Xbox's Mike Ybarra says Sony "isn’t listening to gamers" on cross-play

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Datajoy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,867
Angola / Zaire border region.
Objectively true. I'll probably end up getting a Playstation next gen for the first party games no matter what, but all the BS is making me really want to grab an Xbox as well for third party stuff.
 

bane833

Member
Nov 3, 2017
4,310
Indeed. Between lack of cross-play, lack of any BC whatsoever (you have to buy your PS2 games again), and lack of PS Store refunds without a CS nightmare, Sony can hardly be called 'pro-consumer' this generation sadly. But they make great games, obviously. So they get a free pass most of the time as a result. But the pressure is mounting on all three fronts for the next generation.
I wouldn’t call any of the big three pro consumer. All of them have their own bullshit going.
 

John Bender

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Oct 27, 2017
2,448
User Banned (3 Days): System Wars + Thread Derailment
Cool story Mike. Now make free to play games actually free.
 

Gen X

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Oct 31, 2017
734
New Zealand
I wouldn't be surprised if it's a feature announced at the PS5 reveal. There'll be something behind the scenes that's probably making it complicated and they're covering it up with PR rubbish.
 

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
12,493
Well Microsoft could set an example and start listening to the gamers.

So where are the games and when will F2P games actually be F2P on Xbox?
We've had this discussion just as many times as we had the crossplay discussion. And I still stand by my opinion I had in those topics:
- Paying for online is bad. It should be removed completely.
- It doesn't make sense that you should have to pay to play online for a $60 title when you can play online on a $0 title.
- Beta's shouldn't be part of this stupid pay for online system.
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,023
Sounds funny from where I am sitting considering Microsoft has more to gain from this than PS4 fans or Sony itself.

The more pressure on Sony to do this the better even though I don't even care about Cross Play or wont convert to other platforms next gen.
 

Akai

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Oct 25, 2017
3,350
I wouldn't be surprised if it's a feature announced at the PS5 reveal. There'll be something behind the scenes that's probably making it complicated and they're covering it up with PR rubbish.
If that was the case, you wouldn't have cross-play between several PS4 and PC titles. This is clearly about not wanting to have cross-play with the direct competition.
 

pswii60

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,888
UK
I wouldn’t call any of the big three pro consumer. All of them have their own bullshit going.
I never said it was black or white. Just different shades of grey.
And yet the vote thread here showed over 70% of 3000+ votes didn’t care.
Firstly, era is a bubble. Secondly, we'll see if that holds as the next consoles launch. As Switch, mobile and PC gaming all continue to grow at their current rapid rate, not to mention the potential of a Google console and whatever else, the console(s) with cross-play will be the ones which will have the biggest and most active online userbase next generation.
 
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IIFloodyII

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,331
I wouldn't be surprised if it's a feature announced at the PS5 reveal. There'll be something behind the scenes that's probably making it complicated and they're covering it up with PR rubbish.
We know for a fact nothing is stopping it, Fortnite had a bug which enabled it for a few days.
As another user said they'll only allow it if/when they need a quick PR win. That won't be at the PS5 reveal and it clear they can get away just saying no.
 

Zappy

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
3,738
And MS should not charge to play F2P games on the Xbox.

And round and round we go
They charge for online multiplayer. Period.

Why should I as a Battlefield player, pay MS (or Sony for that matter) for the privilege of accessing EA servers having shelled out £55 for the game already, but someone doesn't have to pay to access Epic servers having paid £0 for fortnite? It makes no sense at all. The fee either exists for online or ideally it doesn't.
 

NippleViking

Member
May 2, 2018
1,661
This is Mike Ybarra's personal opinion, and I believe he genuinely believes it - and that this isn't a tactical play. He's always stated he's predominantly a PC gamer, and regularly plays and discusses games that are on other platforms.
 

Apex88

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Jan 15, 2018
1,428
Well, there is cross-play/progression with PC & Mobile. If we’re talking about bringing in the broader gaming public, those are the people you’re targeting. I’d imagine a good percentage of Xbox owners also own PS4’s themselves.

TBH, the position of both companies is diversifying. Mike Ybarra is a major Xbox exec yet plays on and promotes PC the majority of the time. I’m sure behind the scenes these guys are already planning for the future and putting Microsoft Studios titles on Sony and Nintendo hardware.
 

blacklotus

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
705
Couple of days ago:

Customer: "He likes Mario, football and Fortnite. What do you recomend?"
Me: "Well, there's nothing besides the Switch that handles the games he likes, since Mario is exclusive. Also The Switch already has a good football option that seems to keep being supported. Quick question though: Does he want Fortnite to play with his friends?"
C: "Yes. And they have PS4."
Me: "In that case, if that's the most important thing, you have to buy a PS4."


Sony has done a lot of things For the Gamers this gen and the fact that this is still a "For the Gamers" gen at all is down to Sony since we all remember the piece of shit things Xbox wanted to do - at least, don't see myself forgetting about that any time soon.
Crossplay is For the Gamers but every decision has to have a balance between what's for the gamers and what's the for the company's best interest and with such a big difference in install base i totally understand Sony's decision and everyone making this a trivial and obvious matter is just being simplistic or intelectually dishonest.
 
Aug 26, 2018
1,738
From Sony's side, there is no pressure yet that cross-play is becoming an expected, most-requested feature but I do think supporting it is good because its good for gamers overall.

From MS's side, they should release their games on Steam too if they really care deeply about being what gamers want, not put F2P games behind Xbox Live Gold and merge Xbox Live and Xbox Game Pass.
 

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
12,493
And on PS4 F2P online multiplayer games don’t cost me anything either. Not very pro consumer from Microsoft to charge for that don’t you think?
I think it's very nice of Sony to not charge for it, but it's not really fair towards people that play expensive games. So I understand why Microsoft has chosen to draw the line at all multiplayer.

Regardless of that; paying for multiplayer is shit. And we should all be against it.
 

mejin

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Oct 27, 2017
698
User Banned (A day): Platform Wars. Accumulated Infractions.
Looking at the games coming to PS4 this week...stay strong MS.
 

Yazuka

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,174
Sweden
He's right. I wish we had seen the öast of arrogant Sony. But it seems as soon as things are looking up for them they turn into assholes.
 

Richter1887

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Oct 27, 2017
19,023
I think it's very nice of Sony to not charge for it, but it's not really fair towards people that play expensive games. So I understand why Microsoft has chosen to draw the line at all multiplayer.

Regardless of that; paying for multiplayer is shit. And we should all be against it.
Why exactly?

Free games are called Free to Play for a reason. When you pay for Plus to play them they stop being F2P. Nothing unfair about it.
 

TechnicPuppet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,258
Couple of days ago:

Customer: "He likes Mario, football and Fortnite. What do you recomend?"
Me: "Well, there's nothing besides the Switch that handles the games he likes, since Mario is exclusive. Also The Switch already has a good football option that seems to keep being supported. Quick question though: Does he want Fortnite to play with his friends?"
C: "Yes. And they have PS4."
Me: "In that case, if that's the most important thing, you have to buy a PS4."


Sony has done a lot of things For the Gamers this gen and the fact that this is still a "For the Gamers" gen at all is down to Sony since we all remember the piece of shit things Xbox wanted to do - at least, don't see myself forgetting about that any time soon.
Crossplay is For the Gamers but every decision has to have a balance between what's for the gamers and what's the for the company's best interest and with such a big difference in install base i totally understand Sony's decision and everyone making this a trivial and obvious matter is just being simplistic or intelectually dishonest.
So don't forget the stuff MS never done but please understand the stuff Sony is doing. Gotcha.
 

HBK

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,337
We've had this discussion just as many times as we had the crossplay discussion. And I still stand by my opinion I had in those topics:
- Paying for online is bad. It should be removed completely.
- It doesn't make sense that you should have to pay to play online for a $60 title when you can play online on a $0 title.
- Beta's shouldn't be part of this stupid pay for online system.
Truth, right there.

Simply (only) removing the online paywall for F2P is a dangerous slippery-slope.

But I guess those who don't want to spend a dime playing games don't really care if all games become P2W ridden shovelwares.

Edit: Also whataboutism obviously.
 

MauroNL

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,964
The Netherlands
Knowing Sony they are waiting and they'll probably make a big deal out of it and somehow turn this into some massive positive PR at E3 or something. Like "we now support all cross-play, yay for us we are the best".

Or they genuinly just don't care, idk.
 

Vishmarx

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,043
Then get more devs to care about it. Cod bf rdr 2 and fallout 76 will be biggest online retail games this fall and niether of them have cross play. Nor do i see anyone asking for it.
 

Kryst

Banned
Jul 30, 2018
170
Who genuinely cares about this hypocrisy?
I remember the previous gen Sony was pushing for cross play when Microsoft outright rejected it.

Besides Sony DOES have cross play for many games. They've always had cross play when it came to playing with PC gamers.
They just don't want to cross play with the Xbox and for good reason Sony got slapped down hard in the previous gen and Microsoft is forced to suck it up now that they aren't in the lead in the console war.
 

Shpeshal Ed

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,188
Melbourne, Australia
There's only 2 ways Sony budges this gen on cross-play and/or cross-progression.

1) It starts to affect sales if consoles/software.

There's a noticeable dip in sales of PS4 consoles or a particular spike in Xbox One sales and/or a real downturn in multiplats (that have crossplay) sales on PS4. Again, also while those same multiplats sales increase on Xbox One.

2) Publishers/Developers stop putting their games on PS4 or start removing multiplayer from PS4 versions

Neither of those is going to happen. It would require a publisher with deep enough pockets and a game influential enough (Epic, EA, Activision) to step up. Epic I feel would be the one. I personally believe that if Epic even threatened to pull Fortnite off PS4, Sony would flinch, almost instantly. I'm sure they could claim some technical reason like MS did with Minecraft and just either stop updating the game or pull it altogether. Fornite has that kind of pull I feel.

But again, neither of those will happen. It requires a gen reset.
 

SCB360

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
1,639
honest question:

I see alot of people try to defend Sony by saying the f2p games need XBL on Xbox

Who here owns an Xbox One WITHOUT XBL? Its a rarity I'm sure
 

Deleted member 18951

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,531
Someone make a F2P Isn't Actually Free On Xbox Live thread, please.

I mean this really isnt fair everyone having a go at Sony like this, we need bad news parity or whataboutery, lol.
 

leehom

Member
Nov 30, 2017
231
Microsoft doing whatever it takes to win the mind share, yet continues to ignore their own deficiencies instead of improving them. All talk and no walk.
 

Ukumio

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
847
Australia
I hope Sony get taken down a peg or two next gen. They severely need a wake up call.

But if Xbox finds themselves back on top, will they change their tune just like Sony did this gen? I'd like to think Phil Spencer is a cooler dude than that, but who knows.
That's the thing I don't get, Sony didn't change their tune this gen.

Everyone brings up that Final Fantasy games but that was the devs who wanted it, not Sony. Microsoft said no and Sony didn't comment so we'll never really know if Xbox had said yes if Sony would have said yes as well.

All we know was that Microsoft was against Xbox and Playstation crossplay last gen (don't forget there were a handful of games that had Xbox and PC crossplay last gen). That being said though, Xbox had much different leadership so the change in position isn't really a surprise.
 
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