent dozens of hours making episodes in that game with similar tools.
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There's actually pretty easy way to beat that mission.
Open with turtles (needed to sink initial warships), then put all your resources on naval units with slight more focus on harpoon ships to control sea and air. After that, you can mostly spam warships to wreck havoc on entire bandit island without even having to set a foot on it. I S-ranked that mission without building single air or ground unit.
Oh god. If you get the Lillipad stage in Arcade hard mode get ready to struggle. So many dragons...
Well into Act 5 with full S ranks so far. Eager to finally try out the sea units.
Tried out puzzle mode. I don't want any hints, just a yes/no, but it seems like the villager only has 3 move and the wagon is 4 spaces away. Am I missing something?
Edit: Oh duh, you can wagon from a space away, right? It's getting late...
Tried out puzzle mode. I don't want any hints, just a yes/no, but it seems like the villager only has 3 move and the wagon is 4 spaces away. Am I missing something?
Edit: Oh duh, you can wagon from a space away, right? It's getting late...
I'd kill for an undo button. It's my fault that I miscalculated which spot my unit would be safe on landing, but goddamn does it feel frustrating to have your game completely ruined because of one single move. And this game has many terrains that slow your or enemy's movement, coupled with the fact that enemy range are stopped by your unit, you really, really need to be sure to calculate the enemy's full range before making any steps. I have no idea how I can put up with that in Fire Emblem, but in Wargroove, I immediately felt like an undo button for your movement will be such a QoL. Make the option locked in fog of war chapters and online modes for balanced reasons.
Do they ever let you build your own giants in the campaign? I just got past the one against Koji where you can claim two giants, but still can't build them.
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I was able to in Act 5. Didn't notice if I could before that.
Wow I feel like an idiot. I just beat main mission 3-3. I thought I was going to lose; at the end, I was left with just Nuru and Mercia alive. It was my fourth of fifth try on the stage with incremental progress made each attempt. However, no matter what I did, I felt it was impossible to get control of the middle of the map with air control units, even when I felt I was playing really well.
Near the end of the battle, I was scrolling around the map frustrated, fully expecting that I was most likely about to barely lose just a handful of tiles from the dropoff point for Mercia. Then I accidentally clicked on something. Turns out that one of the bases that you take over with Nuru on the middle/bottom right side of the map could ALSO produce air control units. I was ready to scream when I discovered this. This also probably explains a way to draw aggro so the wagon is easier to get to Mercia (I could only get the wagon over with 2 or 3 hp, the couple of times I was able to get it over to her).
At the very end, I created one witch/anti-air unit, and it took the one hit that likely would've made the difference between victory and defeat for me, and I just made it out alive! I got a 3 star rating but "only" an A rank. Oh well, I'll take it - that stage was incredibly hard for me and needlessly made harder due to my own ignorance. Hopefully the next time I feel frustrated, it won't be due to missing something like this.
Near the end of the battle, I was scrolling around the map frustrated, fully expecting that I was most likely about to barely lose just a handful of tiles from the dropoff point for Mercia. Then I accidentally clicked on something. Turns out that one of the bases that you take over with Nuru on the middle/bottom right side of the map could ALSO produce air control units. I was ready to scream when I discovered this. This also probably explains a way to draw aggro so the wagon is easier to get to Mercia (I could only get the wagon over with 2 or 3 hp, the couple of times I was able to get it over to her).
At the very end, I created one witch/anti-air unit, and it took the one hit that likely would've made the difference between victory and defeat for me, and I just made it out alive! I got a 3 star rating but "only" an A rank. Oh well, I'll take it - that stage was incredibly hard for me and needlessly made harder due to my own ignorance. Hopefully the next time I feel frustrated, it won't be due to missing something like this.
Tip to avoid this kind of mistake: when you're ready to end your turn, press L or R (unsure on PC) to jump to unused units, and if all units have been moved in that turn already, it will start cycling thru bases that can recruit new units ;)
Just played this with my friend. When one player gets the dragon the other gets a witch. Really fun, but gonna tweak the side water areas as the harpoon ship and Turtles are pretty useless without amphibians crossing the river to the other side.
Thanks! I appreciate the tip! I'm also playing the game on Switch. I'm sure that this will save me undue frustration down the line. I often had to manually end my turn on 3-3 when I thought that there were just two buildings to recruit from; on the one or two turns where I recruited from two buildings, I guess I just failed to notice that anything was "off".
I love when they begin to growl at each other when you bring your units to their island
So do we have any idea what the statues in caesar's maps do ? I didn't try to go there and use the groove after unlocking both secret characters yet
We're still working away on our big quality of life update (lots of progress made here!) and we're looking into the possibility for save states mid mission, beyond the current suspend and resume functionality.
Should Wargroove have savestates in campaign mode? Currently we're thinking about limiting the ability to get an S rank if you use a save/load.
Should Wargroove have savestates in campaign mode? Currently we're thinking about limiting the ability to get an S rank if you use a save/load.
I think you should let me blatantly cheat constantly with zero recompense on my part
My savescumming ways must continue
Thank you for making such a fun game to play.
Your save state implementation sounds fine to me. Players would be able to get all mission stars, and thus unlock all content. This would make S ranking be more of a challenge mode and I can see the desire remove the use of save scumming to achieve that.
I agree with limiting the ability to get an S-rank, but just make sure to have it be a different option than the current "suspend" option, so people can still take breaks in the campaign without losing S-rank capability.
Also, I'm not going to even pretend to know anything about the backend for multiplayer, but here's an idea that might be worth looking into if it's viable: On all other platforms than Switch there's a notification system for when it's your turn in a multiplayer game, but what about having a mobile app that will send you a notification when it's your turn? I'm thinking something like you put in the game code in the app, and then you'll get alerts when it's your turn. Just thinking about how in some of these games people might not know it's their turn without going and checking every once in a while.
Keep up the good work though, glad to hear the QoL update is going well!
Oof, thanks for the heads up about that first requirement. I'm just gonna put those missions off then, don't really want to go through them twice.
I'm personally in favor of something like a limited number of hard saves per mission, but locking S-ranks behind saves instead works too, since they're purely cosmetic.
Welp, sounds like fun. Do you know if you can do that shit on easy? I beat all those missions already with A-S ranks on normal, but I don't want to do them again with the added statue bullshit. They're hard enough as it is :p
You still get the statue dialogue prompt on sliders all the way down easy mode so I don't see why it wouldn't work. I just did it myself but because I am an idiot, I forgot to get the necessary amount of stars beforehand so looks like I'll have to redo all of them again. Goodie.
3-1 on super easy mode is actually cathatic after having played it on normal. I just spammed Trebuchets in all directions, felt good.
Heh, it may be fun to put everything on easy to see how ridiculously strong you can get. I'll probably do that then once I get enough stars. Still need to finish the last few campaign missions on normal first.
I feel like the best way would be to have like 2 saves per match
I think it's fair to limit S rank for when you don't use savefiles. You can get all 3 stars with just an A rank anyway.
Every time I restarted a mission from a loss, I totally changed up my early-game strategy. Save states could lock you in to a mission that you "lost" six turns ago, so they're not exclusively useful. The main value for saves states is to lock in a successful long (20+ minutes) stretch of a mission that you could easily redo but wouldn't want to.
Seems like they'd be useful for the missions that shift gears partway through. At the least, I feel like it'd be good to savestate whenever, say, the objective changes, because it's often almost a new mission from that point.
I'm only a few missions into Chapter 4 tho.
Seems like they'd be useful for the missions that shift gears partway through. At the least, I feel like it'd be good to savestate whenever, say, the objective changes, because it's often almost a new mission from that point.
I'm only a few missions into Chapter 4 tho.
As long as mid-mission saves are limited, they wouldn't strictly make anything easier, so I don't see much point restricting S-ranking with them. By contrast, adjusting the difficulty sliders actually compromises a mission's intended challenge, so restricting S-ranking is sensible. All mid-mission saves do is save time — and as Brakke notes, they could actually lock people into failing approaches if they don't assess the situation correctly.
If S-ranking requirements are made transparent, I doubt I would use penalizing mid-mission saves at all. Being aware of the turn limit is half the battle there.
If S-ranking requirements are made transparent, I doubt I would use penalizing mid-mission saves at all. Being aware of the turn limit is half the battle there.
S rank offers nothing other than the achievement, so I don't mind keeping it normal ironman exclusive. Stars is only thing that matters at the end after all. I'm also of opinion that should mid-mission saves be offered, it should be offered all the way, because what's the point of arbitrary limitation when intention of the system is to remove frustration?
The real point of contention is whether to offer mid-mission saves for the Arcade, because it only offers stars yet 5-win streak goal of the mode would be rendered pointless by such convenience feature. Whole Arcade system is kind of poor to begin with, to be honest.
The real point of contention is whether to offer mid-mission saves for the Arcade, because it only offers stars yet 5-win streak goal of the mode would be rendered pointless by such convenience feature. Whole Arcade system is kind of poor to begin with, to be honest.
Shit, i knew i should have tried to get to those tiles, they were so suspicious, lol.
A couple small gripes:
1) where most Xbox One games can be picked up right where you left off if the console is always-on, Wargroove has to be launched anew each time you turn it on. I imagine this is to prevent a sort of save scumming?
2) I wish the game would track playtime on the achievements page. I get anal about these sorts of things and like seeing how much I've played one game compared to another
On a positive note, I've been messing around with making a map where each side only has ranged units: archers, ballista, and trebuchets. I really like that something like this works, especially with fog on, but it runs into a problem if each side is down to one trebuchet with no incentive to move into each other's range. Any ideas for an event that could jar such a stalemate?
1) where most Xbox One games can be picked up right where you left off if the console is always-on, Wargroove has to be launched anew each time you turn it on. I imagine this is to prevent a sort of save scumming?
2) I wish the game would track playtime on the achievements page. I get anal about these sorts of things and like seeing how much I've played one game compared to another
On a positive note, I've been messing around with making a map where each side only has ranged units: archers, ballista, and trebuchets. I really like that something like this works, especially with fog on, but it runs into a problem if each side is down to one trebuchet with no incentive to move into each other's range. Any ideas for an event that could jar such a stalemate?
Save states would be great. After enjoying the godsend that was Mila's turnwheel in Fire Emblem Echoes, it honestly feels like some sort of undo should be an expected feature for tactics games.
Hah, you're right, that made it a cakewalk :p. Even managed to touch the statue. I did briefly touch land with a merman to take over the tower to the far right of their base to spawn a dragon. That helped with taking over their base easily. Didn't even need to take over their naval base near the statue.
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Only water maps are somewhat interesting. Very proud of victory I pulled off in Manta Bay on my Arcade Hard mode run, since it puts you in massive income disadvantage from the start (and water map AI are far more difficult to cheese).
If you make it a scenario you can set up a trigger after so many turns so whomever has more properties or units or something else wins. Or, after a certain number of turns you can spawn more units or anything, really.
I say yes it should have save states for campaign, and honestly there's no reason to limit the ability to get anything since it's just single player