It's still posible to rely heavily on story without the need of voice acting.
This is Pokémon ffs, i'd rather them spending those resources on anything else.
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What's with the animosity towards Game Freak & Pokémon as of late? Is it justified?
- Thread starter Neoxon
- Start date
This is Pokémon ffs, i'd rather them spending those resources on anything else.
the pokemon games haven't changed much. i know the graphics style changed quite a bit with X+Y but otherwise they are more or less the same games with more uninspired pokemon stuffed in.
the games sell like crazy so the formula is doing them well but they really haven't innovated much. i won't be buying another pokemon game until they try something new gameplay wise.
the games sell like crazy so the formula is doing them well but they really haven't innovated much. i won't be buying another pokemon game until they try something new gameplay wise.
Don't rob 6 year olds the chance to practice their reading. They might become overly reliant on voice acting.
Well that would obviously happen too, but don't forget they are trying for a specific art style here
Pokémon games have innovated a lot. I am sick of this narrative.
Just because they haven't changed majorly like what happened with Breath of the Wild does not mean they don't innovate
I prefer the gibberish language in something like Ori and the Blind Forest to some awkwardly delivered VA. (Odyssey did this too)
Imagine some of the cheesier Pokemon dialogue with potentially awkward English voice overs.
Ignoring the rest of the games out there, or from an series-isolated point of view?
What new Pokemon are uninspired? Even the ratata of Gen 7, yungoos, was inspired by the Hawaiians importing the mongoose to combat their rat problem. Certainly more inspired than "Muk" or "Seel"
Then why even tell fans to keep their expectations in check? They'll see what the next pokemon game looks like in May (assuming it releases in 2018)
You sure? The dialogue in Sun and Moon is...ok. Nothing close to "good" if we compare it to other narrative heavy rpg (or jrpg) games.
Today?
I've never heard of a story heavy, AAA game that has no voice acting. I'm sure Game Freak has the money to hire competent voice actors without having it negatively effect other aspects of the game.
You mean like rainbow muk?
Im sure Nintendo had the money to hire competent VA for Zelda too. Or any one of the many Japanese games that gets localized into English and sounds like that.
I don't really see many people calling for Pokemon to not be turn based. The game can be open world (or at least, more open) while still being turn based. These aren't mutually exclusive and don't require a "genre shift".
I think having a world that is fully third person with a controllable camera makes sense and is the direction Pokemon has started to head in the past two generations. The Switch entry makes total sense to be the one to take the full plunge, and that doesn't have to come at the cost to turn based battles.
I don't think people are saying there haven't been innovations and advancements at all. Just that those innovations and advancements should be greater for a series that has been running 20 years with near annual releases. Game Freak also has the (dumb) tendency to create a new feature for a game that is then taken away or greatly diminished in the next title. It feels very two steps forward, one step back, frequently.
No, there are people who legitimately believe there have been no innovations and enhancements
Yes. Today. It is possible, actually.
Voice acting on Pokémon is a waste on money and cartridge space. I'd rather read every single line of dialogue than lose some content because of the projected cartridge size.
This is an alternative, too.
Well, Nintendo dub here in Spain isn't too shabby, so it wouldn't be exactly awkward. But unless a game rely on voice acting for storytelling or atmosphere purposes in game (Starfox, KI: Uprising, The Elder Scrolls, Batman Arkham... ) I'll always see it as a waste of resources.
btw, off topic trivia here, General Pepper in both Starfox 64 3D and Starfox Zero is dubbed here by Snake's voice Alfonso Vallés. It's... weird, but sounds nice.
Alolan forms are celebrations of 20 years of Pokemon and the Pokedex has descriptions as to why and how they adapted to Alola
As someone who follows the main series for the most part, I really haven't noticed anything special or innovative regarding GFs game design.
Sun and Moon was a great "first step" How about taking those games and greatly improving the scale and exploration? Give me the 3D space of Sun and Moon with a significantly larger number or routes. Why can't we compare the next pokemon to Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (in terms of world and environmental detail)? They're both jrpgs.
You really need to look at other "Pokémon on Switch" threads here :/
I feel like people are justified by saying that TPC often removes features players like (like PSS in XY and Dex Nav in ORAS) but they also try new things every time
Maybe I'm glossing over these people. But I do genuinely believe that most fans of this franchise don't want to see it become an action game. I think most -do- want to see it become more open world. But that is okay and a somewhat inevitable change that Game Freak has been -very- slowly implementing for a decade now.
I don't disagree. Especially since Pokemon will be on the system -after- a big RPG like that. Comparisons will be drawn. Again though, I don't think the world has to be -that- open. But I do think running around in 3D fields is what a lot of people are expecting... and again, that doesn't have to come at the cost of turn based battling (which I absolutely think is necessary).
Golf Story did great dialogue boxes. Just copy that, Game Freak.
Oh I agree, most actual fans of the franchise don't. It's the very vocal people who haven't played since RBY or GSC who insist the game needs to change for the Switch to be like this.
On my long list of quality of life improvement wishes would be do away with the whole forget ability system.
You still limit moves per pokemon to 4 but instead of forgetting moves completely, moves just get put into a dormant ability list.
From which you can equip/requip them(and you can put more limits on that like you have to be in a pokemon center etc). But basically it would be nice if abilities were basically treated like gear of a pokemon. By extension TMs stop being items and are just trainer skills you can earn/learn that will automatically pop up in the dormant ability list of eligible pokemon. Stuff like that in my mind cuts down on unnecessary menu navigation and just streamlines the experience and I don't feel there is something about the fantasy of being a pokemon trainer that would get lost here? At least that's how I feel about it.
And I feel like pokemon as a series has tons of stuff that might profit from reapproaching menu navigation for stuff like that. Like the throw pokeball shortcut is pretty recent which just seems crazy to me when you think about how that stand in context to lesson the rest of the world learned about UI user experience since 2008.
You still limit moves per pokemon to 4 but instead of forgetting moves completely, moves just get put into a dormant ability list.
From which you can equip/requip them(and you can put more limits on that like you have to be in a pokemon center etc). But basically it would be nice if abilities were basically treated like gear of a pokemon. By extension TMs stop being items and are just trainer skills you can earn/learn that will automatically pop up in the dormant ability list of eligible pokemon. Stuff like that in my mind cuts down on unnecessary menu navigation and just streamlines the experience and I don't feel there is something about the fantasy of being a pokemon trainer that would get lost here? At least that's how I feel about it.
And I feel like pokemon as a series has tons of stuff that might profit from reapproaching menu navigation for stuff like that. Like the throw pokeball shortcut is pretty recent which just seems crazy to me when you think about how that stand in context to lesson the rest of the world learned about UI user experience since 2008.
US/UM are the first games I'm skipping, ever. No animosity intended, but I guess I can see why. Some people feel as though Game Freak are resting on their laurels, and while I agree to an extent, I also keep in mind that they're trying to fast-track an HD title while also juggling US/UM.
Japanese people and kids are more literate than ever before, in a world where more games are voiced than ever before. They'll manage just fine.
Most of the animosity I've noticed stems from people complaining for some reason that they don't have a Switch Pokemon yet. Beyond this, some weirdo's actually think US/UM belong on Switch, because yeah stretching a 240p game to the Switch's screen wouldn't go horribly wrong or anything lol. (Sarcasm)
Otherwise, most of the posts in the US/UM OT are on the positive side from what I noticed.
Otherwise, most of the posts in the US/UM OT are on the positive side from what I noticed.
It does? Last one I played was X it wasn't in there. My bad for that part then. Fairly sure the tm thing though is still item based of you having to navigate to a menu and use that item.
Doesn't change my base point though that Pokemon overall has a lot of unnecessary menu navigation that can be drastically cut down.
It's existed since Ruby & Sapphire...
Sun & Moon expanded it further by letting you teach Pokémon moves that it has yet to learn as well.
The games they play usually don't have voice acting. Many people have said that they learned to read playing Pokémon and Dragon Quest. No reason to add voice acting when reading works just as well.
Well, now leaving aside useless discussion, if we're to make some suggestions, i've been having in my mind for a lot of time a Trainer level system.
The trainer earns experience and levels up doing what we do in every game. I mean, you earn experience for
- Catching pokémon
- Breeding Pokémon
- Hatching eggs
- Leveling up pokémon
Those kind of things.
During progressions, you can unlock a series of advantages and abilities in a tree, so you can specialize on some things. Also something like a job system based on your most used Pokémon would be nice.
But, well, that's just dreaming. Pokémon Go has a leveling system for the trainer, so maybe that can sneak in some for into the main series.
Er... yes, it's there. Just yesterday i rearranged the moves of a shiny Patrat i received via Wonder Trade in Moon
The trainer earns experience and levels up doing what we do in every game. I mean, you earn experience for
- Catching pokémon
- Breeding Pokémon
- Hatching eggs
- Leveling up pokémon
Those kind of things.
During progressions, you can unlock a series of advantages and abilities in a tree, so you can specialize on some things. Also something like a job system based on your most used Pokémon would be nice.
But, well, that's just dreaming. Pokémon Go has a leveling system for the trainer, so maybe that can sneak in some for into the main series.
Er... yes, it's there. Just yesterday i rearranged the moves of a shiny Patrat i received via Wonder Trade in Moon
That isn't quite what he's asking. Yes technically you can achieve what he wants but it's a very roundabout way. (Unless I too am missing something). Being able to easily swap moves you want on and off of a Pokemon, from a pool of moves it has already learned, would be really nice.
I imagine it could work very similar to how you "Allocate" abilities in Chrono Cross.
Yeah I think you misunderstand me. The way I imagine it is think like any kind of lootgame with character gear and how effortless it often is to change in change out equipment. That kinda approach for abilities that your pokemon has learned at one point in time. If that is already in X pls explain how to do it I booted it up and can't find it.
Yes, you need to locate someone to do it for you for a price, but technically is there. Every single move learned (even egg moves) by a Pokémon are not deleted but moved aside. You can make the Pokémon relearn them paying a heart scale. In essence it's the same, but you can't do it on the go.
Right, doing it like this instead of talking to different NPCs and having some sort of price attached would be very convenient:
https://youtu.be/3Or5K6JURu8?t=3m58s
(Imagine on the left there's still only 4 slots you can equip abilities to).
https://youtu.be/3Or5K6JURu8?t=3m58s
(Imagine on the left there's still only 4 slots you can equip abilities to).
I don't care about VA but your reasoning for why it shouldn't be there is bizarre nonsense. Literacy rates aren't going to drop because of voice acting in DQ and Pokemon.
Thx yeah that's kinda of what I meant.
But it's def not the only thing pokemon I feel is chock full of rather cumbersome stuff that I think can be streamlined without breaking anything.
I thought Sun and Moon were great but it took them a while to get to that point. XY and ORAS were both very mediocre.
I expect the same with the Switch games so maybe gen 9 will give us a good game.
If they exceed my expectations then that's fantastic.
I expect the same with the Switch games so maybe gen 9 will give us a good game.
If they exceed my expectations then that's fantastic.
I liked sun and moon, but its a given that for an studio that has the "rights" to the main line RPG pokemon games, they are incredible small and to some degree, just bad.
from the past its well know that GF had to be directly saved by Iwata during Gold/ Silver, and X and Y, their 1st try at a 3DS pokemon, the walking controls were still locked on a 8 paths directions and the frame rate would drop below 10, on a turn base game
from the past its well know that GF had to be directly saved by Iwata during Gold/ Silver, and X and Y, their 1st try at a 3DS pokemon, the walking controls were still locked on a 8 paths directions and the frame rate would drop below 10, on a turn base game
I never said literacy rates would drop, I said that it was a way to practice reading. And a fun way at that. Children have to learn to read one way or another or forever be a burden on their parents and society.
I mean...that Tapu Shrine 'puzzle' using Machamp is total joke...and I think that's the only occasion you ever use Machamp in story ? Lol.
I wonder if it's too much work to include Hard mode for adult fans. Have the battle mode set to Set, trainer AI closer to Battle tower, higher level and pokemon number, etc.
That's what's naturally gonna happen when like.on switch comes out,some of you guys just think its just gonna be a 3ds game in HD and I guess it's negative if thsyd the right word because every Pokemon game has introduced qol things and graphics upgrades and with the switch being as powerful as it is, they are gonna have to take their biggest leap yet, once the trailer drops people are just gonna shut up about it because "wow hd Pokemon" and things like it should be BOTW will fall by the wayside for a while
Black and White nailed it, then X and Y sent it waaaaay back. I know that was a technical neccesity, but I'd honestly trade slightly less detailed models for a battle system that wasn't a total bore.
"Burden on parents and society", Jesus Christ. They can practice their reading just fine with VA. With the added bonus of not having to ask their parents how to read that kanji in Dragon Quest as often, because they can now hear how it's pronounced. Burden on parents lessened, isn't that great.
How would it break the game though? Like my main point isn't make this function available without restrictions. My main point is more about making this function convenient to use menu navigation wise. Basically the only thing I have in mind is that equipping different abilities should feel as effortless as equipping gear in most rpgs(dragon quest, FF, trails etc). You can retain whatever restrictions on top of that(like can only be done in x place for y price etc).
I mean likely there are currently technical limitations at work with the way those games are programmed I assume.
But as for the inbetween games like bravely default or kiseki already have working solutions where you can just adjust battle speed to 2x/4x(so animation are still there) etc or skip animation with a button press. But in general the solution is just to give more options/tools to players to let them pace battles at their will.
Why I am against the addition of so many new Pokemon over the years is mostly because it seems like the only thing that game freak really do to justify a new entry, and although it adds to the meta game a lot, the inclusion of so many Pokémon doesn't make the game itself more fun necessarily.
Dunno, maybe they shouldn't just add soooo many with every new game.
Dunno, maybe they shouldn't just add soooo many with every new game.
I personally liked SM and will buy USUM out of curiousity some point, but nothing is terribly exciting with where the series is going. But for me, animosity is deserved if its a direct result from a certain viewpoint. That is the one I certainly hold, which is that after gen 5 Gamefreak has dropped the ball pretty damn hard. Black White is as barebones as Sun and Moon, if not a little more content filled because of some post game routes and cities, but the base game was still far superior in all other regards. Better routes, more challenging, actual caves and dungeons, no area cut screens and ridiculous map jumping, etc. Then when you go into the second pair of games Gen 5 is in a league of its own, and that is where the issue lies. Gamefreak did something entirely new, brought in some great gameplay changes with Hidden Grove encounters, a great in game achievement system, a new Sidequest that doesn't require battles, and so on so forth. It was a great step forward and showed promise for what Gen 6 could be. And don't even get me started on gen 6, which ignored everything Gen 5 did, and brought us an unfocused single player game that championed the online aspect more then ever and generally sucked bar Pokemon design. Its why I mentioned Gen 7 first in this post, because its a continuation of Gen 5s design philosophies on all fronts, but its still a butchered experience that shows Gamefreak is having major issues on a technical front.
TLDR; Gamefreak deserves critisism, but only because after Gen 5 which was a great starting point for something new and exciting, Gamefreak decided that online deserves more focus and said fuck you to the single player crowd who enjoys exploring the region, doing things at their own pace, and continuing to play long after they beat the league, which without online nowadays is all but impossible.
TLDR; Gamefreak deserves critisism, but only because after Gen 5 which was a great starting point for something new and exciting, Gamefreak decided that online deserves more focus and said fuck you to the single player crowd who enjoys exploring the region, doing things at their own pace, and continuing to play long after they beat the league, which without online nowadays is all but impossible.
The single player game would be broken
You could theoretically change movesets of a single Pokémon for each gym/trainer that challenged you instead of going out to catch something in the area to beat them like Gamefreak intended
That kind of "Gaming" the system wouldn't really happen until around the last gym unless people really grind their Pokemon... which they can already do to just overpower them by out-leveling. If you have, say, a Fire pokemon up against a rock gym and you suddenly have access to give it scratch and ember (or whatever) again, it's not going to suddenly make that pokemon more effective at the rock gym.
I think having this kind of feature would have little to no effect on peoples' desire to catch other Pokemon. In the early-mid game people are still going to want to catch plenty of stuff. People usually start to determine what kind of team they want by then and stop catching everything anyway. Alternatively, the players who actively try to catch 'em all aren't going to be deterred by this kind of feature.