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mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,401
I'm not letting this comment chain go.

Considering being psychopathic is a mental illness...sure. An attentive parent would probably notice that a child showed very little to no empathy and get them help.

The idea that everything has to be concretely blamed on the parents in situations like this is inhuman, ironically far closer to the black-and-white mentality of the Internet subcultures you're railing against than anything resembling reality. It's just a deluded subset of the myth that everyone deserves what's coming to them, circumstances be damned.

f the account is real, he let this shit happen for at least 3 years. It is inattentive.

The idea that everything has to be concretely blamed on the parents in situations like this is inhuman, ironically far closer to the black-and-white mentality of the Internet subcultures you're railing against than anything resembling reality. It's just a deluded subset of the myth that everyone deserves what's coming to them, circumstances be damned.


There are multiple concrete things the parents could have done and failed to do (Again assuming this is real which I doubt it is)


This is the comment chain between Hollywood Duo and '3y Kingdom


The original thread was locked and there is no point in going over the reasons it was locked. What matters is the discussion here about parenting so use your own imagination on what would warrant this chain. The scenario you should be thinking of is that you are a parent raising a child that increasingly shows behavior that is a danger to even your own family members.

[edit]When I say things have reached a point that even your own family is being threatened I'm talking about it has gotten to a point your child since a teenager has started verbally assaulting immediate members and has gotten into physical confrontation with friends, relatives and strangers at school.

You had previous signs of problems around when they hit puberty but even with all you could do to address those problems then it spiraled out into these immediate threats to the rest of the family.

The discussion I'm focusing on is whether or not parents should always be held responsible when things get this bad. If you do believe they are responsible what could you have done better than already attempting to use multiple therapists, increasing the levels of which you monitor your children with each new incident and having heart to heart conversations.[/edit]

Personally I've held the attitude that a parent is ultimately responsible for how a child comes out but today I've come to agree with RedMercury's assessment.

Yeah, we really can't get into blaming the parents. There are just too many vectors for this hateful shit to permeate and as a parent you do your best but you cannot keep your children in a bubble 24/7- you have your own things to worry about too, your own career, paying the bills and mortgage, a lot of times other children as well. You can do everything you can and your child can still go down a bad road, you can offer them every lifeline but they can refuse to take it. Parents are not psychiatrists or therapists, there is a limit to what we can be reasonably expected to achieve.


Personally while professional help is also needed I would take additional time off from work to drill down into my kid's reasoning for doing the things they do. I would question why they did every little thing that builds up to such a serious problem that I would have to be worried about the safety of everyone else in the family.


As much as I would like to believe you can plan ahead to be an amazing parent certain scenarios are too crazy to deal with because there isn't any sufficient ways to get prepared beforehand.
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
21,466
Sweden
if you want anyone to read and reply to this topic, you should probably do a better job of summarizing in your own words the debate and positions over just slapping in a few quotes, and then ask a mod to change to a more descriptive thread title tbqh
 

SideMatt

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
874
if you want anyone to read and reply to this topic, you should probably do a better job of summarizing in your own words the debate and positions over just slapping in a few quotes, and then ask a mod to change to a more descriptive thread title tbqh
Yeah it's sort of hard to put things together without at least some context.
 

trikster40

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
682
There's way too many other outside influences to pin everything on parents, especially when parents end to be the last person that a teenager wants to listen to.
 

Deleted member 8752

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
10,122
So the question is how, as a parent, do you handle a child that shows little to no empathy?

I think you seek professional help for your child. Not sure what else can be said.
 

Calamari41

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,099
So it seems like the OP is talking about something along the lines of kids displaying clinical mental illnesses or something. Like psychopathy, maybe he was talking about a kid that was killing/torturing animals for a long time and then ended up hurting another kid? It's hard to tell.

Obviously you can't blame the parents for something like that. You can blame them for noticing and not seeking help, though.
 

Deleted member 17402

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,125
This thread could've been made without quoting people at all if you had instead posed the question: Do parents bear all the responsibility of how their children turn out, specifically psychopaths?
 

THE210

Member
Nov 30, 2017
1,544
In general I dislike the assumption that bad kid = bad parents. Too bad It's easier to make that leap then it is to look at the nuances of a given situation. I work with kids so I understand that they can do what they want to do.
 

Hollywood Duo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
41,967
This thread could've been made without quoting people at all if you had instead posed the question: Do parents bear all the responsibility of how their children turn out, specifically psychopaths?
My original argument which is not shown was that a child becoming a full blown incel is the parents fault. Then someone said well some people are just psychopaths. Then my quote comes in. If your kid has a mental illness get them some professional help sooner rather than later.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,401
Yeah it's sort of hard to put things together without at least some context.

I'd love to chime in but I have absolutely no clue what you are talking about

Right? OP just fill us in

When I say things have reached a point that even your own family is being threatened I'm talking about it has gotten to a point your child since a teenager has started verbally assaulting immediate members and has gotten into physical confrontation with friends, relatives and strangers at school.

Your had previous signs of problems around when they hit puberty but even with all you could do to address those problems then it spiralled out into these immediate threats to the rest of the family.

The discussion I'm focusing on is whether or not parents should always be held responsible when things get this bad. If you do believe they are responsible what could you have done better than already attempting to use multiple therapists, increasing the levels of which you monitor your children with each new incident and having heart to heart conversations.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,401
This thread could've been made without quoting people at all if you had instead posed the question: Do parents bear all the responsibility of how their children turn out, specifically psychopaths?
It would've been cleaner but I also specifically wanted to hear more thoughts from the people I quoted. The thread got locked before they elaborated further on their stances.
 

Deleted member 11985

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,168
When I say things have reached a point that even your own family is being threatened I'm talking about it has gotten to a point your child since a teenager has started verbally assaulting immediate members and has gotten into physical confrontation with friends, relatives and strangers at school.

Your had previous signs of problems around when they hit puberty but even with all you could do to address those problems then it spiralled out into these immediate threats to the rest of the family.

The discussion I'm focusing on is whether or not parents should always be held responsible when things get this bad. If you do believe they are responsible what could you have done better than already attempting to use multiple therapists, increasing the levels of which you monitor your children with each new incident and having heart to heart conversations.

The reddit story you're referencing is an anonymous, unverified story. That's why the original thread for this discussion was locked. It seems like you've created this thread and reassumed that the reddit story is credible, again.
 

GeoGonzo

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,329
Madrid, Spain
Parents are like goalkeepers:

Sometimes there was nothing they could do.
Sometimes they absolutely fucked up on something that looks obvious and easy.

The fact of the matter is, our children are our responsibility. Their mistakes are our mistakes. This is sometimes unfair, but life often is.
 

Deleted member 13645

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
6,052
When I say things have reached a point that even your own family is being threatened I'm talking about it has gotten to a point your child since a teenager has started verbally assaulting immediate members and has gotten into physical confrontation with friends, relatives and strangers at school.

Your had previous signs of problems around when they hit puberty but even with all you could do to address those problems then it spiralled out into these immediate threats to the rest of the family.

The discussion I'm focusing on is whether or not parents should always be held responsible when things get this bad. If you do believe they are responsible what could you have done better than already attempting to use multiple therapists, increasing the levels of which you monitor your children with each new incident and having heart to heart conversations.

At least imo I would need context about why (from the kid's perspective) why they're doing those things. In their eyes, why are they getting into verbal and physical confrontations? They likely have a reason for it that makes sense to them. From there, it's about figuring out how to deal with that and that may require therapy (even if multiple therapists have been tried, it may be just it wasn't the right therapists). But i've never been a parent so that's just my initial thoughts on how i'd try to deal with it. Are you trying to reach a thought experiment wherein the kid in question is "irredeemable" (or is a lost cause or etc.) and how to deal with that as a parent of asking if that's the parent's fault?
 

Hollywood Duo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
41,967
It would've been cleaner but I also specifically wanted to hear more thoughts from the people I quoted. The thread got locked before they elaborated further on their stances.
It's not credible to me for a good parent to not realize their child is showing psychopathic tendencies. At the very least you would know something is very wrong with them. Get them professional help or it's on you for what happens next.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,401
The reddit story you're referencing is an anonymous, unverified story. That's why the original thread for this discussion was locked. It seems like you've created this thread and reassumed that the reddit story is credible, again.


I literally said.

The original thread was locked and there is no point in going over the reasons it was locked. What matters is the discussion here about parenting so use your own imagination on what would warrant this chain.

I don't care about continuing that story which is why you see the first 3 people asking for more context. I do care about the philosophical talk about parental responsibility that thread started.
 

Squarehard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
25,892
I literally said.

The original thread was locked and there is no point in going over the reasons it was locked. What matters is the discussion here about parenting so use your own imagination on what would warrant this chain.

I don't care about continuing that story which is why you see the first 3 people asking for more context. I do care about the philosophical talk about parental responsibility that thread started.
Then why not just reframe the discussion into your own context, rather than sloppily copy and paste from that other thread, and then provide no clear context into the OP?

From your subsequent posts in response to requests for clarification, it feels as if you have enough to frame a hypothetical question even if the story wasn't real, but why not just do that instead of lazily doing what you did here instead?

And if you want to hear more from the people you quoted, then make a three way private message with them, rather than bringing in everybody else into this discussion.

It feels as if you have some sort of ulterior motive, rather than just wanting to discuss this further with them. Why the hell do we all nee to be in this conversation too if it's for your own curiosity? And why throw people under the bus directly?
 
Oct 25, 2017
21,466
Sweden
I literally said.

The original thread was locked and there is no point in going over the reasons it was locked. What matters is the discussion here about parenting so use your own imagination on what would warrant this chain.

I don't care about continuing that story which is why you see the first 3 people asking for more context. I do care about the philosophical talk about parental responsibility that thread started.
so why didn't you make the thread about the philosophical points completely, and without dwelling on whatever went down in the previous thread

it would've required more work from you, but generated much better discussion

at this point i don't think this thread is salvageable. imho, you should ask for it to be locked and make a new one with a bit more effort
 
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