Dude when she's put on the cover of time, a performer at awards shows(when frankly no other black women are) snl guest, etc yes she being propped up as the face
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"Why Are We Celebrating Lizzo's Body?"-Jillian Micheals
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Or maybe she's being put on covers because she's a popular artist? She's far, far from the only black woman artist to guest on SNL or perform an award show, idk how you are even making that claim.
PoC aren't a monolith, why are we giving this kind of thinking air to legitimatize itself. If what you say is true take more offense to media not giving more black women a fair shot than harping on her for getting some limelight she isn't suppressing black stars.
Just leave Lizzo alone. Fuck.
She's not the reason that the rich world continues to plump up. This is essentially bullying.
She's not the reason that the rich world continues to plump up. This is essentially bullying.
To each their own. My experience with childhood obesity made me a better person ultimately. I'm very health focused as an adult and developed a much stronger sense of humor than I likely would have otherwise. I didnt like how I was being perceived by others which inspired a positive change in me. I'm grateful to have experienced that as it made me a stronger, more empathetic person overall.
Bad things happened to you and it happened to work out okay. Use some of that fancy empathy you learned to acknowledge and understand that "This went okay for me" doesn't make it okay.
Taking a negative situation and negative experiences and using that for positive change, especially within oneself, is very difficult. Good on ya man.
Thank you so much for understanding my point, and not crapping on me for turning things around. It wasnt easy.
Getting some "I was spanked regularly as a child but I turned out OK" vibes from this response
Society needs more empathy towards obese people however where a lot of this goes off the rails is when people say there is absolutely no problem being obese. That is driving past empathetic and into enabling territory. I'm not familiar enough with Lizzo outside of 1 or 2 songs so I don't know what her take on that is but it's incredibly rude for Jillian to put this all on her either way. Obese people know they have a problem. They might not be ready to act on it yet or have the knowledge to do so. It took me basically all my life until I made a change and lost hundreds of pounds before I finally understood. Stuff like this doesn't spur you to be better, it just tanks your opinion of yourself even lower.
No one is crapping on you for turning things around for yourself, that's commendable. The problem is suggesting that you getting bullied was somehow 'good' or 'helpful'.
Publicly broadcasting that bullying is good and a way to solve issues is incredibly tonedeaf, especially when others reading it have also experienced bullying for being overweight (and other things). Some things don't need to be said on a forum where others can read it. It just normalizes bullying and harassment.
Obesity has only gotten worse the more people screech about personal responsibility. Obviously that's not working so we should look into more systemic solutions. by almost all metrics you can call obesity a disease but nobody is telling you to man up and not get sick.
Actually, this is America. That last point is probably not true..
Actually, this is America. That last point is probably not true..
How is that even remotely related to what he is saying. He is basically saying he used the negative experiences as fuel for positive change. That has nothing to do with your snarky little comment. He even pointed out that this was his personal experience.
How could you take somebody who managed to overcome their adversity and come out on top a better person, and just shit on them. The fuck is wrong with you people? What kind of sociopathic nonsense is going on in here.
My take from this thread is that we should really celebrate ALL bodies. Or none, if that makes sense. Somebody who is really in shape or muscular, another person who is skinny and not toned, another person who is overweight or fat, people with plastic surgery implants and injections, etc. Everybody deserves to be celebrated equally.
Can't really tell if the point of the take was for: 1. people to NOT focus on Lizzo's weight instead of her talents, or 2. people to NOT celebrate being overweight/obese at all. one interpretation seems constructive and the other is straight problematic.
Can't really tell if the point of the take was for: 1. people to NOT focus on Lizzo's weight instead of her talents, or 2. people to NOT celebrate being overweight/obese at all. one interpretation seems constructive and the other is straight problematic.
I'm not talking about what worked. Social-support isn't ERA-support. I'm talking about this forum. Where smokers, non-vegetarian, drug addicts and other groups get constantly shat on, or at least heavily criticized. I'm just baffled by the double standards.
This is definitely true and is the reason why the phrase "body positivity" exists, but at the same time we should be careful of not "all lives mattering" the situation because muscular bodies are already celebrated.
Dude, I'm not talking about your life experience. I'm saying posting on a public forum that bullying is good and helpful normalizes harmful rhetoric with bullying and harassment. Save this "sorry if I offended you" schtick, please.
Jillian Michaels isn't wrong IMO. We are literally at a crisis point for obesity/overweight people in the U.S right now. It's completely out of hand and scary to see the statistics that the current generations will be the first to not outlive their parents on average.
This is most definitely not going to be fixed by pretending that being morbidly obese it totally fine and not a dangerous way to live.
This is most definitely not going to be fixed by pretending that being morbidly obese it totally fine and not a dangerous way to live.
So much of a crisis the government doesn't tell food companies to stop poisoning and malnourishing us? Government could address this head on but ours and most don't and you know it.
Show me one person who's actually saying that. All of you who are in this thread claiming it, show me one example here. ONE. That's all I'm asking.
Nutrition facts should start having bright red labels for anything especially egregious.
A single severing of something should never be hitting 20%+ of a dv.
I meant something bigger it can easily be claimed to be a national security issue. I want a president/congress/senate that will single out most of the shitty big companies shoveling tons of addictive food in to stores. Can't do that if those companies are donating to a lot who are in office on either side.
Dude's problem is not that he managed to overcome a negative experience but that he's using it as a cudgel against those who do not share his views. In the context of a thread filled to the brim with concern trolling it is basically impossible to view it as a positive social message. I would like to share in that poster's happiness but I cannot in the context of the wider discussion of this thread. Posting it as a good thing uncritically reads like advocacy, or that bullying can or should be used to solve the obesity thing
I am not opposed to just broad stroke banning worst offenders, but people will want their chips
If I'm being honest this is just an excuse people throw out (among dozens of others) for why this is happening.
As I approached my 40th birthday I realized I had entered the overweight category on the charts. I realized I didn't want to be part of the statistics and I started using a free app on my my phone to track my calories every day. Within 6 months I had totally got my shit in order and weighed the same as I did at 18 years old. 4 years later and I weigh the same because I continue to track my calories and take my health seriously.
A lot of sodas and snacks have calories/fat/sugar listed pretty prominently on the front. Nobody cares. Same with chain restaurants. 1500+ calorie meals at places like chilis are the norm, not the exception.
It's good that it's labeled but I don't think it makes any difference whatsoever
Wow your situation is 100% applicable to everyone, I had no idea. You alone singlehandedly solved the obesity crisis. Great work!
Yeah and there are way too many common links between childhood mental health issues and eating disorders for me to ever ever think it's as easy as bullying worked for me , Maybe it can for you too? Come on man it's not nearly that simple, what a horrible point of view. Now that I'm reading, a lot of people in this thread really need to stop pretending like it's a super overnight process when obesity can be due to a lot of things that cannot be changed overnight.
Funny thing- the next two articles state pretty concretely that, whatever an ideal motivator might be, it sure as shit isn't fat-shaming (as it's demotivational for the overwhelming majority of people), which, in the article I linked to in a previous response, doesn't just manifest as one individual calling you, personally, a fat piece of shit. You wanna write, but I guess you don't wanna read, so I'm ignoring you now. Bye.
Aside from the fact that both arguments are expressed via a question, I don't see any similarity at all. My argument is that he's basing his ideas about how we should, as a society, approach obesity on an example representative of an atypical minority whose thoughts and experiences run counter to those of the vast majority, as documented by a number of studies, some of which I've already linked to.
Some people like eating lead paint chips. Most people don't, so our approach to reducing the number of people made ill by lead exposure shouldn't be "stop eating lead paint you dumb fucks."
So what even if it is. Doesn't change the situation at and quite frankly how is your story at all a solution to the issue at hand with lizzo or obesity at hand? Don't give me tired arugments about will when obesity and drinking prove people need more than that.
Those companies aren't obligated to sell that crap and they do it cause thy know more people would rather eat unheathily than do what you did.
not everyone is you and considering that there are millions of obese people what does you and a few other people getting their health in check in this thread
do for the ones that most likely won't.
Yeah. People might think there's a clear distinction between calorie counting and disordered eating but there's a lot of overlap. I think that it's not an inherently healthy outlet for compulsive/addictive behavior but I'm always concerned about the tendency to universalize that behavior as good and justified (I'm not obese because ___ in a topic specifically about the public's reaction to Lizzo confuses a structural/public health issue with a personal one; they should probably be considered off-topic as the post above mine suggests).
Eh, they're nice but I'd put antifreeze over as still being sweet but having a complex bouquet behind it. Plus in this day and age it's just easier to get ahold of.
how did bullying make you a more empathetic person if you're dropping zero-empathy statements like this
should we be more aggressively mocking and shaming you for your views, since bullying has worked so well for you historically?
thats true, a better indicator is if youre capable of walking a reasonable distance (like a few miles) and then climbing a few sets of stairs
Right after you show me where I said anyone in this thread is claiming it ;). I'm not speaking about anyone here but rather people like Ragen Chastain or Tess Holiday or anyone who reiterates those beliefs which are gaining traction in society even if no one in this thread has said it specifically.
And you don't want to read what I'm getting at.
I am against fat shaming.
But I am also against normalizing fat bodies. Maybe you equate those as being the same thing. idk. Let me know.
I understand there are underlying reasons people are fat in the US. I'd love to change fix those but they are hard institutional fixes to put in place. They will take time to fix. So what can we do right now?
What is the best way to motivate and encourage people to lose weight in a way that actually works? Maybe the fitness journeys of all the people I know are outliers but it always seemed like a desire to be more confident in their bodies was a primary reason. Part of the reason they were NOT confident in their original bodies was because of societies stigma against being overweight. If their bodies were seen as ideal they wouldn't have bothered trying to change. And society's attitudes toward ideal body types have changed just within the last 200 years. So when people are trying to normalize "it's ok to be fat, don't change a thing, you be you" some people get rightfully worried.
Side anecdote: I think ideal body image in american society is probably the best its been in years. Back in the 90's and early 2000's you were expected to be as thin as a victorias secret model. Nowadays people expect and desire some healthy amount of fat.
I legitimately want to ask you. If we can't use body confidence as a motivator for getting overweight people to lose weight. What works better? Because if your answer is "We don't need to motivate them, they are fine the way they are theres nothing wrong with their weight" Then we have reached our fundamental impasse.
What is "normalizing fat bodies" supposed to mean in this context?
For me it goes like this:
The state of our bodies can be a serious physical health issue.
How we feel about our bodies can be a serious mental health issue.
The body positivity movement is attempting to address the mental health issue, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that and most people involved are not trying to deny or ignore the physical health issue. There are outliers in every movement, and you can find people who are denying health issues, but we don't need to bring up health every time someone is body positive.
Lizzo has likely been told by doctors she's at risk of diabetes; that's really her business. She's also telling people she's happy with who she is, that's a good thing, and that really is what body positivity is. That despite potential physical health issues (because of your body) you shouldn't be mentally unhealthy because of it. I have health issues, I'm still a happy person.. I'm happy with who I am.. and my health issues are my business.
And Jillian Michaels is not a health practitioner; she lost the right to call herself that when she helped create a TV show that involved dangerously fast weight loss.
The state of our bodies can be a serious physical health issue.
How we feel about our bodies can be a serious mental health issue.
The body positivity movement is attempting to address the mental health issue, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that and most people involved are not trying to deny or ignore the physical health issue. There are outliers in every movement, and you can find people who are denying health issues, but we don't need to bring up health every time someone is body positive.
Lizzo has likely been told by doctors she's at risk of diabetes; that's really her business. She's also telling people she's happy with who she is, that's a good thing, and that really is what body positivity is. That despite potential physical health issues (because of your body) you shouldn't be mentally unhealthy because of it. I have health issues, I'm still a happy person.. I'm happy with who I am.. and my health issues are my business.
And Jillian Michaels is not a health practitioner; she lost the right to call herself that when she helped create a TV show that involved dangerously fast weight loss.
how about celebrating an artist for their work?
I don't care what they look like while I listen to audio.
People spend too much time talking personalities, image and shit, who gives a shit. Just listen to the music if you like it
I don't care what they look like while I listen to audio.
People spend too much time talking personalities, image and shit, who gives a shit. Just listen to the music if you like it
See,
I don't think this article addressed my question at all. Look at this quote.
It is true that many diseases are more commonly found in heavier people. However, that doesn't mean that weight itself causes disease. Blaming fatness for heart disease is similar to blaming yellow teeth for lung cancer, rather than considering that smoking might play a role in both. And telling people they need to lose weight is a lot like telling someone with a cold to stop sneezing so much—it may not be possible and won't make the cold go away.
They admit being heavier means health issues are more common. They then say that weight itself doesn't cause the issues. Equating it to smoking by saying yellow teeth don't cause lung cancer. Smoking does.
And do you know how we cut down on smoking rates? By running campaigns to educate and essentially scare people away from smoking. I agree we need to do this too. We need to educate kids young about healthy lifestyles. But what do we do about the people already smoking? We stress to them how bad it is. We make it unnattractive to smoke. Will that change all of them? No. But many of them will look to alternatives, will look to quit etc etc.
This article does a good job at explaining that people are fat due to systemic issues. That is true. And we need to work on changing those. But those are hard changes that take time and possibly generations of lifestyle change.
It never addresses what we do for people NOW. How do we motivate people now to live healthier? I'd like to address the symptoms and the cause at the same time. Trying to address the cause without treating the symptoms is gonna be a long journey.
Normalizing meaning pushing this idea that is 100% fine with being overweight. That there's no negatives to it as long as you feel good.
It's pseudoscience co-written by a nutritionist who posts things like this:
"Eat less and better" is the universal advice for this shit, and this person is saying "Eat whatever. Its food!"
Why is it so hard to say
"I once struggled with my weight and I think the benefits to losing an excess amount would do wonders for ones self-confidence/mental health. There are a lot of ways you can tackle this, I am very open to sharing my personal experiences and advice. I am also acknowledging that the process is not easy, and that there may be many factors going on in one's life that might make the weight loss process difficult. But I am here, I am empathetic, and I want to help."
Instead of " I did it so man up fatty lol/ don't you know it's unhealthy/I don't agree with your being positive about being overweight" and on and on
"I once struggled with my weight and I think the benefits to losing an excess amount would do wonders for ones self-confidence/mental health. There are a lot of ways you can tackle this, I am very open to sharing my personal experiences and advice. I am also acknowledging that the process is not easy, and that there may be many factors going on in one's life that might make the weight loss process difficult. But I am here, I am empathetic, and I want to help."
Instead of " I did it so man up fatty lol/ don't you know it's unhealthy/I don't agree with your being positive about being overweight" and on and on
One thing is how "thin", "normal", "overweight", and "obese" move around on the scale. What was once obese is now overweight, and what was morbidly obese is now just obese. Thin has moved down, and who can say what normal is these days.
Remember when Homer Simpson had to wear a mumu when weighing 300 pounds? You look at his starting weight in that episode (240) and it doesn't seem like he's that large these days.
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