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gremlinz1982

Member
Aug 11, 2018
5,331
If Randy Pitchford was a disqualifier, then David Cage should be too.
I personally think that all Microsoft should be doing right now is rounding off genres not covered by current developers. These are the games that they should be pursuing through Global Publishing or looking to acquire developers for. E rated games, fighting games, and pushing for some JRPG's exclusive to the platform.
 

Icky Thump

Member
Oct 30, 2017
637
So that 14M EA play..... that means delta ea play subs between last quarter and now equals approximately the number of gamepass subscriptions on xbox minus gamepass PC only subscriptions right?

Edit: Reason I say is that at first I was really confused why that number wasn't >18M until I realized EA play is not part of PC gamepass...
 

cyrribrae

Chicken Chaser
Member
Jan 21, 2019
12,723
www.windowscentral.com

Is Genshin Impact coming to Xbox?

Genshin Impact is a popular fantasy RPG that is free-to-play. It's currently available on mobile, PC, and PS4, but will it be coming to Xbox?

China is gonna be another market like Japan that MS will miss out on.

Similar attitude shared.

There is also the whole anime scene with Sony:



Gonna be a tough gen for MS unless they buy IPs fast or Embracer/Tencent buys everything first lol.



Tell that to anyone asking why this game or X game or whatever releasing on all platforms but Xbox. This is why people joke or skip Xbox because devs ignore it unless Spencer drop some game pass cash.

We are still begging for Killer Instinct BTW. A first party game. Sometimes we get tired of begging and rather play where the games at.

Sorry for being grumpy. Just sharing my thoughts.

I'm not sure what you're grumpy at, but I'm pretty sure my intent was misunderstood. "That's a thing" refers to the PILES OF ELECTRONICS BEING GIVEN OUT TO EMPLOYEES WTF. And then, clearly, you can see that there are no Microsoft products being given out at said free electronics bonanza. Clearly, Microsoft is not held in high regard at Mihoyo. Doesn't mean they can't make a deal, but yea.

And I agree, I'd like to see MS make much bigger waves in Asia - though.. China is a fraught situation. The reporting is that MS wants to get OUT of China in some senses. It's become a bit less safe of an investment and business target in key ways (while remaining the only good option in others). And I'd like to see them invest in Anime games too.

But.. It is what it is. They can only focus on what they can.

So that 14M EA play..... that means delta ea play subs between last quarter and now equals approximately the number of gamepass subscriptions on xbox minus gamepass PC only subscriptions right?

Edit: Reason I say is that at first I was really confused why that number wasn't >18M until I realized EA play is not part of PC gamepass...
Depends how they count it. They more than doubled their subscribers with Game Pass. BUT, they also have increased numbers with $1 promos on Steam and PS. I wouldn't discount that. Likely millions of subscribers there too. So, I'm PERSONALLY inclined to interpret these numbers as only GPU subscribers who have actually downloaded an EA game (which yes, therefore could not include PC). Which means it's hard to actually do any inferences from this. But who knows.
 

GING-SAMA

Banned
Jul 10, 2019
7,846
This doesn't seem likely to me simply because live games go against Xbox game pass philosophy. You want people to move from one game to another every month so that people see the value of game pass as a budget method for game consumption. If people keep playing the same game with newer and newer DLC content that isn't part of game pass anyway, then they might as well unsubscribe and buy the one service game they like and buy it's DLC when they need to.

What will sell game pass more is more and more games, which means Microsoft needs smaller games to fill the gaps between bigger AAA releases. These could even be DLCs to the bigger games but then DLCs need to be part of Game Pass as well. Which actually goes even further against your point of driving DLC sales via game pass.

Yup, I agree but is Video games service like Game Pass have the potential to have +100M subscribers like Netflix ?


For exemple PS+ generated 0,916B$ for Q3 (47 Millions subscribers) and 3,54B$ yearly.

PS Store 4,14B$ for Q3 and +12,98B$ yearly through Games & Especially Add on content.

Suppose sony had a service like Game Pass with 40-50M subscribers would the PS Store revenue be that high ? That's the question I'm asking myself, because for Xbox & Sony the bulk of their income is Third party content & Add on content.

To made simple, imagine :

PS store revenue from Digital software this Q3 = $1,69bn & Add on content (DLC, MTX etc...) Q3 = $2,45bn

So The highest gaming segment revenue for Sony & surely Xbox too

-47 Millions Sony Pass subscribers, 9,99$ for basic, 14,99$ for premium ≈1,5b$ for a quarter and ≈ 5,5 or 6b$ for years (replace the PS+)

But if this has a big impact on the PS store revenues of Digital software games which decreases as the first party are day one etc ... And in addition to that this kind of service cannot have + 100M subscribers like Netlfix, the Sony Pass will have to have another source of income that will come from games Add-on content through the service, hence my question about the first party business model.

If Sea of thieves have + 15M players and + 7.5M of them playing on the Game Pass (free) how many of them will be trying to buy the Plunder Pass at $9.99 each season because it won't buy the game? (maybe a bigger part than those who bought the game right?) or even more, reduction of 20% with Game Pass Ultimate ?

Sea of Thieves is just one example among so many others, I think XGP will need to have some big live service franchises with a business model built around XGP (SOT, Halo infinite) to add a new source of income/profit in XGP and avoid raising prices.

Not the all catalog but maybe 3-4 strong First Party games. Activision Blizzard make $1,2B from (Add-on Content,Microtransaction) per quarter with Hearthstone, WoW, Warzone, Candy Crush.

I take sony as an example because they really detailed their Q3 and their business model is a bit similar to Xbox just with higher income.

I can see Undead Labs, Zenimax Online, Rare, 343i & Playground Games have a big role on that.
 

supercommodore

Prophet of Truth
Member
Apr 13, 2020
4,190
UK
Tell that to anyone asking why this game or X game or whatever releasing on all platforms but Xbox. This is why people joke or skip Xbox because devs ignore it unless Spencer drop some game pass cash.

We are still begging for Killer Instinct BTW. A first party game. Sometimes we get tired of begging and rather play where the games at.

Sorry for being grumpy. Just sharing my thoughts.

While Xbox have done a decent job of getting more high profile Japanese games on Xbox (Yakuza, FF, Dragon Quest, Nier) I agree there are some big gaps in the catalogue.

However, it's quite clear that Xbox is an ecosystem tailored to "western tastes" (even more so with Bethesda now). This will probably be the case going forward for quite some time. Unlike others, I don't think Xbox will acquire Japanese devs but will instead aim to get more Japanese games on game pass so the publishers get a guaranteed return (avoiding an Ace Attorney situation).

For the foreseeable future, people that want all available Japanese titles and only want one console then Xbox just isn't the right choice.
 
Last edited:

knightmawk

Member
Dec 12, 2018
7,482
So that 14M EA play..... that means delta ea play subs between last quarter and now equals approximately the number of gamepass subscriptions on xbox minus gamepass PC only subscriptions right?

Edit: Reason I say is that at first I was really confused why that number wasn't >18M until I realized EA play is not part of PC gamepass...

It equals the number of Game Pass Ultimate subscribers specifically. EA Play is only part of Game Pass Ultimate for now, and will be added to PC Game Pass sometime this year.
 

Adrifi

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Jan 5, 2019
3,466
the Spanish Basque Country
I don't think Microsoft needs more FPS studios like Bungie or Gearbox at all. They have Halo, Doom, Wolfenstein, Perfect Dark...

And they have Battlefield on Game Pass too.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
Just a heads up


While Xbox have done a decent job of getting more high profile Japanese games on Xbox (Yakuza, FF, Dragon Quest, Nier) I agree there are some big gaps in the catalogue.

However, it's quite clear that Xbox is an ecosystem tailored to "western tastes" (even more so with Bethesda now). This will probably be the case going forward for quite some time. Unlike others, I don't think Xbox will acquire Japanese devs but will instead aim to get more Japanese games on game pass so the publishers get a guaranteed return (avoiding an Ace Attorney situation).

For the foreseeable future, people that want all available Japanese titles and only want one console then Xbox just isn't the right choice.
Xbox goal is a global ecosystem and it's not trying to tailor to "western tastes". It being tailored to "western tastes" is merely a result of location and opportunity. Xbox is still looking to acquire more studios. If and when an opportunity presents itself from a Japanese studio and/or publisher looking to sell that Xbox see is a deal worth buying and a mutual agreement can be made, then it will happen.
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
60,972
Has Gearbox not teased a new Brothers in Arms multiple times recently?
Hinted abit. Seems to be incubation fase atm.
Also a tv shows was announced. So they didnt really forget about Brothers in Arms.

www.gearboxsoftware.com

Gearbox Entertainment Announces New Brothers in Arms Series, Showrunner

Scott Rosenbaum, an accomplished showrunner with more than 20 years of experience in the entertainment industry, will spearhead a new television series based on Gearbox Entertainment’s successful Brothers in Arms video game series. The Brother in Arms series, based on true events, explores...
 

ToadPacShakur

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,448
Using for what?
Was just saying the imo did great work in Brothers in Arms also next to Borderlands. Nothing more.

using as an example. (and that's not even meant as an attack towards you btw lol)

and heck even their Half Life expansions were good. But again it was so long ago it's not even relevant.

but it's not a studio with any success worth pursuing. You might say "but Borderlands" but Take2 still has publishing rights soooo what's the point
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
ok but you're also trying to use a series where the last main entry was 13 years ago...
Killer Instinct's last game before it was revived was 17 years. Perfect Dark hasn't had a game since 2005 and is now being revived with a new entry.

IP's and Franchises constantly go through lulls and get revived. Not saying this will necessarily happen with Brothers in Arms, but it wouldn't be surprising either for a new owner of these IP's usher in it's revival.

Edit: Sorry, I have no idea how I completely misread the conversation going on and injected something completely irrelevant. LOL

My bad ToadPacShakur
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
60,972
using as an example. (and that's not even meant as an attack towards you btw lol)

and heck even their Half Life expansions were good. But again it was so long ago it's not even relevant.

but it's not a studio with any success worth pursuing. You might say "but Borderlands" but Take2 still has publishing rights soooo what's the point
You said that fuck up everything apart from Borderlands. I just said that the BIA games were amazing also imo. Nothing more.
 

ToadPacShakur

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,448
Killer Instinct's last game before it was revived was 17 years. Perfect Dark hasn't had a game since 2005 and is now being revived with a new entry.

IP's and Franchises constantly go through lulls and get revived. Not saying this will necessarily happen with Brothers in Arms, but it wouldn't be surprising either for a new owner of these IP's usher in it's revival.

I was more talking about Gearbox as a whole. They are a studio that can seemingly only do Borderlands well. Give them anything else and you'll learn the same lesson SEGA learned the hard way
 

ThisIsPrfct

Member
Jun 9, 2019
278
I've got the feeling that their games were just a bit too expensive for what they are. Gamepass didn't help to convince me to buy their games full Price. But at the recent deal, I picked up four of their games.
I've gotten almost all their games discounted myself, that's why I think seeing them on Game Pass would be good (not something to buy at full price but a nice bonus to get)... they can put one game almost every single month of the year and have a big backlog of old ones still not on PC/XBOX... their gameplay lend themselves very well to be played on mobile too. I don't think they would be very expensive, I know older people who buy their games (and big fish) like clockwork to enjoy every month. And maybe I don't know, they can be groomed later to be something else? More ambicious?

Big Fish is another casual company that is absolutely massive.
 

CorvoAttano

Member
Oct 11, 2020
67
Yup, I agree but is Video games service like Game Pass have the potential to have +100M subscribers like Netflix ?


For exemple PS+ generated 0,916B$ for Q3 (47 Millions subscribers) and 3,54B$ yearly.

PS Store 4,14B$ for Q3 and +12,98B$ yearly through Games & Especially Add on content.

Suppose sony had a service like Game Pass with 40-50M subscribers would the PS Store revenue be that high ? That's the question I'm asking myself, because for Xbox & Sony the bulk of their income is Third party content & Add on content.

To made simple, imagine :

PS store revenue from Digital software this Q3 = $1,69bn & Add on content (DLC, MTX etc...) Q3 = $2,45bn

So The highest gaming segment revenue for Sony & surely Xbox too



I take sony as an example because they really detailed their Q3 and their business model is a bit similar to Xbox just with higher income.

I can see Undead Labs, Zenimax Online, Rare, 343i & Playground Games have a big role on that.


I will preface this post by saying that the only thing you should look at from Microsoft's revenues to quell your doubts about Game design being impacted by Gamepass is that Xbox is making way more money today than they were making in the pre-gamepass days. We don't know how much income Microsoft makes from gaming but what we do know seems to paint a rosy picture.

Now, your assumption is that Microsoft is making less money from digital game sales because of Gamepass which is conjecture. We have had several executives and devs say that they sold more copies of their games after they got on gamepass. You might argue that the games not on gamepass see fewer sales now, which once again is conjecture. Majority sales of third party software is AAA releases anyway which rarely get added to gamepass and most of their sales are front loaded while they enter game pass way past their prime sales period. The smaller indie titles are seeing more sales when they get added to gamepass and may offset an "assumed loss" of sales from indie titles not on gamepass. Finally when good titles leave gamepass, they create a FOMO and people buy these games if they love them too much and want to keep playing them. Overall, I think Microsoft is making more money from an average gamepass subscriber than from a non gamepass subscriber. In fact Microsoft has said as much before ( Microsoft's Game Pass Subscription Is Dramatically Changing Video Games - Bloomberg ).

Another thing you should notice is that the number of Xboxes in the world are less than half the number of Playstations and yet Microsoft made 5 billion in revenue compared to Sony's 8.4 billion. Even if you offset a ridiculously overestimated 1 billion from PC, Microsoft is still making an equivalent amount from each user as playstation so clearly Gamepass hasn't negatively impacted revenue per user and in fact I would argue the contrary because there is no chance that they made 1 billion from PC last quarter with no new games.

Finally, Microsoft has always made multiplayer games with a service focus. Halo, Gears and Forza existed in a pre gamepass world already and they had been working on Sea of Thieves since before there was even an idea of Gamepass. So what is changing now? The only thing that has changed is Microsoft is making more single player games today than they were making 3 years ago and the reason for that is the existence of Gamepass.
 
Oct 26, 2018
2,222
Just a heads up


While Xbox have done a decent job of getting more high profile Japanese games on Xbox (Yakuza, FF, Dragon Quest, Nier) I agree there are some big gaps in the catalogue.

However, it's quite clear that Xbox is an ecosystem tailored to "western tastes" (even more so with Bethesda now). This will probably be the case going forward for quite some time. Unlike others, I don't think Xbox will acquire Japanese devs but will instead aim to get more Japanese games on game pass so the publishers get a guaranteed return (avoiding an Ace Attorney situation).

For the foreseeable future, people that want all available Japanese titles and only want one console then Xbox just isn't the right choice.
I mean technically they did acquire a Japanese dev, and have stated they want to. It's good to have a mix of both
 

Adrifi

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Jan 5, 2019
3,466
the Spanish Basque Country
Yup, I agree but is Video games service like Game Pass have the potential to have +100M subscribers like Netflix ?


For exemple PS+ generated 0,916B$ for Q3 (47 Millions subscribers) and 3,54B$ yearly.

PS Store 4,14B$ for Q3 and +12,98B$ yearly through Games & Especially Add on content.

Suppose sony had a service like Game Pass with 40-50M subscribers would the PS Store revenue be that high ? That's the question I'm asking myself, because for Xbox & Sony the bulk of their income is Third party content & Add on content.

To made simple, imagine :

PS store revenue from Digital software this Q3 = $1,69bn & Add on content (DLC, MTX etc...) Q3 = $2,45bn

So The highest gaming segment revenue for Sony & surely Xbox too



I take sony as an example because they really detailed their Q3 and their business model is a bit similar to Xbox just with higher income.

I can see Undead Labs, Zenimax Online, Rare, 343i & Playground Games have a big role on that.
Last quarter Xbox had its biggest third party revenue ever and the quarter before they had their second biggest third party revenue ever, I really wouldn't worry about that.

In the long term (like in 20 years lol) Microsoft's plan is to have xCloud as their platform. They are going to let players play their owned games via streaming, we know that. What would happen if there wasn't a console is that a dev would put their game on the Microsoft Store and then people would play it via streaming and Microsoft would still get a 30% cut because instead of paying for the hardware, they are paying for the cloud infrastructure (which devs cannot allow, same way they can't allow to sell consoles at a loss).

But that would be in the case that consoles disappeared, and that would far into the future. But Microsoft is thinking about that already.
 

Adrifi

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Jan 5, 2019
3,466
the Spanish Basque Country
What the hell is Embracer Group planning?
My theory? Embracer+, a subscription service. They might want to reach a deal with Microsoft to have it as a Game Pass add-on, too, like EA with EA Play.

I really do think that if Game Pass gets a ton of subscribers it'll turn into something like cable tv, where you can purchase additional channels (you can get EA Play by upgrading to Ultimate, well, now imagine being able to add Ubisoft+ or other services to your Game Pass subscription too). Amazon Luna is already doing that.
 

Dimple

Member
Jan 10, 2018
8,538


I really thought that Gearbox was next, was very surprised that Embracer got them, wouldn't be surprised if Randy was a sticking point (I know I'd want that dude gone if I was planing on buying them).

If MS are still intent on buying another publisher I wonder who's left, Paradox is the only one I can think that MS would be interesting but the problem is A. They're publicly traded, and B. Tencent owns a 5% stake in them.
 

Guerrilla

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,235
My theory? Embracer+, a subscription service. They might want to reach a deal with Microsoft to have it as a Game Pass add-on, too, like EA with EA Play.

I really do think that if Game Pass gets a ton of subscribers it'll turn into something like cable tv, where you can purchase additional channels (you can get EA Play by upgrading to Ultimate, well, now imagine being able to add Ubisoft+ or other services to your Game Pass subscription too). Amazon Luna is already doing that.
Yeah that's probably the end game
 
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