-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
Why is the DCEU such a failure?
- Thread starter DragonSJG
- Start date
At least it is fully believable that Smallville's Clark really wants to make the world a better place. Teenage angst and some really bad writing aside, he really does want to help people.
Also, Pa Kent in Smallville doesn't tell a young Clark to let a school bus full of kids die.
Not a failure, but it had a few missteps and the big one was allowing Zack Snyder to introduce the world to The Dark Knight Returns Batman, having a grizzled batman is one thing, having a pushed to the edge, death wish, and given up Batman as an entry point was a bad call.
5.3bill WW in 7 movies is a failure? I'm pretty certain that even out grosses the first 7 MCU movies.
They dropped the ball hard and left money on the table but it's hardly a failure.
They dropped the ball hard and left money on the table but it's hardly a failure.
There is no indication that will be set in the 90s or part of the "DCEU" at all. For all we know, it is a hard reboot for Batman, not a soft one.
Honestly, the only real horrid movie is Batman V. Superman. Man of Steel, Suicide Squad, and Justice League aren't good but not the worst things ever. Aquaman, Wonder Woman, and Shazam are all great movies. And the only real money loser was Justice League, so it's not a failure by any means, especially with Joker, Birds of Prey, and WW1984 on the horizon.
It's just a failure in comparison to Marvel, and honestly what ISN'T a failure in comparison. Compared to Fox's efforts, Logan notwithstanding, DC might as well be crowned.
It's just a failure in comparison to Marvel, and honestly what ISN'T a failure in comparison. Compared to Fox's efforts, Logan notwithstanding, DC might as well be crowned.
The DCEU is a failure when you look at it from the perspective of they have Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman literally three of the most iconic and popular comic book character's of all-time and they had them team up in two movies which barely beat out R-rated Deadpool movies in total gross. Hell DC TV side has done way better then DC movie side. They managed to launch a whole multiverse off the back of the a green arrow tv show. Hiring Zack Snyder was probably the worst financial decision anyone at Warner Brothers has ever made. It literally cost them billions of dollars.
WB lost their damn minds when Avengers exploded and made 1.5 billion at the box office and buoyed all the other individual films. They started rushing and fucked up.
Wasn't until they slowed down a bit (even if forced) and took it easy that they got their 1.14 billion payday on Aquaman.
Wasn't until they slowed down a bit (even if forced) and took it easy that they got their 1.14 billion payday on Aquaman.
WB pushed these movies out too fast
Dark edgy tone
Ruined Batman and Superman
Bad writing
At least Wonder Woman, Aquaman were good with Shazam being amazing.
Now it's going to feel disjointed with them rebooting Batman.
Dark edgy tone
Ruined Batman and Superman
Bad writing
At least Wonder Woman, Aquaman were good with Shazam being amazing.
Now it's going to feel disjointed with them rebooting Batman.
It's kind of a failure given what they were working with yeah.
The MCU started off with franchises that had basically no cinematic presence, whereas the DCU had one that grossed $1 billion plus.
There were individual successes in the DCU, but by the end Justice League was struggling to out earn Doctor Strange and Ant Man.
Wonder no more.
Aquaman is WB's second most successful film at the box office ever.
It's worldwide gross is greater than any Spider-Man film to date.
Simply put with Snyder at the helm they weren't actually building a cinematic universe. Snyder was planning a limited run of films which had they played out would have ended with most of the main cast dead. That's why he was so casual about killing off minor characters like Olson.
As things stand the DCEU is not a confirmed failure as it is still going and I think the best of it is still ahead. The problem is that we are stuck with a lot of Snyder leftovers like old Batman, crap Lex etc in continuity that would normally encourage a reboot. On the other hand there are salvageable and profitable elements still in play.
I personally believe that there will be a new DCEU incorporating things like Shazam which is why they are only tying in that film to continuity in a very general way.
As things stand the DCEU is not a confirmed failure as it is still going and I think the best of it is still ahead. The problem is that we are stuck with a lot of Snyder leftovers like old Batman, crap Lex etc in continuity that would normally encourage a reboot. On the other hand there are salvageable and profitable elements still in play.
I personally believe that there will be a new DCEU incorporating things like Shazam which is why they are only tying in that film to continuity in a very general way.
No faith in the projects and staff they started and ruined them in production, then over correcting them, releasing something nowhere near the original plan.
Broken movies getting slammed for reasons that weren't the issue, because there was nothing else to pick on.
Broken movies getting slammed for reasons that weren't the issue, because there was nothing else to pick on.
They tried to rush thing by having the big crossover as the second movie already
Also Hack Snyder as the planner
Also Hack Snyder as the planner
Last I heard his contract was getting close to expiring and he was having creative differences with WB over the Flash movie which made him want out. Something about Ezra wanting to do a darker Flash movie and WB wanting something more up beat and fun.
Honestly, I'm #TeamWB in that scenario
Batman.
The tone of the DCEU movies revolves around Batman, making everything more dark and gloomy than it should be.
The tone of the DCEU movies revolves around Batman, making everything more dark and gloomy than it should be.
Oh yeah, wasn't Snyder's original script for Justice League a total fucking downer where most of the heroes were already dead at the start of the movie and Superman had gone evil?
No plan and then rushing to make one. Plus everything had to be as grim dark as possible.
Plus it does to help that they make movies that are their own continuity. Are the Batman films in universe? Is Suicide Squad? We know the tv shows aren't which is also a mistake.
Plus it does to help that they make movies that are their own continuity. Are the Batman films in universe? Is Suicide Squad? We know the tv shows aren't which is also a mistake.
Aquaman great lol
Pretty much the epitome of blockbuster trash. Awful story, awful script, awful acting, an hour too long, just endless CG puppets flopping around and blowing up interspersed with painfully bad character interactions. Hot garbage.
The initial run of movies were frankly not very fun to watch, and it made them stumble right out of the gate with setting up their extended movie universe. Marvel pretty much nailed the formula from the get go with Iron Man. The Marvel movies are funny, charming, witty, exciting, emotional, and many other wonderful buzzwords. I'd barely even classify the earlier DC movies as heroic let alone most of those other things.
All of this is just a damn shame. I love modern DC Comics far more than modern Marvel, but the movies are just painful to sit through. They had actual access to their biggest characters from the very start; some of them the most iconic characters in modern fiction. Yet Marvel totall schooled them without even having Spider-Man to start with. They built it on the back of a C-list hero (at the time) by getting a great script and the right actor.
All of this is just a damn shame. I love modern DC Comics far more than modern Marvel, but the movies are just painful to sit through. They had actual access to their biggest characters from the very start; some of them the most iconic characters in modern fiction. Yet Marvel totall schooled them without even having Spider-Man to start with. They built it on the back of a C-list hero (at the time) by getting a great script and the right actor.
They rushed it, pure and simple. The first movies weren't very good, and even once they had a legitimate good movie in WW, they rushed that character into a terrible JL movie. The MCU has had some bad movies, AoU would probably be the biggest misstep even if it is not the worst movie, but they have built up to such a broad slate now that they can survive the odd clanger. Plus they never seem to put abject failure on the screen.
Some prime examples of DCEU abject failures:
- CGI for Superman's face
- the two rounds of character introductions in SS, followed by a third introduction of a character who instantly dies
- going straight into Batman vs Superman
- Martha
- pretty much all of JL
Some prime examples of DCEU abject failures:
- CGI for Superman's face
- the two rounds of character introductions in SS, followed by a third introduction of a character who instantly dies
- going straight into Batman vs Superman
- Martha
- pretty much all of JL
Yeah I'd say they've turned it around. Man of Steel and Batman vs Superman were pretty awful movies, but Justice League was a huge improvement, Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Shazam are legitimately great movies and Joker and Suicide Squad have the potential to be as good.
The "DCEU" might be dead but DC movies are getting better all the time.
Justice League made less money than Doctor Strange.
Even comparing it to other DC movies, none of the DCEU movies made as much money as the Dark Knight or Dark Knight Rises.
Well most of it is conjecture but by rumour it was originally a three picture arc with Lois dying in the second film, Superman going bad and the League and earth being totally trashed (aka BVS vision scene) with the few survivors mounting a Mad Max style resistance in film 3.
Still more interesting than the bland dogshit we ended up with and as a stand-alone arc it could even have worked but as the foundation of a connected universe?
even the ones people enjoy like Aquaman and Shazam look terrible. Can't understand why people would want to watch them.
Definitely the quality of the movies is the first thing. And mismanagement of the properties as a combined "universe" is a close second.
That said, I wonder if the DCEU isn't also just hurt by virtue of their being second to the idea of an superhero cinematic universe. The appeal of an extended cinematic universe is that the franchise builds on itself such that a dozen movies combine in movie-goers' collective conscience to generate hype for the thirteenth movie in a way traditional sequels never could. Except now there's already a big universe out there, and it's eating up a lot of a limited supply of movie-goers' mindshare. The same way there's been relatively less value generated from all of the other extended universes being tried for non-superhero properties... maybe the whole extended universe idea has just "been done", and can only be done once, at least in the large pop culture zeitgeisty way the MCU's done it.
I'm confident another cinematic universe can take off in a decade or so after MCU fatigue (finally) takes hold. And I'm sure other properties and individual movies will be successful while the MCU is still chugging along. I just think it's hard to match or exceed what the MCU's done in total while the MCU's still doing it.
That said, I wonder if the DCEU isn't also just hurt by virtue of their being second to the idea of an superhero cinematic universe. The appeal of an extended cinematic universe is that the franchise builds on itself such that a dozen movies combine in movie-goers' collective conscience to generate hype for the thirteenth movie in a way traditional sequels never could. Except now there's already a big universe out there, and it's eating up a lot of a limited supply of movie-goers' mindshare. The same way there's been relatively less value generated from all of the other extended universes being tried for non-superhero properties... maybe the whole extended universe idea has just "been done", and can only be done once, at least in the large pop culture zeitgeisty way the MCU's done it.
I'm confident another cinematic universe can take off in a decade or so after MCU fatigue (finally) takes hold. And I'm sure other properties and individual movies will be successful while the MCU is still chugging along. I just think it's hard to match or exceed what the MCU's done in total while the MCU's still doing it.
Man of Steel is a good movie. Trying to force it into an MCU model before any other legwork was done establishing the other heroes was the fatal mistake.
They picked a person who does not like superheroes, but likes dark edgy power fantasies, as their main architect. A person who reads comics but somehow does not understand them and only sees the surface. You know, the director of Sucker Punch.
Like i said there was definitely money left on the table but it's still not a failure in overall BO success. If we are talkin overall structure, yes they did a horrible job planning the entire DCEU. They rushed into it which was obvious since day one.
The problem isn't that he doesn't like superheroes, the problem is that he has no clue how to make a good movie and that he thinks that the only interesting characters are bleak, dark and broken characters.
In the case of dark gloomy Batman tone, it does look like they're on course to right the ship. Things are looking up for the new DCEU!
But yeah, MoS was weirdly cynical while having the characters talk like it's about hope.