"Productive" for them, it let them sleep at night easier hopefully lol
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What I actually said on Kotaku Splitscreen about the PlayStation 5's specs
- Thread starter jschreier
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Some are, i did want to hear what devs thought about the PS5, but that turned into a shitshow at a lightning pace.
You literally called him a 'shill', but hid it in a shitty double-negative.
I just want to know if the devs reaching out are first part or third party? Because if it's first party it makes sense that they would be excited about ps5 given the ability for them to fully utilise it but for their party devs who make pc ports how many years until you can say the 5gb/s base SSD is a minimum requirement? A long time in my opinion.
so maybe 4 or 5 games a generation will get to leverage this amazing drive I guess
so maybe 4 or 5 games a generation will get to leverage this amazing drive I guess
I literally did the opposite. He's far from a shill, I'm just confused why he's invested in sonys pr
I mean this entire gen has demonstrated to me that raw power simply doesn't matter anymore, and it all comes down to the technology around how we tackle these limitations that determines how a console performs.
In that other thread I saw a post from DF's Alex Battaglia simply stating that he "disagreed" with the original title about how the PS5 will be revolutionary this next gen, which from him seems a little flippant? I mean this gen we've seen 4.2 and 6TF machines achieve perfomance decently close to 4K30 (or perceptably close to it using some neat tricks)... And temporal AA and image reconstruction, whilst inherently imperfect in their nature, go to great lengths to achieve some incredible results relative to raw pixel output of a native image on much more powerful hardware.
I think the I/O gain that PS5 makes for itself could potentially be every bit as massive as some of the hyperbole states, and I really don't think it will do well to undersell Mark Cerny's direct input in its hardware design, especially when it comes to creating bespoke methodology behind reaching certain results without necessary requiring raw horsepower.
All-in-all I'm incredibly excited!
In that other thread I saw a post from DF's Alex Battaglia simply stating that he "disagreed" with the original title about how the PS5 will be revolutionary this next gen, which from him seems a little flippant? I mean this gen we've seen 4.2 and 6TF machines achieve perfomance decently close to 4K30 (or perceptably close to it using some neat tricks)... And temporal AA and image reconstruction, whilst inherently imperfect in their nature, go to great lengths to achieve some incredible results relative to raw pixel output of a native image on much more powerful hardware.
I think the I/O gain that PS5 makes for itself could potentially be every bit as massive as some of the hyperbole states, and I really don't think it will do well to undersell Mark Cerny's direct input in its hardware design, especially when it comes to creating bespoke methodology behind reaching certain results without necessary requiring raw horsepower.
All-in-all I'm incredibly excited!
Oh hey would you look at that:
Andrea Pessino on Twitter
“Dollar bet: within a year from its launch gamers will fully appreciate that the PlayStation 5 is one of the most revolutionary, inspired home consoles ever designed, and will feel silly for having spent energy arguing about "teraflops" and other similarly misunderstood specs. 😘”twitter.com
People don't argue about things like teraflops because they want to be right. They argue about them because it suits the narrative of the team they support or the product they own / will own.
No one arguing for Xbox now is going to post in a years time and say "you know what PS5 games are incredible. I was wrong!" Lol...
The internet is by and large an incredibly poisonous place full of people with agendas. I commend you for even interacting with people online. With the kind of messages I imagine you get it must be both sickening and extremely disheartening at times.
I honestly wouldn't work in this industry either as a journalist or developer for even double the salary I earn now. It's seems to be toxic to its very core for a variety of reasons in a variety of different ways from online hate to threats of violence to misogyny and harassment.
User Banned (Permanent): Trolling, platform warring, hostility; multiple prior bans for hostility and platform warring
Again, the hype that Jason is pushing should easily be supported by the titles Sony reveals. In less than a year all of this chatter about the 'most innovative console in 20 years' will have the software to show the true potential, or not.
I just hope Jason isn't as defensive in a year from now if the software doesn't blow minds like he's insinuating. For now, watching him go all in for Sony is amusing.
It feels like you're making a very big mountain out of a molehill, he's having a pop at Sony for messing up their message and passing on what some devs are saying about the tech. it doesn't scream all in for Sony to me.
Thanks Jason. Fanboys in general are pathetic ("gamers" especially). They're always twistings someone's words in order to fit their own pointless agenda.
Pretty much the reason I barely can stand the gaming side anymore. It all seems so silly to behave this way for games. I've owned every system at one point and other than a few exclusives here and there, the experiences weren't all that drastically different either way.
Embarassing couple of days for this forum for sure.
I'm not a huge tech guy or really that interested in specs but it would be nice to browse threads in the hope of learning some stuff....unfortunately I've had to put most created in the wake of the GDC talk on ignore due to the relentless console warring....some of you need to grow the fuck up quite honestly.
I'm not a huge tech guy or really that interested in specs but it would be nice to browse threads in the hope of learning some stuff....unfortunately I've had to put most created in the wake of the GDC talk on ignore due to the relentless console warring....some of you need to grow the fuck up quite honestly.
Oh hey would you look at that:
Andrea Pessino on Twitter
“Dollar bet: within a year from its launch gamers will fully appreciate that the PlayStation 5 is one of the most revolutionary, inspired home consoles ever designed, and will feel silly for having spent energy arguing about "teraflops" and other similarly misunderstood specs. 😘”
How is TF a misunderstood bullet point on a spec sheet though? Even Cerny brought up flops in his presentation saying GCN flops != RDNA2 flops. Why mention it if it's meaningless? Why upclock the GPU to get closer to XSX if it's meaningless and unnecessarily puts strain on thermals?
Even if we forget TF for a second, the PS5 has slower RAM. It has a slower CPU, it has less CUs (which with AMD are linked to RT performance). Are those meaningless too? I get that devs want to defuse the situation for Sony since they themselves did a poor job but this whole "TF don't matter anymore" thing is a very sudden shift when it was all everyone ever talked about. We have direct proof that TF is a good indicator for performance through years of testing (by digital foundry and other sites). Why the sudden shift?
I've just never seen Jason so defensive and so determined to lay it all out there for either Sony or MS until pre and post-reveal of the PS5. Yet he's bound and determined to make everyone "get" the unique hardware profile of the PS5. I've just never seen this level of effort from him.
I think he just should have stayed out of it.
It is simply not a good look for him.
He was commenting what he thought of the presentation. What is wrong with you?
I'm just not seeing the issue, this isn't international diplomacy and the Cuban missile crisis.
It's electronic tat.
Jesus, i think i'm finally becoming old.
i think this has more to do with what he said about both consoles being more powerful than the 2080, and aiming to be over 10.7 tflops. the ps5 might actually be more powerful than the 2080 but what sony showed yesterday doesnt show it which calls into question his reporting which in turns makes this personal for him... whether he would like to admit it or not. i thought it was curious why he was so obsessed with our spec thread calling us out on twitter for being console warriors just for being interested in knowing the tflops count. we have never treated him with disrespect in that thread, so it was pretty demoralizing seeing him call everyone in that thread a rabid fanboy. but this makes a bit more sense because Cerny's terrible presentation might have actually undersold the power of the system and thus his reporting of a powerful system. remember, he had just tweeted some dev's opinion that it was the most exciting hardware in 20 years. his reputation is on the line. thats why hes invested in sony's pr.
that said, you arent fooling anyone, everyone here including you, me, jason and everyone else in between you were trying to paint him as a sony shill without actually saying it. the guy didnt even get an early briefing on the specs like IGN, gamespot and DF did. he's likely been blacklisted by sony.
Mark brings it up because he knows it's a misconception many people have, thus wants to try his best to help the audience understand why it's a misconception...
Looking at the replies to that RAD tweet is so cringey. Listing off all of those buzzwords and marketing terms about XSX features that the PS5 supposedly doesn't have is pretty premature at this point. Dollars to donuts by the time both of these boxes launch and we know everything about their capabilities the list of differences in technical capabilities will have shrunken way down.
Looking at the replies to that RAD tweet is so cringey. Listing off all of those buzzwords and marketing terms about XSX features that the PS5 supposedly doesn't have is pretty premature at this point. Dollars to donuts by the time both of these boxes launch and we know everything about their capabilities the list of differences in technical capabilities will have shrunken way down.
I don't think Jason cares necessarily about Sony so much as he's against this idea of teraflops meaning everything, especially considering how much he got bugged about it over the past year or so and in that case, Sony is on the shorter end of that stick this time around.
If you want to look at his true crusade, it's pretty clear that he's intent on finding ways to expose crunch and ending those practices. The level of effort with the PS5 ain't close to that.
If you want to look at his true crusade, it's pretty clear that he's intent on finding ways to expose crunch and ending those practices. The level of effort with the PS5 ain't close to that.
I'd love to know who actually says that. Of course they aren't everything. It's still a valid indicator for performance.
What's bugging me is this, people are actually saying not to trust the spec sheets. Thats absolutely baffling to me.
OP
OP
I will begrudgingly admit that you are correct and that this is indeed part of it.
But are they saying *not to trust* the spec sheets? Or are they saying that taking the spec sheets at face value don't tell the whole story or give a conclusive indicator of performance/graphics/etc.? Because I have only ever seen the latter.
To make yet another terrible analogy on this forum I think with the TF thing it's kind of like in real life where just because you see a BIG guy doesn't mean he's STRONG. A buddy of mine was a bouncer for a while but still looks pretty big, and he says once he stopped working out he lost most of his muscle mass and it's just flab now, and that he can't lift what he used to be able to lift. He can still lift more than MY skinny ass, but if I worked out and was even a sport/trim looking thin guy it's possible that I could lift close to what he can currently lift now- maybe even more.
From what I can tell, in the Next Gen speculation thread, there were definitely people a lot more invested in learning about the TFs number and little else, so again, I think it's frustration built on that. A lot of people tagged him begging to know about those Tflops and seemed a lot less interested in learning anything else. Nobody may have explicitly said it, but I don't think it can be denied that it dominated the majority of discussion.
Of course, this doesn't change the fact that the Series X is superior in other aspects as well.
They are telling us not to take cold hard data at face value because.... why? None of them explain in detail why.
and that has to be one of the worst analogies I have ever seen on this site.
What is wrong with you? I am not referring to the initial comments rather the extending discourse that followed. Rightly or wrongly, it gave the impression of partiality.
I dont see a big issue either! :)
But the existence of this thread and its volume of posts, may indicate it is a general issue. Like some have mentioned, his main cause is not Sony or MS, it is about the crunch that exists in the industry.
Oh hey would you look at that:
Andrea Pessino on Twitter
“Dollar bet: within a year from its launch gamers will fully appreciate that the PlayStation 5 is one of the most revolutionary, inspired home consoles ever designed, and will feel silly for having spent energy arguing about "teraflops" and other similarly misunderstood specs. 😘”
I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean? A studio of former Sony developers praising the PS5 in a series of tweets? Color me surprised.
I dont understand the reluctance to also talk about cool features and strengths of the XSX shared from 3p devs?
Like, is there nothing special about this machine? Are there NO 3p devs excited about the XSX?
Its not a "what about me?!" question its more like, should I be concerned this box isnt doing ANYTHING interesting/cool/new/revolutionary???
Like, is there nothing special about this machine? Are there NO 3p devs excited about the XSX?
Its not a "what about me?!" question its more like, should I be concerned this box isnt doing ANYTHING interesting/cool/new/revolutionary???
Just because most people talked about it, doesn't make it any more right
This x100000.
Also people are talking about these specs as if they matter all. The one and only decisive factor that has ever mattered at all is games.
Ah i forgot about the 10.7 thing it makes sense now, i respect him for putting his sources and guesswork out there don't think people should hold that over him. Was he wrong sure? But obviously he heard good things about the system that is way more than capable regardless of its tf count. And for your last bit no one calling Jason a shill.
That is what is bothering me slightly on both sides of this "war" The strengths of each console are potential on both sides. Yet some explain away these strengths by:
1. Dismissing them as theoretical, not real world, values, while simultaneously positing their selected values as absolute
2. Not comparing like for like values where possible.
Crazy times. As always, the games will tell. Rockstar will tax these systems................. in about 20 years when GTAVI comes out!
Where is the partiality in saying that Sony built a very good machine and their presentation undersold it to the general consumer? He didn't say anything bad about Xbox. Get over your fanboy glasses.
Only fanboys dont want to see reason with this. With any of this. And I blame that "Github" leak for it all. Besides the fact that Gitub did not factor many many aspects of PS5. It was propagated as Final SoC! Without all those processes and proprietary chips that Sony is putting in PS5, without the Tempest Audio Engine, Geometry Engine, etc etc , my goodness,Sony worked crazy hard on creating a machine, which will continue to be explored graphically in the years to come. Chances are the actual PS5 chip will be bigger than the Xbox Series X chip in the end.
I say... let kids argue argue over "Teraflops" argument, but Jason is right.. we will let the games do the talking.
I say... let kids argue argue over "Teraflops" argument, but Jason is right.. we will let the games do the talking.
This.
For months people have been frothing at the mouth for specs. Then when it's all said and done, those specs don't quite matter anymore. I read though some of those twitter responses of the link that Jason posted and christ, people have really forced themselves to believe that the XSX will be holding back the PS5 in terms of multiplats because of the SSD secret sauce. I swear, it's a complete reversal from the beginning of last generation where power was king, specs were queen, and it was a running joke that the XBO could bridge any gap with its secret sauce.
Sure, they haven't explained why, but considering they are developers of videogames, I'm going to trust their opinion over someone on a forum or comments section- I'll even trust them over DF considering DF doesn't make videogames, they measure metrics of videogames performance and make videos about it.
Hopefully we get better clarity in the coming months, though I'm not expecting a developer to take the time and responsibility to write up some post explaining to use gamers why they think TF's aren't the whole story.
perfectly written, people don't think straight these days.
so the compliments on PS5 must come from which Studios for you to believe? RAD and Andrea have every reason to not compliment Sony since their game was many, many years ago and never had a chance of sequel.
just accept it devs are impressed (by both consoles) and move on.
Or you could trust the spec sheets released by Sony and MS. Weird I know.
The specs sheet doesn't tell you how all that work. The fact is, Sony is making some new things, so it's not a 1 to 1 comparison.
He's trying to help explain something that he thinks people aren't fully understanding. That falls within the purview of journalism and editorial, does it not?
Calling it "investment in Sony's pr" is an uncharitable framing of his actions. Unless you have pre-existing evidence that he's a Sony mouthpiece, it's unwarranted.
Specs sheets never tell the whole story since day 1 this isn't different for either system. Both have custom blocks tools/secret sauces.
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