WSJ: ‘Simpsons’ Episode Featuring Michael Jackson’s Voice to Be Pulled From Circulation

Cranster

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Oct 25, 2017
4,072
Michael Jackson flat out admits to monsterous things. This sounds a lot like you drawing the line at precisely penetration, when there are tons and tons of things in the documentary that Jackson and his estate admit to that are very obviously monstrous.
Michael Jackson and his estate never admitted to any monstrous things. The only thing that gives me pause is him having kids in his bed but it sounds wrong when taken out of the context of his statement since he admitted he would be in a sleeping bag off the bed.

Previous allegations were proven false in court and considering the history in this specific case I draw the line when I am presented actual proof of abuse as a biased for profit documentary doesn't prove anything. Let alone when it makes claims that other specific boys were abused only for them to refute it afterwards.

Jimmy Savile had hundreds of people come out shortly after his death with similar stories and was subject of multiple independent journalist investigations along with police investigations that lead to multiple arrests and convictions. There is also publicly aired footage of Jimmy Savile of him groping young girls.

However, if an unbiased investigation occurs and finds MJ was a pedophile, then fine, he is guilty.
 

LewieP

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,978
I would say that basically is the opposite of what you're claiming it proves. Michael Jackson wasn't a member of The Jetzons, in what way does "hard times" have anything to do with Jackson beyond the fact that the author of the song also wrote background music for Jackson's other songs?

Beyond that, they've already replaced the Sonic 3 soundtrack before.
Do you think Sega's decision to not rerelease Sonic 3 since 2011 is unrelated to Michael Jackson? I don't know what other explanations there could be, not sure if it's anything that's really known outside of Sega.
 

Krejlooc

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Oct 27, 2017
15,593
Michael Jackson and his estate never admitted to any monstrous things.

Here is Michael Jackson admitting he sleeps with children. A 30 fucking year old man sleeping with 7 year old boys is monstrous. This is not up for debate.

am presented actual proof of abuse as a biased for profit documentary doesn't prove anything.
The documentary explains that neither Wade Robson nor James Safechuck, nor any of their family, were paid to appear in the documentary nor do they receive a cent of any profits. You'd know that, if you actually watched the documentary.
 

Goldenroad

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,771
Erasing history because of a documentary that comes out 30 years after an episode came out? One that still doesn’t prove any guilt?

I mean I get it..but the episode doesn’t even officially claim or credit MJ in it.

Will it be taken off streaming?
It's not erasing history. The episode existed and exists in digital and physical formats all over the world. They're just not going to air it (or probably stream it) going forward. Forward as in the future. They cast a monster and feel that tarnishes the episode because of course it does and could potentially help contribute negatively to the ongoing healing processfor his victims. It's their show and their call to make and I respect it. Everyone should, but they won't. People will threaten and harass these creators for doing the right thing like the internet always does.
 
Oct 25, 2017
10,511
Does it make sense to cancel someone who has been dead for 10 years?
On Still Processing (great podcast, episode here https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/07/podcasts/still-processing-mj-michael-jackson-leaving-neverland.html) the discuss the nature of cancel culture w/r/t to MJ. They more or less settled on that with somelike MJ you can't cancel the person, especially once they've passed. It's especially hard to cancel him when his legacy and impact on pop culture has already been felt, and impacted so many others; they use the example of how he influeced people like Beyonce, JT, and many others. So in the case of MJ, removing his episode from circulation is about the best you can do but you can't simply 'cancel' his cultural impact.

Now, this changes a bit with someone like Louis CK. They had an impact and likely influenced people, but you can effectively "cancel" them from continuing to profit and have opportunities as they're still performing.
 

UF_C

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
999
It’s a good call. Making money from syndication off a child molester’s fame is not a good look.
 

UberTag

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,397
Kitchener, ON
Edit: I'll also say if this blows up and they get the lynch mobs after them, they'll probably just have someone else re-record his lines.
Bringing in Kipp Lennon to re-record Leon Kompowsky's dialogue isn't the problem. The problem is that the episode was framed around the Michael Jackson mythos and that can't simply be dubbed out of the episode or replaced with some fictional Simpsonized pop idol caricature to use in his place. It's too ingrained into the episode's narrative.

And for those of you who aren't aware, the show has been perfectly content to evoke nostalgia for this episode in recent years by having Kipp Lennon perform "Lisa, It's Your Birthday" in a live performance in 2014 at the Hollywood Bowl (5 years after Michael's death)...



And then again in a Season 29 episode of the show proper...

 

Replicant

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Oct 25, 2017
2,829
MN
It's not erasing history. The episode existed and exists in digital and physical formats all over the world. They're just not going to air it (or probably stream it) going forward. Forward as in the future. They cast a monster and feel that tarnishes the episode because of course it does and could potentially help contribute negatively to the ongoing healing processfor his victims. It's their show and their call to make and I respect it. Everyone should, but they won't. People will threaten and harass these creators for doing the right thing like the internet always does.
It’s their choice to make and I respect it, but again, I don’t like the fact they can try to hide stuff away. At the very least redub the voice.
 

Goldenroad

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,771
Bringing in Kipp Lennon to re-record Leon Kompowsky's dialogue isn't the problem. The problem is that the episode was framed around the Michael Jackson mythos and that can't simply be dubbed out of the episode or replaced with some fictional Simpsonized pop idol caricature to use in his place. It's too ingrained into the episode's narrative.

And for those of you who aren't aware, the show has been perfectly content to evoke nostalgia for this episode in recent years by having Kipp Lennon perform "Lisa, It's Your Birthday" in a live performance in 2014 at the Hollywood Bowl (5 years after Michael's death)...



And then again in a Season 29 episode of the show proper...

I hadn't considered that, but you're right. It's an episode beyond redemption. Oh well.
 

TSSZNews

Member
Oct 27, 2017
639
Are we never going to see Do The Bartman on TV ever again too?

IIRC that was directly produced by MJ and FOX even aired it the Sunday after he died.
 
Pulled from simpsonsworld.com

Outlaw Torn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
277
Looks like the episode was also taken off of Simpsons World streaming.

Season 3 starts with episode 2 now and clicking on the episode after searching for it leads to a 404 page.
 

UberTag

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,397
Kitchener, ON
Are we never going to see Do The Bartman on TV ever again too?

IIRC that was directly produced by MJ and FOX even aired it the Sunday after he died.
I think that's slightly different because MJ isn't inextricably linked with "Do the Bartman" the way he is with Stark Raving Dad even if he helped to produce it.
 
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Krejlooc

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Oct 27, 2017
15,593
The real question is Krejlooc going to ban Sonic 3 from his life?
I've said from the release of Sonic 3 that the tracks that supposedly sample MJ -- Knuckles Theme, Mini Boss 1, Carnival Night Zone, and Launch Base Zone, are among the worst sonic songs of all time. All of them have been replaced, either with Sonic & Knuckles patching them out (Knuckles Theme and Mini Boss 1) or the PC release.

I've also said for years I feel like Sonic 3 was the worst of the main sega genesis Sonic games. If they ever do re-release it, I hope for sure they change those tracks.

I just don't think Ice Cap Zone has really anything to do with Jackson, since you can prove the song existed before Buxer worked with Jackson at all.
 

Goldenroad

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Nov 2, 2017
2,771
It’s their choice to make and I respect it, but again, I don’t like the fact they can try to hide stuff away. At the very least redub the voice.
Again. They aren't hiding anything away or erasing the past. If you want that episode, it is out there. Go get it. Those early season DVD's go on sale for like $5 all the time. They aren't going to come delete the episode off your hard drive or rip the tape out of your VHS. It will never not exist. The gist of it is, they don't want to be presenting an episode going forward, that we find out now is almost 100% definitely about a child rapist, as being representative of what their show is. If you don't like that, then I really can't help you, but it I hope it's just because you haven't really thought it through.
 

Goldenroad

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,771
Making it unable to be viewed unless you physically own it for one.
If you don't own it then you can't complain about not being able to view it. If you own it (physically or digitally) you can view it. Go be a producer at the Simpsons and you can have a right to your say in how other people can watch it.

This entitlement in this thread is crazy. "I should get to have something I don't own because it's my right to watch whatever I want whenever I want". I don't sit here and complain that they don't air the Dana Carvey Show anymore, or that most SNL episodes are missing a ton of sketches in syndication or that the retro channel doesn't play the Cosby Show anymore. The people that own those shows and networks get to decide what to do with them. Go make your own shows if you want to have a say.
 

Mido

Member
Oct 27, 2017
745
It will join the cult of banned TV episodes like Family Guy's Wish Upon a Weinstein.
 

Sanjuro

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Oct 25, 2017
11,870
Massachusetts
I would have preferred a disclaimer for fans who would like to directly see the episode, and have it taken out of network/stream rotation.
 

RedMercury

Member
Dec 24, 2017
7,122
This is the right call to make. For people who are desperate to see it, it will always be out there, but taking a stand against child rape is a bit more important than airing a cartoon.
 

Stinkles

343 Industries
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
12,196
I don't like this. It's possible to understand history without erasure.

Removing it from circulation is also history and arguably as historical as the episode. And the episode itself is still available just not on air. But it's still copyrighted material and that's commerce as well as history. Lots of important information and media is outright destroyed in the name of commerce.

Besides even if you believe Michael Jackson's own words 100%, and all he did was innocently sleep with multiple young boys, hundreds of times - and show them naked art of other children and at least one playboy magazine, with no other adults present - airing an episode about his friendship with a small boy through the proxy of an overweight white man's body as a twist, is a really bad look for a corporation.

So it's only surprising it took a documentary many years later to tip that scale.

Jackson's (above described) behaviors at the time were not disputed. Those are the things he himself acknowledged.

It’s their choice to make and I respect it, but again, I don’t like the fact they can try to hide stuff away. At the very least redub the voice.
The entire plot is predicated on the fact that he sounds like Michael Jackson and his name is Michael Jackson. They'd have to redub with a famous performer of color for it to even make sense.
 

TheKidObi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
725

Here is Michael Jackson admitting he sleeps with children. A 30 fucking year old man sleeping with 7 year old boys is monstrous. This is not up for debate.
Context matter in the video when the interviewer mention sleeps with boys MJ said it wasn't in a sexual way yet people mention it like his having sex with in bed with boys.Now a days when someone said they sleep with someone in bed everyone thinking they having sex in bed.

Regardless I'm not defending sleeping in bed with boys weather it's sexual or non sexual. just clearing that statement to make it clear MJ said it wasn't in a sexual way, so y'all better not come at me saying I'm defending him sleeping with boys, cause yall be assuming some shit and taking things it of context.
 

Krejlooc

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Oct 27, 2017
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Context matter in the video when the interviewer mention sleeps with boys MJ said it wasn't in a sexual way yet people mention it like his having sex with in bed with boys.Now a days when someone said they sleep with someone in bed everyone thinking they having sex in bed.

Regardless I'm not defending sleeping in bed with boys weather it's sexual or non sexual. just puting that statement to make it clear MJ said it wasn't in a sexual way, so y'all better not come at me saying I'm defending him sleeping with boys, cause yall be assuming some shit.
Context absolutely matters. So let's add some context from a boy who A) Has never sued the Jackson estate nor intends to, and B) Claims there was never any explicitly sexual encounter with Jackson:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/michael-jackson-called-rubba-rubba-13912812

"When I slept in his bed, we wore just boxer shorts and he would put his arm around me and push his body to my body, like you would with a girlfriend.

“He would put our bodies on each other and kiss me on the head and cheek. I woke many times and his hands were on me... one hand on the top of my legs and one hand around me.

“When he was high on his medication he would get closer in the same way as when a man gets drunk. It disinhibited him.

“He’d pull me closer and be grabbing me more and kissing me more on the head and on the cheek, He would also stroke my hair.

“He never carried out an explicit sexual act on me, but there were sexual intentions.

“He must have been getting something out of it sexually. I feel now like he was testing me, seeing how far he could go.”

It is EXACTLY this kind of context, within the last several months, that has turned the conversation on Michael Jackson. The above is from January of this year. That is literally the purpose of the documentary, to add context to everything regarding Jackson. It's why it's turned so many minds.
 
Apr 14, 2018
2,266
That episode he didnt even want credit in and used a voice double for? Simpsons needed a positive headline after Apu last year. This documentary is firing up Hollywood
 

Birdie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,459
I've said from the release of Sonic 3 that the tracks that supposedly sample MJ -- Knuckles Theme, Mini Boss 1, Carnival Night Zone, and Launch Base Zone, are among the worst sonic songs of all time. All of them have been replaced, either with Sonic & Knuckles patching them out (Knuckles Theme and Mini Boss 1) or the PC release.

I've also said for years I feel like Sonic 3 was the worst of the main sega genesis Sonic games. If they ever do re-release it, I hope for sure they change those tracks.

I just don't think Ice Cap Zone has really anything to do with Jackson, since you can prove the song existed before Buxer worked with Jackson at all.
So...Hydrocity Act 2 is still good right?
 

Ghost_Messiah

Member
Oct 27, 2017
637
Classic and very nostalgic episode of The Simpsons from the show's golden age. Probably one of the most well known episodes they have.

Something tells me we're going to see much more of this. Radio stations are already happening, then there's television decisions like this - I wouldn't be surprised to see similar news coming soon from Spotify and streaming services removing his discography and so on - such are the ramifications here.

The documentary was compelling, believable and seems to have turned the tide of public opinion - perhaps irreversibly.
 
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Krejlooc

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Oct 27, 2017
15,593
I haven't seen this new doc about mj, but is the evidence really that definitive?
A lot of it is reframing things that aren't disputed with new context. It does more than just paint MJ as a sexual predator, it paints him as very manipulative and emotionally abusive, to people beyond just the boys. Even if you ignore all the sexual stuff, the rest of the things MJ did to these families, which is corroborated by many people over the years, is very heinous shit.

You should watch the documentary, it's very thorough. I mean, counting the epilogue After Neverland, it's over 5 hours long. Also worth noting -- it's not a documentary on Michael Jackson. It's a documentary on Wade Robson and James Safechuck, from early childhood til today. There is an 11 year gap where neither of them talked to Michael Jackson that the documentary is still thorough about.
 

Dishwalla

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
7,562
Boise, Idaho
Something tells me we're going to see much more of this. Radio stations are already happening, then there's television decisions like this - I wouldn't be surprised to see similar news coming soon from Spotify and streaming services removing his discography and so on - such are the ramifications here.
I was wondering this too, songs like "Don't Stop 'til You Get Enough", "Billie Jean", "Beat It", "Man in the Mirror" at the least are in heavy rotation on the radio, or were. I haven't really paid attention recently, but I wonder if this means less to no MJ music will be played on the radio from now on.
 

Krejlooc

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Oct 27, 2017
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I was wondering this too, songs like "Don't Stop 'til You Get Enough", "Billie Jean", "Beat It", "Man in the Mirror" at the least are in heavy rotation on the radio, or were. I haven't really paid attention recently, but I wonder if this means less to no MJ music will be played on the radio from now on.
It was honestly inevitable. There is a phenomenon in media, where 30 year olds are pandered to by representing their childhood to them in a idealized package. You saw it in the 70's with a revival of the 1950's tropes through Grease, Love American Style, Happy Days, etc. You saw it in the 80's with the 1960's through things like The Wonder Years. You saw it in the 90's with that 70's show.

Michael Jackson was huge in the 1980's and 1990's. His current revival is a part of those 30 year old age groups moving towards those eras. Eventually, music stations were going to stop playing Michael Jackson. It's inevitable. The group that viewed him as a mega star is aging out.
 

ZeroCDR

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
661
I was wondering this too, songs like "Don't Stop 'til You Get Enough", "Billie Jean", "Beat It", "Man in the Mirror" at the least are in heavy rotation on the radio, or were. I haven't really paid attention recently, but I wonder if this means less to no MJ music will be played on the radio from now on.
That would be my guess, it was very much like that before he died due to the stigma. After his death it became okay to play his music again, very jarring. I think we’re back to radio silence.