Why women criticise sexualised character designs |OT2| I have no pants and I must scream (READ OP)

Deleted member 5535

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Based on the wiki article , I found out that this Character Mirai Suenaga is an official mascot for Japan Tourism .

I never heard of her and I am not any expert on the Japanese culture and mange/anime .


As an outside/European I find this stuff somewhat cringy and that it is printed on official touristy stuff ???
Why and how did this get even made ???
In my perspective , it reinforces the stereotype of sexualizing minors and all that horny anime stuff of the couple prior pages...
Or am I missing something , then please help me out here?

EDIT: Even for touristy stuff in malaysia as a muslim country ???



here on a map :



here are some character highlights of ' her ':
  • get teased for her large chest
  • shy but reliable
  • she is 17 !!!
and here is a bonus picture:

This isn't that official, they almost don't use it. But the government do make many projects be it for tourism, militarism and other things with manga or anime art. About this project, you can read about the guy in wikipedia too, he's a foreigner living in Japan: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Choo

As far as Malaysia, you would be surprised (or not) to see the same on other countries. It's no coincidence that China is the biggest market of anime outside of Japan, with Malaysia, Taiwan and many asian countries being later. Same for manga outside of Japan, which they are behind France in that case. And of course, if you look at the own productions of manhua and manwha, you can see many like this as well, much like in the game production with chinese mobile games like Azur Lane or Korean mobile games like Epic 7. If you look outside of Japan in which there's so much focus, you'll see that it's not that different for Asia in general.

About the rest, what can I explain to you if not the reality that fictional minors are sexualized for decades from teenage to adult publications? The biggest manga magazine which is Shonen Jump had hundreds of romcom series in which the characters were naked and so on, with some censorship to not show the parts (but uncensored nipples are sold on volumes). I"s, 100% Ichigo, To Love Ru and the current Yuragi sou no Yuna-san are one of the examples. I'm not going to post it here because I'm not an idiot but you can easily find on google by the name of the series+manga.
And of course, that's only manga. If we go to real people and other industries, there's actually pre-teens and teens working as gravure idol (in their case, junior idol, which not necessarily means being a model) posing on swimsuits and bikini in magazines or DVDs. You can find more details here if you want, it's fairly complete from what I know: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junior_idol

There's a reason for why the government is trying to hide many of those things that deal with real people in the Olympics. It's why many of those products stopped to be on convenience stores.
 

eisschollee

Member
Oct 25, 2018
88
This isn't that official, they almost don't use it. But the government do make many projects be it for tourism, militarism and other things with manga or anime art. About this project, you can read about the guy in wikipedia too, he's a foreigner living in Japan: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Choo

As far as Malaysia, you would be surprised (or not) to see the same on other countries. It's no coincidence that China is the biggest market of anime outside of Japan, with Malaysia, Taiwan and many asian countries being later. Same for manga outside of Japan, which they are behind France in that case. And of course, if you look at the own productions of manhua and manwha, you can see many like this as well, much like in the game production with chinese mobile games like Azur Lane or Korean mobile games like Epic 7. If you look outside of Japan in which there's so much focus, you'll see that it's not that different for Asia in general.

About the rest, what can I explain to you if not the reality that fictional minors are sexualized for decades from teenage to adult publications? The biggest manga magazine which is Shonen Jump had hundreds of romcom series in which the characters were naked and so on, with some censorship to not show the parts (but uncensored nipples are sold on volumes). I"s, 100% Ichigo, To Love Ru and the current Yuragi sou no Yuna-san are one of the examples. I'm not going to post it here because I'm not an idiot but you can easily find on google by the name of the series+manga.
And of course, that's only manga. If we go to real people and other industries, there's actually pre-teens and teens working as gravure idol (in their case, junior idol, which not necessarily means being a model) posing on swimsuits and bikini in magazines or DVDs. You can find more details here if you want, it's fairly complete from what I know: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junior_idol

There's a reason for why the government is trying to hide many of those things that deal with real people in the Olympics. It's why many of those products stopped to be on convenience stores.
... If people should not see it then maybe dont put it on tourist maps ?
And dont have a foreigner promote your country and your art style by sexualizing minors?
 

AztecComplex

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,371
Based on the wiki article , I found out that this Character Mirai Suenaga is an official mascot for Japan Tourism .

I never heard of her and I am not any expert on the Japanese culture and mange/anime .


As an outside/European I find this stuff somewhat cringy and that it is printed on official touristy stuff ???
Why and how did this get even made ???
In my perspective , it reinforces the stereotype of sexualizing minors and all that horny anime stuff of the couple prior pages...
Or am I missing something , then please help me out here?

EDIT: Even for touristy stuff in malaysia as a muslim country ???



here on a map :



here are some character highlights of ' her ':
  • get teased for her large chest
  • shy but reliable
  • she is 17 !!!
and here is a bonus picture:

Even for anime standards those are some impossibly short micro skirts! I don’t think they could’ve had a skirt 1cm shorter before they’d show buttcheek or underwear. Hell, in that first pic of yours they were very deliberate in the pose showing the smallest hints of the beginnings of her butt. These girls wouldn’t be able to bend over even 45 degrees without flashing everyone behind. And the ages range from 13 to 17 and that’s just lovely.
 
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Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
13,656
There's not much point in trying to have a discussion about this with Nemesis.
Probably because the point had nothing to do with this as I was talking about the magazines with junior idols in swimsuit getting out along other things related to sex or being somehow sexual. I wasn't talking in any point about the tourism thing when I said this.

And it's obvious that they don't care and don't see it as a problem. Otherwise, that wouldn't be used in first place or anything like that would be allowed in first place.
 

Mr_Antimatter

Member
Oct 28, 2017
686
Those are short to be sure, but not the most imposible i've seen. Utena's girls uniforms have skirts that make no sense given the length of characters legs.

Interestingly, the few times excessive skin is shown on a girl he situations are more horrifying then erotic. Guys are usually the source of what normally passes as fanservice, at least in the TV series.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
13,656
What I said before about female otaku. In this case, it's only counting highschool girls instead of a full specter of ages below and above. Read the full article for more details.

 
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Saucycarpdog

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,352
On a more positive note, it's good to hear the rumors of the From Software and GRRM collaboration are true. We might get two FS games with great women designs in a single year.

And the Norse setting might mean a shield maiden boss!
 

lunatique

Member
Oct 25, 2017
310
So, character creation is confirmed for Nioh 2. Considering how good the women representation in the first game was, I expect the sequel will follow the same path.

But judging by the live streams so far, I'm interested in seeing the male vs female armot sets comparison in Nioh 2. And I kinda have a bad feeling about this.





Here's the armor sets in Nioh for comparison: https://nioh.wiki.fextralife.com/Armor

Edit: Yeah, here we go.

 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
7,396
So, character creation is confirmed for Nioh 2. Considering how good the women representation in the first game was, I expect the sequel will follow the same path.

But judging by the live streams so far, I'm interested in seeing the male vs female armot sets comparison in Nioh 2. And I kinda have a bad feeling about this.





Here's the armor sets in Nioh for comparison: https://nioh.wiki.fextralife.com/Armor

Edit: Yeah, here we go.

Male armor: Arms and legs covered
Female armor: Arms and legs bared

Sick of this predictable shit.
 

Morrigan

Armoring
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
10,202
Where are you guys seeing male armour in Nioh 2?

I'm not too worried. Nioh 1 had male armour that had bare legs and arms, it just depended on the set. The female warriors were tastefully rendered, like Ginchiyo:



Edit: oh in that character creation clip. Hmmmm yeah that's not cool. :(
 
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SolidSnakex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,869
There was a person playing earlier with a female character and there's just a bunch of different armor sets













What interesting with the character creator screen is that while the character starts off wearing a skirt/shorts, before a fight even happened the person playing went into a house and found several pieces of armor. One piece was a pair of pants the immediately made their stats go up.

 

Morrigan

Armoring
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
10,202
There was a person playing earlier with a female character and there's just a bunch of different armor sets
True. But it does seem like some sets are "cuter" or sexier on the woman (like the fur coat version in your screenshot, it's in that character creator clip and it's more covered on the male), which kind of sucks.

But at least yeah she does seem to have some proper armour sets too.
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
7,396
There was a person playing earlier with a female character and there's just a bunch of different armor sets

What interesting with the character creator screen is that while the character starts off wearing a skirt/shorts, before a fight even happened the person playing went into a house and found several pieces of armor. One piece was a pair of pants the immediately made their stats go up.
That makes me feel better.
 

Biestmann

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,334
It bugs me to perhaps unreasonable degrees how the player in that video doesn't even bother to check the black preset.
Edit: Beaten. Great minds think alike Vee
 

SolidSnakex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,869
True. But it does seem like some sets are "cuter" or sexier on the woman (like the fur coat version in your screenshot, it's in that character creator clip and it's more covered on the male), which kind of sucks.

But at least yeah she does seem to have some proper armour sets too.
I'd say the good news is that it seems like they're building the female armor off of what we saw in the original. Obviously Okatsu had a skirt in that, but you also had fully armored/clothed characters like Tome, Maria and Ginchiyo. It seems to stick into that space. Which means that they aren't going into DoA or Ninja Gaiden territory with the designs.
 

Choppasmith

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,568
Beaumont, CA
I love Arcee in Prime, that's so bad :(

Didn't they to explain Kos Mos' breasts were actually coolant reservoirs in Xenosaga Ep3 thought I saw something about a bonus costume "explaining" that.

Not that I mean that as a gotcha or anything just adding to Xaszatm that there's precedent for giving dumb lore reasons for robots.
 

Foot

Member
Mar 10, 2019
679
Everything about that dumb Nicee (FUCK, WHAT A NAME) is meant to give off a sense of sexual POWER. She is looming over us. Dominating. And then you get to her feet and she’s pigeon toed. Like, make up your minds, idiots!
 

4Tran

Member
Nov 4, 2017
752
Well, obviously there is a rational scientific explanation for this and if only you read the lore you would know that this is in fact a tragic part of robot physiology!

/s obviously
Of course there is! If she didn't have huge gazoongas, then how's she going to give milk to her Transformers babies?

Everything about that dumb Nicee (FUCK, WHAT A NAME) is meant to give off a sense of sexual POWER. She is looming over us. Dominating. And then you get to her feet and she’s pigeon toed. Like, make up your minds, idiots!
Pigeon toes are supposed to be sexy, didn't you get the memo? Also I love (hate) how it's so common for otaku-oriented female characters to be posed so that you can barely see their feet.
 

SofNascimento

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,723
So, I'm replaying Mass Effect 2 right now and I'm wondering what do you guys think of Miranda's costume in that game?



I quite like it but then there are shots like this:



I'm thinking in the context of an urban scenario only. Of course it's a terrible choice of attire when you go on a mission in the vacuum of space, but that's just how ME2 rolls. An understandable compromise if you ask me.

Do you guys think the problem is the shot or the costume itself don't do any favors?
 

Xaszatm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,700
Everything about that dumb Nicee (FUCK, WHAT A NAME) is meant to give off a sense of sexual POWER. She is looming over us. Dominating. And then you get to her feet and she’s pigeon toed. Like, make up your minds, idiots!
What, and run the risk of having these manly men feel inadequate? No! We must make sure that all our waifus are submissive enough to their OC because love can only be done in lopsided master/servant relationships!

/s again
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,731
So, I'm replaying Mass Effect 2 right now and I'm wondering what do you guys think of Miranda's costume in that game?



I quite like it but then there are shots like this:



I'm thinking in the context of an urban scenario only. Of course it's a terrible choice of attire when you go on a mission in the vacuum of space, but that's just how ME2 rolls. An understandable compromise if you ask me.

Do you guys think the problem is the shot or the costume itself don't do any favors?
It's kinda both? Even if Miranda's scenes didn't have male gaze shots like that, it doesn't change the fact that they designed her character model that way. Also re: wearing her costume in a vacuum, this is a setting that's based really heavily on believability and attention to detail (there's literally an explanation for why personal shields deflect attacks but don't push away every object you get near), so "because it looks stylish" doesn't really work as a defense the way it would in other things.
 

HK-47

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,354
So, I'm replaying Mass Effect 2 right now and I'm wondering what do you guys think of Miranda's costume in that game?



I quite like it but then there are shots like this:



I'm thinking in the context of an urban scenario only. Of course it's a terrible choice of attire when you go on a mission in the vacuum of space, but that's just how ME2 rolls. An understandable compromise if you ask me.

Do you guys think the problem is the shot or the costume itself don't do any favors?
ME 1 armor was much better. Everyone actually looked like they were on a space mission.
 

SofNascimento

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,723
It's kinda both? Even if Miranda's scenes didn't have male gaze shots like that, it doesn't change the fact that they designed her character model that way. Also re: wearing her costume in a vacuum, this is a setting that's based really heavily on believability and attention to detail (there's literally an explanation for why personal shields deflect attacks but don't push away every object you get near), so "because it looks stylish" doesn't really work as a defense the way it would in other things.
It's not really about looking stylish. The difference from ME1's character design and ME2's is that in the former characters simply used generic armors, while in the latter they decided to give each squadmate a unique costume that gave them more personality. For space missions, they would either need to design a new armor for each one or give them generic armors.

ME 1 armor was much better. Everyone actually looked like they were on a space mission.
Refer to my previous answer. They did look more like characters wearing the proper outfits for space, but they also looked generic. Indeed, I believe you might not even tell the difference between Liara and Ashley in some missions.
 

Wanderer5

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,854
Somewhere.
They seriously changed Arcee to Nicee? Lol, funny seeing that, cause I been thinking about checking out a Windblade figure after obtaining a mini one of her. Windblade looks badass. <3 Though I ended up remembering this....

 

HK-47

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,354
It's not really about looking stylish. The difference from ME1's character design and ME2's is that in the former characters simply used generic armors, while in the latter they decided to give each squadmate a unique costume that gave them more personality. For space missions, they would either need to design a new armor for each one or give them generic armors.



Refer to my previous answer. They did look more like characters wearing the proper outfits for space, but they also looked generic. Indeed, I believe you might not even tell the difference between Liara and Ashley in some missions.
They looked cool. Better than most looked in ME2.
 

AAK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,800
That's very disappointing coming out of Sekiro and seeing the female outfits for Nioh 2.
 

misho8723

Member
Jan 7, 2018
1,221
Slovakia
I feel like this is relevant.

But this isn't only true for gamers... almost every day I see articles on news websites that go something like this "See how this actress/model looks without makeup", "This actress/model without makeup still looks fantastic" when you can clearly see that that person used some form of makeup, "natural" makeup.. even woman have problem with this but yeah, many many men don't know what's the difference between "no makeup" - "natural makeup" and "friday night makeup" :D
 

Xaszatm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,700
You’re kidding, right? There is something seriously fucked up if those comments are real.
Men are clueless about makeup, considering it "a girl's thing" and stopping there. It doesn't help that media only shows women with at least a small amount of makeup even if they are doing things that would run counter to it. Like waking up. So most men think that everyday makeup is just something that is magically placed on them.
 

Static_Void

Member
Oct 30, 2018
1,646
north of the Dreamlands
Men are clueless about makeup, considering it "a girl's thing" and stopping there. It doesn't help that media only shows women with at least a small amount of makeup even if they are doing things that would run counter to it. Like waking up. So most men think that everyday makeup is just something that is magically placed on them.
Yeah, I get what you’re saying. But many of those heterosexual men have significant others, and even live with them, right? So they must be aware that a woman is not born with makeup, and that the L’Oréal gnome isn’t taking care of their face during the night...
 

Xaszatm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,700
Every modern made should be forced, by law, to spend at least a week wearing make-up. It might help improve their empathy. Might.
I think there's a grammar error here...

Yeah, I get what you’re saying. But many of those heterosexual men have significant others, and even live with them, right? So they must be aware that a woman is not born with makeup, and that the L’Oréal gnome isn’t taking care of their face during the night...
Quote from someone I asked.

"Well obviously not all women look like that without make-up, but these are celebrities so obviously their skin is less impure! Why else do they get to be in the spotlight?"

I...I swear there's something in the California water...