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abellwillring

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,907
Austin, TX
I had actually canceled my sub but then bought the 6 month sub with the flying ghost ship on sale from ebay (got it for like $54 or something which was a really nice deal in theory) but haven't touched it in like 6 weeks now. This expansion is sadly not at all compelling for me.. I haven't bothered to level up any alts after getting about 8 or so to 110 in the last one. Certainly one of the main issues was the follower quests only yielding like 100-125 gold.. it's barely even worth my time to open the app.

Has there been anything new added in the past month plus?
 
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Tachya

Tachya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,496
Rokal good post.

Yeah, it's a huge problem that systems aren't really integrated anymore. Like there's no overarching systems philosophy/goal. There's all these various types of content, but they're frequently contradictory in a vacuum and especially so in the context that they're often undermining other pieces of content. It's negative synergy.

For gearing especially, probably the primary source of player power, too much seems to be more or less viable, so nothing feels valuable.

Perhaps one solution would to be to have gear go back to being good only for specific activities (e.g. PvP gear with resilience), but that has a different set of issues. As it stands though, gear is being used as a sort of catch-all reward system and very likely overused beyond an appropriate amount.

Islands and Warfronts are a huge shame because clearly a lot of developer resources went into them, but the final product is not worth that much. Islands are especially bad because the objective being the exact same across all islands every time devolves them into the same boring mess, just with different window dressing.


I'm not entirely sure if this is the right way to go about it, but I think in general Blizzard should look at condensing difficulty settings while also slowly increasing depth (if not also breadth) for class and systems design. The latter is a fine thing to balance if you also want to remain accessible, but remaining stagnant or shrinking depth is not the way to go (neither is change for change's sake) if you want to retain veterans as well. I definitely think the strata of difficulty in content in the game has gotten out of hand though. I'm not completely anti-LFR or anything, but it's introduction was definitely a turning point, certainly for raids.

For raids specifically, I'm not sure where you'd make the prune. Probably the current normal mode? But that assumes nothing else changes and to be honest the whole system might need a larger redesign. I don't know about other people, but I would almost certainly still be very committed if 10-man Mythic was a thing. Obviously that has its own drawbacks, but that's more on Blizzard's end. It makes THEIR job easier only having to balance for one "hard" difficulty. It doesn't necessarily make for the best end-user experience.
 
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Bregor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,477
Raids and Instances are fine. It's the new content (Islands and Warfronts) that are a flop.

And more importantly, it's the new system - Azerite. Don't forget that an activity is no better than it's reward. In Legion AP was a good reward because it earned you permanent upgrades. With the Azerite system you have to grind just to stay in the same place. That's no fun and motivates nobody. With the motivation for earning Azerite being poor, the activities that reward it by definition become less appealing.
 

TiredGamer

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,813
I love how the final Raid Finder wing for Dazar'alor opens just 2 weeks before Dreadwake subs start expiring (Monday March 18 2018, 180 days after the promotion launched).
 

Anoregon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,014
Raids and Instances are fine. It's the new content (Islands and Warfronts) that are a flop.

And more importantly, it's the new system - Azerite. Don't forget that an activity is no better than it's reward. In Legion AP was a good reward because it earned you permanent upgrades. With the Azerite system you have to grind just to stay in the same place. That's no fun and motivates nobody. With the motivation for earning Azerite being poor, the activities that reward it by definition become less appealing.

Raids and Dungeons are generally good, but I found M+ overall to be a lot less fun and interesting in BfA than Legion. I know some of that is Azerite related, but the dungeons themselves felt like more of a chore largely due to a mix of onerous trash and spec/combat mechanics feeling a bit worse than Legion.
 

Prophet Five

Pundeath Knight
Member
Nov 11, 2017
7,689
The Great Dark Beyond
Raids and Dungeons are generally good, but I found M+ overall to be a lot less fun and interesting in BfA than Legion. I know some of that is Azerite related, but the dungeons themselves felt like more of a chore largely due to a mix of onerous trash and spec/combat mechanics feeling a bit worse than Legion.

yeah same. I think it has a lot to do with trash and some specs/classes feeling like they're missing that certain something/ability.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,964
G'huun health got lowered again by 5%. Even for rekills the last phase is still a nightmare where you constantly wipe at like 1-2m hp left.
 

cdyhybrid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,422
Classes being meh makes everything less enjoyable, since you have to play your class's mechanics to do pretty much anything that isn't pet battles.
 

Kintaro

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,331
Been gone a couple of months, did 8.1 bring the nerf to leveling I read about before stopping? I was leveling some allied races but I just couldn't continue with that torture for the upteenth time.
 
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Tachya

Tachya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,496
Been gone a couple of months, did 8.1 bring the nerf to leveling I read about before stopping? I was leveling some allied races but I just couldn't continue with that torture for the upteenth time.

Yeah but I wasn't leveling anything (at least anything below 110) when it was supposedly really bad and I haven't leveled anything since the change went through so I don't have a good frame of reference myself.

Although with the war mode change if you're leveling an Alliance character with war mode enabled you'll likely be getting a 30% xp boost on top of any other xp bonuses you have rather than just a 10% one.
 

Kintaro

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,331
Yeah but I wasn't leveling anything (at least anything below 110) when it was supposedly really bad and I haven't leveled anything since the change went through so I don't have a good frame of reference myself.

Although with the war mode change if you're leveling an Alliance character with war mode enabled you'll likely be getting a 30% xp boost on top of any other xp bonuses you have rather than just a 10% one.
Ok I need to see if I can find the XP changes somewhere. The XP boost for Alliance is nice, too bad I was doing my hordie. Does the XP boost also apply to the 110-120 range, because I have Alliance that I want to level.
 

Magnus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,350
Ok I need to see if I can find the XP changes somewhere. The XP boost for Alliance is nice, too bad I was doing my hordie. Does the XP boost also apply to the 110-120 range, because I have Alliance that I want to level.

The 30% from War Mode does! That with a 5% experience gem and some horde incursions (same as Legion invasions) thrown into the max and leveling is breezy. Mix it up with a few Island Expeditions and you're golden.
 

Kintaro

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,331
The 30% from War Mode does! That with a 5% experience gem and some horde incursions (same as Legion invasions) thrown into the max and leveling is breezy. Mix it up with a few Island Expeditions and you're golden.
Oh wow, I completely forgot about incursions. Are those as nice as the Legion invasions for leveling?
 
Oct 25, 2017
12,486
I went from 50-70 on my dark iron shaman so fast. Just used heirlooms, plus the xp buff you can buy with legion medals which is 10% and adds 10 to all stats which also persists through death btw, and warmode 30% xp bonus. I did mostly quests but also like maybe 2 dungeons.
 
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Tachya

Tachya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,496
Huh.

The higher level story stuff seems interesting enough, but it just makes all the current faction war stuff stand out as very contrived and doesn't excuse the poor writing.

Like, you can't just come in and say "hey guys the bad plot/character development was all an intentional setup to juxtapose with this good stuff!"

I mean you could, but it's hardly an endearing strategy vs. just being consistently high (enough) quality. It's the same as intentionally sabotaging something then hoping to look the hero by coming to fix it. Except literally everyone involved saw you sabotaging the thing in the first place, so you're just an asshole. Oh and for some reason we still end up paying the perpetrator the whole time.

Interesting thought experiment would be if software/games could have situations where they're compelled to fork the code if the user-base isn't satisfied by some measure. So you either produce good content or risk some other company being able to step in and do your job better.
 

Cass_Se

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,123
I'm all for Old Gods finally coming into the story, but my interest is thwarted by everything around Sylvanas continuing to be dumpster fire.
 

Anoregon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,014
Zandopally mount:

814727.jpg


Shoulda been a raptor, but not bad.
 

Magnus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,350
Oh wow, I completely forgot about incursions. Are those as nice as the Legion invasions for leveling?

Dont think so but still lucrative compared to every other way to level. Felt like 50-60% of a rested level. I could be wrong. And that was with the 30% war mode buff, 5% gem and 10% potion. Also, completing the full incursion grants you an additional 10% buff for an hour. It's a no brainer.
 

RoninChaos

Member
Oct 26, 2017
8,331
Hey, for the quests out in darkshore, can those Rares that drop mounts be killed once a day or is it just once every time the Warfront is up?
 

Jag

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,669
Dont think so but still lucrative compared to every other way to level. Felt like 50-60% of a rested level. I could be wrong. And that was with the 30% war mode buff, 5% gem and 10% potion. Also, completing the full incursion grants you an additional 10% buff for an hour. It's a no brainer.

More like roughly 1/3 of a rested level per assault. I'm leveling up some Alliance alts through assaults only. Using a gem, 30% war mode and the prior assault 1hr 10% buff (and this week DMF lol). I don't think everything stacks, but I haven't tried to figure out which.

Hey, for the quests out in darkshore, can those Rares that drop mounts be killed once a day or is it just once every time the Warfront is up?

You don't need quests for the mount to drop. Just kill the rare. You can only kill one rare per character per warfront cycle. Meaning you can kill it while Alliance or Horde holds it, but you can't get kill credit again until the warfront changes hands. (I believe it is 6 days for the scenario to run + resource hand in time. Not totally sure)

I'm running 6 120s through warfront rare hunting and only have 2 mounts left to get. Got the Chimera yesterday. I'd say about half are easily soloable, the others need a few players.

If you don't have Handynotes Warfront addon, stop and get it now. It tells you what you have already killed for the current cycle. It also tells you which rares have items you still need (mounts, toys, etc). It is very accurate and useful.
 

RoninChaos

Member
Oct 26, 2017
8,331
More like roughly 1/3 of a rested level per assault. I'm leveling up some Alliance alts through assaults only. Using a gem, 30% war mode and the prior assault 1hr 10% buff (and this week DMF lol). I don't think everything stacks, but I haven't tried to figure out which.



You don't need quests for the mount to drop. Just kill the rare. You can only kill one rare per character per warfront cycle. Meaning you can kill it while Alliance or Horde holds it, but you can't get kill credit again until the warfront changes hands. (I believe it is 6 days for the scenario to run + resource hand in time. Not totally sure)

I'm running 6 120s through warfront rare hunting and only have 2 mounts left to get. Got the Chimera yesterday. I'd say about half are easily soloable, the others need a few players.

If you don't have Handynotes Warfront addon, stop and get it now. It tells you what you have already killed for the current cycle. It also tells you which rares have items you still need (mounts, toys, etc). It is very accurate and useful.
I'll definitely grab that add on. Thanks for the response. So I shouldn't bother going back there tomorrow with my DK since he already killed the Rares that drop mounts this cycle, got it. When do we get another shot at this? In 2 weeks?
 

Jag

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,669
I completely forgot about the 5% XP gem and I main a jewelcrafter. -_-

For leveling, get the Sephuz Legendary ring and socket the gem. It will last from 110-120 even if you lose the ring bonus after 115. Although, I did read something about them possibly "fixing" it so you can't socket BFA gems in non-BFA items. I was worried about this, so I socketed all my 5% gems before the last patch. Not sure how to get a socket on leveling items without crafting them.

I'll definitely grab that add on. Thanks for the response. So I shouldn't bother going back there tomorrow with my DK since he already killed the Rares that drop mounts this cycle, got it. When do we get another shot at this? In 2 weeks?

Yeah, you won't get another shot for the mounts on your DK until the reset. I think it is roughly two weeks, but I'm not really sure. That's why having max level alts is useful! Don't forget about the Arathi mounts too. Handynotes works for all.
 
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Anoregon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,014
I was half-joking, but in all honesty I think the collector's edition mount is absolutely perfect for Zandalari Paladins.
 

Metroidvania

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,767
So.....apparently Blizz is doubling down (not that there was a lot of doubt) on Sylvanas going full Garrosh, what with her
'confirming' to have been all-but-conditioning Derek Proudmoore in a not-a-violation-by-a-hair of the forsaken ideology
, which is funny, because IIRC Blizz was quick to point out that the
Risen Night Elf rangers joining with the horde was all free will

But at the same time...
Bownsamdi is 'confirming' that Sylvanas is important to the Death Gods/Pantheon storyline being laid, in that he apparently tells Telanji he'd free her from the bargain Rastakhan made if Telanji brings him Sylvanas' head

....Eesh. I suppose it's not 'technically' Garrosh 2.0, but.....GL with that, Blizz
 

Bregor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,477
Why are you so suprised? She has been this way for years. The problem isn't that she will probably get removed. The problem is that they replaced the superb Vol'jinn with her.
 

CarthOhNoes

Someone is plagiarizing this post
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,181
Just back and hit 120 on a new server (EU - dirty alliance) after a hiatus since Legion. If anyone knows anyone who wants a laid back, friendly tank who used to raid very hardcore but doesn't have the time anymore and wants something chill and casual then give em my name!
 
Nov 2, 2017
2,084
Way better than another boring raptor.
this is so much better than raptor #48456
I disagree. Rezan was the patron Loa of the Prelates, and so it should've been either a raptor or a small Devilsaur. The normal Zandalari mounts are already direhorns, and almost all of the raptor mounts are old and shitty looking. If I recall correctly the only "new" raptor models are either the Vicious one, or the CE ones. Vicious is a pain in the ass to get, and I dislike the look of it anyway.

The holy Direhorn isn't bad by any means. But I'm disappointed. I wanted a cool new Raptor
 

Yunsen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,762
Speaking of Direhorns, I finally got the last one I needed from Warbringers tonight. I got the first two during Mists (and saw the 3rd drop before but didn't win it). I've looked for Warbringers off and on for most of BFA and finally got the last mount I needed from them.
 

Jag

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,669
Speaking of Direhorns, I finally got the last one I needed from Warbringers tonight. I got the first two during Mists (and saw the 3rd drop before but didn't win it). I've looked for Warbringers off and on for most of BFA and finally got the last mount I needed from them.

I'm about 25 mounts from the last mount achievement. So many of the remaining ones are rng drops. I just don't have the will or energy to farm them anymore.
 

Prophet Five

Pundeath Knight
Member
Nov 11, 2017
7,689
The Great Dark Beyond
I used to farm ICC and others for mounts on like 12 characters weekly and I have no idea where that motivation went. It's not so much that I hate doing it - I think I just don't have enough time in the day. I think I have maybe one of the direhorns but honestly I'm not sure - I should get back on that sometime.
 

LegendofTrey

Member
Oct 27, 2017
306
Is there a good source for Rings/Trinkets/Weapons besides the AH? RNG kills it for me. I haven't gotten a good weapon ring or trinket on any toon but my DH that I raided with when BOA first launched.

=/
 
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Tachya

Tachya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,496
I'm about 25 mounts from the last mount achievement. So many of the remaining ones are rng drops. I just don't have the will or energy to farm them anymore.

There's a few lower hanging ones for me and with a little luck on rarer drops I could hit 350 I think, especially with the stuff added in BfA, but yeah, it can just be so tedious at times it's demoralizing. At this point most individual mounts themselves aren't particularly exciting, they're just another number to add to my collection total.

Add in the fact that I'm overall demoralized about the game right now and don't know how much or even how long I'll play it into the future and it's not the most enticing activity, even as one of the more stable long-term goals in the game.
 
Oct 25, 2017
12,486
image0.png


I like this catch up mechanic. I know one guy, and others, probably hate it. But I think it's a good thing. Kinda keeps these dungeons still relevant for progression in some cases. Keeps normal mythic on the same level as LFR for BFD.
 

Prophet Five

Pundeath Knight
Member
Nov 11, 2017
7,689
The Great Dark Beyond
Dungeons having their item levels updated over the course of the expansion makes complete sense so you don't drive them to be irrelevant versus new content (See Cataclysm and the End Time trilogy on how not to do dungeons. Or Mists and not adding anything at all). Essentlially when season 2 begins the first raid will be outdated and sadly hardly anyone will be running it for gearing purposes. They don't want to get back into the BC era of raid progression.

Blanket statements about how "one guy and others may hate it" are unnecessary. What the actual, valid concern is with gearing is how there's no actual line of progression that matters now. Currently, you can do dungeons then jump into raiding. But your raid gear (let's say heroic) doesn't matter as much because you can get gear from M+, Warfronts, Titan/Warforging, caches, and whatever the hell it is I'm sure that I'm forgetting to mention. Someone can be 370 with a little luck and a lot of keystone runs. It makes raiding feel less substantial despite the effort that is put into it by one person and their coordinated teams.

This line of "people complaining about the game are only being negative!!!!!!!!!!!!" that is pervading the playerbase is ridiculous. There's a difference between being a troll who just blasts the game 24/7 and people who play the game and know it can be better. I'd say "I'm sorry that it seems BFA is generating a negative response" but I'm not. They've released an expansion that isn't reaching the same highs as before and it shows. I truly doubt anyone who is upset about the current state of the game wants Blizzard/WoW to crash and burn. We just want it to be better. But this idea that people can't take issue with the state of the game just because others enjoy it is absurd.
 
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Tachya

Tachya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,496
Honestly more things should probably adjust dynamically or with a greater sensitivity of being done manually.

Regarding increasing the ilvl of entry dungeon content as time goes on.
 
Oct 25, 2017
12,486
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