Audio Era: Because Sound Matters

accx · Nov 24, 2017

I want to recommend and vouch for the Audio Technica ATH MSR7. Purely for "soundwhoring" (That is, for competitive gaming). According to Audio Technica they're a closed 'phone, but i think most would agree that it's somewhat of a hybrid. I'm not sure how much sound they leak but you can absolutely hear your surroundings.
If you've read the recommendations by mad lust envy over at head-fi (yea yea..), the ones that tops the tests are AKG Q701 (and all those derivatives) and Audio Technica ATH-AD700(X) when it comes to spatial awareness (or soundstage).
I haven't tried the AKG but i do own the AD700's. They're truly amazing for that purpose only, of giving an edge in competitive gaming, but they lack everywhere else. The comfort is shitty, the shape is idiotic (made for a decently sized watermelon), absolutely no bass, leaks (yea they're open so expected) and listening to music or anything other than pure comp gaming is terrible. I actually prefer neutral-bright and bright headphones but i do not enjoy these at all.
Enter, the MSR7.
So yea, the MSR7 are super bright aswell but with added bass, more specifically a fantastic sub bass (is that what it's called btw?). I personally hate bass and both V-shaped or U-shaped 'phones, and these hit just the right amount. Maybe slightly more oomph would make them the great all-rounder that i have come to love.
The soundstage are on par but just a smidge worse than the AD700's, meaning they're extremely worth it for competitive. The added bass makes them enjoyable both for music and movies (although for movies i'd look for something with more bass i guess).
Detachable cable is a plus as well. You get three different cables. One short, one long and one with mic + phone controls. Although i'm not sure it has a mic, i haven't really used it but i recall it being advertised.
So they're basically as good as AD700's, don't leak as much and makes them usable in other situations.

The downside? Well they're frequently priced at what? $200-250+? (I'm EU so i'm not sure). At that price range i'm sure there's better alternatives.
But! They are usually heavily discounted. Last year i got them for about $120 during black friday in fact, and i see that they've dropped down to that price range this year again.
Which makes them exceptionally cheap. If you can get them for sub $150 they're a steal imo.
Comfort is also an issue. I've come to love Audio Technicas gear over the years but they are absolutely clueless when it comes to comfort. I thought i had started to suffer from chronic headaches that where almost worse than migraines, only it was 24/7. Turns out the MSR7 clamps at a certain point which after a year of having them on 8-10 hours a day finally started to affect me. If you search for MSR7 mods there's guides on how to bend them so they fit properly and there's also this (which i've yet to try)
https://alexanderdarks.wordpress.co...-during-long-sessions-for-about-five-dollars/
You could also invest in a pair of brainwavz hm5 pads. I sold mine before i had a chance to try them out on these phones but i'm considering buying a new pair. Loved how they felt.
They're creaky as all hell. You'll get used to it.

Also, they're easy to drive! I have them connected only to a external soundcard (NI komplete audio 6), but they work just as fine on my phone.

EDIT:
Don't be put off by reviews. I've seen some saying they're fantastic but also a lot saying they're mediocre.
Thing is, they are comparing it to $200+ phones. Which is perfectly fine since they're usually at that price point.
And they're basically only tested for music, which yea, there's probably better in the $200+ range for that (but at that price point i'd argue it comes down to personal taste).
It's the value attached since they're usually priced at about 120-140, which makes them exceptionally good. And they compete with the best comp gaming phones out there. There's such a negligible difference that i shouldn't really mention it.
But beware, they're bright, really bright. Exceptionally bright since they're considered closed (which isn't really true).
If you're looking for "hi-fi cinematic" sound (heavy on the bass and whatnot), these aren't for you. They are the perfect competitive gaming 'phone with slight compromise to make them enjoyable for other things.
Some say they need burn-in but i've always thought burn-in was a myth? Isn't it just you getting used to the soundscape? Anyways if you're getting 'em and they seem shrill and suffer from sibilance, give them some time.
The AD700X/AKG Q701 (and derivatives) are exceptionally worse. Well, i dunno about AKG but they look so similar to AD700s and share the same score for soundstage and brightness so i'd wager they sound extremely similar.

...God i love these 'phones.

Hydrus · Nov 24, 2017

I dont know if this is the right place, but do you recommend this Onkyo A/V receiver? I have very little knowledge of surround sound and this would be my first.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/onkyo-...&acampID=ad444bd6d13611e7a12396bc129f10c70INT

Bman94 · Nov 24, 2017

It just want to say I'm glad Nintendo cared about the audio on the Switch. The 3DS sounded horrible and low volume. The Switch is miles ahead in terms of audio capability.

john385 · Nov 24, 2017

Any good EU headphone deals?

dgrdsv · Nov 25, 2017

Hydrus said:
but do you recommend this Onkyo A/V receiver?

Sure, I don't see anything which is wrong with it - beyond the fact that it's HDMI 2.0 still. The only moot feature is that it supports HDMI 2.0b only on 3 of its 8 HDMI inputs but this should be enough for the near future. Just make sure that your speakers fit the amplifier wattage.

Rhaya · Nov 25, 2017

So this might be a dumb question but are you supposed to crank the Bass setting on the Sub-woofer of your audio speaker set to max?

or should it be set lower or is it up to personal preference ?

GenG · Nov 25, 2017

Hi AudioERA, I'm thinking about setting up a small wireless audio system for my docked Switch. I have something in mind but I need your input and suggestions.

Here's the idea: Since Switch is not bluetooth compatible yet, I wanted to buy a USB to Jack or Bluetooth to Jack dongle in order to connect a wireless set, but I don't know much about the right brands or models for a low latency experience.

Do you have a wireless set hooked to your docked Switch? Which model? Do you experience lag?

Thank you very much for your help!

Frostman · Nov 25, 2017

I've got a question.

Been using the Astro mixamp Pro TR with a set of AKG K712s. Would it be worth it to invest in a Fulla 2? Would the upgrade be significant?

sleepnaught · Nov 25, 2017

sleepnaught said:
With my Switch, headphone usage has been somewhat disappointing. It can't quite drive my Q701s or HD598s properly. Is there a decent portable amp solution that isn't too bulky that can give it an extra boost?

Hydrus · Nov 25, 2017

dgrdsv said:
Sure, I don't see anything which is wrong with it - beyond the fact that it's HDMI 2.0 still. The only moot feature is that it supports HDMI 2.0b only on 3 of its 8 HDMI inputs but this should be enough for the near future. Just make sure that your speakers fit the amplifier wattage.

Great. I ended up buying it. It's my first receiver as I start my first surround system. Thank you.

Darkmaigle · Nov 25, 2017

Looking for a high quality pair of in ear headphones. I'd be using them for rhythm games on switch/Vita/PS4. I also listen to a lot of drum n bass.

NekoNeko · Nov 25, 2017

i mute all games.

Rhaya · Nov 25, 2017

Rhaya said:
So this might be a dumb question but are you supposed to crank the Bass setting on the Sub-woofer of your audio speaker set to max?

or should it be set lower or is it up to personal preference ?

anyone ?

Darknight · Nov 25, 2017

Rhaya said:
anyone ?

It should be set lower than max.

dgrdsv · Nov 25, 2017

Rhaya said:
or is it up to personal preference ?

It's completely up to you to set up the system the way you like it. You can use it at max but generally this isn't recommended since using anything at max means that you're getting a lot of sound distortions either from running above the amplifier capacity or above your speakers capacity.

Zing · Nov 25, 2017

Rhaya said:
anyone ?

When I configure Audyssey on my Denon, it recommends sub amp set to half power. I just left it at that.

Jeremiah · Nov 25, 2017

Frostman said:
I've got a question.

Been using the Astro mixamp Pro TR with a set of AKG K712s. Would it be worth it to invest in a Fulla 2? Would the upgrade be significant?

Not that this will be of any help... I've not sampled either, but you can at least take solace in Schiit's 15 Day Money Back Guarantee.

What matters is whether you notice a difference. Nothing quite like trying AV gear for yourself.

copelandmaster · Nov 26, 2017

Already a PC Headphone beast. Have had a Sennheiser HD 595 for ~7 years, a Creative Soundblaster ZXR for 4.5 (2+ on an external PCI-E riser on my desk, woo hoo electrical fire risk!!!), and just got a HD 650 last year, but I realized that I needed something that I wouldn't sweat all over while playing Tekken.

I was looking for a new set of desk speakers to upgrade from my 12 year old Altec (dell re-branded) A425s that I moved into my room 4 months ago out of desperation. They sound pretty good for what they are, but crackle, emit a low static sound when nothing is happening (happens on both my current rig and the 2005 dell they came with), and have an uneven output after volume adjustment.

The usual suspects that all got price cuts for BF:
Klipsh pro 2.1, Creative z623's - probably barely better than my altecs and cost double (with huge box desk subs)
JBL LSR305/KlipschR-14&15M - need an external device (I just wanna use my soundblaster ZXR, that's it), no sub
Audioengine A2+/A5+ - too expensive, colored (insufficient quality for the price point, in regards to the A2s) sound, questionable internals, HEUG AF, no sub

None were looking too hot.

Then I stumbled across the Creative SoundblasterX Katana. It seems designed for PC gamers (I am this to a tee, and not much of a picky audio/music buff anyway) with cramped desks who want to blow their ears off (a common comment was that this thing can bump). Has a bunch of extra features like virtual 7.1 and even has an internal soundcard that was just firmware updated to support the PS4 audio over USB (in addition to PC, but y'know, aux will be better for that in my case)... interesting. I watched like a dozen reviews, most were tech youtuber type ("its new and hot guys!", btw sponsored), but none the less positive. A few 'just a gamer in their room' vids, were also impressed, but pointed out the 30w sub was bad over 20 volume. Then I remembered that I have a 150w Onkyo SKW-550 HTiB floor sub laying around disused. I looked some more BF sales and the thing was on sale at both Creative and Amazon w/ free ship and *NO TAX* (I bought my ZXR on sale for the same reasons, worth it) so I took the plunge. I guess I'll post my findings here soon.

BTW, the HD 650s sound excellent, but they will vice grip your brain to death at the start. A stones throw from Oculus Rift with glasses bad, but on your head, not on your nose. ReAL-hEAdaChe-liKe-eXperIENce! They are better now (after lots of bending and general use), but there is always this tiny nagging feeling in the back of my head (literally) going, "god I wish my 595s sounded this good so I didn't have to wear these fuckers". Really soft cups tho...butnotassoftasthe595s*cough**cough*.

General Ipod/PS4 via dualshock 4 input/laptop/Realtek bros and gals, you'll have a good time time with a Sennheiser HD 595/598 pair if you like a neutral/uncolored sound. Unless you are a frequent flyer - open cans on a plane = don't. Amazing value, event with the headband and housing cracking issue and the need to sew the cups back up a few times. Mine now sports electrical tape on the left side. What a trooper!

EDIT: This HD 600/650/700 comparison by Z Review is amazing, I just remembered watching it this time last year.

ronco2000 · Nov 26, 2017

Glenn Gould said:
if you haven't already then you should sign up to MassDrop, I've recently had a pair of Sennheiser HD6XXs delivered to me which I paid $200 for. They're a special edition of the HD650s that are exclusive to massDrop, they're a slightly different colour and have a shorter lead but apart from those two details the hardware is identical.

They've listed them a couple of times now and they're really popular so it's best to be quick with them but I'd be amazed if they didn't list them again at some point.

Good deal, but you have to wait 4 months for delivery. Just get the HD600, which is better IMHO.

Reader · Nov 26, 2017

I was searching for headphones that produce that bumping bass that a lot of songs, games, and movies produce. After buying several headphones that range from LCD 2 to JVC SZ2000. All of them failed to produce a good amount of bass while keeping the other parts of the music in check. After continued purchases, I bought V-Moda M100. While this headphone produced an ample amount of bass (I was pretty happy with them), a friend recommended Purple Hearts by Fostex. I was a bit reluctant to purchase them at first because the M100 had already met my expectations. I ended up buying them, and it turned out that the Purple Hearts beat the M100 for me. So if anyone is looking to experience a good amount of bass through their headphones while they play video games, or listen to some EDM music. I highly recommend the Purple Hearts (If you got the $$$), or the V-Moda M100. They have low Ohms so you can drive them with just a phone. Both of these headphones will provide you with ample amount of bass that will make your listening experience great.

Besides the bass, I ended up buying the LCD 2, and the iFi Micro Black Label. If you are not a fan of the bass, but you enjoy a more neutral tone. The LCD 2 or the Sennheiser 600+ series will fulfill that desire. I have used the LCD 2's for a few months, and they are great at producing neutral sound in genres like rock, classical, jazz, and more. I am not really good at describing the sound they produce, but I have had no complaints while using it. I am more about the feel of the music (Through bass, mostly) than about keeping the sounds neutral. In regards to the Sennheiser 600+, I have not had the chance to test the Sennheiser 6XX yet (It arrives in December, Massdrop website usually has them for $200), but I have heard praise for their neutral tone by many people. Lastly, the iFi Micro Black Label is a great DAC/AMP combination that has a lot of useful features such as a Crossfeed switch and an XBass switch. Both of these switches have given me different ways to listen to music such as an old song that was recorded in mono. I can use the crossfeed feature to enhance it. And if a song lacks the bass, I can enable the XBass feature to enhance it. It's been a very good purchase that I expect to last me a long time because it is also portable. Before using the Black Label, I was using the Objective 2 DAC/AMP combination for a few years. It worked out really well for me. It was able to drive pretty much anything I threw at it so if you're looking for a good DAC/AMP, the Objective 2 can fulfill that need. I hope that my impressions help someone make the decision to purchase one of these headphones, or a DAC/AMP setup if they were wondering which one to purchase.

leng jai · Nov 26, 2017

Yeah, the Massdrop Fostex headphones are very good value if you're looking for a woody with nice bass. I've tried both the standard brown and Purplehearts and they are both great. End up returning them though since I can't stand closed headphones anymore after using the HD800s for so long.

Tratorn · Nov 26, 2017

Hi AudioERA,

I don't have any clues about soundbars but would like to enhance the soundexperience of my new LG 55B7 that is coming next week. I'm not audiophile, so I don't want to spend several hundred of Euros. I just want a good sound experience (since the normal sound of the TV will probably not that great).

Amazon.de has a decent discount on the Sony HT-XT2 sounddeck (167€ and I've an additional 10€ voucher) for the next 12 hours and it seems to get pretty good user reviews (not from everyone, but opinions naturally differ). Normal price here is 220-230€ for that thing.
So, is that a good choice or are there much better options for that price / in the 200€ price range? And it's not just for gaming, I'd like to enhance both my watching and gaming experience.

I'm living in germany btw. if that's something that has to be considered.

Thanks in advance for any help. :)

Neo0mj · Nov 27, 2017

So I'm trying to decide between the Bose QuietComfort 25 and the beyerdynamic DT 770 PRO 80 Ohm. No amplifier or DAC on me if that helps.

Glenn Gould · Nov 27, 2017

ronco2000 said:
Good deal, but you have to wait 4 months for delivery. Just get the HD600, which is better IMHO.

I've never really been a fan of the HD 600, in particular for gaming which is what is being discussed here due to the compromised sound stage of the HD 600s which really reduces your ability position in game audio. The HD 600s also seemed to be designed for pop music which I don't listen too so they wouldn't be a great deal of use to me.

The HD 600s are obviously a decent headphone and this range of headphones are quite likely the most important range of headphones over the past few decades, for a series that's been going for almost 25 years and often been considered the cream of the crop throughout those 25 years you can't really go wrong with any of them, even though they all have their own strengths and weaknesses.

Of course, you could well order HD 650s today and have them delivered tomorrow but the HD 6XXs are actually manufactured for you and individually numbered after MassDrop place the order so that does take longer that just buying a headphone thats already on a shelf somewhere. When I bought mine I was one of the first to order so I did receive mine a couple of months before they were due to be delivered.

Jeremiah · Nov 27, 2017

Darkmaigle said:
Looking for a high quality pair of in ear headphones. I'd be using them for rhythm games on switch/Vita/PS4. I also listen to a lot of drum n bass.

What's your budget?

Tratorn said:
Hi AudioERA,

I don't have any clues about soundbars but would like to enhance the soundexperience of my new LG 55B7 that is coming next week. I'm not audiophile, so I don't want to spend several hundred of Euros. I just want a good sound experience (since the normal sound of the TV will probably not that great).

Amazon.de has a decent discount on the Sony HT-XT2 sounddeck (167€ and I've an additional 10€ voucher) for the next 12 hours and it seems to get pretty good user reviews (not from everyone, but opinions naturally differ). Normal price here is 220-230€ for that thing.
So, is that a good choice or are there much better options for that price / in the 200€ price range? And it's not just for gaming, I'd like to enhance both my watching and gaming experience.

I'm living in germany btw. if that's something that has to be considered.

Thanks in advance for any help. :)

Did you end up buying it?

Neo0mj said:
So I'm trying to decide between the Bose QuietComfort 25 and the beyerdynamic DT 770 PRO 80 Ohm. No amplifier or DAC on me if that helps.

I vote Bose... functions well for travel/on the go use.

SOLDIER · Nov 27, 2017

Can anyone help me out? I received my Logitech G933 to use with my Xbox One X. Everything works except audio chat. I've tried all sorts of things but it doesn't appear to be picking up my voice.

According to Xbox, the easiest way to test if your mic is working is to start a Party chat, and your gamerpic's ring will light up every time you speak.

The only time the ring pops up is when I'm muting and un-muting the mic.

Deleted member 9135 · Nov 27, 2017

Do we know of any wireless headsets that work on Nintendo Switch, Xbox One X and PS4?

Deleted member 9135 · Nov 27, 2017

Oops nvm

Pizzamigo · Nov 27, 2017

SOLDIER said:
Can anyone help me out? I received my Logitech G933 to use with my Xbox One X. Everything works except audio chat. I've tried all sorts of things but it doesn't appear to be picking up my voice.

According to Xbox, the easiest way to test if your mic is working is to start a Party chat, and your gamerpic's ring will light up every time you speak.

The only time the ring pops up is when I'm muting and un-muting the mic.

Looked up the Logitech FAQ, but even though you're plugged into the headset with the 3.5mm cable the headset has to be on Wireless ON mode whatever that means (I don't own them) assuming you're using the boom mic.

According to the FAQ
"Boom microphone is only available in Wireless On mode. Inline mic is available in both modes."

Dunno if this helps or not!

SOLDIER · Nov 27, 2017

aka Bueno said:
Looked up the Logitech FAQ, but even though you're plugged into the headset with the 3.5mm cable the headset has to be on Wireless ON mode whatever that means (I don't own them) assuming you're using the boom mic.

According to the FAQ
"Boom microphone is only available in Wireless On mode. Inline mic is available in both modes."

Dunno if this helps or not!

It doesn't, because I've tried both ways. Unless it turns out I am transmitting voice, but there's no way to truly know unless I'm speaking to another human being.

Furthermore, the Amazon page says that the G933 doesn't actually have surround on the Xbox One? That can't be right, can it?

Pizzamigo · Nov 27, 2017

SOLDIER said:
It doesn't, because I've tried both ways. Unless it turns out I am transmitting voice, but there's no way to truly know unless I'm speaking to another human being.

Furthermore, the Amazon page says that the G933 doesn't actually have surround on the Xbox One? That can't be right, can it?

Those headphones, like most, are stereo headphones. The surround sound for these comes from software, for your set you need the Logitech software to enable the virtual surround sound modes on PC.

You can't use the Logitech software on Xbox obviously, so it will just output stereo unless you use Xbox's built in Windows Sonic or purchase Dolby Atmos For Headphones to turn stereo into virtual surround sound.

SOLDIER · Nov 27, 2017

aka Bueno said:
Those headphones, like most, are stereo headphones. The surround sound for these comes from software, for your set you need the Logitech software to enable the virtual surround sound modes on PC.

You can't use the Logitech software on Xbox obviously, so it will just output stereo unless you use Xbox's built in Windows Sonic or purchase Dolby Atmos For Headphones to turn stereo into virtual surround sound.

Is that going to be the case for any headset I use? None of them can actually produce surround, just virtual?

Is that the case with the PS4 Gold Headset? Been using those for ages, and while I couldn't tell you the difference between "real" surround sound and that headset, it gets the job done.

I'm not sure now what to do about the G933. It sounded great from what I heard, but if voice chat won't work without spending another $20, and there are alternatives that do work without the adapter, then those should be the ones I use.

Pizzamigo · Nov 27, 2017

SOLDIER said:
Is that going to be the case for any headset I use? None of them can actually produce surround, just virtual?

Is that the case with the PS4 Gold Headset? Been using those for ages, and while I couldn't tell you the difference between "real" surround sound and that headset, it gets the job done.

I'm not sure now what to do about the G933. It sounded great from what I heard, but if voice chat won't work without spending another $20, and there are alternatives that do work without the adapter, then those should be the ones I use.

Yep, they're all mostly virtual surround sound. And they work really really well. There's like one or two gimmicky headsets that tried to fit 7 drivers (speakers) but they're terrible. Theres a reason everyone sticks to 2 drivers and uses virtual surround, cause it's very convincing and works far better than having more (but tiny and crappier) drivers crammed in a pair of headset cans.

I don't know what's wrong with your setup on XB1 though and chat not working. What $20 adapter are you talking about? You shouldn't need any adapters to get this working on the XB1X controller.

SOLDIER · Nov 27, 2017

aka Bueno said:
Yep, they're all mostly virtual surround sound. And they work really really well.

I don't know what's wrong with your setup on XB1 though and chat not working. What $20 adapter are you talking about? You shouldn't need any adapters to get this working on the XB1X controller.

This thing: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IAVDOS6/?tag=era0f0-20

I was under the impression it was no longer needed with current versions of the controller and you could just use the 3.5m cable.

Only way I'll know for sure is if I can test it out with someone else in party chat or something.

Pizzamigo · Nov 27, 2017

SOLDIER said:
This thing: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IAVDOS6/?tag=era0f0-20

I was under the impression it was no longer needed with current versions of the controller and you could just use the 3.5m cable.

Only way I'll know for sure is if I can test it out with someone else in party chat or something.

You don't need that adapter, that's for older controllers and stuff.

You can test by using Cortana voice commands on the dashboard or go into a message and use the voice to text feature (have to press one of the buttons, it shows you which button on the virtual keyboard) to translate your voice into text and see if it's workig.

nib95 · Nov 27, 2017

Anyone needing a pair of immense value audiophile headphones need not look further than these here. $200 Sennheiser HDXX. They're essentially a Massdrop modified version of the HD650's.

There are 3 days left on Massdrop to pick them up.

https://www.massdrop.com/buy/massdrop-sennheiser-hd6xx

I no longer use them myself, but I can vouch for how fantastic they sound compared to cans of any price point really.
If you don't mind spending a bit more and fancy something with a touch more micro detailing, articulation and soundstage, but at the cost of slightly less bass, a used pair of Beyerdynamic T1.1's can also still be had for a bargain.

My personal main gaming and general music listening headphones are the Sony MDR-Z1R's, but I still have my Sennheiser HD800S and Beyerdynamic T1.1's too.

Jeremiah · Nov 27, 2017

nib95 said:
Anyone needing a pair of immense value audiophile headphones need not look further than these here. $200 Sennheiser HDXX. They're essentially a Massdrop modified version of the HD650's.

There are 3 days left on Massdrop to pick them up.

https://www.massdrop.com/buy/massdrop-sennheiser-hd6xx

I no longer use them myself, but I can vouch for how fantastic they sound compared to cans of any price point really.
If you don't mind spending a bit more and fancy something with a touch more micro detailing, articulation and soundstage, but at the cost of slightly less bass, a used pair of Beyerdynamic T1.1's can also still be had for a bargain.

My personal main gaming and general music listening headphones are the Sony MDR-Z1R's, but I still have my Sennheiser HD800S and Beyerdynamic T1.1's too.

I've never sampled the MDR-Z1R. May i ask you to share your thoughts on it vs the HD 800?

wihio · Nov 27, 2017

I use HD6XX's from the first Massdrop and they are awesome. I will say that if you decide to go this way I highly recommend pairing them with the Bottlehead Crack amp. They sound phenomenal together and the satisfaction you will get from actually building your own tube amp really seals the deal. Read around the internet and you will find that many people specifically recommend this combo, as if they are built for each other. The other great thing about this setup is that you can tweak and mod the setup quite a bit (roll tubes, speedball upgrade, etc) as time goes by. After 1 year of listening to the Crack in its stock configuration I am about to install the Speedball upgrade.

V07 · Nov 27, 2017

Looking for a good soundbar for my television. Willing to spend at least $200 for one. My Samsung soundbar keeps acting up and cutting off the sound.

nib95 · Nov 27, 2017

Gn0mercy said:
I've never sampled the MDR-Z1R. May i ask you to share your thoughts on it vs the HD 800?

They're my favourite cans.

Essentially they sound like a HD800/S with more bass impact and presence (especially sub-bass), whilst still retaining magnificent imaging, detail retrieval and articulation. They do however sacrifice a bit of the HD800's massive soundstage and they are slightly warmer sounding and less fatiguing overall.

In terms of tonality and accuracy of instruments, vocals etc, I once again prefer them. They're just overall more atmospheric, engaging and fun sounding than the HD800's, and unlike the LCD-2/3's, they're not so warm that imaging, detailing or soundstage is compromised on, instead, for me they're a near perfect balance.

The HD800 comparatively sound tonally a tad too cold and articulate, and for many genres of music, I find the soundstage to actually be a bit artificially large and splayed out. The HD800 sound really crisp and revealing, but lack bass impact and presence, and just don't always get the tonal balance quite right for my personal tastes.

One other huge advantage of the MDR-Z1R's is that they sound as good as they do whilst being closed cans. I actually use them in bed next to my wife whilst she sleeps, and unlike with my other open or semi-open cans, I get no complaints. They have excellent sound isolation.

Regarding gaming, here are some impressions I posted comparing the headphones with games on another forum.

nib95 said:
MDR-Z1R's for gaming.

I have also decided to use the Z1R's as my primary gaming can, despite owning the HD800 and T1's. You'd think the German cans would be better for gaming because they're very articulate and spacious, which is great for the placing and positioning of enemies in shooters and so on, but I find the Z1R's deal with specific textures and nuances a little more realistically, and authentically. For example, I'm playing a lot of Forza Horizon 3 at the moment, and have dabbled in a bit of Battlefield 1 as well, and whilst the German cans do offer that super layered soundstage and separation, dramatic events and moments just don't have quite the same impact and enjoyment as they do with the Z1R's. To be more specific...

In Forza Horizon 3, there are certain vehicle engine notes, low end burbles, gargles and whines etc from V8's, V12's, turbo dump valves, down-shifts, and so on, that just sound that much more rich and textured on the Z1R's. On the HD800 they're a bit too thin and splayed out, with the T1's its an improvement, but now and again you can still miss that sub bass richness and drama.

For those that have played the game, you'll know that when you drive to one of the Festival camp locations, the way the music sounds essentially changes, with filters mimicking that of distant festival celebrations or concert dynamics. You get this constant low-end murmur of bass and vibrations as if some huge speakers in the distance were bellowing out the music to mass crowds. With the T1's and HD800's, this sounds ever so slightly dull. Essentially the lack of sub bass quantity, especially super low, makes the effect sound just a hair flat and anticlimactic. With the Z1R's it's a completely different story. The moment you enter a Festival camp, you feel this thunderous low end pulsing, that absolutely lets you know there's a major festival going on, and partying happening all around the camp. You literally feel it.

With Battlefield 1, it's a similar sort of thing with major explosions and weapon sounds. You really feel that added oomph that ends up making a fairly tangible difference to the overall experience. War ends up sounding that much more threatening, thunderous and dangerous.

nib95 said:
So I'm playing ABZU. Breathtaking game and a really sumptuous testing ground for headphones.

Compared all my cans again multiple times just for kicks.

---

HD800 - A bit too treble emphasised for my liking. Minute sounds are exaggerated and zingy, and detract somewhat from the more ambient or subtle sounds. It's great that you can hear every little detail since its all really quite present, but it sort of sounds like it's also been somewhat artificially extracted to the forefront, in order to garner more attention, and as a result the tonal balance isn't quite right. It doesn't sound honest or realistic enough.

---

HD800S - Better than above. Things just toned down a touch, but certain sounds to me still sound over cooked. Splashes and dives have a snap sharpness to them that feels more akin to a whipping sensation than that of a weighty diver or dolphin smashing in to or through water or waves at high speed. There's a great sense of space and air to everything, which adds clarity, but also makes things sound a touch sterile sounding, almost as though you're swimming through the air rather than under water. Tonal balance is closer, but for this game at least, still lacking a touch of weight or emotion.

---

T1.1 - Tonal balance is more honest and realistic sounding than above. Ambient sounds share attention or space with everything else a little more sensibly, with nothing standing out as over emphasised. Splashes etc sound more realistic too, if just a hint on the quiet or undramatic side (ever so slightly more recessed mids?). Overall this still offers an airy, spacious sound, but with just a touch more warmth and smoothness.

---

Z1R - This is some sort of half way house between the T1.1 and HD800S in terms of micro details and separation or pronunciation of individual sounds. Oddly, certain effects like certain fishes dashing around, or you speed breaching through the water, or diving in to it from a height, are a hair louder than they are with the T1.1's (mids or upper mids?), but at the same time they're not as sharp sounding as with the Sennheisers, and instead sound the most realistic of the lot. There's intricacy to these sounds, but some more body and weight at the same time too. Like it genuinely feels like a human is smashing through the water. You feel it just a little more.

Things still sound spacious too, but warmer than even the T1.1's. It now feels more like you actually are under water. There's a moodiness and atmosphere to how its all presented, but the tonal balance, similar to the T1.1's, is excellent, perhaps the best out of the lot. It still doesn't sound congested, since the micro details are all there, just sitting on top of a moodier foundation.

Lastly, when the great white shark jump scares the hell out of you, usually by eating one of your guide bots, the sudden snap, slam, crunch or explosion that immediately follows, sounds more threatening and scary with the the Z1R's compared to the others. The bass quantity seems to add a sense of drama to these moments, that isn't quite as threatening with the other headphones.

The only downside is on a couple of levels, the background bass on some loud persistent percussion type sounds can be a bit too heavy.

---

Anyway, in order of preference of sound with ABZU (PS4 Pro), I'd rank them Z1R > T1.1 > HD800S > HD800.

If however I fancied a slightly airier presentation instead of a more musical or atmospheric one, whilst maintaining a realistic overall total balance, I might switch to the T1.1 as top pick.

This was not my order of testing, plus I tested each headphone multiple times, reloading certain levels, roughly all volume matched.

I should add that I'm not one of those flavour of the month type headphone buyers either, nor do I believe in snake oil cable or even extreme high-end amp/DAC malarky, and I've tested a huge number of super high-end premium goods. The T1.1's were my previously most used and favourite cans for several years, despite owning or using cans like the HD800, HD800S, LCD-X, LCD-XC, LCD-2, LCD-3, T1 2nd Generation, K812 etc.

That said, I have to stress, I do NOT recommend the MDR-Z1R to anyone except those who have a lot of spare expenditure (I managed to get them considerably cheaper than they sell for today, so I was lucky). High-end audio has extreme diminishing returns and extremely poor value proposition, so don't expect the MDR-Z1R, or any super high-end headphone to sound remarkably better than the top premium $200-$500 headphones. If however you have lots of spare cash, and you want something that gives you that remaining 10-20% of pleasure and sonic bliss, go for it. Also as always, bare in mind audio is subjective, so what works or sounds right to me, might not work or sound right to you.

SOLDIER · Nov 27, 2017

aka Bueno said:
You don't need that adapter, that's for older controllers and stuff.

You can test by using Cortana voice commands on the dashboard or go into a message and use the voice to text feature (have to press one of the buttons, it shows you which button on the virtual keyboard) to translate your voice into text and see if it's workig.

Couldn't figure out how to do this yet, but I did just send out a message that was a recorded voice and hit the "transcribe" button. It was able to transcribe the voice recording to text, so I think it is picking up my voice.

I'm not sure why I can't listen back to my own voice recordings though, unless it's supposed to be that way? Until I can have a chat with someone in-person, I won't know for sure.

The headset also works with PS4 wirelessly, and auto-mutes the system from my receiver's end. Tried plugging it to the USB port on the Switch, but strangely enough the Switch will freeze unless I unplug the USB receiver. Weird.

FuturaBold · Nov 27, 2017

Ive been playing Rise of the Tomb Raider with Atmos Headphones and my Audio Technica AD700x. IT SOUNDS GLORIOUS! Should hold me over until i get a proper Atmos system build next year.

MistaTwo · Nov 27, 2017

I'm not a huge audiophile, but I absolutely cannot live without some sort of barebones 5.1 system at least.
I convinced my parents to buy a crappy all-in-one Sony system from Best Buy when I was in high school and took that with me to college.
The sound quality deteriorated at an astonishing rate, but it was still better than stereo!

When I got my first 'real' paycheck about 10 years ago, one of the first things I bought along was a surround sound system. I was still using a 21" monitory
and decided to buy a 5.1 system over a new HD TV. I ended up buying a TV from a friend who was moving soon after anyway.

That first system I bought was a fairly nice Denon Amp/5.1 combo system that set me back about $450-500 bucks.
It actually lasted until very recently, and I am pretty sure one of the capacitors when bad inside the amp or something.
It started making a buzzing noise that sounded like really bad ground loop (which ended up not being the issue after eliminating as many factors as I could).

I had just gotten a bonus from my company, so the timing was good and I ended up buying a 'used' (bought but never used) Sony HT-SS370 system.
It's a bit out-dated now, but was an improvement over my last one by quite a bit, especially in the convenience factor as I used to just have 3 optical ports to run everything through,
and the new Amp has HDMI pass-through and such.

I need to get a new pair of 5.1 headphones sometime in the near future. I have a pair of the Sony PS4 headphones from years ago, but they were one of the
models known for kind of weak build quality and are almost in pieces at this point. They still technically work, but the plastic above the cups is busted so they won't sit right
unless I rig them up with some tape or something. They are too far gone to bother though.

FastRedPonyCar · Nov 28, 2017

AudioEra Brahs, I'm considering grabbing either a 930E or C7P 4K TV to go with my X1X but need to upgrade either my receiver or get a good sound bar that can do the whole HDCP 2.2 passthrough.

I've currently got an old Denon AVR1612 receiver, a Bic Acoustech (HSU engineered) PL200 subwoofer, KEF center channel, OOOOLD Bose 301 series II bookshelf speakers (they still sound pretty good) and Klipsch promedia satellite speakers for rear.

I'm torn between going sound bar that I can hook my sub up to or just getting a new receiver (something like the Denon AVRS930H) and something like a pair of the Pioneer SP-EBS73 bookshelf speakers.

I run my Xbone, PS4 pro and switch into the receiver so 3 inputs are all that's needed for now but I may add a 4K dish network Joey unit later on.

I'm leaning towards the receiver and new bookshelf speakers because of the flexibility to use mostly what I already have invested money into but also I don't HAVE to buy those bookshelf speakers or any speakers right now to get the benefits of good surround sound with the 4K HDR experience.

If you guys really do think that a sound bar would be the best route, is there a really good sound bar that I can hook my own sub up to?

Tratorn · Nov 28, 2017

Gn0mercy said:
Did you end up buying it?

Yes, still not sure if it was a decent choice though, any opinion about it? :)

In worst case I have to return it if I don't like it or someone knows a better option in a similiar price range, so I just jumped in before the discount ended.

jsnepo · Nov 28, 2017

Anyone has feedback on the Sony MDR-DS6500? I plan on getting this to get wireless headphones for all my game consoles through HDMI passthrough. Since it also supports analog input, I can probably use this for my retro consoles too.

Jeremiah · Nov 28, 2017

nib95 said:
They're my favourite cans.

Essentially they sound like a HD800/S with more bass impact and presence (especially sub-bass), whilst still retaining magnificent imaging, detail retrieval and articulation. They do however sacrifice a bit of the HD800's massive soundstage and they are slightly warmer sounding and less fatiguing overall.

In terms of tonality and accuracy of instruments, vocals etc, I once again prefer them. They're just overall more atmospheric, engaging and fun sounding than the HD800's, and unlike the LCD-2/3's, they're not so warm that imaging, detailing or soundstage is compromised on, instead, for me they're a near perfect balance.

The HD800 comparatively sound tonally a tad too cold and articulate, and for many genres of music, I find the soundstage to actually be a bit artificially large and splayed out. The HD800 sound really crisp and revealing, but lack bass impact and presence, and just don't always get the tonal balance quite right for my personal tastes.

One other huge advantage of the MDR-Z1R's is that they sound as good as they do whilst being closed cans. I actually use them in bed next to my wife whilst she sleeps, and unlike with my other open or semi-open cans, I get no complaints. They have excellent sound isolation.

Regarding gaming, here are some impressions I posted comparing the headphones with games on another forum.

I should add that I'm not one of those flavour of the month type headphone buyers either, nor do I believe in snake oil cable or even extreme high-end amp/DAC malarky, and I've tested a huge number of super high-end premium goods. The T1.1's were my previously most used and favourite cans for several years, despite owning or using cans like the HD800, HD800S, LCD-X, LCD-XC, LCD-2, LCD-3, T1 2nd Generation, K812 etc.

That said, I have to stress, I do NOT recommend the MDR-Z1R to anyone except those who have a lot of spare expenditure (I managed to get them considerably cheaper than they sell for today, so I was lucky). High-end audio has extreme diminishing returns and extremely poor value proposition, so don't expect the MDR-Z1R, or any super high-end headphone to sound remarkably better than the top premium $200-$500 headphones. If however you have lots of spare cash, and you want something that gives you that remaining 10-20% of pleasure and sonic bliss, go for it. Also as always, bare in mind audio is subjective, so what works or sounds right to me, might not work or sound right to you.

Thanks a lot for the detailed response mate -- i'll definitely be sampling the Z1R in the near future. What are your thoughts on comfort? I recently had a Focal Utopia but ultimately decided to sell it. The clamp pressure was a bit too much and comfort was good but not great.
With that being said, it's the best sounding headphones i've ever heard in my life, surpassing even the Abyss. Wish it was more comfortable.

Tratorn said:
Yes, still not sure if it was a decent choice though, any opinion about it? :)

In worst case I have to return it if I don't like it or someone knows a better option in a similiar price range, so I just jumped in before the discount ended.

Haha no opinion. My friend is looking at the exact model and thought i'd ask to get how you like it :)

guitarguy316 · Nov 28, 2017

To use Atmos simulation (I bought the app on Xbox one x), can you plug straight into conroller? Using AT mx50

Soulstoner · Nov 28, 2017

guitarguy316 said:
To use Atmos simulation (I bought the app on Xbox one x), can you plug straight into conroller? Using AT mx50

Yes.

StereoVSN · Nov 28, 2017

Thank you for the pointer to Massdrop HD6XX headphone group buy. That likes like a great deal for amazing headphones for the price so I jumped in. I currently have a pair of audio technica ath-m50x cans and they are pretty great but I wanted to spice those up a bit and HD6XX for $200 fit the bill.

Can anyone recommend a good DAC for $200 or under? Preferably portable.

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