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Chamomile

Member
Oct 25, 2017
335
facebook-genderqueer-gengar.jpg


The worldwide Women's March was conducted yesterday at Washington, D.C. The Women's March aims to advocate for legislation pertaining to women's rights, reproductive rights, immigration reform, LGBTQ+ rights, etc. The unofficial symbol of the Women's March is essentially the "pink pussyhat." (Pictured below)

image.jpg


The consensus on Twitter from non-white women of color and transfolk appears to be that the symbol of the pink pussyhat is exclusionary because "feminism extends beyond women, [to women that do] not have vaginas, and [to women of color's vaginas that] are [not] pink". (Taken from Tweet below)


Furthermore, yesterday, it was found that some white women placed a pink pussyhat on a statue of Harriet Tubman, a female Black abolitionist who helped many slaves escape their slaveowners by using the Underground Railroad. (Tweets below)



All criticism aside: the pink pussyhat creator addressed the critiques in an article on February 2017.

The cat-eared "pussyhat" became the crown of the Women's March in January. Many saw it as a symbol of female empowerment -- and still don the pink hat weeks after the event that catapulted it to fame. But others believed the pussyhat equated gender with biology, making some transgender people feel excluded from the movement.

"I never thought that by calling it the 'pussyhat' that it was saying that women's issues are predicated on the possession of the pussy," Pussyhat Project co-founder Krista Suh told NBC Out.

Suh said that was not the knitting group's intention when it created the hat. She expressed sadness that some people felt that way.
Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/pink-pussyhat-creator-addresses-criticism-over-name-n717886

Although Suh's explanation makes sense at face, it is important to understand that many women of color, LGBTQ+, and non-binary people still experience radically exclusionary behavior from white women. This is similar to other groups that intersect with "white" or otherwise privileged forms of identity that indirectly or directly benefit from the plight and activism of marginalized groups. One of these groups would be Black men being the "face" and atop the totem pole of the civil rights and Black Lives Matter movement because of their male identity being a "privilege" in comparison to their female counterparts (for more reading on this read about misogynoir--misogyny that is directly aimed and experienced by women of color, especially Black women--please refer to this article, an interview by the woman who coined the term: https://mic.com/articles/152965/mee...an-who-created-the-term-misogynoir#.JQueFlEZx).

I have collected a few Tweets below that (although not embedded because of the limit of 2 Tweet embeds per post) chronicles the experiences of both women of color, LGBTQ+, and non-binary peoples:

brg0vmV.png

BCYxiaa.png

cauqeCA.png


How can we do better to ensure this exclusionary behavior stops? Should the Women's March leadership implement measures to keep these exclusionary people out?
 

IrishNinja

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,837
Vice City
^exaaaaaactly

that first sign in the OP should've been shut down, full stop - i went to the DC one last year and there were several signs about "Ill see you fine ladies at the next BLM meeting, right?" type message and man, did that resonate

sansour & others put together something special, but like many such movements, it's kinda obvious if you don't have POC & other minority groups involved enough or in mind with the effort...fuckery like that creeps in
 

SocksForWok

Alt-Account.
Banned
Jan 8, 2018
119
User Has Been Banned (length pending review) For: Trolling. Not Reading the OP. Transphobic remarks.
The next wave of feminism really needs to drop the hatred of men, they're losing more allies than they realize.
 

SegFault

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,939
I was pretty pleased that the march here in Philly seemed more inclusive. Most of the speakers mentioned trans rights, disabled rights, black lives, etc. didn't see anything TERF-y thankfully.

The next wave of feminism really needs to drop the hatred of men, they're losing more allies than they realize.

lol.

anime avatar too
 
OP
OP
Chamomile

Chamomile

Member
Oct 25, 2017
335
Wait wait wait. There are vaginas that aren't pink?
I think the implication is that "pink pussies" refer to white women's pussies and not other women of color's.

Also I forgot to add this quote in the Suh defense in the OP so here it is. Very important and adds more context:

"I think 'pussy' refers to the female anatomical part, but it's also a word that's used to shame people who are feminine … whether they are men, women [or] genderqueer. And I think what it comes down to is that femininity is really disrespected in our society," Suh explained.

The Los Angeles screenwriter said the concept was inspired by outrage over President Trump's "grab 'em by the pussy" comment captured in a 2005 Access Hollywood recording. The symbolism is all about "pussy power," she explained. She said the knitters were frustrated that the most intimate part of their bodies is often used as a catchword for weakness.

"We want to reclaim that word," Suh said.
 

Deleted member 11413

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,961
I think the implication is that "pink pussies" refer to white women's pussies and not other women of color's.

Also I forgot to add this quote in the Suh defense in the OP so here it is. Very important and adds more context:
I think the hat being pink has more to do with pink being a color associated with women and femininity, rather than the physical color of anyone's genitalia.
 
OP
OP
Chamomile

Chamomile

Member
Oct 25, 2017
335
I think the hat being pink has more to do with pink being a color associated with women and femininity, rather than the physical color of anyone's genitalia.
I think so too, as stated by the creator of the original hat. It's just now being co-opted by exclusionary feminists, so I think it's important to recognize the original intentions and how the meaning has warped because a group of people has systemically reduced the support from other marginalized identities.
 

Amory

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,161
Why does everything have to be explicitly inclusionary? If you wanna wear a vagina hat wear a vagina hat. If you're a woman without a vagina and don't wanna wear a vagina hat, that's cool too.

The event itself can be inclusive.
 

firehawk12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,202
I remember hearing about the hat being quietly unofficially "banned" a few days before the rallies and I do get that it's alienating, both to women of colour and to genderqueer/trans women. I don't know the symbol loses its power if you change the colour or even the shape though, but it's also a reminder that intersectionality is important and that you have to be careful if you want to make blanket statements about "all women".
 

Platy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,703
Brazil
I mean I understand how reprodutive rights affects most women and all but ... yeah there are better ways to protest that. SPECIALLY with that terf sign.

Like seriously you could be protesting about EVERYTHING ... wage gap, genital mutilation, violence against women of color, lesbophobia, harassers, trump's mysoginy ... and THAT is what you think it is the most important issue?

Did you read how they were treating trans folk? They were saying MtF individuals were false and are basically still men, that's quite awful, no?

So by saying "hatred of men" it sounds like you agree that trans women are men ... is that right?
 

SocksForWok

Alt-Account.
Banned
Jan 8, 2018
119
I think so too, as stated by the creator of the original hat. It's just now being co-opted by exclusionary feminists, so I think it's important to recognize the original intentions and how the meaning has warped because a group of people has systemically reduced the support from other marginalized identities.

Exactly my point, dunno why others are so apparently mystified.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,129
A lot of trans women have been speaking out about usage of the vagina and "pussy"s as a rallying cry feels really exclusionary. I tend to agree.
 

Opto

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,546
and it's an little girl anime avatar too!

The amount of people in the Women's March is going to lead to some problematic happenings. For a lot of negative interactions, there were some positive ones of intersectionality too. There definitely needs work to be done, but the turnout against a single president is impressive and fortuitous for actual seats being flipped.
 

Darryl M R

The Spectacular PlayStation-Man
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,721
Why does everything have to be explicitly inclusionary? If you wanna wear a vagina hat wear a vagina hat. If you're a woman without a vagina and don't wanna wear a vagina hat, that's cool too.

The event itself can be inclusive.
Sounds like faux inclusion. It's not hard to be conscious of your messaging and address concerns which would allow you to keep your original message.

"Despite the phrase we use and the hats wear, this march is for all women including transwomen and women of color." Bam. And this is the lowest effort solution.
 

Linkura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,943
and it's an little girl anime avatar too!

The amount of people in the Women's March is going to lead to some problematic happenings. For a lot of negative interactions, there were some positive ones of intersectionality too. There definitely needs work to be done, but the turnout against a single president is impressive and fortuitous for actual seats being flipped.
Yeah, with a group that large, there's gonna be assholes involved no matter what. The question is what can be done. There's no reason for folks to feel excluded at these events due to their skin color or orientation/gender identity.

Edit: And of course you have an Anime avatar, of course...

Looks like a chibi fanart of Maria from Xenogears, actually. But yeah...
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,944
This was one of the reasons I thought the way the March came together last year was odd. There was so many different reasons to protest and it was clear that many were being ignored or forgotten in favor of the "easy" ways of protest, but would so many people have been involved if the march focused on the harder issues brought up in the OP? Unfortunately I don't think so. Hopefully future protests will do a better job of fostering tolerant intersectional discussion that involves everyone

Full disclosure I wore a Pikachu hat to the women's march last year, so I also deserve criticism for wearing a silly hat
 

SegFault

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,939
and it's an little girl anime avatar too!

The amount of people in the Women's March is going to lead to some problematic happenings. For a lot of negative interactions, there were some positive ones of intersectionality too. There definitely needs work to be done, but the turnout against a single president is impressive and fortuitous for actual seats being flipped.

indeed. it's also slightly a good thing imo that we can get these issues out in the open while we have an unprecedented amount of people supporting the cause


Trans Exclusionary Radical 'Feminist'
 
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