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CaviarMeths

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,655
Western Canada
Said it in the LA Noire thread too, but Nintendo should be eating the cost of those 32gb carts. This is bullshit for consumers and neither Nintendo nor 2K is benefiting from it either. It hurts everyone.

But until that time, this is a ringing endorsement to just keep buying indie gems instead. Suits me just fine.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,039
So you can sale, lend the game to friends? IDK. For the X86 twins, all games must be installed in the HDD even if you bought them physical. And now you see games that wont start at all without the day 1 patch, let alone the many others that released on a broken stage and need the day 1 patch to run decently.

What PS4/XB1 game won't start without a day 1 patch?
 

Effect

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,945
If GTAV ever comes...
Unknown. The Xbox.com marketplace website says the file size for GTA V on the 360 is 7.63 GB. The finally install is likely bigger. Also bigger once you factor in patches and some other addons. So lets double it for that and perhaps higher resolution assets but no where near the same as PC, PS4, XBO. Lets go with 16GB. That could easily all fit on the cart. Maybe GTA Online if that came is a download and goes on the SD card.

I still don't understand why WWE 2K18 is so big in general. Forget cart size.
 
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ZhugeEX

Senior Analyst at Niko Partners
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
3,099
I see a lot of people complaining. But no one has a solution.

The way Switch is designed + the price to publish on Switch is the current issue.
 

nekomix

Member
Oct 30, 2017
471
Said it in the LA Noire thread too, but Nintendo should be eating the cost of those 32gb carts. This is bullshit for consumers and neither Nintendo nor 2K is benefiting from it either. It hurts everyone.

You're saying that like it would be free for Nintendo to subsidise more. Someone has to pay the bill and it's most likely the consumer, companies aren't unfortunately charities. We just have to wait prices go down.
 

Bunkles

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,663
I see a lot of people complaining. But no one has a solution.

Original games for Switch built on UE4 and adhere to the storage limitations of the system. All of these ports with heavy memory burdens will most likely bomb and we won't be getting many more of them after this.
 

Yasumi

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,566
I mean, not many alternatives if you want those massive 3rd party AAA's on your cartridge-based console. It was always bound to happen.
 
Oct 26, 2017
9,859
We don't have to blame publishers. If you don't want the game to cost over 60$ with a 32Gb SDcard take the download and move on.
Now there's no solution.

We knew it from the beginning, 16Gb aren't enough for third parties.
 

Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,487
I see a lot of people complaining. But no one has a solution.

The way Switch is designed + the price to publish on Switch is the current issue.

You can't expect people to be okay paying full price and then downloading the entirety of their systems storage. The solution is minimally dont use an 8GB card.

I don't think the general market (ignoring enthusiest people here) minds 8GBish installs or buying a micro sd card for $50-70. But it is definitely hard to get people to look at a 24GB install and be fine with that. It's insane.
 

ShinkuTachi

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,873
I see a lot of people complaining. But no one has a solution.

The way Switch is designed + the price to publish on Switch is the current issue.

A quickest solution would be larger capacity cartridges. We're basically seeing the PS Vita problem on a larger scale on the Switch due to cartridge capacity and game size.
 

PCPace

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,841
Alabama
I see a lot of people complaining. But no one has a solution.

The way Switch is designed + the price to publish on Switch is the current issue.

I guess the question is "how much does a Switch cart cost?" All these games are $10 more on Switch due to the cart, fair enough. We don't know how much carts cost, but we know at least that you can go pick up a 32gb micro SD for around $10. So a publisher end cart probably shouldn't be more expensive than that, so why aren't they using the 32gb cart? They're already charging the extra $10. That should cover the extra cost.
 

nampad

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,238
So people should plan getting a 200-256GB microSD card for their Switch. Nice, over 100 bucks additional costs.
 

Vito

One Winged Slayer - Formerly Undead Fantasy
Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,037
I don't reckon I will ever buy any Switch version of a AAA multiplatform game.
I think I won't either. I won't ever buy a game that requires a download to play.

Yesterday I got Odyssey and it already had a patch, decided to not wait and played 2 hours just fine without it.

It looks like the Switch will be my Nintendo games only machine.
 

Sqrt

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,880
I guess the question is "how much does a Switch cart cost?" All these games are $10 more on Switch due to the cart, fair enough. We don't know how much carts cost, but we know at least that you can go pick up a 32gb micro SD for around $10. So a publisher end cart probably shouldn't be more expensive than that, so why aren't they using the 32gb cart? They're already charging the extra $10. That should cover the extra cost.
This is the WWE thread and 2K is not charging extra in this case.
 

ZhugeEX

Senior Analyst at Niko Partners
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
3,099
A quickest solution would be larger capacity cartridges. We're basically seeing the PS Vita problem on a larger scale on the Switch due to cartridge capacity and game size.

The issue of larger cart sizes is it costs too much.

There is a reason every publisher doesn't want to go above an 8GB or 16GB cart.
Right now a 32GB cart doesn't really work unless you're happy paying $70+ for games.
I'm sure an argument will be that either Nintendo or publishers should eat the costs. I agree with that, they should. But it seems so far they're passing the costs onto the consumer. OR they're using lower capacity carts and having a mandatory download to make the game cheaper to the consumer.

Btw. I'd recommend everyone read this article about the situation- http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20..._and_why_nintendo_was_right_to_use_game_cards

I guess the question is "how much does a Switch cart cost?" All these games are $10 more on Switch due to the cart, fair enough. We don't know how much carts cost, but we know at least that you can go pick up a 32gb micro SD for around $10. So a publisher end cart probably shouldn't be more expensive than that, so why aren't they using the 32gb cart? They're already charging the extra $10. That should cover the extra cost.

Because Nintendo charges for the cart + a license fee + packaging and shipping costs. Then you have the retailer cut and other costs to think about.

So it's not $10. Some carts cost more than double that for publishers.
 

PCPace

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,841
Alabama
Because Nintendo charges for the cart + a license fee + packaging and shipping costs. Then you have the retailer cut and other costs to think about.

So it's not $10. Some carts cost more than double that for publishers.

Doesn't everyone charge a comparable licensing fee and packaging and shipping?

I was mistaken on this games price though, they didn't charge $10 more.
 

ShinUltramanJ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,949
The last thing I want as a consumer is a need to own multiple memory cards to play certain games. Somebody better get on the ball with getting larger cartridge sizes out.
 

ZhugeEX

Senior Analyst at Niko Partners
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
3,099
Doesn't everyone charge a comparable licensing fee and packaging and shipping?

I was mistaken on this games price though, they didn't charge $10 more.

Of course.

But the main difference is Nintendo use carts and not blu-ray discs.
When you add all the costs together, one platform holder charges significantly more than the other two.

Unless you use an 8GB or smaller cart, then it's not too bad, price wise.

Cart prices will come down in time like they did with 3DS.
 

CaviarMeths

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,655
Western Canada
You're saying that like it would be free for Nintendo to subsidise more. Someone has to pay the bill and it's most likely the consumer, companies aren't unfortunately charities. We just have to wait prices go down.
It wouldn't be free. The carts obviously have a manufacturing cost. But Nintendo is also taking a cut on every 3rd party game sale. They have wiggle room to subsidize. This is a good opportunity for Nintendo to strengthen relationships with western 3rd parties. Ideally, it shouldn't cost publishers any more to put their game on a 32gb cart than a 16gb cart, though that might take a bit of time.
 

PCPace

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,841
Alabama
Of course.

But the main difference is Nintendo use carts and not blu-ray discs.
When you add all the costs together, one platform holder charges significantly more than the other two.

Unless you use an 8GB or smaller cart, then it's not too bad, price wise.

Cart prices will come down in time like they did with 3DS.

So in these cases the cart price is really the only major difference. Personally I would be happy to just pay a higher cost in most cases.

For WWE this wouldn't work though. Even if they went with a 32 gb cart and charged more due to the expense, the game would still need to download more data. So it would be rather pointless on their end. In this case, I think their needing a 24gb download is fine, especially since they are charging the same amount as other platforms.

I guess my problem is with games that both charge $10 more AND use a smaller cart requiring a large download when it would be possible to fit on a cart, but that isn't this game.

One thing I wish Nintendo would do, and I'm not sure they can because of retailer relations, would be to give companies the OK to charge less for the digital version without having to justify it by throwing a keychain in the retail box. That would make things easier for the publisher and for the consumer. I don't think it would necessarily harm the retailer either, as many people would still prefer physical, which would still be cheaper when you factor in having resale value.
 

ZhugeEX

Senior Analyst at Niko Partners
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
3,099
So in these cases the cart price is really the only major difference. Personally I would be happy to just pay a higher cost in most cases.

For WWE this wouldn't work though. Even if they went with a 32 gb cart and charged more due to the expense, the game would still need to download more data. So it would be rather pointless on their end. In this case, I think their needing a 24gb download is fine, especially since they are charging the same amount as other platforms.

Yup. Some people would certainly be ok paying a higher price. But unfortunately the majority, as you can see from responses on this forum and in general, would not be ok with that.
 

Dust

C H A O S
Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,119
No rational company is going to use bigger than 8GB carts, the are playing by Nintendo's rules to absolute minimum.
 

Vern

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,097
Said it in the LA Noire thread, but no one noticed as of yet...

According to people I've talked to that have been highly reliable in the past, 32Gb cartridges aren't even available yet for devs and pubs. Someone else with inside knowledge feel free to correct me, but I'm about 99% sure this is still the case.
 

Edge

A King's Landing
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,012
Celle, Germany
Thanks no, they can keep this shit.

It's already an absolute clusterfuck on the big consoles. I don't pay 70 bucks again to get another one + don't even have the base game on the cartridge.

Good luck 2K.
 

Slappy White

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,205
The 128gb card I bought when I got my Switch is not going to last nearly as long as I thought if this continues.
 

Fat4all

Woke up, got a money tag, swears a lot
Member
Oct 25, 2017
92,367
here
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fade

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,491
Just gotta buy it on other consoles if you have the choice or not at all if you only have the Switch. Can't normalize this.
 
Oct 28, 2017
16,773
This was always going to be the reality of a portable home console. I don't know why anybody is surprised by this. It was obvious this was going to be the case for a lot of modern titles from the day Switch was announced. Modern games have big file sizes. Carts big enough to accomodate that was never a realistic prospect.
 

sleepnaught

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
4,538
Nintendo needs to put a stop to this. You'll have to buy a 256 gb sd car minimum if you play on buying s lot of third party games.
 
Oct 27, 2017
20,745
Didn't shinobi say on Twitter that a 32GB cart plus fees was 60% more for the same game on a Blu-ray on ps4?

Makes sense. It's sucks but this is the trade off with going hybrid imo. They already make like $28-$30 after first party license fee, retailer cut, etc so I can't imagine publishers want to lose even a few dollars more
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,043
I worry for when we hear how big the Skyrim/Doom/Wolfenstein downloads will be. Since Bethesda seems to be the third party most on-board at present. If their games can't be compressed enough leading to big downloads, leading to annoyed customers and in turn leading to lack of purchases of third party support. If that happens for the team most on with the switch at launch, it doesn't bode well for future third party games.
 

shanafan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
847
Ypsilanti, MI
I worry for when we hear how big the Skyrim/Doom/Wolfenstein downloads will be. Since Bethesda seems to be the third party most on-board at present. If their games can't be compressed enough leading to big downloads, leading to annoyed customers and in turn leading to lack of purchases of third party support. If that happens for the team most on with the switch at launch, it doesn't bode well for future third party games.

Skyrim is 14.3 GB.

Doom has a 9 GB multiplayer download size, but not sure about the single player campaign size. Articles state it does fit on a Switch cartridge though.
 

concrete1992

Member
Oct 26, 2017
31
Do we even know when this is coming out or what it looks like? The file size is baaaaad but compounded by not even knowing how it compares to the other buggy version of the game.
 

Proteus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,981
Toronto
Do we even know when this is coming out or what it looks like? The file size is baaaaad but compounded by not even knowing how it compares to the other buggy version of the game.
The rumour is November 21st based on some temporary changes to order status on both Best Buy and Target but nothing is confirmed. We haven't seen one image.
 

shanafan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
847
Ypsilanti, MI
The rumour is November 21st based on some temporary changes to order status on both Best Buy and Target but nothing is confirmed. We haven't seen one image.

I changed my order from shipping to in-store pickup at Best Buy because I am going out-of-town later on the 21st, and when I did the change to in-store pickup, it said "Ready by Jan 1", lol. Wished I grabbed a screenshot of the release date change I mentioned yesterday.
 

Mr. Pointy

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,141
Said it in the LA Noire thread, but no one noticed as of yet...

According to people I've talked to that have been highly reliable in the past, 32Gb cartridges aren't even available yet for devs and pubs. Someone else with inside knowledge feel free to correct me, but I'm about 99% sure this is still the case.
There was DQH I + II, but it wouldn't surprise me if that was a one-off for SE since it was a compilation and they can get away with $90-100 games in Japan.

When is it getting a Western release? When they can sell it for a profit at $60 RRP.