Let's assume the worst and edit it out later if we're wrong, lol
Updated OP with Shadow of the Colossus. Can't watch the video right now, does it have 1080p benefits?
Did this too if people want to join me:
Joined you! :) Guys, please all Twitter Bluepointgames. Maybe we can change something till release in case they indeed plan right now to just lock out HDTV users of a higher resolution mode.
I don't know it from personal experience, but it's been stated by a developer who would know several times, yes.
Too bad we can't expect the gaming media to do any actual journalism... such as getting a straight answer from Sony.
I thought it was worded correctly in the blog article that HDTV users would at least get a better image quality:Let's assume the worst and edit it out later if we're wrong, lol
- Cinematic, which emphasizes image quality, and for owners of compatible 4K HDR displays, boasts a beautiful dynamic 4K image targeting 30 fps
Updated OP with Shadow of the Colossus. Can't watch the video right now, does it have 1080p benefits?
Did this too if people want to join me:
Every PS4 since Oct 2013 had down-sampling as default behavior, internet just decided to conveniently forget about it when Pro/4k displays came out.
I'm more concerned about PS4 Pro games that lock 1080p players into downsampling. A lot of the time, I'd rather just have the smoother frame rates available prior to any Pro support patch. I'm looking at you Fallout 4 and Skyrim.
That would be an interesting topic in all honesty, but not relevant for this one.
I'd be interested to read a thread about people discussing that.
Why? Why are certain games locking out options for 1080p display users on the PS4 Pro? Mark Cerny promised at the Pro announcement that 1080p users would receive benefits, and yet for a fair few games, we're being arbitrarily locked out of accessing them for no other reason than that we don't own/use a 4K display instead.
Every PS4 since Oct 2013 had down-sampling as default behavior, internet just decided to conveniently forget about it when Pro/4k displays came out.
Sorry, it's your thread, so if you want to keep it super narrow to one particular poor PS4 Pro behavior, I'll leave, but it follows along right from this statement in your original post. 1080p users are being arbitrarily locked out of PS4 Pro benefits, only in more than just one way. I don't consider a lower frame rate than a regular PS4 user in exchange for a marginally more antialiassed image a "benefit", and I thought this problem within the realm of limiting 1080p Pro users' choices enough for the same discussion.
Yep. Play your PS4 (OG) or PS4 Pro on a 720p/768p TV and your 900p/1080p games are downsampling, their internal resolution doesn't drop to 720p.
I did and it didBut how the fuck would you know that if you never used your PS4 on an old-ass 720p screen lol hardly something people "conveniently forgot about."
Every PS4 since Oct 2013 had down-sampling as default behavior, internet just decided to conveniently forget about it when Pro/4k displays came out.
For one, Sony does have a similar system (minus the 16xAF). Boosting of dynamic resolution, framerate, and other effects that scale with available resources happens on Pro. And downsampling is the default behavior.
It's not a dice roll, the developer has to intentionally offer a different mode for 1080p displays. In almost all cases, this means better framerates instead of downsampling. In some cases, like those listed in the OP, there are other benefits as well. If I recall correctly, there are only 3 games where there's no apparent benefit (though even for those it's possible very rare framerate problems are ironed out).
Of course, from a player perspective it'd be better if you could choose between such options, rather than being locked into one or the other based on your display. But it's definite hyperbole to say 1080p users get "screwed".
You can force 720p on a 1080p display to test it out - I was mainly pointing out anyone could see this for themselves, and consoles have had this since 2005, and it was quite commonly bypassed by developer back then also.But how the would you know that if you never used your PS4 on an old-ass 720p screen
As Liabe Brave and others have pointed out - explicit support for 1080p/4k usually means different performance profiles, and users seem to want multiple options for that. I recall a lot of noise was made on the old forum over certain early Pro enabled-games that only-downsampled without choice of other modes, and their performance wasn't perceived favorably.Any ideas or insight why a developer would put in the extra work to disable downsampling?
This makes Sony look super pathetic to be honest.
How long have they had now to implement a similar system?
But no, let's roll the dice and see if 1080p players get screwed.
You can force 720p on a 1080p display to test it out - I was mainly pointing out anyone could see this for themselves, and consoles have had this since 2005, and it was quite commonly bypassed by developer back then also.
As Liabe Brave and others have pointed out - explicit support for 1080p/4k usually means different performance profiles, and users seem to want multiple options for that. I recall a lot of noise was made on the old forum over certain early Pro enabled-games that only-downsampled without choice of other modes, and their performance wasn't perceived favorably.
As to why that, over using in-game menu with graphical-modes (that would work regardless of TV connected) the answer is simple - far less work is involved. UX and QA/performance testing are generally the biggest time/money sinks when supporting multiple configurations.
I get it with games that have different performance profiles. I don't question the developer choices with those games since it's pretty clear. I'm curious on games that don't offer multiple rendering modes but also don't downsample when hooked up to a 1080p display. Games like the Assassins Creed Collection, Dishonored 2, and Outlast 2 all render at higher resolutions when hooked up to a 4K TV but render at 1080p when hooked up to a FHD display with no benefits. If I understand you correctly, additional work would have needed to be done to disable SS and I'm just curious why they would go through this additional work. I'm not bothered by any of it in the end, it's just a curiosity on my part.
You can force 720p on a 1080p display to test it out - I was mainly pointing out anyone could see this for themselves, and consoles have had this since 2005, and it was quite commonly bypassed by developer back then also.
Fafalada has already responded so this may be superfluous, but you're a little confused about what I was saying. Boosting resolution automatically only happens with unpatched games with dynamic resolution. And it tops out at whatever the original target was, which I believe in all cases is 1080p. Therefore, unpatched games don't ever get downsampling.Have any links to devs or other corroborating info? If boosting dynamic res were the default, then how is it that devs have to "intentionally offer a different mode for 1080p display"? If the res is boosted in accordance with processing power and then is downsampled automatically as you claim, then why would devs need to do it manually as your say in the 2nd paragraph?
Sorry, it's your thread, so if you want to keep it super narrow to one particular poor PS4 Pro behavior, I'll leave, but it follows along right from this statement in your original post. 1080p users are being arbitrarily locked out of PS4 Pro benefits, only in more than just one way. I don't consider a lower frame rate than a regular PS4 user in exchange for a marginally more antialiassed image a "benefit", and I thought this problem within the realm of limiting 1080p Pro users' choices enough for the same discussion.
99% sure it is
Rocket League really needs downsampling on PS4 Pro; image quality is poor at 1080p. It's a shame too, as the checkerboard rendering implementation was really good on PS4 Pro.
More replies following my first tweet if people want to retweet, like, post their own tweets, etc.
Nothing will change if nobody is making noise about it.
Thank you very much! It appears that Future Tone doesn't have downsampling for 1080p displays...but it does have improved AA versus its 4K mode. So edges and detail are about as smooth as they would be with downsampling, but the texture filtering isn't improved.
This still annoy me, I sold my base ps4 to get ready for the pro deals this holiday but as a 1080p tv user this kept me from going with the pro. But seems like the average consumer is not bothered with it.
That makes it sound like most of the games don't offer downsampling, which is utterly wrong. About 90% off the games with Pro support offer their high res setting in form of downsampling. And of the rest, most have specific benefits like increased draw distance or better antialiasing for 1080p users.By default, games in 1920x1080 mode will display in 1080p and offer no downsampling.
I guess it wouldn't be SOTC without at least one mode having framerate drops.Fafalada has already responded so this may be superfluous, but you're a little confused about what I was saying. Boosting resolution automatically only happens with unpatched games with dynamic resolution. And it tops out at whatever the original target was, which I believe in all cases is 1080p. Therefore, unpatched games don't ever get downsampling.
Patched games will automatically downsample on 1080p displays if necessary, so if the dev wants to focus on a different benefit, such as framerate, they have to intentionally offer a non-default setup. And yes, theoretically they could choose to not remove but just reduce the res increase instead. So on 4K displays the game could be, say, 1800p with unstable 30fps, but on 1080p displays 1440p downsampled with stable 30fps.
In fact, we seem to have a (similar) instance announced just now. It appears that Shadow of the Colossus resolution mode is 2160ti on 4K displays (that is, 4K resolution reconstructed from prior frame info). But on 1080p displays, it's downsampled from only 1440p (the single-frame render target), rather than the reconstructed 3840x2160 buffer. It's not known if the framerate is improved, but I imagine it could be by some little amount.
In fact, we seem to have a (similar) instance announced just now. It appears that Shadow of the Colossus resolution mode is 2160ti on 4K displays (that is, 4K resolution reconstructed from prior frame info). But on 1080p displays, it's downsampled from only 1440p (the single-frame render target), rather than the reconstructed 3840x2160 buffer. It's not known if the framerate is improved, but I imagine it could be by some little amount.
Sorry, it's your thread, so if you want to keep it super narrow to one particular poor PS4 Pro behavior, I'll leave, but it follows along right from this statement in your original post. 1080p users are being arbitrarily locked out of PS4 Pro benefits, only in more than just one way. I don't consider a lower frame rate than a regular PS4 user in exchange for a marginally more antialiassed image a "benefit", and I thought this problem within the realm of limiting 1080p Pro users' choices enough for the same discussion.
If any Rocket League fans want downsampling, I'd ask you to upvote and perhaps comment on my post on their official Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeag...ease_implement_downsamplingsupersampling_for/
I initially posted it on their official support system, before being redirected to Facebook, before again being redirected to Reddit! :P