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Where are the 50 year old game developers?

maks

maks

Member
Oct 27, 2017
418
They are in a paradise land often referred to as 'life after games'. A place where we work nearly half the hours, on well-managed agile projects, for a significantly better salary, and with alot more job security! Some even have more time to play and actually enjoy games once you stop working on them. Interesting side effect.
 
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Scottt

Scottt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,208
maks said:
They are in a paradise land often referred to as 'life after games'. A place where we work nearly half the hours, on well-managed agile projects, for a significantly better salary, and with alot more job security! Some even have more time to play and actually enjoy games once you stop working on them. Interesting side effect.
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Are you someone like that? What sort of job did you take on afterward?
 
RPTGB

RPTGB

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,189
UK
....46 year old pixel pusher here.

Depends who you work for and I suppose how happy you are, I don't think there is a hard and fast rule on this stuff. There's certainly more than a few of my workmates who are on the wrong side of 35.
Some move on into more of a middle management/production role rather than grafting with us footsoldiers!

A lot of people involved in the art and animation side sometimes move into film or TV FX production when they have had their fill of games development. I've seen a few old workmates names pop up in film credits.
Teaching or freelancing are other options.
 
Karateka

Karateka

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Oct 28, 2017
6,940
I still dream of developing games but i have no education or experience in the industry...
Probably too old now.
 
oneils

oneils

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Oct 25, 2017
3,071
Ottawa Canada
Seems like the industry is still very young, so devs in their 50s will be rare to begin with as the industry was a lot smaller 30 years ago.

I wonder if game development is something someone would take on in their 50s, as a new career? That's an interesting question. I'm guessing probably not?
 

Deleted member 888

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Fumito Ueda is almost there and he still looks 30.

I'd expect him to look 80 after TLGs development.
 
Hollywood Pescado

Hollywood Pescado

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Apr 28, 2018
305
I'm getting hope from reading some of the replies here.

I'll be turning 30 next month and I want to work in the gaming industry someday (if I don't like it I'll transition to something else though). But I'm not ready yet. I still have a lot to learn. I would like to be an animator and if possible, work my way up or something. I just feel like people my age should be in the industry already with years of experience. I feel like I'm behind, but I'm not going to give up or anything.
 
smash_robot

smash_robot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
994
In addition to all the comments here, I'd add that age discrimination is a problem in tech fields generally. Nearly 50 myself and I know that I will have to obfuscate my age if I have to look for a new software development role.
 
RPTGB

RPTGB

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,189
UK
Hollywood Pescado said:
I'm getting hope from reading some of the replies here.

I'll be turning 30 next month and I want to work in the gaming industry someday (if I don't like it I'll transition to something else though). But I'm not ready yet. I still have a lot to learn. I would like to be an animator and if possible, work my way up or something. I just feel like people my age should be in the industry already with years of experience. I feel like I'm behind, but I'm not going to give up or anything.
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Talent will always win out, regardless of industry experience, especially on the creative side.
One of the animators I used to work alongside entered the gaming industry in his forties.
He used to be a "proper" animator, having worked for Cosgrove Hall and Don Bluth Studios, we always though he was slumming it in games development.;)

A good showreel will get your foot in the door, though more and more devs, unfortunately in my personal opinion, are using motion and facial capture these days.
 
Kamisori

Kamisori

Member
Oct 26, 2017
157
France
Most exit the industry in their 40s to take a more general developer job (in software and/or web) since it's better paid, more stable and less stressing/exhausting (and they usually quickly find a position thanks to their experience in the videogame industry).

Of course there is a few who go in management roles or stay doing the grunt work, but they are the few in this situation.

End even if the industry is relatively young, it doesn't prevent to hire more "senior" dev for very technical position but it's complicated to find people who are willing to do it prior experience in the videogame industry (and because videogame studios hardly compete with others developers sectors salary-wise). That's also an issue for the industry because they can't keep seniors/leads very long which mean a huge loss of skill when someone leave the industry/a studio).

I have a bit more of 8 years in the videogame industry (yet it's in France) and i didn't encounter many people/colleagues over 45 yo and it was particularly visible in events like internal christmas parties with others studios of a publisher for example.
 
Hollywood Pescado

Hollywood Pescado

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Apr 28, 2018
305
RPTGB said:
Talent will always win out, regardless of industry experience, especially on the creative side.
One of the animators I used to work alongside entered the gaming industry in his forties.
He used to be a "proper" animator, having worked for Cosgrove Hall and Don Bluth Studios, we always though he was slumming it in games development.;)

A good showreel will get your foot in the door, though more and more devs, unfortunately in my personal opinion, are using motion and facial capture these days.
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Thanks for the advice!

Motion and facial capture does worry me a bit.
 
RPTGB

RPTGB

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,189
UK
Kamisori said:
Most exit the industry in their 40s to take a more general developer job (in software and/or web) since it's better paid, more stable and less stressing/exhausting (and they usually quickly find a position thanks to their experience in the videogame industry).

Of course there is a few who go in management roles or stay doing the grunt work, but they are the few in this situation.

End even if the industry is relatively young, it doesn't prevent to hire more "senior" dev for very technical position but it's complicated to find people who are willing to do it prior experience in the videogame industry (and because videogame studios hardly compete with others developers sectors salary-wise). That's also an issue for the industry because they can't keep seniors/leads very long which mean a huge loss of skill when someone leave the industry/a studio).

I have a bit more of 8 years in the videogame industry (yet it's in France) and i didn't encounter many people/colleagues over 45 yo and it was particularly visible in events like internal christmas parties with others studios of a publisher for example.
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Yep, the studio I worked for, before we were involved in a merger, had an average of 11+ years industry experience,..I think the UK average at the time was somewhere between 4-4-7 years.

Studios with younger staff are probably going to have lots of young, free and single guts and girls employed who are just starting out and who want to grab a few years experience before moving on to something bigger and better. As you get older, with marriages and families involved, job security tends to be more important than any ambitions!
 
Beatle

Beatle

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Dec 4, 2017
1,123
Nintendo as company does it right in their treatment of people, with some others, it's not universal, but if a company treats people poorly where few stay in after 45 then they should be called out for it
 
Remember

Remember

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Oct 29, 2017
2,484
Chicago, IL United States
Karateka said:
I still dream of developing games but i have no education or experience in the industry...
Probably too old now.
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Never say never. Work your way up through another industry( like marketing or translation for example) and then bounce over to a video game developer or publisher. There are plenty of non-programming jobs in the industry that are necessary for a game's success and that also put you within the range of a studio to collaborate with.

Edit: According to Kamiya, Keiji Inafune(co-creator of Megaman) is more of a business mind than an artistic mind, but he still managed to be a lead on multiple projects.
 
maks

maks

Member
Oct 27, 2017
418
Scotthe said:
Are you someone like that? What sort of job did you take on afterward?
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I worked in games from early 90's to 2011. Had a few year break in the middle of it. I'm in my early 40's now and working in software security. I've had 10 or 11 former co-workers (project management, qa, engineering) also work at my current workplace so making a transition from game to software isnt uncommon. Mobile development has also been a good landing spot. I find that software devs in other industries have alot of interest and respect for us.

The 40 and 50 year olds in games that i know are in senior management roles and have typically been in the industry since their 20's. I work with alot more older devs where I'm at now but it's pretty evenly distributed among age groups. (Edit: older folks are still lesser represented but it isnt obviously lopsided towards late 20 / early 30 year olds. I also work with alot of people with 10+ years experience at the same company, so nice to hear and the big reason why I made the career change).
 
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Kamisori

Kamisori

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Oct 26, 2017
157
France
RPTGB said:
As you get older, with marriages and families involved, job security tends to be more important than any ambitions!
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Especially when you have a family. It takes a heavy toll for those who keep working in the industry to have to move out potentially every few years meaning the children has to be registered in a new school, make new friends, find a new job for the wife (or husband), etc...

I even knew very few people who moved out alone and go back every weekend or once a month in their family elsewhere in the country :/ (to let some stability to the children and/or wife/husband)
 
RPTGB

RPTGB

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Oct 28, 2017
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Kamisori said:
Especially when you have a family. It takes a heavy toll for those who keep working in the industry to have to move out potentially every few years meaning the children has to be registered in a new school, make new friends, find a new job for the wife (or husband), etc...

I even knew very few people who moved out alone and go back every weekend or once a month in their family elsewhere in the country :/ (to let some stability to the children and/or wife/husband)
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Yep, been there done that. No job or money is worth missing years of your kids growing up. Luckily, with remote working becoming more popular as a working practice for those staff who need it, that's one problem we should be seeing less of.
 
VFX_Veteran

VFX_Veteran

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Nov 11, 2017
1,003
They go to much more relaxing companies like Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Apple, etc.., start their own start-ups, contract work, etc..
 
balohna

balohna

Member
Nov 1, 2017
4,139
There will probably more people staying in the industry as time goes on, because they aren't really trained to do anything else.

Programmers and managers can move on though, of course.
 
Zhukov

Zhukov

Banned
Dec 6, 2017
2,641
Mad said:
https://gdcvault.com/play/1024944/Failing-to-Fail-The-Spiderweb

Jeff Vogel 26+ years in the industry and still going

The entire thing is fun to watch and a great explanation/look into the industry
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Love that guy.

I don't even play his games anymore, but I'm so glad he's managing to just do his thing, serve his niche and even find success doing it, all the while quietly outlasting studios of hundreds of people.

He has a great attitude toward the whole thing too, somewhere between humble and shameless.
 
SilverArrow20XX

SilverArrow20XX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,442
Tetsuya Nomura is 48. Almost there.
Hironobu Sakaguchi is 55, but I guess it's been a while since he's directed.
Yoshinori Kitase is 52. Also hasn't directed in a while though.

Then there's Motomu Toriyama, who might be 50. He's older than Nomura, but younger than Kitase is all we know, and his birthdy is apparently Feb 8, at which point he'll be either 49, 50, 51, or 52.
 
Kamisori

Kamisori

Member
Oct 26, 2017
157
France
People should stop talking about few specific high profile people, there is ten of thousands of people working in the industry and having few dozens of highly recognizable people doesn't compare to the hundreds or even thousands who left the industry before their 50s.
 
OldBoyGamer

OldBoyGamer

Member
Dec 11, 2017
525
I'll be there in 2 years time. :)

Still making games.* Still loving it. Still cracking my head open against brick walls.

One thing that does happen as you get older is that you tend to be happy to sit back and let younger people take the limelight more.

I worked with a couple of real old school legends when I was younger and I saw the same behaviour in them.

So you'll probably find they're still making games but just more on the quiet.

*Not that you will have heard of any of them!
 
Segafreak

Segafreak

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Oct 27, 2017
2,756
Scotthe said:
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Are you serious? The most famous developers (auteurs) of this industry are all in their 50s, and they're mostly in Japan. Makes sense, Japan reigned supreme in the past. Like most of the famous Western devs are also over 50. Never heard of Gaben, Ken Levine, Warren Spector, Lorne Lanning etc? I barely know any famous dev in their 30, let alone 20.

But if you meant "where are the 50 year olds doing entry level jobs" lol, very few 50 year olds do entry level jobs in any given industry.
 
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KtSlime

KtSlime

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Oct 25, 2017
6,910
Tokyo
If you are just a normal henchmen developer by the age 50 and still there you aren't doing something right.
 
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Scottt

Scottt

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Oct 25, 2017
4,208
Segafreak said:
Are you serious? The most famous developers (auteurs) of this industry are all in their 50s, and they're mostly in Japan. Makes sense, Japan reigned supreme in the past. I barely know any famous dev in their 30, let alone 20.
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Yes, my question about people who have left game development for other careers was serious.
 
Segafreak

Segafreak

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Oct 27, 2017
2,756
Scotthe said:
Yes, my question about people who have left game development for other careers was serious.
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Uh probably some people left it for other careers, like anywhere else? This is a young industry, and the gravitation of development shifted from Japan to the West not that long ago so you'll find even less examples here unless you ask in Japan.
 
Strings

Strings

Member
Oct 27, 2017
31,360
You've got a ton of 50 year olds at SE - Kitase (52), Nomura (well, he's 48), Tokita (53), Kawuza (55), Horii (64) - not to mention at a bunch of other JP companies (Hino of Level-5 is 50, Takahashi of Monolith Soft is 51, Shinji Mikami is 53, etc).
 
Dandy

Dandy

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Oct 25, 2017
4,423
I think people in many fields naturally progress to management the longer they've been in an industry because they are the most experienced.
 
DennyDifferent

DennyDifferent

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Oct 27, 2017
284
Rotherham, England
I'm 35 and have been a programmer in the industry for about 13 years now. I often think about leaving purely because the tools and technologies required to make game vs apps/web/mobile are diverging at an alarming rate and I worry that I'll hit 50 and not want to write games anymore. For the people who do the hiring it's a box ticking exercise. "Do you have X years experience in X language and X, Y and Z frameworks?". So I'd be excluded from a lot of roles or have to take a severe role/pay cut.
 
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