• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

hussien-11

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,315
Jordan
They'll still show up on PS5, unless the console bombs.

They are showing on PS4 because Sony was focusing on them at the start of this gen, and PS4 is widely popular. you can't be sure this will be the case with PS5.

There are already a lot of indie games that are not confirmed for PS4 yet or released late: The Messenger - Gris - My Friend Pedro - Hollow Knight - Katana Zero are just some examples.
 

Aurica

音楽オタク - Comics Council 2020
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
23,496
A mountain in the US
If I ever ask someone if they like games, and they tell me they're a "hardcore gamer," that would be a red flag for me. Haha. I get what they mean, but I hope nobody describes themselves that way.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,142
I'm sure Microsoft thought the same thing in 2013 with XBLA. Perhaps it will be different this time, but I'm hearing a worryingly similar tone coming from Sony.
Barring some disaster, Sony will win next gen as well. Indies have been a big part of console gaming for a bit now. It's not the early days anymore.
 

Buzzman

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,549
They prolly looked at the time and energy they put into building relationships with indie devs, compared it to the time and energy they put is bigger studios only to see every time
that the bugger games sell more consoles and more software
Too bad Sony has become extremely restrictive regarding those types of games.
 

gofreak

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,736
Personally I hate such move. Sony could invest a bit, maybe give some economic advantage/deal to indie. Not necessarily need to invest money but at least put them in the economical conditions to release games on PlayStation. Hate when big corporation act like this. I hope it doesn't means they will stop to care totally about indies but smells of it.

What does 'the economical conditions to release games on Playstation' mean?

If it means an audience, if it means a sensible lower-overheard application and publishing process, and revenue pay out, I believe Sony is on top of these things.

It's one thing to suggest Sony isn't going to spend as much on partner marketing or funding for indies as they once may have, it's another to suggest they will walk back the conditions that made it easier for smaller devs to access the platform. I've seen zero suggestion of the latter.
 

Zelas

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,020
Personally I hate such move. Sony could give some economic advantage/deal to indie developers. Not necessarily needs to invest money but at least put them in the economical conditions to release more games on PlayStation. Hate when big multicorporation act like this. I hope it doesn't means they will stop to care totally about indies but smells of it.
What does that mean? Publishing? Sony couldnt afford to publish enough indie devs to kill this narrative. Nobody could. They only option is push back on larger publishers and they cant do that while MS exists. MS cant either.
 

Prine

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,724
All thier sales come from consoles, so I can see why they're taking this approach, as MS are moving to being a platform that encompasses more then consoles. I think both can be successful here, Im encouraged to hear they'll continue to focus on quality, big budget games, it was precisely this strategy that forced MS to move away from 3rd parties (late X360/X1 gen) and try to bolster thier studio numbers. Also, Gamepass may be under threat once bug publishers move into their own subscription model, MS will need to double/triple thier studio numbers for GP to maintain its position. Next gen means lots of game, and more first party effort, which is always good when it comes to meaningful utilisation of the platform they serve.
 

Electro

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,899
Vienna
Personally I hate such move. Sony could give some economic advantage/deal to indie developers. Not necessarily needs to invest money but at least put them in the economical conditions to release more games on PlayStation. Hate when big multicorporation act like this. I hope it doesn't means they will stop to care totally about indies but smells of it.

There will be PS + titles.

Or did anyone believe PS5 will get AAA plus games right from the beginning ?
 

thuway

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,168
Personally I hate such move. Sony could give some economic advantage/deal to indie developers. Not necessarily needs to invest money but at least put them in the economical conditions to release more games on PlayStation. Hate when big multicorporation act like this. I hope it doesn't means they will stop to care totally about indies but smells of it.
Holy shit. You can't be serious. You actually think Sony rerouting limited funds to insure AAA support for a next generation console somehow equates to them rolling back publishing guidelines to make it difficult for indies?


What???
 

Kingpin722

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,028
Buckle up Xbox. Clearly, PS5 is doubling down on exclusive content, the area where Xbox struggles most. Sony is seemingly preparing to hit Xbox where it hurts early and hard. Xbox as a brand/service isn't going anywhere but it'll be interesting to see watch Microsoft's view on consoles over time if there is anything close of a repeat of the PS4/XB1 gen.
 

Iwao

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,800
I believe we're gonna have some fantastic Year One first-party games (Horizon 2, GT, R&C), as well as some third-party timed/exclusive games from good publisher relationships like we saw with the Xbox 360 (Mass Effect, Left 4 Dead, BioShock). As far as non-timed stuff I think we'll see some exclusive partnerships with studios like Remedy.

If Sony can also nail down comprehensive BC, cloud streaming + SSD (for immediacy of access), wireless VR, strong hardware and also provide a new entiticing tier of PS+ they're in for a huge generation.
 
Last edited:

Imitatio

Member
Feb 19, 2018
14,560
Wow, PlayStation's development over the past 3 years or so is completely contradictory to what I personally want out of a gaming platform. That's great, because it makes it easier to not use a PlayStation as my main console. On the other hand it'll likely secure a PlayStation as my complementary device to whatever Nintendo does with Switch and what comes after it. So I guess in a certain way I should be very satisfied with how PlayStation handles things. On the other hand though, the reasons for buying a PlayStation over a Xbox become less overall. If Microsoft can secure parity with big JP third parties, the small quirks of each ecosystem will become more and more important to which platform I'll personally want as my big budget machine. So Sony's walking on a narrow path right here, at least for me as an individual consumer.
 

Pheonix

Banned
Dec 14, 2018
5,990
St Kitts
It's like most people just woke up here and see to have forgotten that this is all first and foremost a business. And they have rivals. I know we all hate exclusivity deals of any sort, but the bottom line is that in an industry where you are making a very similar product with very similar offerings and at a very similar price point, that along with your own personal offerings (first party stuff) is the only way to compete.

Sonys biggest weapon going into nextgen is its current brand power and momentum. A third party dev is probably 70% more likely to do an exclusivity deal with Sony simply because they know that globally, their game will sell the most on Sony's platform.

And people shouldn't for a second think that MS would not be doing this if they could.

And It makes perfect sense to focus on the hardcore gamers first (aka the people willing to spend $500 just for a GPU, the early adopters, the people least concerned by price) cause those are the people that are buying your console within the first year. Those are the people that set your word of mouth ball rolling. Its just business, don't know it seems to be surprising some people and upsetting others.

Wow, PlayStation's development over the past 3 years or so is completely contradictory to what I personally want out of a gaming platform. That's great, because it makes it easier to not use a PlayStation as my main console. On the other hand it'll likely secure a PlayStation as my complementary device to whatever Nintendo does with Switch and what comes after it. So I guess in a certain way I should be very satisfied with how PlayStation handles things. On the other hand though, the reasons for buying a PlayStation over a Xbox become less overall. If Microsoft can secure parity with big JP third parties, the small quirks of each ecosystem will become more and more important to which platform I'll personally want as my big budget machine. So Sony's walking on a narrow path right here, at least for me as an individual consumer.
And this makes absolutely no sense to me. Especially the part about MS securing parity with big JP third parties.

I'm super curious though, what it is that you want out of a game console that PlayStation has been failing at the last three years. I don't need you to answer that though, at the end we are all entitled to our opinions.
 
Last edited:

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,142
I believe we're gonna have some fantastic Year One first-party games (Horizon 2, GT, R&C), as well as some third-party timed/exclusive games from good publisher relationships like we saw with the Xbox 360 (Mass Effect, Left 4 Dead, BioShock). As far as non-timed stuff I think we'll see some exclusive partnerships with studios like Remedy.
Again, I can't see this at all. Games cost way too much money to make.

I think it's just gonna the same co-marketing deals we've seen this generation. Nothing crazy. Just more of them.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,246
Nothing in this article seems out of the ordinary for a business, let alone Sony.

I always liked indie games, so I wish they'd give them more time but eh, Nintendo and Switch have that covered for me.
 

Samanyolu

Member
Apr 27, 2019
861
I'm a bit sick of everyone obsessing over indie devs so this is good news. I don't want cheapo low budget indie titles, I'm buying a PS5 for the same reason I got a PS4: for big PS exclusives like TLOU, Gran Turismo and God of War.
Same. It's why I've been with Sony for like forever. I simply don't like MS's offering while Sony's are absolutely stellar. I'm not into indies.
 

Mr_F_Snowman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,881
I absolutely despise the "hardcore" gamer bullshit, especially coming from such a higher up in the industry. Sure those hardcore gamers can't wait for their exclusive pre order bonus for an extra FUT pack or 6 month exclusive access to COD lootbox skins
 
OP
OP
modiz

modiz

Member
Oct 8, 2018
17,844
Again, I can't see this at all. Games cost way too much money to make.

I think it's just gonna the same co-marketing deals we've seen this generation. Nothing crazy. Just more of them.
i think we are going to see deeper collaborations with square enix specifically, they teased something about it in their press conference iirc.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,142
i think we are going to see deeper collaborations with square enix specifically, they teased something about it in their press conference iirc.
I can see Japanese stuff, sure. But they basically have default monopolies there anyway, so there's no need to invest.
 

Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
Holy shit. You can't be serious. You actually think Sony rerouting limited funds to insure AAA support for a next generation console somehow equates to them rolling back publishing guidelines to make it difficult for indies?


What???

There is some quality concern trolling going on in this thread.

Strategies made publicly is not be all and end all for the lifetime of a console generation. People here always talk about how the hardcore market is the one that pays premium to get the better HW (in this case a new gen) and so for the first year it makes sense for them to reroute their limited resources to what they have found jives with the hardcore crowd. Pretty sure no reasonable person can believe that a successful business only sticks to a singular strategy to attract various demographics throughout the said life time of a platform.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,073
I'll say one thing in response to the whole "indies will come to PS4/5 anyway."

We've actually been seeing more and more high-profile indies published by Devolver and Annapurna be announced more so for Xbox/Switch than PS4. Games like Outer Wilds, Sayonara Wild Hearts, Ape Out, 12 Minutes, Gato Roboto, Artful Escape, etc.

Sure, they're probably timed exclusives that will come to PS4 in 6 months to a year, but MS/Nintendo are notably aggressive in those spaces today.

This, absolutely.

You have to be dishonest or not being actually interested in indies if you don't see the trend that's happening for about two years now. Switch is attracting every single indies in the world naturally for obvious commercial reasons and Microsoft is more active and supportive than ever with ID@Xbox (there are some really attractive games that we can add to your list like Sable or Tunic). And just this past week there was another ID@Xbox Game Pass program following the steps of Nintendo's Nindies Showcase.

Compared to this, SIE's efforts on the indie front have weakened incredibly. The part in the WSJ article about putting "the emphasis on strengthening relationships with large publishers since resources are limited" is such a joke. Poor little PlayStation, who makes more money every year than any other gaming company, does not have enough ressources to support big games and indies ? Yeah, sure, I'm going to sympathize.

It's okay to not care about indie games, but at least I would ask fellow PlayStation fans to stop ignoring some facts and stop denying that this attitude is another bad look for the company.
 

thuway

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,168
There is some quality concern trolling going on in this thread.

Strategies made publicly is not be all and end all for the lifetime of a console generation. People here always talk about how the hardcore market is the one that pays premium to get the better HW (in this case a new gen) and so for the first year it makes sense for them to reroute their limited resources to what they have found jives with the hardcore crowd. Pretty sure no reasonable person can believe that a successful business only sticks to a singular strategy to attract various demographics throughout the said life time of a platform.
I am kind of speechless. Some of this tone deaf jump to conclusion rhetoric is literally just screaming vitriol and less about saying any thing meaningful.
 

Remo Williams

Self-requested ban
Banned
Jan 13, 2018
4,769
Companies pivot and change strategy all the time.

I don't get why people don't understand this.

Like I said, it's entirely expected. Sony and Microsoft seem to be on an eternal seesaw when it comes to putting consumers - not just their own customers - and small development partners first, they only do it when it suits their short term interests. I'm only wondering if one of them will ever break the cycle in favour of long term benefits to everyone. Going by this, Sony are unlikely to do it in this round.

Again, unsurprising, but still disappointing. And the old "it makes perfect business sense for them" excuse is not unexpected either.
 

Nameless

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,362
On top of VR taking priority, I think Nintendo is a big factor in this. A lot of people prefer to play indies on Switch, and Nintendo has a vested interest in featuring/securing indies going forward due to the nature of their hardware (portable, underpowered) and the impending widening of the power gap.

Similar to MS and Gamepass, I do think Sony will look to bolster PS Now with Indies as Subscription Services become more important.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,736
Hmmm very interesting. It's a sound strategy even though it sounds very cocky. But per the numbers, it makes sense. Now I don't see Sony completely blocking them or not giving Indies any type of show case (because they still do via State of Play and I see them giving them their own storefront) but at the same time, it does come off a bit strong. But judging by comments about PS+ in the earlier years and even today....and even during some E3s and PSX...It definitely makes sense for Sony to put more focus on AAA because tbh, that all people whine up and down about.


The whole indie games aren't real games was and still is a routine phrase that's being used and it's kind of weird for ppl to make it seem like that isn't the case. Using gamepass as this savior for Indies is also bad, because if most of all games on gamepass outside of MS 1st party exclusives were 90% Indies, you will hear the same complaints like the early days of PS+. I feel bad for Indies because I like them and have really shifted them to the switch for it's portability like the Vita before hand, but something in the way they build games will also have to be updated so they aren't giving this side swipe attitude when their biggest talking face finally gets big and now can has room to move on from recruiting but to expecting they will get it.
 

Wollan

Mostly Positive
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,816
Norway but living in France
Big AAA exclusives and the most of them.
À la carte instead of subscriptions (avoiding GaaS and small/medium only).
High quality graphics & audio.
Low friction OS experience + near zero load times.
Local processing, low latency & uncompressed audiovisuals.
Virtual Reality.
Physical in addition to digital.

I like their focus.
 
Last edited:

Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
I am kind of speechless. Some of this tone deaf jump to conclusion rhetoric is literally just screaming vitriol and less about saying any thing meaningful.

Yep. Thankfully however, reasonable heads prevail.

Some folks need to remember that AAA development period, on average, has grown lengthier. Ergo, all three manufacturers will inevitably have to cater to the smaller developers to act as the largest content provider as interstitial between large AAA IPs in their portfolio, at one point or another.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,142
Big AAA exclusives and the most of them.
$60 a la carte instead of subscriptions.
High quality graphics & audio.
Low friction OS experience + near zero load times.
Local processing, low latency & uncompressed audiovisuals.
Virtual Reality.
Physical in addition to digital.

I like their focus.
Most of these will be done by MS too. Don't forget that PSNow is a thing. It's always forgotten in GamePass discussion.
 

Buzzard

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
128
Argentina
Sony is in the last year of this generation and nintendo is mid generation.

What did they expect?

They'll be back next year when they have a reason to be there.


This is also true. Even if ERA hates on AAA games. People buy consoles for Fifa or Fallout rather than indies.

Nintendo is giving great support and coverage for Indies non-stop since the beginning of the Wii U.

Sony discarded them since the second year of PS4.
 

SolidSnakex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,402
I'll say one thing in response to the whole "indies will come to PS4/5 anyway."

We've actually been seeing more and more high-profile indies published by Devolver and Annapurna be announced more so for Xbox/Switch than PS4. Games like Outer Wilds, Sayonara Wild Hearts, Ape Out, 12 Minutes, Gato Roboto, Artful Escape, etc.

Sure, they're probably timed exclusives that will come to PS4 in 6 months to a year, but MS/Nintendo are notably aggressive in those spaces today.

I think it's just a case of indie games spreading out more. Because if you look at the PS4 you'll see that it's still getting its fair share of exclusive or timed console exclusive indie games like Spelunky 2, The Pathless, Observation etc.
 

thuway

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,168
Big AAA exclusives and the most of them.
À la carte instead of subscriptions (preventing only GaaS and small/medium).
High quality graphics & audio.
Low friction OS experience + near zero load times.
Local processing, low latency & uncompressed audiovisuals.
Virtual Reality.
Physical in addition to digital.

I like their focus.
This.
 

SecondNature

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,159
Arent they just saying "we wont focus on indies, but the indies will come to us anyway"? It's not like they are shutting them out, but it does sound like more opportunities for MS and Nintendo to make timed exclusive deals, meaning Sony would lag behind in receiving titles.
 

DigSCCP

Banned
Nov 16, 2017
4,201
I'll say one thing in response to the whole "indies will come to PS4/5 anyway."

We've actually been seeing more and more high-profile indies published by Devolver and Annapurna be announced more so for Xbox/Switch than PS4. Games like Outer Wilds, Sayonara Wild Hearts, Ape Out, 12 Minutes, Gato Roboto, Artful Escape, etc.

Sure, they're probably timed exclusives that will come to PS4 in 6 months to a year, but MS/Nintendo are notably aggressive in those spaces today.

Honestly question : why are some of those games coming first to Switch or Xbox ?
 

ghostcrew

The Shrouded Ghost
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,366
I think it's just a case of indie games spreading out more. Because if you look at the PS4 you'll see that it's still getting its fair share of exclusive or timed console exclusive indie games like Spelunky 2, The Pathless, Observation etc.

Yeah PS4 gets a ton of indie stuff that comes first to PlayStation or only PS4/PC or whatever. Same as the other platforms have theirs.

It's why I don't really take 'they'll all come to PS5 anyway' seriously because that doesn't happen right now. Indie devs frequently choose to come to one platform over the other. Whether that's PS4 or Xbox or Switch. They all have exclusive indie titles. Devs need funding and marketing deals and timed exclusivity can offer that. Nothing is a given.
 

DigSCCP

Banned
Nov 16, 2017
4,201
Arent they just saying "we wont focus on indies, but the indies will come to us anyway"? It's not like they are shutting them out, but it does sound like more opportunities for MS and Nintendo to make timed exclusive deals, meaning Sony would lag behind in receiving titles.

So moneyhatting for timed exclusives are good in this case ?
 

Panda Andino

Member
Nov 5, 2018
354
So hardcore gamers are fifa and cod buyers(best ps4 and ps3 sellers), thnx god I'm not after 24 years of gaming and 700 games.
 

DrDeckard

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,109
UK
So less focus on indies and more on buying exclusive content...that seems different than the start of the ps4 to me. Where ms snubbed indies and relied on exclusive madden/fifa and cod.

Good luck sony.
 
OP
OP
modiz

modiz

Member
Oct 8, 2018
17,844
So less focus on indies and more on buying exclusive content...that seems different than the start of the ps4 to me. Where ms snubbed indies and relied on exclusive madden/fifa and cod.

Good luck sony.
you are talking like the reason MS lost the generation is because they didnt focus on indies.... lets ignore all the huge PR hit, crazy value ps4 had from being more powerful and cheaper etc. etc.
 

Pheonix

Banned
Dec 14, 2018
5,990
St Kitts
So hardcore gamers are fifa and cod buyers(best ps4 and ps3 sellers), thnx god I'm not after 24 years of gaming and 700 games.
Lol.... hardcore gamers are why games like GOW, Spiderman, Uncharted, Bloodborne, Horizon, RDR, FF15, Tomb Raider.... that happen to be all single player games. Exist.

It's like you just conveniently picked out the kinda games that literally doesn't defn the classification and ignored all the ones that do.