What's your opinion on people who say they have no right to criticize an athlete if the critic themselves have never played professionally before?

[Duncan]

I hear this all the time now amongst my circle of friends now whenever they talk about sports journalists or media criticizing players on how they play.

"How can you talk about basketball if you never dribbled a ball before yourself?"

"How can you talk about MMA if you never stepped onto the octagon yourself?"

I watch All The Smoke with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes who really build their entire show around having this whole 'by athletes for athletes' type of product and all the time they and their guests say the exact same thing. Great show btw I highly recommend it.

 

[Rhomega]

I feel with that mentality, no one would have the right to criticize anything outside of their field of work.

 

[Volimar]

I imagine it depends on the criticism. If you're saying like "Basketball isn't even hard" or something, then yeah you should probably have the experience so you know what you're talking about.

 

[bionic77]

It's just an opinion just like the first person had on the athlete.

It's a dumb position to take but that's common in the land of opinions. See 90% of the takes on the internet.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Ad hominem? The 'let's see YOU do better' argument always grates me. Like needing to know the topic at hand to the same degree as the person means you can't criticize anything whatsoever because you cannot do it.

If I see a bridge fall down because it was done poorly and I say "man that was a shitty bridge" and someone says "well you aren't an engineer let's see YOU do better!" it's super grating.

I consider it as annoying as asking why people can breathe underwater in say a fantasy story that for the most part never established that people could breathe underwater and I get the wiggly eyebrowed motherfucker "REALLY? You're going to ask that in a story with DRAGONS AND MAGIC?!"

 

[ascii42]

"How can you complain that the surgeon removed the wrong organ if you've never performed surgery yourself?"

 

[blazenumb1]

Depends on the criticism. If it's you have never played said sport so how can you have an opinion, I agree. If it's something else like cheating the game, drugs, trouble with the law, etc, it's a lot more open to discuss.

 

[Seesaw15]

Clearly anyone can have an opinion but there is nuance to it imo. In an ideal world a person would have a little bit of real world practice to balance out all the theory they studied to give them perspective. Or at the very least they are so well versed on the topic that they wouldn't say dumb shit.

 

[CloseTalker]

There's an element of truth to it. Take what you do for work, and imagine some random person talking about how your job should be done better. Would probably annoy you

 

[RastaMentality]

Click to shrink...

You can disparage people's lack of knowledge when they say shit like this yes.

 

[Gundam]

It's dumb.

Sport Analysis is worthless dribble but not because half the people that are paid to talk about it haven't played the sport they're talking about.

 

[Ultimate Bear Cub]

Do they have the right to defend an athlete from criticism if they never played professionally?

 

[Squarehard]

It's not about their background, it's about what they're actually saying.

Even people who are actually in the sport have no idea what they're talking about sometimes, more often than not.

 

[Eugene's Axe]

I hear this all the time now amongst my circle of friends now whenever they talk about sports journalists or media criticizing players on how they play.

"How can you talk about basketball if you never dribbled a ball before yourself?"

"How can you talk about MMA if you never stepped onto the octagon yourself?"

I watch All The Smoke with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes who really build their entire show around having this whole 'by athletes for athletes' type of product and all the time they and their guests say the exact same thing. Great show btw I highly recommend it.

Click to shrink...

Everyone is supposed to be good at their profession. If I'm a professional actor and I suck at it then people have all the right to criticize me.

 

[THE210]

It depends on the specific subject being discussed. There are certain topics that should be left to those who have actually been in the area.

 

[Doctor_Xoa]

I don't need to be a professional chef to know that this soup you've served me is cold, too salty for my taste, and has a fly floating in it.

 

[GalvoAg]

I kind of agree with it, everyone thinks they're an expert or knowledgeable on any subject these days.

 

[Haze]

I've never played football outside of pickup games but I can tell you for certain that jameis winston is not a good quarterback.

I don't need to have played in the NFL to know what makes a good QB.

 

[ConVito]

Personally I go with Steve Hofstetter's way of thinking. (Paraphrased) I don't know how to fly a helicopter, but if I saw one stuck in a tree, I could pretty confidently say "dude fucked up."

 

[Haze]

Like where does this line of thinking end?

Film critics can't critique a movie unless they've directed one?

 

[Conciliator]

You always have the right to critique

And other people always have to right to consider your critique dumb or worthless.

And you have the right to think they don't know what they're talking about!

 

[leng jai]

It's not like saying you can't criticise food you order at a restaurant unless you're a professional chef yourself.

 

[SugarNoodles]

anti intellectualism

 

[RiOrius]

It depends on the criticism. I can't stand when people say that some particular pro athlete is "trash," or "garbage," or "terrible." They're a professional athlete! Better than 99.9% of the population! You're sitting on your couch drinking a beer and you're gonna scream that someone else isn't good at the game?

I understand the concept of hyperbole, but when it's taken to such ridiculous extremes, and so negative, I get upset. Which I argue is far more valid than the people who get upset because "their team" is losing.

Even at the professional level, people will make mistakes. And certainly people will get outplayed, since the people on the other team are also the best of the best. But nobody makes it onto the field without being excellent at the game.

 

[eXistor]

You can criticize anything you have no experience in. I have no experience in making games or movies either, but I can recognize and criticize a badly made one.People can know a lot about things they have no first-hand experience in. Otherwise people in general should probably just...stop talking altogether, which now that I think about it isn't a bad proposition.

 

[Sacrilicious]

The argument really doesn't make much sense - the role of a critic is to analyze the performance of a professional, not to perform at a professional level.

The "lets see YOU do better" argument primarily applies to a lack of appreciation in your personal life. It's the kind of thing people say when someone, for example, cooks a meal or does a chore and another person shits on it even though they didn't contribute.

Someone who is being paid to perform at expert levels should expect to have their performance scrutinized. That's not an excuse for people to be cruel or have unrealistic expectations, but it's absolutely fair game to analyze the quality of the performance regardless of your own skill level.

 

[Draconis]

Completely depends on the sport, and what is involved. But in general, unless you know actively what you are talking about, the value of your critique is far less than that of an knowledgeable individual who actively practices or participates in the activity as a whole.

Let's take Medieval Sword Fighting from say, Fiore's knowledge, or the German traditions. If a well known instructor within HEMA or say, my Guild critiques me on a parry, a levada technique, or how I am handling matters of concern in say, Largo vs Stretto and Hand, Body, Foot, and so on...I am going to listen.

If however, you have dumbasses like this complete jackass who decided to insert full on foot into mouth, and then doubled down, like a frigging idiot...then no, your critique has no value because it is an opinion, and a completely and wholly incorrect one, at that.

 

[subpar spatula]

I would believe someone more if they've played the sport or whatever they're critiquing. That doesn't mean they are always correct.

 

[Deleted member 3465]

I agree to an extent, but this applies to almost everything. People saying a player is lazy or just sucks and doesn't deserve to play is pretty ignorant when you consider the amount of time that goes into being an athlete. Especially at that level even the "worst" is really amazing in my eyes. As long as it's constructive I'm okay with it, but it should never be personal or petty. People tend to exaggerate when it comes to entertainment and that does get annoying pretty fast, I can't imagine being a player and reading that.

 

[Actinium]

Valid criticism can come from anyone, but not all criticism is valid.

You'll often hear a mix of both valid and invalid in a single statement, like 'the defense is getting torn apart', and that will both be true in that the hypothetical team is unable to prevent successful plays by the opponents, but also misplaced blame in that maybe the defensive team members are getting bad plays from a coach, or being forced to play while injured, or are unwilling to risk injury for what they consider an unfair wage, or maybe the offense is actually losing control of the ball or puck or whatever so often that the team is placed on the defensive too much and those players are getting exhausted, or a hundred other things an inexperienced outside observer isn't taking into account.

 

[Deleted member 8166]

I kind of agree with it, everyone thinks they're an expert or knowledgeable on any subject these days.

Click to shrink...

"these days" lol


on topic: you can be a critic of a football team even if you never played football, because you have a lot of knowledge about the topic maybe read books about tactics etc.

 

[Hate]

You can criticize athletes but I will more likely believe a fellow athletes opinion/criticism than someone else.

 

[Baji Boxer]

Depends on the criticism.

 

[XaviConcept]

It depends on the criticism, when clowns are bashing players with the "they dont have the clutch gene" or "they dont want it bad enough" bullshit then I think its totally warranted to dismiss those people.

 

[Darknight]

I think giving criticism whether something is good or bad doesn't necessarily need someone to have first hand experience but where the problem lies is when people who lack knowledge and experience try to explain why something is good or bad.

 

[sirap]

No one likes a backseat driver.

 

[Klyka]

"How can you criticize the Presidents actions if you've never been President yourself?"

 

[Croc Man]

Its a ridiculous argument most of the time but occasionally is warranted.
Mostly when it comes to athletes mindsets, how can the average person ever know what 60,000 of your own fans booing you feels like and how that effects performance?

Also occasionally somebody will think everyone should be like a FIFA player or Messi for things that are usually difficult but can me made to look easy.

 

[Deleted member 8852]

Taking this to its inevitable conclusion would mean nobody would be able to criticize anybody unless they are part of that extremely specific group.

So, it's dumb.

 

[Kinketsu]

I need to turn in my degree because I, full disclosure, did not write Frost at Midnight

 

[Metal Slugger]

I don't talk about sports at all, so mission accomplished.

 

[Deleted member 9932]

I'm fairly sure they are probably idiots. Doesn't mean there aren't a lot of idiotic opinions too.

 

[Menchin]

You can't criticize Jeff Bezos until you become a multi-billionaire

 

[kmfdmpig]

I feel with that mentality, no one would have the right to criticize anything outside of their field of work.

Click to shrink...

Exactly. That mindset means no one can judge anything. Don't like the meal at a restaurant? Too bad if you're not a professional chef. Think that Cats is a bad movie? If you're not an actor, costume designer, sfx artist or director then bite your tongue. Think Milli Vanilli is crap? Well you're not a professional singer. We can still comparitively judge things against others. While I'll never be a better QB than Baker Mayfield I can judge that he'll never be elite and doesn't lead well or conduct himself well with media.

 

[Deleted member 2802]

I find it hilarious. It's like when old people give their hot takes about video games.

 

[nekkid]

The difference is only one is trying to be a professional athlete.

 

[Yossarian]

I feel with that mentality, no one would have the right to criticize anything outside of their field of work.

Click to shrink...

It's less about people's right to criticise something. Anyone can, for sure; I just think maybe the opinions of people without any experience in a field whatsoever should probably be given less weight?

Opinions are too often treated as sacred. I don't know how many times I've heard "Well, that's just my opinion" to end an argument when confronted with facts or expert testimonies.

Reminds me of this:

 

[Mona]

its a dumb as hell argument alot of the time

 

[Kittens McMittens]

You have no right to criticise me if you haven't lived my life.

 

[Serene]

It depends on the criticism. I can't stand when people say that some particular pro athlete is "trash," or "garbage," or "terrible." They're a professional athlete! Better than 99.9% of the population! You're sitting on your couch drinking a beer and you're gonna scream that someone else isn't good at the game?

I understand the concept of hyperbole, but when it's taken to such ridiculous extremes, and so negative, I get upset. Which I argue is far more valid than the people who get upset because "their team" is losing.

Even at the professional level, people will make mistakes. And certainly people will get outplayed, since the people on the other team are also the best of the best. But nobody makes it onto the field without being excellent at the game.

Click to shrink...

You have to realize it's all relative. Nobody thinks a lower-tier NBA player is "bad at basketball" compared to you or me. It's a qualitative statement relative to their competition. I don't think every off-hand remark needs to preface that. You can just kind of assume that's what the intent of the judgement is.