Will we ever get an SRPG with high production values?

Instro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,275
Fire Emblem sells enough at this point that Three Houses should not look anywhere near bad as it does(nor should it perform like it does either). It's largely a product of outsourcing to KT.
 

Hella

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,899
I think I know something that can satisfy everyone except Square-Enix, which seems like the most mutually agreeable way to settle this.

Throw a hundred million dollars into an SRPG pit and make the best Tactics Ogre game ever.
 

Aaronrules380

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,541
I'm actually not convinced three houses production values are even that low, it's just that most of the money went into the ludicrous amount of voiceover work rather than the graphics
 

Aaronrules380

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,541
Yeah even some NPC are fully voiced, which is incredible. Better graphics would be nice but good voice work is also great.
I'd honestly be interested in seeing if anyone could actually calculate the precise length of all voice work if played consecutively (and preferably do this for all languages involved), because I fully expect it would add up to dozens of hours which is insane
 

Pirate Bae

X marks the spot
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
3,542
??
I think I know something that can satisfy everyone except Square-Enix, which seems like the most mutually agreeable way to settle this.

Throw a hundred million dollars into an SRPG pit and make the best Tactics Ogre game ever.
It’s a good idea, therefore SE will never do it.
 

CrazyHal

Member
Nov 1, 2017
580
The super robot wars games are probably as good looking as srpg's can get. Sure the maps don't look very good but the battle animations are amazing.
 

hussien-11

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
Jordan
For a Japanese SRPG I think Three Houses production value is impressive. as for the graphics not everything is because of lack of money. it seems like the developers are not very good with visuals. still, it is more than good enough.
 

jaekeem

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,179
is self insert silent protagonist a budget thing? I thought that was a narrative decision. regardless, I hate it, and I'm tired of games with it, rather than an actual character
 

K.Jack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,353
Dark Space
I imagine a Front Mission SRPG in 2019/2020 would pretty much be it by default, given the history of the series.

I've always believed that's why Square Enix benched the series, because they had no faith in sales justifying the projections of ballooning budgets.

"DAMMIT", my soul screams.
 

flashman92

Member
Feb 15, 2018
942
At the time, Shining Force 3 seemed like big budget game (3 disks, 3 scenarios, a bonus disk, voice acted spells/attacks)

Valkyria Chronicles, Divinity 2, and XCOM seem like the best current candidates
 

Yiazmat

Member
Oct 25, 2017
216
I don't even need RDR2 graphics, my dream is a Tactics Ogre game for PS5 that looks like this image:

And with the environments being all small, static and blocky they could even use raytracing to get that perfect diorama look.



Throw a hundred million dollars into an SRPG pit and make the best Tactics Ogre game ever.
Or basically this.
 

Pata Hikari

Member
Jan 15, 2018
1,710
is self insert silent protagonist a budget thing? I thought that was a narrative decision. regardless, I hate it, and I'm tired of games with it, rather than an actual character
Considering the sheer amount of voice acting in this game it's very clear it's a deliberate choice.

Not to mention that the plot actually uses Beylth's general quietness as several chracters point out they're stoic and softspoken.
 

Faiyaz

Member
Nov 30, 2017
1,223
Bangladesh
I have a feeling that the next FE on the Switch will look absolutely fantastic. Three Houses has already laid the groundwork.
 

Moltres006

Member
Jan 5, 2019
1,080
Wait until the next gen switch. I'm sure sometime in future it'll be cheaper to develop an strategy RPG that looks as good as Horizon.
You might have to wait 5+ years though. 🤣
 

Evil Lucario

Member
Feb 16, 2019
360
Three Houses does have good production values though. Just not in the graphical department.

It all went into the gameplay/story/world with oodles and oodles of character interactions, voice overs, animated cutscenes, and an ambitious, split narrative across four routes with different outcomes and events.

Those aspects will carry the game much farther than just some pretty graphics. Even Valkyria Chronicles has maps that don't particularly look all that pleasing compared to your typical "AAA" game.

Game development is always a big give-or-take.
 

the_wart

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,347
Like most have said the genre is too niche to break the bank on production values. There is room to improve with Fire Emblem certainly, & given it was their first HD effort I expect it will over time, but I wouldn't expect it to ever be a graphical showcase.
Fire Emblem could certainly aspire to production values on the level of, say, the Xenoblade series, which would be a big step up. The limiting factor is probably know-how and experience more than budget, since FE is a much bigger IP at this point.

Speaking of which, what I wouldn't give to see Monolith handling the environments for the next FE. If they do remake Genealogy they're gonna need way bigger maps than they had in 3H.
 

PSqueak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,312
One day we shall get a SRW game with attack animations indistinguishable from their Animes of origin.

One day.
 

Dark_Castle

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,081
Square Enix isn't even interested in strategy RPG anymore. Recently they kind of made one, but only for mobile. You would think Left Alive is a successor to Front Mission, nope just another third person shooter.
 

Zedark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,543
The Netherlands
Well, you saw FETH's budget balloon compared to the 3ds games. If FETH measures up to it and sells 5M+, then you can expect further investment into the franchise. If growth continues to exist, then budget is quite possibly going to increase as well. Fire Emblem is your best bet for such a AAA SRPG, and FETH does not necessarily represent the most Nintendo is ever going to spend on it. That investment will be as big as for HZD is doubtful, but I don't think FETH is the ceiling in terms of SRPG budget if sales grow to the 5M level.
 

Elfforkusu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,923
Based on the trajectory of the FE games (and the ... subterranean trajectory of Valkyria Chronicles), I think future installments of FE are your best hope. They clearly just didn't prioritize graphics this time around (probably because they made the game 1000 hours long)

But there's not really anything right now. FFT was at the time, I guess.
 

ace3skoot

Member
Dec 3, 2018
37
I'd settle for an xcom game that doesn't run like ass, I don't need great graphics just smooth transitions and good loading times
 
OP
OP

banshee150

Member
Apr 3, 2019
571
Thanks for the recommendations and I will try out some of those games (I did see some of them on YT) but none of them have the production values I mentioned.

VC4 artstyle is nice but it looks just like VC1 did in 2008 and the production values are lower than Three Houses.

I thought Project Sakura Wars looked nice until they revealed that it became a generic action game.
 

CaviarMeths

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
6,953
Western Canada
Not really sure I'd be interested in an SRPG that looked like western AAA games. I don't find that style of art direction very interesting at all. FETH had some pretty questionable environments for sure, but the cure here definitely isn't making it look like a Rockstar game. Really what I would have wanted if they had a bigger budget was to commit more to the design aesthetic and go full cel-shading with its environments and models. Something more similar to Breath of the Wild than God of War.

Also, Valkyria Chronicles is not really an RPG. It's pretty much pure strategy/tactics.
 

texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,152
Indonesia
Not really sure I'd be interested in an SRPG that looked like western AAA games. I don't find that style of art direction very interesting at all. FETH had some pretty questionable environments for sure, but the cure here definitely isn't making it look like a Rockstar game. Really what I would have wanted if they had a bigger budget was to commit more to the design aesthetic and go full cel-shading with its environments and models. Something more similar to Breath of the Wild than God of War.
How about a new Final Fantasy Tactics in Final Fantasy XV or VIIR visuals?
 

IamFlying

Member
Apr 6, 2019
346
You might get your wish eventually if Fire Emblem continues to grow in popularity while other developers jump on the bandwagon.
The problem is that the FE developer would spend more money on the relationships and conversations cutscenes and writing.

They are already annoying because most of the time they don't add to the story or characters. And don't even start with the dumb tea parties. The SRGB part becomes more and more minor in FE games anyway, in a few years FE games will probably be only about socializing with other characters.

That's a shame because I enjoy the fighting part of FE very much. If FE developers would just concentrate on this and not the sometimes creepy "pick your love interest part" the games could be so much better.
 

Forkball

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,617
I'm loving Three Houses but yeah... it ain't a looker. I would like them to go full cel-shaded art style for the next title. The characters look fine, but they are contrasted by a bland world with a totally different art style. Especially if they are going to push the roaming aspects outside of battle, they need to make the hub area visually appealing.
 

Nappael

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,292
Honestly, probably not. Future installments of Fire Emblem are about as close as you are likely to get.

There's not much of a leap from SRPG's as you would know them to things like XCOM and Shadowrun, though. Or even something like Battletech. Shadowrun for more RPG, Battletech for more tactics/strategy.
 

Wereroku

Member
Oct 27, 2017
893
If it continues to sell consistently FE will get a higher budget. Maybe not in the 100 mil range but higher. However I don't know if you will ever get a set protagonist again. Most rpgs opt for silent as a design choice to get more investment to the player.
 

Glio

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,598
Spain
They can't sell as much as GoW so they won't have the GoW budget

It is quite simple.

The fact that Three Houses has almost triple the content that a normal Fire Emblem should have affected the budget. And honestly I prefer that to have only 40 hours but with better graphics.
 

HeRinger

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,739
Is Three Houses budget low to begin with?

Budget is more than graphics. The game has a ridiculous amount of dialogue and every single line is voiced. You have four different paths to take in the story and each one is at least 50 hours long. There are a ton of different characters, mechanics and systems at play. And the graphics aren't even that bad.

Budget seems pretty decent to me. It's just that it was spread over many aspects instead of just dumping most of it in graphics.
 

Zelas

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,005
SRPG need to sell better for that to happen.
Nobody need to remind you that Fire Emblem was a dying IP with Awakening planned to be the last one of the series.
FE has sold just as well as Divinity. And it has certainly sold more than Battletech.

Nintendo can afford to have similar production values but leans heavily in the direction of maximizing profit than producing polished efforts these days.
 

Phabh

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,077
I think the next FE will look a lot better now the HD transition is done and its apparent success.
 

Glio

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,598
Spain
FE has sold just as well as Divinity. And it has certainly sold more than Battletech.

Nintendo can afford to have similar production values but leans heavily in the direction of maximizing profit than producing polished efforts these days.
Do you have any proof of both budgets? Apart from the fact of being on different platforms and such.
 

Death Penalty

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
1,677
Might be a stretch, but FF could go this direction after VII Remake. A fully turn-based version of what VIIR is doing would basically be exactly what OP is asking for.
 

Starlatine

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,750
i dont get the "no self insert silent protagonist" complaint, most FE protagonists are defined, speaking characters. the few that aren't still speak. havent touched 3H yet but if its silent there then its actually a first from all FE games ive played