Unless you inherited that mortgage from your elderly parents or something, I'm not sure how much sympathy this'll get. I know you weren't going for sympathy, just stating a fact.
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Warren confronted by angry father over her plan to forgive student debt: “Those of us that did the right thing get screwed?”
- Thread starter BAD
- Start date
Unless you inherited that mortgage from your elderly parents or something, I'm not sure how much sympathy this'll get. I know you weren't going for sympathy, just stating a fact.
Oh hell no I'm not going for sympathy. But it was either pay for some overpriced apartment nonsense or just get a house and make the same payments.
Yep. That's the typical mindset of the average white voter. :|
Well, he's obviously not. lol
Well, he's obviously not. lol
Well...the guy did save all the money for her to go to school so that's not entirely awful.
How are you getting screwed by someone else having their debt forgiven, buddy? Does their debt forgiveness erase your daughter's education and the fact that you were able to pay for it? In what way does this impact your life, unless you define your own success and failure only in proportion to others'?
And: are we supposed to never make progress as a society because it's not fair to all the people who came before? "Oh sure, cure that guy's polio... TOTAL DISRESPECT for my great grandfather who was paralyzed from it."
And: are we supposed to never make progress as a society because it's not fair to all the people who came before? "Oh sure, cure that guy's polio... TOTAL DISRESPECT for my great grandfather who was paralyzed from it."
Would this dude throw a fit if they built a new road that took 20 minutes off the commute he's done for the past 30 years? Why shouldn't everyone drive that original route? He did it for years, and so should everyone else.
Being that guy and quoting my own post from the bottom of a previous page that lists some of Warren's more comprehensive plan:
We're talking a complete overhaul of a system that has been fucking us for decades. So these plans are in flux and are bound to change, but Warren and Bernie have way more on the plate than debt forgiveness.
Doesn't go far enough but then again I'm basically a socialist and I recognize capitalism as the root problem for this systemic bullshit:
No one is saying we're going to fix all of this with plan A, version 1. But it's good to have a strategy and to get the word out that there are solutions we can try and need to try.
Seriously this. These graphs help explain the problem:
You typically hear "well too many kids going to college with empty degrees and not everyone needs to go" which is true but it's not the as can be seen here.
How would the recent graduates, with large student debts, feel if they made college free from next year onwards? I'm willing to bet quite a lot would protest.
Forgiveness of student loans would be for the greater macroeconomic good, but I don't believe it will realistically happen.
Forgiveness of student loans would be for the greater macroeconomic good, but I don't believe it will realistically happen.
Are you making a post to rationalise this man's selfish outburst?
Times change, he isn't owed anything and if future students don't need to suffer the same hardship that is a good thing.
It wouldn't make any sense to make it free without offering relief to those still burdened. Just as it wouldn't make any sense to relieve those that are burdened without addressing the issue for future students.
Offering tax incentives to those that have paid while forgiving/restructuring the debt of those that have yet to pay is probably the easy part of the equation. Fixing the system is the hard part.
He's coming from the, fuck you I got mine, but it is another issue that will need to be addressed. Specifically students in the past 10-15 years. Basically there is a generation of tens of millions right now who paid off, or managed their student debt. While sacrificing home ownership, retirement investment, etc. Top it off with the recession delaying it as well. I get it.
It can't just be debt forgiven for the current and free college going forward. An entire generation was already knee capped because of this. Some tax breaks for people who took out loans and paid back would be needed
It can't just be debt forgiven for the current and free college going forward. An entire generation was already knee capped because of this. Some tax breaks for people who took out loans and paid back would be needed
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Yeh, things like unaffordable home ownership and lack of retirement investment are now separate issues that need addressing in tandem.
If this guy has issues in his life brought on by his struggle to afford to pay his student debts, and is now living a life with the repercussions, those are valid things that need addressing.
Entire generations are knee-capped due to bad policy all the time. It's a problem that needs a general attitude change to solve not one specific policy.
A policy can address those previously affected by it, bring relief to those currently, and provide better ways going forward. A tax break over x amount of years for those who paid it off. Its not a magic bullet. But it makes it easier to shallow, gives them some back to hopefully play catch up a bit.
I'm conflicted with the whole thing.
I understand his frustration.
I think a better avenue would be to mandate that colleges/student loan creditors delay recovery on their loans until you cross a higher salary threshold for a better debt-to-income ratio. Make it so that the schools literally have to invest in you for the long term.
Bailing out debtors is just a short term fix and yes, it's unfair to those who worked their asses off to put their own kids through school. It doesn't solve the problem and just pisses people off.
I understand his frustration.
I think a better avenue would be to mandate that colleges/student loan creditors delay recovery on their loans until you cross a higher salary threshold for a better debt-to-income ratio. Make it so that the schools literally have to invest in you for the long term.
Bailing out debtors is just a short term fix and yes, it's unfair to those who worked their asses off to put their own kids through school. It doesn't solve the problem and just pisses people off.
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Not all Degrees earn $160k. MSW as an example. Some people want to learn for their own enrichment and not a salary.
That doesn't have anything to do with my post. Now you're suggesting other taxpayers should pay for peoples personal journeys of enrichment.
There are jobs where they will partially or totally pay off your college debt - the VA will hire RNs fresh out of school and pay it off over a period of time (five years) but u have to take the position that qualifies, typically hands on not supervisory. Pretty sure pubic teaching jobs and some social work positions have loan payoff programs.
Isn't forgiving the debt just a bandaid to a bigger problem?
Is it not possible to focus on tackling school tuition costs rather than just a blanket debt relief and then back to business as usual? Or can the government not do anything about that?
Is it not possible to focus on tackling school tuition costs rather than just a blanket debt relief and then back to business as usual? Or can the government not do anything about that?
Same. I think making college free is a better policy and would make the argument from jackassess like him irrelevant.
Yes. But Resettlers and the voting public at large are more concerned about what they can personally get than what future generations will go though.
Reducing costs should be the priority when it comes to higher education, with a focus on encouraging enrollment in community colleges and trade schools with free or nominal tuition.
Well that was pointless, being angry and in a huff and trying to take it out on warren is so daft.
I mean yeah people have paid for college who won't have to pay under warren, so it's a good change. Changes happen all the time.
Asking for a rebate or getting angry that u missed out on this new policy is just life. Its like people don't demand back pay when the min wage goes up.
I mean yeah people have paid for college who won't have to pay under warren, so it's a good change. Changes happen all the time.
Asking for a rebate or getting angry that u missed out on this new policy is just life. Its like people don't demand back pay when the min wage goes up.
Yep, all that's been discussed in this 600+ page thread. Nothing more than talking about this so obvious grift.
Once more with feeling:
It's an old plan, but one to evolve. Bernie's was already better. And no, it's not some grift. It utilizes research and planning and historical data to identify the several systemic problems we have with education, and chooses a multitude of solutions to be packaged together...and that will be to start because something this fucking huge
will need more than goals, especially since we're going straight up against the money who have been feasting for over a decade. Pretty sure the progressives get that. Do the moderates or *snicker* conservatives?
The goal here isn't to forgive debt, it's to transform the entire educational sector.
Equivalent to a house is a bit of an exaggeration. You're not getting tuition anywhere near that amount unless you're going to some pricey private school.
Education prices when up when education loans became guaranteed and easier to get.
Instead of simply forgiving loans (which is a one time fix), I would rather see a fix going forward:
* Tuition prices fixed at a certain level
* As long as tuition stays at that level, school gets 100% reimbursement for each student (private or public)
* Schools that don't keep fixed tuition, get -ZERO- reimbursement (prevents schools from inflating tuition and double dipping)
If someone wants to get a free education, they should be able to do so.
If someone wants to go to a super fancy, out-of-state private school that costs $100k/year? That should be on them. The school in question will have to justify itself as a value.
Yeah I mean, I'm in the same spot as you (I paid 6k into student loans this year and almost all of it went into interest) but I do not have a mortgage. The fact that you do is kinda nice. Rent is literally a waste of money. So much so that I've honestly considered going homeless on purpose and living in my office.
Anyways, I really want interest lowered to something small like 2%. I think people should be able to get behind that. Even people like the guy in the OP. If not, just let us discharge in bankruptcy. I'd do it in a second lol.
So can you refuse to pay or take a student loan in preparation for a possible debt forgiveness?
If so then that... kinda is punishing the person who does pay.
If so then that... kinda is punishing the person who does pay.
That was an a option at the time though. You have to make the best decision available. Sometimes new options became available after you've made a decision. There are serious consequences for not paying your student loans, and waiting out is a big risk.
Goddamn, its not that complicated.
FORGIVE ALL STUDENT DEBT AS IT IS.
"But I worked hard and sacrificed much!"
And now people will not have to go through that mind searing stress and uncertainty.
"Thats not fair'"
That was the system that did that to you and we just got rid of it. It has to start sometime, and that is now. Have some solidarity. SOLIDARITY.
*At this point, the recalcitrant contrarian makes the discussion turns eerily similar to republicans complaining about welfare queens, affirmative action, and taxes*
FORGIVE ALL STUDENT DEBT AS IT IS.
"But I worked hard and sacrificed much!"
And now people will not have to go through that mind searing stress and uncertainty.
"Thats not fair'"
That was the system that did that to you and we just got rid of it. It has to start sometime, and that is now. Have some solidarity. SOLIDARITY.
*At this point, the recalcitrant contrarian makes the discussion turns eerily similar to republicans complaining about welfare queens, affirmative action, and taxes*
Great post, glad I'm not the only one who got that bolded vibe reading this thread.
This is happening to me. My university this year, as I've stated, has been made tuition free for low income students starting this year. I graduate this semester. I'm glad they don't have to carry the burden I do.
We should be forgiving loans and making college tuition free.
Bailing out one type of debtor still leaves other debtors unassisted.
It would be better to offer a 1 time $50k credit to ALL debtors for ALL types of loans nationwide.
This way, everyone can use it towards whatever type of debt they have. Student loan, mortgage, credit card, medical bills, etc... Just offer a 1 time nationwide bailout credit of up to $50K to every non-business.
Granted, this doesn't solve anything long term. People will still run up debt. But this at least gives the current debtor population a quick bit a breathing room. Might help save a few lives too.
It would be better to offer a 1 time $50k credit to ALL debtors for ALL types of loans nationwide.
This way, everyone can use it towards whatever type of debt they have. Student loan, mortgage, credit card, medical bills, etc... Just offer a 1 time nationwide bailout credit of up to $50K to every non-business.
Granted, this doesn't solve anything long term. People will still run up debt. But this at least gives the current debtor population a quick bit a breathing room. Might help save a few lives too.
Yep, exactly. This is the position that I find myself in.
Do I think student loan forgiveness is great? Absolutely! I think that this is the best way forward and if that's done, even though I paid student loans, it's a good thing. We should always strive to make things better for the people ahead of us.
That being said... I live in one of the world's most heated housing markets and I can't afford to buy anymore. I wonder about what life could have been like if I hadn't paid off $100k of student loan debt. Would I have been able to afford to buy earlier on, like my peers who didn't have to worry about that kind of thing? Even having $100k extra in savings now would probably let me buy into the market in a much more secure position.
I wouldn't say $50k for all debts just debts that can't be forgiven via bankruptcy.
He is an asshole. His behavior completely inappropriate. His logic is poor.
Emotions cloud logic. He still did a good thing for his family. I doubt most of you in debt have or had a parent willing to do that. His anger is just terribly misplaced.
I don't get the rage at the dad.
He just wants the same thing everyone else wants - to be able to put their kids through college without wrecking their lives to do it.
People calling him an asshole sound just as bad as he does. You're actually all arguing for the same thing, just from two different perspectives. Stop sniping at him and come up with a solution that helps everyone, not just people with a remaining balance. He may not have the same debt on paper, but he's suffered an unassisted toll nonetheless.
He just wants the same thing everyone else wants - to be able to put their kids through college without wrecking their lives to do it.
People calling him an asshole sound just as bad as he does. You're actually all arguing for the same thing, just from two different perspectives. Stop sniping at him and come up with a solution that helps everyone, not just people with a remaining balance. He may not have the same debt on paper, but he's suffered an unassisted toll nonetheless.
Anyone that has outbursts to something like this is unstable. Period. Regardless of the reality of discharging student loans, this man's position will not change and him raging to a candidate like a lunatic only make him look like what he is.
He saved his own money over decades, he's outside of the scope of student loans. You can't compensate everyone who paid for college out of pocket. The important point is drawing a line, getting free college, and maybe doing something about existing loans. But even that is a massive fight.