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What are some mechanics featured in fighting games that you wish were present/universal in other fighting games?

PBalfredo

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,792
The icons in Persona 4 Arena for when you get hit with a sweep or an overhead, which is a great way to learn what's getting past your defenses while playing. It really cuts out a lot of the frustration that leads to salty "What the fuck? I was blocking!" when the immediate feedback leads to realizing "Oh, that hits low." and you can adjust on the fly.
 

Jakisthe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,298
Putting aside the fact that not every mechanic works for every game, I would want to see more games with a breaker/counterbreaker system. Although it sometimes had the effect of making combos too rigid, which is a bad thing, actual fights aren’t about trapping opponents in loops; it’s possible to shift momentum at any time, with any move, not just super special exertions (like, say, an MK breaker). This winds up engendering an infinitely more interesting mindgame setup and has a ton of potential.
 

j^aws

Member
Oct 31, 2017
478
UK
- Virtua Fighter 4 Evolutions Quest Mode for single player content - a virtual arcade competing against AI opponents modelled with data from real players.

- Mortal Kombat Fatalities - execution style finishes being an optional way to finish matches without taking away in-game mechanics.

- King of Fighters jumping/ hoping mechanics - I suppose when you start taking actual game mechanics from other games, then your game starts to lose its identity.
 

Rickenslacker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,971
The universal mechanic that I'd want is actually the complete omission of a mechanic. Comeback mechanics. Ever since SF4 most games need some wacky high reward thing that you get every round, usually for getting your ass beat. It's tedious.
 

skillzilla81

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,127
Any universal mechanic would change how every game is played and move toward homogeneity, so...no. Not at all.

The only right answers for people who actually enjoy fighting games and not just one or two IPs are netcode and crossplay.
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,833
It's good netcode. All these developers are jumping over themselves to innovate what a fighting game entails and how to best bring in casuals, when the ultimate answer for continued engagement with your game is one that actually feels pleasant to play with other people. Good netcode will go so much further than what some of these devs keep focusing on to not real result.
ONLINE TRAINING

like seriously, wtf. Basically just KOFxiv and KI I think have it this gen?
Mortal Kombat 11 has it.
 

Harken Raiser

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,680
Let me hold down a button to do mash attacks (like E. Honda's Hundred Hand Slap), Smash Bros Ultimate introduced the concept and I think it's genius.
 

Pundere

Member
Oct 30, 2017
291
In-game hitbox and frame data display is a big one for me.

Also, while not really a mechanic or system, detailed patch notes should be mandatory for all fighting games. Nothing is worse that seeing shit like "Ryu's forward throw been adjusted" Adjusted how??? More damage? Less? Slower?Faster? Now a 360 motion?

It feels ridiculous that you need to depend on outside sources for basic competitive information when it should all be in the game.
 

Harken Raiser

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,680
The point of moves like that is the execution barrier. Most mash moves like Blanka's electricity or E. Honda's slap would be too powerful if you could just essentially turbo button them.
What execution barrier? I mained Blank throughout SF4 and never had a problem pulling off his electricity move. SFV even lets you perform Chun-Li's rapid kick with a quarter circle motion instead of mashing kick if you want, so it must not be a problem there.
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,833
What execution barrier? I mained Blank throughout SF4 and never had a problem pulling off his electricity move. SFV even lets you perform Chun-Li's rapid kick with a quarter circle motion instead of mashing kick if you want, so it must not be a problem there.
I think it's move dependent. Something like Ed's rapid punches would be no issue if it was also given the QCF motion instead of mash, but for the others, it's essentially the same reason Gief's SPD is a 360 motion and not a HCB motion, even though Giefs have no problem pulling off an SPD. It forces your hand when it comes to the kinds of situations you can actually pull that move off, instead of just being able to throw it out in neutral.
 

JusDoIt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,372
South Central Los Angeles
Rolling my eyes at all these parrying from 3rd Strike answers (nevermind the first two SFIII games that had parrying and weren’t that great), and I’ve probably played more 3rd Strike against other people this year than everybody saying it.
 

McNum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,400
Denmark
From Smash: Jump is a button and Up can be disabled as a jump.

Fighting games are more or less the only kind of games that still use Up as a jump. Every other genre has changed it to a button. Removing jump from Up also gives you new input directions to use for grounded moves.

Stick jumping is just one of those odd things fighting games do because they've always done it. Maybe it's time to question it?
 

Kung Fucius

Member
Jun 28, 2019
117
Every game should have Chun-Li

I play Chun Ling right now in Tekken.

Answering the thread: Good netcode. I love Soul Calibur's Character creation system. I like to ability to record matches, so I can save the ones I thought were good. Customizable soundtracks so I can load my own music in to the stages. All characters should be unlocked from the beginning. Having to spend a few hours unlocking characters in games is always a bore. Better tutorials.
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,633
From Smash: Jump is a button and Up can be disabled as a jump.

Fighting games are more or less the only kind of games that still use Up as a jump. Every other genre has changed it to a button. Removing jump from Up also gives you new input directions to use for grounded moves.

Stick jumping is just one of those odd things fighting games do because they've always done it. Maybe it's time to question it?
That's one more button that could have been used for something else.

Use a hitbox, problem solved!
 

McNum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,400
Denmark
That's one more button that could have been used for something else.

Use a hitbox, problem solved!
Design the game around the controller just like every other game does. Problem solved.

I still find it odd that Street Fighter, when it releases for consoles first, still has six attack buttons when the controller has four face buttons. That's not made with the controller in mind. Which probably is another thing from Smash that other games could learn from. There is a default controller, design for that. See also Mortal Kombat 11, which makes good use of its four main buttons for attacks and shoulder buttons for non-attack or context moves.

MK11 is best in class on this as far as I can tell. Even Smash kind of wants the GameCube controller, not the default one, to play best.
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,633
Design the game around the controller just like every other game does. Problem solved.

I still find it odd that Street Fighter, when it releases for consoles first, still has six attack buttons when the controller has four face buttons. That's not made with the controller in mind. Which probably is another thing from Smash that other games could learn from. There is a default controller, design for that. See also Mortal Kombat 11, which makes good use of its four main buttons for attacks and shoulder buttons for non-attack or context moves.

MK11 is best in class on this as far as I can tell. Even Smash kind of wants the GameCube controller, not the default one, to play best.
I don't really see what mk is doing ahead of the majority of other fighting games that already are more focused on controllers. Most are 4 button fighters, with the shoulder and trigger buttons used for other things. SF uses 6 because it always has but even then, I don't think it's ever been an issue to play street Fighter on a typical 4 face button, 2 shoulder, 2 trigger controller.

And in any case, which would be the jump button? If it's a face button, that's one less attack button in a four button Fighter, assuming you don't want to put attacks on the shoulders/triggers.

I think it would be very awkward to do a flash kick or spinning bird kick with jump as a face button.

Or worse yet, jump cancelling for air combos. RIP your thumb lol
 

McNum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,400
Denmark
I don't really see what mk is doing ahead of the majority of other fighting games that already are more focused on controllers. Most are 4 button fighters, with the shoulder and trigger buttons used for other things. SF uses 6 because it always has but even then, I don't think it's ever been an issue to play street Fighter on a typical 4 face button, 2 shoulder, 2 trigger controller.

And in any case, which would be the jump button? If it's a face button, that's one less attack button in a four button Fighter, assuming you don't want to put attacks on the shoulders/triggers.

I think it would be very awkward to do a flash kick or spinning bird kick with jump as a face button.

Or worse yet, jump cancelling for air combos. RIP your thumb lol
Why would Flash Kick be awkward? It's still Charge Down -> Up+Kick. It's just Up isn't Jump. It's Up. For Up Normals and blocking high or whatever you gain from getting three cardinal directions open.

As for attack buttons, I would honestly be fine with three. Use more command normals, after all, you have three more directions to use to compensate. I would probably move Collarbone Breaker for Ryu to an Up Normal since it must be blocked high, as an example. Up+Forward+Punch = Overhead. It could even be a universal input for everyone, like how Down+HK is sweep now.

Yes, if Street Fighter did this, it would change, and possibly not for the better. The three strengths of most Specials matter in SF. But for a new game, perhaps someone getting an interesting license to play with? Maybe give it a shot, see what three attacks and a jump button can do.
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,633
Why would Flash Kick be awkward? It's still Charge Down -> Up+Kick. It's just Up isn't Jump. It's Up. For Up Normals and blocking high or whatever you gain from getting three cardinal directions open.

As for attack buttons, I would honestly be fine with three. Use more command normals, after all, you have three more directions to use to compensate. I would probably move Collarbone Breaker for Ryu to an Up Normal since it must be blocked high, as an example. Up+Forward+Punch = Overhead. It could even be a universal input for everyone, like how Down+HK is sweep now.

Yes, if Street Fighter did this, it would change, and possibly not for the better. The three strengths of most Specials matter in SF. But for a new game, perhaps someone getting an interesting license to play with? Maybe give it a shot, see what three attacks and a jump button can do.
Tbh I'm down for fighters to be 3 buttons instead of 6 or 4, but I don't think a dedicated jump button is going to go down well. It's one of those "if it ain't broke" things.
 

JusDoIt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,372
South Central Los Angeles
From Smash: Jump is a button and Up can be disabled as a jump.

Fighting games are more or less the only kind of games that still use Up as a jump. Every other genre has changed it to a button. Removing jump from Up also gives you new input directions to use for grounded moves.

Stick jumping is just one of those odd things fighting games do because they've always done it. Maybe it's time to question it?
Probably the most offensive post I’ve read in 2019.

Why would Flash Kick be awkward? It's still Charge Down -> Up+Kick. It's just Up isn't Jump. It's Up.
If up isn’t jump the charge motion is imbalanced. You’d be giving people access to riskless flash kick buffers.
 

BassForever

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,457
CT
Because I suck at fighting games but love fighting game characters, Soul Calibur's create-a-soul.
This is mine, but I’m gonna use mortal kombat Armageddon as my example game. Not only did you have a huge amount of costumes and other options for customizing the look of your fighter, you could literally pick their normal attacks, their special attacks, and their weapon fighting style it was nuts. Smash’s mii fighters are good but I wish you could go a bit deeper in customizing their normal attacks alongside their specials.
 

McNum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,400
Denmark
Tbh I'm down for fighters to be 3 buttons instead of 6 or 4, but I don't think a dedicated jump button is going to go down well. It's one of those "if it ain't broke" things.
What we have works, yes. But questioning if something that's been done some way for years, decades even, is still the way to go is good to do, too.

I don't expect many, if any, fighting games to do it, but I kind of want to see one try, just to see if it works.
Probably the most offensive post I’ve read in 2019.
I aim to please. Or terrify. Whichever works.
 

BeaconofTruth

Member
Dec 30, 2017
1,837
Rolling my eyes at all these parrying from 3rd Strike answers (nevermind the first two SFIII games that had parrying and weren’t that great), and I’ve probably played more 3rd Strike against other people this year than everybody saying it.
There is some weirdo disconnect between what actually makes SF3 so great and what people think is cool about SF3 lol

the parry Is not some end all, be all mechanic. Tho it leads to some interesting movement in 3
 

skillzilla81

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,127
What we have works, yes. But questioning if something that's been done some way for years, decades even, is still the way to go is good to do, too.

I don't expect many, if any, fighting games to do it, but I kind of want to see one try, just to see if it works.

I aim to please. Or terrify. Whichever works.
Kind of ignores the fact that capcom has put out tons of different fighters with tons of control schemes. Power stone? Onumusha Blade Warriors? Just go through their catalog.

Some people keep wanting to change some of these fighters for literally no reason ither than to change them. That's the worst reason to try something new.
 

McNum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,400
Denmark
Kind of ignores the fact that capcom has put out tons of different fighters with tons of control schemes. Power stone? Onumusha Blade Warriors? Just go through their catalog.

Some people keep wanting to change some of these fighters for literally no reason ither than to change them. That's the worst reason to try something new.
Do it early enough in prototypes so you can try it. If it works, keep it, if it doesn't, toss it. Doing things because they've always been done like that leaves you blind to other options.

I believe there was an old scrapped Street Fighter prototype that let you rewind time during the fight, for instance. That went nowhere, of course, because that would just break the game in all kinds of silly ways, but when you're early enough that crazy ideas are cheap to try, why not go for a few?

Though if the tradeoff between a button versus three cardinal directions is worth it... That really needs to be figured out early. I'm thinking for certain games, it might be. For others, probably not.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,302
Universal super motions PLEASE. Or at least MOSTLY universal, barring exceptions. SFV is fine, every character has 2xQCF/QCB+P/K, except for the two characters whose inputs entirely revolve around not being standard (Guile and Gief). I hate playing KoF or Guilty Gear because along with remembering which super is more useful in which situation and why, I also have to remember which motion and (in GG's case) which button to use the supers, and in the end I just end up dropping my combo or burning my meter in other ways anyway because the mental clouding isn't worth it.
 

Garrod_Ran

Member
Mar 23, 2018
1,131
Tbh I'm down for fighters to be 3 buttons instead of 6 or 4, but I don't think a dedicated jump button is going to go down well. It's one of those "if it ain't broke" things.
under night has three attack buttons and pads out the normals by giving everyone a ton of command normals and charged normals as well
it's a pretty elegant solution imo