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ScOULaris

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,634
When Final Fantasy 7 Remake was first announced, I was overwhelmed with excitement like many were at the time. The mythical remake was finally going to happen, and its announcement trailer couldn't have looked better. Once the game finally came out to generally great critical and commercial success, however, I held off on buying it. You see, Final Fantasy 7 is an unassailable classic of the genre for me, and one that still very much holds up today. All of the footage of the remake that I'd seen by the time of release kind of put me off to wanting to play it because the overall tone of what I was seeing seemed a bit off from how I think of the original. As weird as it sounds, I didn't want to play the remake and allow for its different style and increased fidelity to subconsciously "replace" FF7 in my mind in the same way that a poor film adaptation of one's favorite book can sort of overwrite your conception of characters and events after having seen it.

Well, for whatever reason I decided to pick up the PS5 version of FF7R recently, and while I'm enjoying this newer, more bombastic take on FF7 I can't help but feel that its depiction of Midgar just feels strange to me.

Final-Fantasy-VII-Remake-April-20-2020-20200413103321.jpg


I'm only a few hours in, mind you, but my general impression of Midgar in FF7R is that it feels quite different in terms of atmosphere from how I perceived the city in the original. I think this feeling stems from a few key differences in how the remake presents Midgar in the opening hours:
  • The NPC's - This is the big one for me. Just what the hell are these Midgar citizens? Whether it be in the slums or up on the plate, everyone looks like a randomly generated Abercrombie & Fitch model. Hell, they sound like one too. The idle chatter that I hear when walking past throngs of people who are supposed to be living in this oppressive cyberpunk world sounds like a bunch of broskies shooting the breeze at a local sports bar. And they all seem to be sporting super clean, preppy attire and precisely styled hair. Even kids kickin' fucking cans in Sector 5 are rocking immaculate undercut fades. I just can't reconcile these Midgar denizens with how my mind filled in the blanks for the blocky, low-poly ones in the original.
  • The Music - Don't get me wrong. Some of the newly recorded arrangements of the classic tracks sound great, but I do think that there was a darker, more oppressive atmosphere conveyed by the original's MIDI tracks. The new versions in FF7R all tend to be very orchestral and oftentimes bombastic, which sometimes adds a sense of grandiosity to areas that originally felt sad and mysterious. I don't think this aspect is as easily perceivable as the barista-chic NPC's, but I do think it's contributing to the sense that FF7R's Midgar is just not the same as how I've always seen the original's backdrop in my mind's eye.

Aside from those factors many areas of the city look really spot-on, now sporting tons of added detail that brings them to life in a way that the fixed-perspective pre-rendered backgrounds never could have. As I spend time killing rats and doing other busywork that was never a thing in the original, I just couldn't help but want to put this particular thought into writing to see if others felt the same.

This is by no means a thread meant to shit on FF7R. It took balls to even attempt remaking the Midgar portion of such a seminal classic, and there's no way that they could've ever made this thing perfect to everyone. In many ways they absolutely killed it on the remake front. I just need to treat this as a sort of alternate take on a familiar story rather than a new-and-improved, definitive version of one of my favorite JRPG's of all time.
 
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Feb 29, 2020
401
Totally!

It was great to be able to explore even more the city! I loved how well designed the Reactor was, as well as the sector 7 slums!

The Wall Market is just awesome! I loved the dancing minigame!
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,711
like 3/4 yeah. Its somewhat its own thing, for better and worse.
Some of the NPC's look like they're from Sonic 06
 

headfallsoff

Member
Mar 16, 2018
683
I really like the remake but you're totally right that the feel and design of midgar has changed. It takes more cues from advent children than it does the original game, which is this bold and strange mess of visual styles that has been completely lost in the transition to a realistic modern game.
 

Faenix1

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,114
Canada
Up until it went full Kingdom Hearts the game was everything I wanted in a remake.

From how it played (to a point, at least), to the atmosphere, to just.. how things were.
 

Turin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,464
The mood is altered a bit. I had a mostly great time but I would have preferred to keep more of the funky, grungy, moody vibes.
 

DecoReturns

Member
Oct 27, 2017
22,003
No. They really didn't try to match the mood that the original was going for. Which is a shame.

but it wasn't as bad as the Shinra break-in which was horribly done in remake.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,753
Sometimes it did, some times it did not.

My main issue is how bright the slums look. In the original, the slums were dark, grimy, and the light from the surface barely shined upon them due to the gigantic plates above. I don't understand why they added the "the plates have giant lights under them to illuminate the slums" nonsense. Why would Shinra care? The dark, depressing and oppressive looks of the original was way better.

I also preferred the more shady, dirty and seedy look of the Wall Market of the original. The one in the Remake is way too lively.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,143
Definitely did not. Probably the worst aspect of the game is how completely they whiffed on capturing the seedy, disgusting weirdness. Sector 7 near Seventh Heaven feels like a comfy commune in the Remake. It's weird.
 

Deleted member 34949

Account closed at user request
Banned
Nov 30, 2017
19,101
No, but that didn't negatively impact my enjoyment either. It had it's own essence that I really ended up digging.

I will say though, it came damn close whenever there were Nighttime segments.
 

Atom

Member
Jul 25, 2021
11,492
Nothing was ever going to compare to the hand-crafted meticulousness and coziness of the prerendered backgrounds in the original, but given that they did everything in 3D I think it was pretty close. It manages to keep a fair amount of the weird vibe stuff, especially in Wall Market and nothing feels exceptionally unfaithful in design to the original. Overall quite the reimagining, obvious bloat aside.

One thing that I don't think did a ton of favors was all the harsh bright sunlight. A lot of the appeal of the original aesthetic was the night time or dim daylight from under the plate, with bluey hues. Crisis core I think got this balance just right, FF7R feels a lot more like there isn't a plate overhead at all given how bright some parts of the game are.
 

Ashes of Dreams

Unshakable Resolve
Member
May 22, 2020
14,497
Not even close.

There's supposed to be no light, it's supposed to be depressing, rundown, dirty, and a bit dangerous feeling. Wall Market is supposed to be sleazy and gross.
The whole thing feels way too bright and polished. Even when they have trash heaps in the art direction, it's like... just off enough to feel wrong.

I'd never want to step foot into the slums of the original. I could probably live in the slums of Remake.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,711
Not even close.

There's supposed to be no light, it's supposed to be depressing, rundown, dirty, and a bit dangerous feeling. Wall Market is supposed to be sleazy and gross.
The whole thing feels way too bright and polished. Even when they have trash heaps in the art direction, it's like... just off enough to feel wrong.

I'd never want to step foot into the slums of the original. I could probably live in the slums of Remake.

Its the same issue I have with games like XIV. The world feels so clean and sterilized in contrast to the subject matter.
7R absolutely nailed the eccentric antagonists though. Corneo, Heidegger, Hojo are pretty much how I imagined. The underground tournament arena was also great, with Beck and his stupid gang.
 
Oct 26, 2017
19,762
Not even close.

There's supposed to be no light, it's supposed to be depressing, rundown, dirty, and a bit dangerous feeling. Wall Market is supposed to be sleazy and gross.
The whole thing feels way too bright and polished. Even when they have trash heaps in the art direction, it's like... just off enough to feel wrong.

I'd never want to step foot into the slums of the original. I could probably live in the slums of Remake.
Agreed.
 

mute

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,118
Yeah most of the npcs are out of place and clash with the mostly faithful main cast. I wonder if they were made in house or not, they seem like they could fit lots of different games.

The atmosphere was mostly fine but the game having to go through several day-night cycles caused some areas to look off in daylight.

I mostly just miss the areas we didn't get to see. The game rides the same rails as the original with only a couple new areas. I'd like to see more sectors, more action on top of the plate, and more use of the transportation systems.
 

Jotakori

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,184
There were a few parts here and there that gave me whooshes of that nailed-it nostalgia, but on the whole it really did not.
The NPCs were a biggie for me, too; everyone looked so generic and then you'd come across a named character and they'd stick out like a sore thumb lol. I love FF7's weird 90's grunge fashion and Remake really failed to capture that for me outside of (mostly) the main cast.
Music fell short for me, as well. I think the only track that really stood out to me in the entire game was the new weird ass theme they had during the section with the crane hands. Everything else was just kinda there and alright, or felt like it was lacking a special something from the original tunes.
Much of the settings also didn't quite do it for me... Like idk, the lighting was frequently really flat (especially during the day), and yeah it felt slummy, but it just... it's hard to describe it, but I felt like a lot of areas lacked the same moody impact to me as the original. I pretty much agree with everyone else who's bringing this up.

And then there's the story itself -- which was great when it was following the original, but then they'd bring out those whispers and it'd immediately crush any stirrings of, 'omg this is ff7!!' I'd be starting to feel lol.
 

Dice

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,398
Canada
Sort of

Jessie's chapter was a great way to see the middle[?] class we never got to see.

But the game cleaned up it's slums like crazy, everyone looks so fashionably and "clean" (FF7 OG had slums with all kinds of impovershed, drunk, or unkempt).

FF7R offers a more hopeful and more sustainable (friendly citizens, a school, and seemingly nice community), but I love the grime of the original too, it felt more realistic (especially for a slum where people live in pipes and broken down RVs) and made Shinra seem even shittier for letting this happen in their city.

FINAL-FANTASY-VII-REMAKE_20200410224204-1024x576.jpg


hqdefault.jpg
 
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Lobster Roll

signature-less, now and forever
Member
Sep 24, 2019
34,392
Final Fantasy VII to me includes the game's mood, plot, and melancholic themes. The missing sense of dread from the original, as well as the mishandling of Sephiroth as a villain makes it miss the mark for me. Sephiroth is meant to be a rumor that you're chasing … a ghost that's one step ahead of and being unimaginably powerful. Instead he's Cloud's pushover schoolyard bully.
 

GalaxyDive

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,670
Agree with you on a lot, OP, even as someone largely satisfied with Remake. I think the areas they nailed, they really nailed, while some other environments could be quite lacking.

The generic, straight out of XV NPCs felt very odd against the designs of the existing characters and vibe of the city. I definitely feel like the NPC design direction needed to try and lean into the VII aesthetic more.

I generally liked most of the city's design, but I do think it could have still captured the "oppressive" feel more. Which could have been as simple as making the environments darker/favoring more scenes set at night. Especially as far as the undercity goes, it was a mistake to have the (artificial!) lighting look like the sun was shining overhead.

I do think most of the music's arrangements were well-done, but as I remarked in another recent thread on the two games' OSTs, 1. The janky synth really did make a lot of Midgar's atmosphere in the original and 2. While I understand Hamauzu not wanting to emulate Uematsu, a few too many of his original tracks lacked any identity that made them feel like they belonged in VII's world and instead felt as if they were lifted from something like a XIII game;

Like being out in the abandoned warehouse area between the Sector 7 train station and slums, between its straightforward visual design, the Hamauzu track, amd the bright daylight, I honestly felt like I was playing Lightning Returns, not that I was in Midgar beneath the plates.
 

Kuro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,699
I think portraying the slums as still grimey and run down full of rusty shacks but not straight up Mad Max toxic hell and the people still able to enjoy a meager existence makes more sense when going for a more modern realistic take. It fits real world situations a lot better when people don't want to change things because they still have electricity and entertainment like the real world.

Sector 7 still looks really run down full of shacks, dirt, and garbage and Sector 5 is literally a junkyard with the very sad realization that you see more elderly and orphans than adults which is the result of the war with Wutai and long hours at work (which you pick up from idle NPC chatter).

I mean you see kids playing in freakin dumpsters and on top of shanty town rooftops. That's sadly accurate for very low income slum regions of the world.

The only major difference I got from the environments is that the game actually has more daytime scenes compared to the original where everything is mostly dark in Midgar.

The NPCs largely look awful though and Intergrade inexplicably gave everyone eyeliner to boot.

Also the original had some absolutely terrible maps like the region inbetween sector 5 and the park or the segment beyond the wall in wall market.
 

Trigger

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,924
Atlanta, GA
It didn't feel nearly as from as the original. Sunlight, fashionable NPCs, etc. It's a great urban environment, but not what I imagined the OG's Midgar looking like.
 

Hoggle

Member
Mar 25, 2021
6,114
Same for me. I live absolutely everything about it except the NPC's. They should have looked like they were straight out of Akira, not some fashion magazine.
 

Laxoon

One Winged Slayer
Member
Jan 24, 2018
1,836
For the most part yes, it's just Wall Market. It's near a totally different vibe, it's not bad at all but hardly the same. I'd even say what goes down in Wall Market vibes better in the remake with all the wacky running around/fetch questing, it's way more cinematic, but I will always adore the original grimier version of it too.
 

Vidpixel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,637
They nailed the look and feel for the most part, but I kinda wish they learned a bit more into the 90s punk aesthetic. The generic NPCs felt completely out of place compared to the main cast lol. You got spikey haired anime dudes juxtaposed with normal ass people in suits, it's bizarre in an almost endearing sort of way? But still weird lol.
 

Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,392
No. Everything is sanitized and weak.

But that's the whole game really.

Not even close.

There's supposed to be no light, it's supposed to be depressing, rundown, dirty, and a bit dangerous feeling. Wall Market is supposed to be sleazy and gross.
The whole thing feels way too bright and polished. Even when they have trash heaps in the art direction, it's like... just off enough to feel wrong.

I'd never want to step foot into the slums of the original. I could probably live in the slums of Remake.
Yup, all of this
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,717
Some areas were great, others felt really wrong and the NPCs felt like they were from a different game entirely.
Id say mostly eh/10
 

Zeal543

Next Level Seer
Member
May 15, 2020
5,797
wallmarket, yes. Everything else, no including most of the music
 

Terraforce

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
18,917
It was a massive upgrade. The disparity between wall market and the slums can be felt a lot more. Places like Sector 5 in particular stand out a lot more.
 

mute

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,118
They nailed the look and feel for the most part, but I kinda wish they learned a bit more into the 90s punk aesthetic. The generic NPCs felt completely out of place compared to the main cast lol. You got spikey haired anime dudes juxtaposed with normal ass people in suits, it's bizarre in an almost endearing sort of way? But still weird lol.
The shinra suits are pretty accurate and highlight the disparity more but everyone else needed a couple more coats of MadMax at least.
 
Oct 8, 2019
9,144
I know, right? Shit looks like a pleasant little hamlet with a slightly lacking bulk trash disposal infrastructure.

Uh where have you lived in where most of the houses are made from rusted sheet metal and the place to get scraps are overrun with monsters?

The local factory has been abandoned because its also overrun with monsters. They have a local militia to handle the monster problem because Shinra refuses to protect the civilians who live there. Its really close by to a haunted train yard where children have been murdered by an actual ghost.