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Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,858
1F23eMb.png

Quick shield your virgin eyes and go watch those episodes
Yeah...kind of. It's a six-episode bomb that's only available legitimately on the goddamn Cartoon Network App until it airs on TV in December. Cartoon Network is pushing online distribution hard.


EDIT: Also, THERE ARE SPOILERS HERE NOW AVOID THIS THREAD UNTIL YOU SEE THE EPISODES!

Got you covered. I'm so self-centered that I only see what I want to see. I physically can't see the spoilers.


Halfway through the episodes. Steven's behavior while waiting for Connie to talk to him hits too close to home and it's bumming me out. Also I have to wonder if the writers are aware that it's a major annoyance to fans that Steven seems to have very little interest in learning gem history besides stuff about what Rose was like, either not asking any/enough questions or straight up cutting off reveals to deal with other stuff.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
1,823
So I thought the bomb was fine, nothing spectacular (it's obviously a breather arc) but fine, however I think the scheduling is really starting to take it's toll in regards to these burst of lowkey townie episodes.
No one wants to wait five months for something like this and then have no idea when they're gonna get new content again, its frustrating as all get out.

However I do want to note that I really, really enjoyed that kindergarten episode with Peridot.
She has become a completely different person from the character we were first introduced to in season 1.
It seems like she really has grown to truly love almost every aspect of the earth- it's fauna, its flora, its wind, its freedom, etc.-, and you can see that it's really pushing against her programming as a kindergartener.
This role that she once cherished inhabiting in homeworld's society is now seen as this toxic and destructive thing to her, the antithesis of the lifestyle she's currently enjoying with her friends.
There's just some really great character development on that front, it really makes me wish we had spent more time with Peridot in season 4.
It's unfortunate that the crewniverse has limited themselves to Steven's perspective, there's too much that happens off screen that we miss out on in this show.
I can live with it I guess...but it's definitely a little irksome.

The only thing that truly got on my nerves during this arc was Steven's complete dismissal of anything gem related and him not being remotely phased by anything that happened on homeworld...it's kind of annoying to see him go "yeah yeah yeah...whatever Pink diamond was bad and homeworld was crazy...but CONNIE's MAD AT ME!! Boo hoo hoo T.T" whenever the CGs try to bring that stuff up with him.
Like...I totally feel for Connie and respect where she's coming from, she had been training with this boy she loves and admires for months on end to deal with homeworld's goons...and he just suddenly forgets all his training and abandons her with a rash decision that could've gotten him killed.
I think this was a necessary arc to have...but come on...don't just brush off the events of the "Wanted" arc off like that...
Like I'm sure they'll get to it later but it's just irritating to see Steven "I'm never gonna ask follow up questions" Universe dismiss the all the juicy gem knowledge that's offered to him.
 

PSqueak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,464
Like I'm sure they'll get to it later but it's just irritating to see Steven "I'm never gonna ask follow up questions" Universe dismiss the all the juicy gem knowledge that's offered to him.

I felt that was to put emphasis on the irrationality of the situation, he is a teenager and was in an emotionally hurt place, think of it as how teens often think breaking up is the end of the world and get overtly emotional rather than steven genuinely dismissing all that.
 

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,858
I felt that was to put emphasis on the irrationality of the situation, he is a teenager and was in an emotionally hurt place, think of it as how teens often think breaking up is the end of the world and get overtly emotional rather than steven genuinely dismissing all that.

He's been doing that throughout most of the show, though. He doesn't seem interested in knowing anything that's not Rose-specific.
 

Protoman200X

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
8,574
N. Vancouver, BC, Canada
He's been doing that throughout most of the show, though. He doesn't seem interested in knowing anything that's not Rose-specific.

It didn't help that Steven is now conditioned to have the Crystal Gems rarely give him straightforward or truthful answers. In 'Giant Woman' for instance, look how many legitimate questions he asked to Pearl and Amethyst, who simply brush them off without answering any of them.

The Crystal Gems seem especially reluctant to talk about the darker aspects of their culture, as they keep things on a need-to-know basis. And prior to Lapis and Homeworld, there wasn't much they felt he "needed" to know.
 

NTom64_HFC

Member
Oct 27, 2017
247
How would you all rank the S5 episodes so far? I tend to go by Great/Good/OK/Meh:

Great:
The Trial (5x02)
Off Colours (5x03)
Raising the Barn (5x06)
Back to the Kindergarten (5x08)
Sadie Killer (5x09)
Kevin Party (5x10)

Good:
Stuck Togther (5x01)
Lars' Head (5x04)
Dewey Wins (5x05)
Gemcation (5x07)

OK:
N/A

Meh:
N/A

I originally was gonna drop Dewey Wins from Good to OK due to the clunky writing and kinda hamfisted moral spouting at the end, but Joel's delivery, the general tone of the episode and the heart-wrenching ending keep it firmly in the good column IMO.
 

KNZFive

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,767
I agree that it's been all good and great episodes for Season 5 so far! I, for one, absolutely adore The Trial and think it does a stellar job of telling an engaging and twisty story in just 11 minutes. Blue Zircon made a great impression on me and I hope we see more of her as an accidental ally to the Crystal Gems. Or at least as an ally to the truth.

I'd need some time to think about the most recent episodes before I rank them, but The Trial would be my #1 of the season thus far.
 

Just D

Member
Oct 26, 2017
104

Dewey Wins:


After going through all that, the first thing Steven gotta deal with is someone's poor attitude smh. Can see if they would have actually had a chance but after seeing the gems even as Alexandrite tossed around like they ain't nothing, he knew that wasn't gonna work so he tried something different.

Gemcation:

It's good that the Gems and Greg are concerned about him and how he feels about what went down since he was the one that took the big risk. It's unfortunate he doesn't have the chance to reflect on it and talk about it with them but instead deal with this other crap. And it seems Pearl is physically unable to talk about the past, which is interesting.

Raising the Barn:

Nice to see Lapis and Peridot again, sucks how absent they be sometimes. Lapis ain't trying to take no chances but you can't really blame her considering what she went through last time. Can see why Peridot would want to stay though her overall experience has been positive. Don't really care about them being apart too much tbh but that's mostly because I never really liked how their meeting up again in Barn Mates was done so never became invested in their friendship. But she'll be back though, maybe next time she appears she'll have an arc focused on her, that would be nice, and she needs it.

Back to the Kindergarten:

They really couldn't give them the garden? At least the ending had an upbeat note.

Kevin's Party:

Well the good thing about this is it's finished. I don't really like how this drama was handled and how it practically all went on Steven. Also, don't like how it overrode everything, kinda disappointing after such a hiatus.
 

peyrin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,408
California
there is no filler in this show.

As much as fans love to point to that one time Ian JQ said that there's no filler, the fact is, this show does have some filler episodes that do very little to progress the overarching story or develop any characters - Garnet's Universe, Say Uncle, Future Boy Zoltron, Rocknaldo, and Onion Gang all come to mind. The problem is when people try to describe anything without a giant lore bomb as filler, or when people use filler as a negative term to describe any episode they found boring. Filler doesn't equate to boring - you could make a pretty decent case for Kindergarten Kid being filler, yet it's one of the most fun episodes of the series.
 

Dusk Golem

Local Horror Enthusiast
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,807
As much as fans love to point to that one time Ian JQ said that there's no filler, the fact is, this show does have some filler episodes that do very little to progress the overarching story or develop any characters - Garnet's Universe, Say Uncle, Future Boy Zoltron, Rocknaldo, and Onion Gang all come to mind. The problem is when people try to describe anything without a giant lore bomb as filler, or when people use filler as a negative term to describe any episode they found boring. Filler doesn't equate to boring - you could make a pretty decent case for Kindergarten Kid being filler, yet it's one of the most fun episodes of the series.

Garnet's Universe and Say Uncle can be said to be filler, but that's dependent on viewpoint. One is just a fun episode of Steven coming up with a story to Garnet, though one thing to note is it demonstrates one trait of Garnet that the show has done a few times. Garnet is the character who listens to Steven directly the most and both Steven and Garnet have shared stories with each other once in a while through the series, and this episode can be seen as establishing that in part. Say Uncle is a non-canon crossover episode with Uncle Grandpa they did for fun as the team of both had friends in both.

Future Boy Zoltron introduces Frowny as a character and his dynamic with Mr. Smiley, which could come into play in the future. Rocknaldo establishes that Ronaldo has a founded admiration for the Crystal Gems, which played at least into a gag in the recent episodes when Steven doesn't respond he breaks into their Beach House to make sure they're okay. It establishes Ronaldo's deeper interest in the Crystal Gems which may play a role in the future. Onion Gang also introduces a cast of characters who come to visit Onion in the Summer, who will probably come back again and play a role in the future.

Now how important these individually are and how much people care about them is another thing, but I think one thing you have to accept is Steven Universe is in part 'Slice of Life', the team consider and show consistently that the daily lives of the characters are part of the show's focus. Some people view this aspect as pure filler, but they do feed into each other and is part of the overall show, even if there's some stronger and weaker interpretations than others. And sometimes an episode airs and it doesn't play a role again until MUCH later down the line.
 

zulux21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,379
I mean beyond that almost every single tv show has filler.
not every story fits perfectly in the time frame so you have to add filler to each individual episode in order to reach the needed story time.
so saying there is no filler at all is just outright a lie :P
 

peyrin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,408
California
Yeah for sure, the fact that we're only 5 seasons in makes it hard to decisively call anything filler - I don't think many of us expected, say, the Watermelon Stevens to play such a big role in the show. I think my point is more that there are eps you can reasonably argue are filler given what we know so far, but trying to claim either extreme (there's no filler/everything that's not a lore bomb is filler) is kind of a stretch.
 
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Morlas

Morlas

Looking for a better cartoon show.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
72,871
i dunno man even the 'filler' episodes usually either come back into relevance or have a small progression of a bigger plot point
 

KNZFive

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,767
I always associate the term "filler episode" with anime, since there it means anime-original content added into the show to keep it from catching up with the ongoing manga. But if you don't think watching Goku and Piccolo learn how to drive in a DBZ filler episode isn't the best shit ever, then we're gonna have some problems here.

I think that when people refer to an episode as "filler", they mean the episode is "unimportant" or "skippable." The problem is that what's unimporant or skippable can be subjective.

Garnet's Universe has some nice animation at times, but it's not terribly important in the grand scheme of things. However, the real purpose of the episode was some very subtle development of Garnet and Steven's relationship. Steven describes Garnet as wanting to tell Steven how much she loves him. Garnet actually realizes after his story that he wishes she was more open with her emotions with him. After the episode, you do see Garnet open up a bit more to Steven. It's very subtle though, to the point that I would argue it's not intentional and that Garnet's Universe and subsequent episode just didn't do a good job of establishing this change in Garnet. Say Uncle is filler, but screw continuity. Sometimes you just want a show that has gotten more serious to let loose for an episode with bat-shit meta humor and Pearl's personality magnified by 1000% percent. I can tell that the crews had fun making the episode. So even though Say Uncle is literally not canon, I'd be more likely to tell new fans to skip Garnet's Universe than Say Uncle.

Future Boy Zoltron might set up stuff for future episodes with Smiley and Frowny, but it feels so utterly, utterly pointless at the moment. It's my second least favorite episode, beaten only by Onion Gang. As much as I loathe Onion Gang with a burning passion, it accomplishes its purpose of establishing that Onion considers Steven a true and deep friend. The wooded area where the gang meets also comes into play in Are You My Dad?, since that's where Aquamarine and Topaz capture Connie. Onion being the first on-screen abductee of Topaz and Aquamarine has more impact thanks to Onion Gang's focus on Steven and Onion's relationship. Onion Gang is my most hated episode, but I've had to eat crow and admit that it set up stuff for the future (including possibly foreshadowing some deep lore or main plot developments if you believe some fan theories).

Rocknaldo, as much as it's derided by fans, is one of my favorite Ronaldo episodes. He's insufferable in this episode, but that's the point. He's trying to be a better person by recognizing that he's been wrong about the gems, but he takes it in the totally wrong direction and makes it all about himself. It also has the Gems playing a role in the episode, leading to some really funny lines like Amethyst's "You truthed him so hard that he died!" It's appropriate that the Gems literally just dump him like trash in front of the fry shop in the middle of the night. Anyway, the episode isn't filler since Ronaldo has developed as a character by the end of it into a more functional and well-meaning supporter of the Crystal Gems. Hate him or loathe him, Ronaldo is one of the more prominent townies and he'll undoubtedly play some sort of role in more "important" episodes to come. Even Uncle Andy got to be a part of the Zoo arc by flying Steven and Greg to South Korea.

I think the major problem with some fans that they're expecting one kind of show all the time and getting angry or disappointed when their expectations aren't met. This can be with specific, asinine stuff like getting angry when an expected event doesn't happen or when a character is acting in a way they don't like, despite the fact that the character is supposed to be in a grey area or setting up character development. They react impatiently without letting the story play out in full and without looking at things from a different perspective. People were mad that Steven cut off Pearl's revelation in Gemcation to cry about Connie hating him. But Steven's a young teen going through his first psuedo-break-up/fight. Of course he's going to think his problems with Connie are the worst and only thing in the world right now.
 
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Protoman200X

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
8,574
N. Vancouver, BC, Canada
The show has done a good job balancing the plot-heavy, serial episodes with the comical one-offs.

Restaurant Wars is still my favourite episode in the series because of that, while "Nobody Wants Greg" mini-series was a fun view of watching Greg transition from wide-eye rock star to caring father figure.
 

Manipular

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
579
Detroit, MI
I always associate the term "filler episode" with anime, since there it means anime-original content added into the show to keep it from catching up with the ongoing manga. But if you don't think watching Goku and Piccolo learn how to drive in a DBZ filler episode isn't the best shit ever, then we're gonna have some problems here.

I think that when people refer to an episode as "filler", they mean the episode is "unimportant" or "skippable." The problem is that what's unimporant or skippable can be subjective.

Garnet's Universe has some nice animation at times, but it's not terribly important in the grand scheme of things. However, the real purpose of the episode was some very subtle development of Garnet and Steven's relationship. Steven describes Garnet as wanting to tell Steven how much she loves him. Garnet actually realizes after his story that he wishes she was more open with her emotions with him. After the episode, you do see Garnet open up a bit more to Steven. It's very subtle though, to the point that I would argue it's not intentional and that Garnet's Universe and subsequent episode just didn't do a good job of establishing this change in Garnet. Say Uncle is filler, but screw continuity. Sometimes you just want a show that has gotten more serious to let loose for an episode with bat-shit meta humor and Pearl's personality magnified by 1000% percent. I can tell that the crews had fun making the episode. So even though Say Uncle is literally not canon, I'd be more likely to tell new fans to skip Garnet's Universe than Say Uncle.

Future Boy Zoltron might set up stuff for future episodes with Smiley and Frowny, but it feels so utterly, utterly pointless at the moment. It's my second least favorite episode, beaten only by Onion Gang. As much as I loathe Onion Gang with a burning passion, it accomplishes its purpose of establishing that Onion considers Steven a true and deep friend. The wooded area where the gang meets also comes into play in Are You My Dad?, since that's where Aquamarine and Topaz capture Connie. Onion being the first on-screen abductee of Topaz and Aquamarine has more impact thanks to Onion Gang's focus on Steven and Onion's relationship. Onion Gang is my most hated episode, but I've had to eat crow and admit that it set up stuff for the future (including possibly foreshadowing some deep lore or main plot developments if you believe some fan theories).

Rocknaldo, as much as it's derided by fans, is one of my favorite Ronaldo episodes. He's insufferable in this episode, but that's the point. He's trying to be a better person by recognizing that he's been wrong about the gems, but he takes it in the totally wrong direction and makes it all about himself. It also has the Gems playing a role in the episode, leading to some really funny lines like Amethyst's "You truthed him so hard that he died!" It's appropriate that the Gems literally just dump him like trash in front of the fry shop in the middle of the night. Anyway, the episode isn't filler since Ronaldo has developed as a character by the end of it into a more functional and well-meaning supporter of the Crystal Gems. Hate him or loathe him, Ronaldo is one of the more prominent townies and he'll undoubtedly play some sort of role in more "important" episodes to come. Even Uncle Andy got to be a part of the Zoo arc by flying Steven and Greg to South Korea.

I think the major problem with some fans that they're expecting one kind of show all the time and getting angry or disappointed when their expectations aren't met. This can be with specific, asinine stuff like getting angry when an expected event doesn't happen or when a character is acting in a way they don't like, despite the fact that the character is supposed to be in a grey area or setting up character development. They react impatiently without letting the story play out in full and without looking at things from a different perspective. People were mad that Steven cut off Pearl's revelation in Gemcation to cry about Connie hating him. But Steven's a young teen going through his first psuedo-break-up/fight. Of course he's going to think his problems with Connie are the worst and only thing in the world right now.

Very well put. As passionate as the SU fanbase is about this show, the dismissal of damn near EVERYTHING that doesn't immediately connect to Homeworld/The Diamonds/The Gems in general as "filler" is more than a little eye-rolling. In addition to the word being incredibly subjective, SU fans, of all people, should know how often episodes that seem to have no apparent importance turn out to be critical later on down the line. Just because the episode doesn't broadcast this upon first viewing does not make it filler. And I say this as someone who can get pretty fed up with the abundance of townie episodes when we still have Lars stuck on Homeworld and the whole Pink Diamond mystery to resolve.
 
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Morlas

Morlas

Looking for a better cartoon show.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
72,871
Garnet's universe is awesome, steven is clearly a dragon ball fan
 

Fuu

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,361
This discussion is reminding me that my first impression of SU was that it was purely a slice of life type of deal. The fact that it had fights etc pushed me away from it initially, haha.
 

KNZFive

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,767
It's probably the closest SU's come to filler until you consider the following:

- A character voice by Matthew Moy (Lars) dies and is brought back to life by a magical gem. Also...
be2.png
Garnet's Universe also foreshadows Garnet being a fusion, as Garnet makes a comment that Steven isn't "ready to learn that [she] has secret animal friends." Hoppy and Hopper are supposed to represent Ruby and Sapphire.
 

KNZFive

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,767

DVD instead of BluRay.

*sigh* Oh well, it's better than having no Region 1 physical release at all. Plus fitting 52 episodes on several BluRays might have raised the price considerably.

The episode order is a bit off; Story for Steven and Shirt Club are bumped to Season 2 to include Full Disclosure and Joy Ride.

But I'm definitely preordering it the moment it goes up on Amazon. I'm all about those special features and DVD sales are a straight-forward way to support the show.
 

zulux21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,379

Psxphile

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,529
ONE JOB

... guess it'll be announced later like Adventure Time's season sets... harumph

I also have concerns about that episode list. They included Season 2's first episode which is fine I guess, since it acts as a bookend to Season 1's finale but Joy Ride too? And although they aired as a part of Season 2 early on; Shirt Club, Say Uncle and Story for Steven were meant to precede The Message and are not listed, which I assume means they'll be showing up for Season 2's collection. I thought we were over this when Ian J. posted the definitive episode order 2-3 years ago but I guess CN gotta CN.

(oddly enough Open Book is in and in its proper place, and that aired in early Season 2 as well).
 

KNZFive

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,767
I'll begrudgingly accept full-season sets on DVD if that's all we're getting. Disney hasn't even done that for Gravity Falls, and that show ended almost two years ago with only two seasons.

My best guess is that Ducktales will get full-season physical releases since that is Disney's highest-profile animated show right now with a lot of nostalgia attached to it. Hopefully after that, Disney might look into physical releases for Gravity Falls and Star vs The Forces of Evil.
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,013
Do they really hate those two shows?

I don't think it's anything to do with hate. They just don't get the dollar-signs in their eyes at the thought of home video releases like they do with some shows. Even FOX has cut back on which shows get Blu-ray releases because the sales potential isn't there for a lot of them, so DVD releases are the token effort.
 

peyrin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,408
California
I dunno, the lack of a boxset is especially weird cause Disney has really leaned hard into Gravity Falls since it finished, rerunning it a ton and pushing out loads of merchandise.
 

zulux21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,379
I dunno, the lack of a boxset is especially weird cause Disney has really leaned hard into Gravity Falls since it finished, rerunning it a ton and pushing out loads of merchandise.
I mean... that reads as a statement as to why you wouldn't put out a box set.

Rerunning a show a lot is a great reason to not release the show in a box set. it requires the people who want to watch it legally to keep a sub to your channel, and watch your channel. if you sell a box set then those people don't have to pay attention to your channel at all and can just watch it whenever.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,823
I felt that was to put emphasis on the irrationality of the situation, he is a teenager and was in an emotionally hurt place, think of it as how teens often think breaking up is the end of the world and get overtly emotional rather than steven genuinely dismissing all that.
But Steven's a young teen going through his first psuedo-break-up/fight. Of course he's going to think his problems with Connie are the worst and only thing in the world right now.

I mean, I get that...but Princess Star Butterfly from "Star vs The Forces of Evil" is a teenage girl with your typical slice of life problems (love triangles, breaks ups, etc.)...but she still reflects upon the huge magical events that she's part of in her strange high-fantasy world and also attempts to actively ask important questions about the history of said world whenever she can.
It would be nice if Steven wasn't always so one tracked minded and somewhat blase about non-Rose related gem stuff.
 
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Pluto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,466
Pfft, DVD only and the episode order is wrong. No thanks. I'd like to hear the behind the scenes commentary but this set is not worth it otherwise, I already have the australian Blu Rays of seasons 1-3 that feature the correct episode order. Sadly there are no bonus features except for the pilot episode but ultimately it is about the episodes.

I might double dip if they actually release "season 1" instead of "most of season 1 and a bit of season 2" plus bonus features but this is a lazy release, if they don't even bother including the correct episodes I have little faith in this.
 
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Morlas

Morlas

Looking for a better cartoon show.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
72,871
I'd rather have the complete first season digitally tbh
 

zulux21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,379
I think you have the wrong thread.
I think you might have missed the joke.
think about the only character that is known to use the word clod
now look at the aquaman symbol in the world alone
now think about that character again.

did you get it?

the symbol kind of looks like peridot's head :P
 

Popstar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
878
Oh. Oops.

It's been too long since I watched an episode and the front page is full of Justice League threads.

And i'm not a Peridot fan.
 

SchrodingerC

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,863
Ok, finally caught up with new episodes!

Now for my chain of thoughts:

I like how Connie chewed Steven out for giving himself up, and Steven not initially understanding why Connie and Lion are not happy with him. Connie certainly has a right to be mad at Steven.
Good on the SU crew for not resolving the tension between them at the end of Dewey Wins.

Poor Sadie, girl needs a normal relationship.

Aww, Peridot's and Lapis' friendship has progressed. Well, it was.

Damn Lapis, did you really have to take the entire barn?

Was Peridot's height inconsistent again or was it just me?

Go away Ronaldo.

I wanted to see Pearl fighting the snake :T

There's just something hilarious about seeing Garnet in a hot tub.

While the gems did not initially understand why Steven was being distant, I like how they were approaching it as possible trauma and how to talk to someone who has had a traumatic experience.

Amethyst treating the kindergarten a little differently since meeting her famethyst was nice.
Oh hey, a corrupted gem, been a while since we've seen on of those.

Sadie has her own house?

I know those minimum wage job feels, Sadie.

Oh, I forgot about Kevin.
Kevin with that relationship advice tho lol.

Hmm, Steven and Connie reuniting would've had a bigger impact if it wasn't apart of the bomb format.

Not bad so far; pretty light on the overarching story, but it's understandable there would be lighter episodes after the homeworld adventure.
 
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