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Platy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,634
Brazil
So you either have two solutions...
  • Lean into those big brands even in the title, such as "Street Fighter vs. Capcom".
  • Take Max's idea of going the Killer Instinct approach, so start small & grow from there.

Or go the casual way back to the Pocket Fighter roots (the OG Capcom vs Capcom) and focus on the casual market and try to grab 20% of Smash fanbase, which is already twice more of what SF5 sold

Anyone that says that Capcom characters are less than 20% as famous as Nintendo are crazy
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
85,287
Houston, TX
Or go the casual way back to the Pocket Fighter roots (the OG Capcom vs Capcom) and focus on the casual market and try to grab 20% of Smash fanbase, which is already twice more of what SF5 sold

Anyone that says that Capcom characters are less than 20% as famous as Nintendo are crazy
Outside of the big dogs & maybe Ace Attorney, that's not inaccurate. Either way, leaving the Versus series for dead permanently may not be the best course of action. Your idea as a side thing may be interesting.
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,653
Well they fucked up then because I want SF to look like that anime.
So you want Street Fighter to look like Akiman's highly detailed, complexly shaded concept art.
And you also want Street Fighter to look like one of ArcSys's two-tone cel-shaded fighters.

So you basically have no idea what you want then.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,059
I ditch Capcom's characters, and call up Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft to create the ultimate fighting game between 3 mega-corporations
 

Platy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,634
Brazil
Outside of the big dogs & maybe Ace Attorney, that's not inaccurate. Either way, leaving the Versus series for dead permanently may not be the best course of action. Your idea as a side thing may be interesting.

To be fair lots of nintendo characters weren't either before they enteres smash ... marth, roy, ice climbers, Game & watch, nes, captain falcon .. hell, I would put even fox in the "20% as well known as mario/link/samus" without the smash help to popularity =P
 

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
So you want Street Fighter to look like Akiman's highly detailed, complexly shaded concept art.
And you also want Street Fighter to look like one of ArcSys's two-tone cel-shaded fighters.

So you basically have no idea what you want then.

LOL

The main point is I prefer the 2D look and think either one would look good for SF. Either the anime look or the painted look would look fine. You're just coming at me like this because you have no other retort besides being defensive towards SFV. You have made no actual arguments. Only finger pointing.
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,653
LOL

The main point is I prefer the 2D look and think either one would look good for SF. Either the anime look or the painted look would look fine. You're just coming at me like this because you have no other retort besides being defensive towards SFV.
I'm just trying to let you know that what you allegedly want is also what Capcom wants. :P
 

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
I'm just trying to let you know that what you allegedly want is also what Capcom wants. :P

Well they should look at how Arc is doing their presentation. Presentation matters a lot in fighters and I don't think Capcom has done a good way in managing the presentation of its fighters this gen.

Obama put out a vid the other day about presentation in fighting games.


I'm not going to say it looks bad.

But between this..

i7tvpmA.gif


and this....

HmPvMHG.gif


I just think SFV is lacking.

Which one looks better? The choice is obvious.

I remember liking the sumi-e paint look of SFIV and thinking they'd take it further in that direction and just make SFV look like a Japanese water paint style. After GGXrd came out it seemed like the best direction for SFV to go. And then we go some 3D stuff that just doesn't work for me.

You couldn't tell by their other contradictory walls of text in this thread?

LOL.

I'm out. Too many Capcom/SFV stans that are overly defensive.

Y'all are unable to craft an argument without attacking. Never change.
 

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
Oh, and bring back World Tour mode.

Better yet, make it multiplayer and allow you to play it local or online so you and your buddy can kick that Ai's ass.
 

Dinobot

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,126
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Street Fighter 6 with every fighter that has ever featured on in the games on the roster. Same gameplay as 5 with minor tweaks. Released on PC, Xbox Scarlett, PS5 and Switch. A couple new fighters as well.
 

Namtab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,008
lol people asking for sprites or a 2d look. Those games sell like shit and take a extra effort to make that is not worth it.
 

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
I responded with a minute long video that dispelled all of the reductive cherry-picking you wrote in that novel on the previous page.

You responded with nothing, actually. Just passive aggression. Posting a video isn't an argument.

Nuki is playing basic Chun. Kikoken for horizontal space, neutral jump air attack for vertical space/air control. Mash legs for a good hitbox move with pressure. Super when viable. Extremely linear.
 

PSqueak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,464
Option A:

Marvel vs Capcom 4:

-Art style is closer to MVC3 with slightly improved models
-Everyone with a 3D that can be reused or cheaply improved is back, that is, everyone from MVC3, MVCI and TVC's capcom side is back
-Make brand new 3D models for everyone in MVC2 that is not yet in a 3D vs. Game.
-Add a few new Capcom reps that are missing like Gene, Asura and Regina.
-Add the remaining canned MVCI Marvel reps.
-3V3 with Infinity storms from MVCI replacing X Factor
-Tagging straight up ripped off from Battle for the Grid.
-Arcade mode with individual endings

Option B:

Project Cross Zone: Fighting edition:

-Roster of at least 60 characters from Capcom, Namco, Sega and Nintendo.
-Each company gets 15 reps
-Gameplay ripped off straight from MVC3
-Cellshaded if high quality 2D sprite unavailable.
-Story mode is a glorified SRW game using the fighting game assets for the attack animations

Option C:

Another vote for Nintendo vs Capcom.
 

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
I wasn't trying to argue. I just wanted to offer evidence that what you wrote didn't make any sense.

It makes plenty of sense.

The video even proved it: Street Fighter is simple. It's limited.

In this video there's no dash, limited air movement, limited space control. It's SF down to its base parts.

Compare with King of Fighters 94 which came out the same year as ST.

Dashes, hops, tag moves, side steps, ki charge. It just has more things going and more tools for the player.


More means of movement and expression.

SF allows self expression but only for the tippest of the top. Other games allow more expression and more options out the gate which means a larger toolkit. Street Fighter didn't add dash until Street Fighter III. SF is very plain. It's vanilla.

If you like that, that's fine and I respect it. But for my tastes I would spice SF up. This is after all a thread asking what you would do if you could make a Capcom fighter.
 

JusDoIt

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,641
South Central Los Angeles
It makes plenty of sense.

The video even proved it: Street Fighter is simple. It's limited.

In this video there's no dash, limited air movement, limited space control. It's SF down to its base parts.

Compare with King of Fighters 94 which came out the same year as ST.

Dashes, hops, tag moves, side steps, ki charge. It just has more things going and more tools for the player.


More means of movement and expression.

SF allows self expression but only for the tippest of the top. Other games allow more expression and more options out the gate which means a larger toolkit. Street Fighter didn't add dash until Street Fighter III. SF is very plain. It's vanilla.

If you like that, that's fine and I respect it. But for my tastes I would spice SF up. This is after all a thread asking what you would do if you could make a Capcom fighter.

I'm not going to go back and forth on this—we will continue disagreeing in the end—but your conflation of universal movement mechanics and "expression" is flimsy.

It's true: ST doesn't have universal dashes, hops, side steps, or ki charge (not a movement mechanic, but whatever, I'll give it to you). This limitation in universal movement compared to KOF 94 happens to come with the trade of having more basic attacks and special move variations than KOF 94. Those two extra buttons make a difference. Not only because you got more attacks to consider at different positions, but because many of those attacks include...

wait for it...

movement options. Look at basic ass Street Fighter ass boring ass vanilla ass Ryu and Chun:

Ryu has air tatsus and a dash punch.

Chun got neck breaker, head stomp, wall jump, up kicks, air spinning bird kick.

Lots of different ways for players to get around the screen and express themselves with agility.

More movement options than KOF 94? No. ST has a stronger focus on spacing than KOF 94 tho. Which is better is a matter of personal taste, but of both those games released in 1994 I don't think there's any arguing which has the more hype scene in 2019.

Lastly, if you truly want honest discussion, you can't be saying wild stuff like:

Nuki is playing basic Chun. Kikoken for horizontal space, neutral jump air attack for vertical space/air control. Mash legs for a good hitbox move with pressure. Super when viable. Extremely linear.

I mean, come on.
 
Last edited:

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
I'm not going to go back and forth on this—we will continue disagreeing in the end—but your conflation of universal movement mechanics and "expression" is flimsy.

It's true: ST doesn't have universal dashes, hops, side steps, or ki charge (not a movement mechanic, but whatever, I'll give it to you). This limitation in universal movement compared to KOF 94 happens to come with the trade of having more basic attacks and special move variations than KOF 94. Those two extra buttons make a difference. Not only because you got more attacks to consider at different positions, but because many of those attacks include...

wait for it...

movement options. Look at basic ass Street Fighter ass boring ass vanilla ass Ryu and Chun:

Ryu has air tatsus and a dash punch.

Chun neck breaker, head stomp, wall jump, up kicks, air spinning bird kick.

Lots of different ways for players to get around the screen and express themselves with agility.

More movement options than KOF 94? No. ST has a stronger focus on spacing than KOF 94 tho. Which is better is a matter of personal taste, but of both those games released in 1994 I don't think there's no arguing which has the more hype scene in 2019.

Lastly, if you truly want honest discussion, you can't be saying wild stuff like:



I mean, come on.

Ryu has dash punch and tatsu, true. But again, this is character specific. Only Ryu has something like that. Chun has her movement speed going for her and so does Cammy. But Cammy has no real reversal option because hers isn't invincible, and the only meter is for Super. She can hooligan but a raw hooligan will get you bopped offline. She has her drill but that's not safe and requires very, very well placed spacing.

My argument is one of universal features. In Guity Gear, pretty much every character has an air dash. GG is a character fighting game as opposed to a system fighting game. But where GG goes above SF is by including universal features such as air dash and roman cancels that give characters more options to make up for their flaws. In SF you can't do this because most SF's lack universal mechanics. In SFV for instance it's dependent on your V-skill and V-trigger and that's character dependent, so you don't have an universal thing like parries, air dash, shit like that to get you out of harms way. No, you have to rely on your character. And depending on how your character is balanced makes or breaks you. Don't get me wrong, every fighting game has tiers. But it feels like in other fighting games you have more options to make up for character flaws/weaknesses due to universal features such as hops, sidesteps, tech rolls.

In my original post I gave GG's Millia an example. She has extremely low HP and no real reversal. Sounds like a shit situation, right? Well, Millia also has some of the best movement in the game. Every character in the game has air dash besides Potemkin but Millia (as well as Dizzy) can air dash TWICE. She can air dash forward then backwards and zip and zap all over the battlefield like a bumblebee on top of having the standard double jump. The game has balanced out her weakness by giving her more universal options. She's now more viable.

This really appeals to me. I just like fighters with more options. I find it hard to want to get better at Street Fighter after a certain point.

For one thing, more options expands upon the mind game. Take parry in 3S. Standard SF is about punishing an opponent that jumps at you from the air. Well some times they might empty jump, wait for you to reversal or anti-air, and parry it. Or maybe you'll get the read expect an empty jump, do nothing, and delay your anti-air timing. Or maybe they'll jump in with an air to air move and instead of anti-airing, you parry it and super as a punish? That one little tweak adds a new dynamic and mind game to the meta.

In the KOF 94 video I posted it shows more mind games and things going on than ST due, specifically, to the universal mechanics.


4 minutes in, we see Infiltration repeatedly avoid the opponents attack with the side step. It results later down the round with a "is he, isn't he going to sidestep?" mind game.

More options = more mind games = more involved meta = more involved game = game I want to learn.

Watch this fight between Nakamura's Millia vs Elphelt.


Millia's movement options take something that's almost universal (air dash) and turn it into fine wine for mind games and mix ups. The way he weaves in and out. The use of the pin as a tool to get in, the dash speed. Air blocking. Then roman cancels added on top. GG takes (nearly) universal mechanics and lets characters open the doors with them.

A really depressing revelation was that I just don't like SF that much.
 

Space Lion

Banned
May 24, 2019
1,015
A big problem with SFV is that it's an offensive game without universal defensive options. Woshige wants it to play like GG but GG has faultless defense, air dashes, roman cancels, bursts. SFV lacks universal mechanics that apply to the whole cast, which limits the casts options if they are defensively lacking.
 

GamePnoy74

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,536
If was was in charge of a SF6 or a MvC5 all I know is that I'd get Kamasi Washington to do the soundtrack.

 

BKatastrophe

Member
Oct 28, 2017
13,359
Either:

Capcom vs Shonen Jump/Capcom Fighting All-Stars (which if I recall a story correctly from the days of yore, I do believe Seth Killian pitched such a thing right before he left Capcom to go work on Playstation All-Stars that he called Capcom vs Capcom cuz he was like "why waste a good system on just this property?"). A VS game by Capcom would be a blast, but I would love 3v3, not 2v2, though I didn't play Infinite and I LOVED Tatsunoko vs Capcom (to this day some of the most fun I've ever had playing a fighting game).

A Tatsunoko vs Capcom HD Remix that merges the JP and US versions so it has ALL the characters and ALL the tracks (the JP version had character music, while the US version had stage music). Make it available on Switch and PS4 at least and overhaul the online so it's GOOD, and you've got a winner. Don't even worry about the lack of character music for Zero, Frank West, Yatterman-2, Tekkaman Blade, and Joe the Condor. Or the fact that there would be one more Tatsunoko character than Capcom character. Like, if Capcom really wanted to fullblown rock that shit, they could add one more Capcom character (Amaterasu, since the main villain is from Okami), and then add character tracks for all the characters that don't have them. That said, that's a dream one.

What I REALLY want is a Capcom All-Stars that uses the groove system from Capcom vs SNK, but only from Capcom fighters. It would be tricky though, since obviously how do you balance Third Strike against Ultra SF4? For example? But boy it'd be wild.
 

Platy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,634
Brazil
Here is the long story short of the capcom project I made

It is a Capcom Smash Bros (think smash bros meele mechanics) but with an extra kick button (and the attack one turns into punch) while directional air attacks keep being just one, ex moves (made with the actual half circle motions), 2 supers (special+punch and special+kick) and a ultra (special+punch+kick) with the proper bar and more hitstun so you can make more marvel vs capcom like combos that can trow people away (like you hold the person while you are comboing and the bigger then combo the further it will trow the person after if finishes).

Multiplat, characters are SD and almost low poly and cell shaded (think Dragalia lost but with a stroke around it) to recall Pocket Fighter (like I said before, the OG capcom vs capcom) and to help to reuse the models for a mobile/download only Puzzle Fighter 2

It shall have 26 characters + create your character + unlockable boss

13 will be based on today's Capcom

  1. Ryu
  2. Akuma
  3. Chun Li
  4. Monster Hunter
  5. Felyne
  6. Ratha
  7. Jill Valentine
  8. Nemesis
  9. Dante
  10. Lady
  11. Phoenix Wright
  12. Date Masamune
  13. Megaman

and 13 based on old school Capcom

  1. Regina
  2. Haggar
  3. Super Ace
  4. Captain Commando
  5. Amaterasu
  6. Ryu (BoF)
  7. Strider
  8. Mobi-Chan Alpha
  9. Morrigan
  10. Linn Kurosawa
  11. Unknown Warrior
  12. Akira Kazama
  13. Arthur
The boss will be a (giant?) Vulgus ship with the unlockable version being a humanoid vulgus ship
9 women, 5 unidentified genders and 13 men for Neoxon
Feel sad for the lack of Sakura, Tabasa and Ibuki (because of pocket fighter seniority) and a few of my favorites (edward falcon, jin saotome, pink ostrich) but hard to fit them when 26 is already Meele's number so a pretty good first game roster pre-dlc

items and different stages and everything. No cinematic story mode but lots of low budget single player modes like a beat em up mode (aka long stage beating low lvl AI to progress), a megaman boss mode where you can mix the enemies specials with yours and more.
 

Deleted member 8860

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
6,525
What I REALLY want is a Capcom All-Stars that uses the groove system from Capcom vs SNK, but only from Capcom fighters. It would be tricky though, since obviously how do you balance Third Strike against Ultra SF4? For example? But boy it'd be wild.

Screw balance. Just make a game that's fun. CvS2, A3, 3s, MvC2, even vanilla SF4 weren't particularly concerned with making all options even roughly equal and they were all beloved by casuals as well as having vibrant tourney scenes. As long as most of the cast/grooves are viable, that's enough.

And CvS2's grooves weren't at all balanced in themselves. But it's a damn fun game.