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LL_Decitrig

User-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,334
Sunderland
Expected the Brexit bus for some reason, then thought, no it must be the bus from Planet of the Dead.

I'm actually quite excited by the colour of the bus. This looks as if it might be a story about the civil rights struggle in the United States. Well written historical episodes are rare as hens' teeth in modern Who. I think Chris Chibnall of all people could pull this off.
 

Paradox

Member
Oct 28, 2017
684
Yeah, that's right. Eight was in one story of the first set, and then the second featured episodes with River and Seven, then River and Six, and then the three of them together. She was also in three of the Eighth Doctor Doom Coalition sets.

Hearing Alex Kingston and Tom Baker together in the fourth series of Diary is going to be amazing.

The idea of the 4th Doctor and River together has always been nothing but pure filth in my mind. Innuendos for days. And think of all that hair.
 

EvilRedEye

Member
Oct 29, 2017
747
Will the First Doctor threaten to spank River's bottom when it gets to that set, that is the question.
 
OP
OP
Dwebble

Dwebble

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,627
Ooh, that's exciting. Big Finish's Torchwood stuff is some of their finest work.

Arthur Darvill into the bargain as well! Shackle him in that studio until you can lure Smith and Gillan in, Big Finish.
 

APZonerunner

Features Editor at VG247.com
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
1,731
England
Did the Torchwood audios ever wrap the cliffhanger from the end of Miracle Day?

I don't think so, though I think some of the Big Finish stories have been post Miracle Day. The Torchwood stuff has truly been all over the shop though - there's been stuff with Jack alone, stuff with Jack and Yvonne (the lady from Army of Ghosts!), stuff in between series, stuff after, etc.
 

EvilRedEye

Member
Oct 29, 2017
747
One of their current series is the authorised Series 5. I get the impression RTD has steered other creators away from the Miracle Day characters etc. since.
 

obin_gam

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,032
Sollefteå, Sweden
Bought this one this weekend
Doctor-Who-Series-2-Steelbook-Outside.jpeg


God I miss Tennants seasons. Sure, they look like cheap television, but they were so much fun and camp and just pure joy.
I have no problems with Smiths and Capaldis seasons (except for season 6...) but they lost a bit of needed camp when RTD left :)
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,623
That artwork is really nice. Even if the tins don't sell well, I hope they commission art for every other season anyway, and just have it live online somewhere.

Wrapped up the penultimate story of my (abridged) Troughton run last week. What a shame so many of his episodes have been lost, I'm already nearly at the end with him.

The Invasion
At eight episodes, this is the longest Doctor Who serial yet, but the pacing is actually pretty fine for the most part. While it probably could have stood to lose two episodes, I think the plot unfolds at a quicker pace here than it does in some four- or six-parters I've seen. A big reason why, I think, is it's essentially structured as two four-parters: one more focused on establishing Vaughn and his organization (plus reintroducing the Brigadier, who is now actually a brigadier general, and UNIT) and the second focused on revealing the Cybermen, and their role in the story. The Cybermen here are pretty lame -- they've traded the creepy skin suits for dumb-looking block heads, and lost the singsong voice for a really generic robotic drone. On the other hand, Vaughn is an incredible villain! His outbursts and the way he shits on his right-hand man Packer are hilarious, but he also seems genuinely threatening at times. Other than being a little longer than necessary, my only other main issue with this story is that it ends really abruptly, so much so that I didn't even realize
Vaughn was supposed to have been dead
until like 10 minutes later when he still hadn't resurfaced.

As far as Troughton Cybermen stories go, I'd squeeze this one in between The Tomb of the Cybermen and The Moonbase. Overall, one of the stronger Troughton serials.
 

Paradox

Member
Oct 28, 2017
684
The artist has done a ton of other Doctor Who art - a line of prints and comic book covers off the top of my head.
You might be thinking of Alice X Zhang? She does the comic book covers and has done some of the steelbook cases, whereas the S1 and 2 artwork is Lee Binding who did the S7 movie posters and other promo stuff. Admittedly very similar. Although Alice X Zhang's stuff is way nicer in my opinion. Nothing tops the S9 artwork:

 

APZonerunner

Features Editor at VG247.com
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
1,731
England
Zygons! I wonder if we will get to see Osgood and Kate again[/spoiler[

Not so sure that is definitely what they're suggesting it is, to be honest.

I mean, that is very much a Zygon-esque shape, but that silhouette could also easily belong to a Judoon, for instance, or any other really top-heavy alien. Hmmm. I hope it is a returning alien, though.
 

M.Bluth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,261
Actually, looking closer it might be Judoon, I'm not sure
Definitely not a Zygon, if it's a returning alien, the pose is almost certainly a Judoon... Next down, potentially Sontarans, though seem a bit large for that, unless they're making them taller than they've been in NuWho so far
 

EvilChameleon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,793
Ohio
Got my copy of Doctor Who Magazine in the mail. Another thing you friendly folks over the pond do better than us. This is an actual magazine. Has heft and weight.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,623
And that's a wrap on Troughton.

The War Games
This is one hell of a finale, which is fitting because it serves as the end of three eras: the end of Patrick Troughton's run as the Second Doctor; the end of 1960s Doctor Who; and, the end of Doctor Who in black and white. And, unlike The Tenth Planet, which felt like a story that had to be reworked in late stages to accommodate William Hartnell's exit from the show, this one feels like it was actually designed from the start as Troughton's swan song. That might be why they gave the story 10 episodes to unfold, making it the show's longest serial.

I wrote in my review of The Invasion, which was also pretty long, that while it probably could've stood to lose one or two episodes, it generally felt paced pretty well given the amount of story it contained and how it was structured. I feel the same way about The War Games too -- this serial would have probably worked just as well at seven or eight parts, which would've certainly help trim down the "Doctor and friends get captured, escape, get captured again" padding that occurred basically every other episode. But as is, there's so much story packed in here -- from the Doctor, Jamie, and Zoe wandering through a series of famous wars throughout history, to unfolding the mystery of the aliens who arranged this plot and why, to the very first introduction of the Time Lords and their role -- that it does feel like it moves quicker and has more to do than a lot of four- or six-parters up to this point have.

I'm not going to get too into the weeds on the story, but did want to call out three things I really liked about this story:
  • The Time Lords are actually kind of menacing. Every other time I've seen them, they've been pompous, incompetent clowns in really stupid costumes, impossible to take seriously. Here? They're pretty intimidating; while not literally omnipotent, they certainly give off that impression, and mete out harsh punishments with such a cold, detached manner. This is a hell of a first impression for the Doctor's people, and even though they're never this intimidating ever again, knowing how lame they become later on surprisingly doesn't take away anything about their appearance here.
  • The War Chief. What an awesome villain. I was genuinely hooked over how his background and role into the war games plot unfolded over the last few episodes. Great performance too. One particular highlight: the moment he and the Doctor first recognize each other, where both actors capture this perfect "Oh shit" moment in their eyes, realizing who the other one is and what that means for them. Troughton's "RUN!" reaction to it is perfect.
  • Speaking of which, this has to be Troughton's best performance of the show. He runs the gamut of joy and humor to intensity and anger and actual fear, sometimes within the span of a single scene, and does it effortlessly. What a fantastic Doctor. That aforementioned recognition scene with the War Chief is one highlight, but Troughton has a ton of them in the last three episodes, not the least of which is his trial under the Time Lords and the reaction to his punishment. Even knowing what was going to happen to him, the way the ending plays out is still kind of dark and haunting.
    The last we see of Troughton, he's spiraling into the abyss, screaming "NO!", as his body changes against his will.
    For what's supposed to be a kid's show, that's pretty fucked up!
Despite some heavy padding, The War Games is a pretty strong ending to Troughton's run as the Doctor -- and this whole era of the show itself -- with the final three episodes in particular being among the series' best.

And for what it's worth -- a ranking of the Troughton episodes I've seen:
The Mind Robber
The Tomb of the Cybermen
The War Games
The Invasion
The Moonbase
The Web of Fear
The Enemy of the World
 

Paradox

Member
Oct 28, 2017
684
I watched The War Games for the first time recently and was amazed how 'modern' it feels in a lot of the elements. By which I mean this could have feasibly been a Big Finish type story written in recent times to fit into that era. You forget how cohesive this 55 year old show sometimes is - its the first appearance of the Time Lords and yet they're not drastically different from something like Hell Bent (in fact, thinking about, Heaven Sent has a lot of parallels to The War Games). The idea of a collection of battles from different time zones placed next to each other for nefarious means feels very new series. And as you say, the Time Lords come across as a genuine threat. A lot of Classic Who portrays them as tedious bureaucrats that the Doctor is dragged down by, but here they're terrifying because they're just doing their job. They're essentially the Time Police coming to mop up a crime and the Doctor happens to be a part of it. I'd really recommend it to anyone looking to get into black-and-white Who, or to get a taste of how regenerations were handled for the first few times.
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,468
On the subject of Big Finish, and dredging up a post from some time ago:

And finally, in terms of acquiring Big Finish audio, the best bet to get a lot of BF cheaply is to keep an eye on Humble Bundle; they've had two (if I remember correctly) bundles that included a wodge of BF content. However, of course, you're at the mercy of their release schedule there. An alternative is to keep an ear on BBC Radio 4 Extra, who will occasionally broadcast Big Finish audios. There's none broadcasting at the moment - looks like the most recent ones listed there were some of the first series of the Lost Stories line back in July. Based on previous years, they usually broadcast something Doctor Who over the winter, although it's not always Big Finish - sometimes there's some BBC Audio productions instead.

And yes, they've started doing so again, starting last weekend (so still available on iPlayer); they're doing the first of their Tom Baker ones. Based on the schedule so far (note that iPlayer links in the future will only lead to placeholder pages for now)

20th Jan: 1.1: Destination Nerva (iPlayer)
27th Jan: 1.2: The Renaissance Man (iPlayer)
3rd Feb: 1.3: The Wrath of the Iceni ( iPlayer)

Schedules beyond that haven't yet gone up on the website, but I daresay they'll run at least most of the series (occasionally when R4Extra has broadcast BF, they've dropped an episode here and there. But on the bright side, that's why I've still never heard Minuet in Hell)

Radio iPlayer might work outside the UK, not sure of the exact terms for that one; it may depend on the licensing for individual broadcasts. Would be interested to hear if it works for US folks.

If they do keep going, I gather that 1.4 is a Dalek episode, and 1.5 and 1.6 are joined together (dunno if that means a two-parter, or linked stories)

10th Feb? : 1.4: Energy of the Daleks
17th Feb? : 1.5: Trail of the White Worm
24th Feb? : 1.6: The Oseidon Adventure
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,468
Big Finish is having a warehouse clearance at the moment with some Who spin-offs in there. It's mostly old tat but most things are 99p so... You have to buy the physical CD because it's warehouse clearance but the download versions have shown up in my account.

Anyone got any opinions about the SJS series? I've got the other BF titles through various Humble Bundles in the past, by the looks of things (Dalek Empire was in "Humble Audiobook Bundle: Doctor Who" at Christmas 2014, Cyberman was in "Humble Audiobook Bundle: Worlds of Doctor Who" in Christmas 2015, "I, Davros" was in "Humble Audiobook Bundle: Doctor Who & Torchwood presented by Big Finish!" in March 2017), but that one doesn't seem to have appeared.
 

EvilRedEye

Member
Oct 29, 2017
747
One of them doesn't have download rights yet - but it's just sold out in the clearance sale so you've got no way to legally access it. I guess if they sort the rights out they might Humble Bundle it in the future.
 
OP
OP
Dwebble

Dwebble

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,627
Twice Upon a Time ratings update- it gained 0.36 million in the +28 figures, leaving it at a final total of 8.28 million- infuriatingly, that's 0.01 million less than EastEnders got.

Full Christmas Day figures:
Christmas Day (28-Day ratings)
10.38m (+0.81m) - Call the Midwife
9.29m (+0.25m) - Mrs Brown's Boys
8.55m (+0.27m) - Strictly Come Dancing
8.29m (+0.16m) - EastEnders
8.28m (+0.36m) - Doctor Who
7.14m (+0.15m) - Coronation Street
6.60m (+0.64m) - The Highway Rat
6.25m (+0.02m) - The Queen
5.79m (+0.35m) - Victoria
5.19m (+0.07m) - Emmerdale
5.00m (+0.23m) - The Great Christmas Bake Off
4.77m (+0.11m) - 300 Years of French and Saunders
4.32m (+0.07m) - Paul O'Grady: For the Love of Dogs
 

ClivePwned

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,625
Australia

EvilRedEye

Member
Oct 29, 2017
747
I decided to start my classic watch from Pertwee onward and still haven't reached the end of the Third Doctor era yet so this is vaguely good timing for me (if it happens).
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,623
I decided to start my classic watch from Pertwee onward and still haven't reached the end of the Third Doctor era yet so this is vaguely good timing for me (if it happens).

Heh, as it so happens, I just got started on the Pertwee phase of my classic watch, too.

I had only seen two Pertwee stories before this -- The Daemons, which I more or less hated, and The Three Doctors, which I liked more, but mostly for Troughton's inclusion and the way he and Pertwee play off each other. There was a lot of stuff I disliked about both serials, but chief among them was the Third Doctor himself. He just seemed like too much of an asshole to the people around him, particularly in The Daemons, for seemingly no reason. He was unlikable to me in a way that even someone like Capaldi's Doctor, in his meanest moments, never felt to me. So I kicked off Pertwee's run not really looking forward to what I was about to watch -- more eager just to see the fallout from The War Games than watch the Third Doctor himself, really.

Spearhead from Space
But goddammit, this was a fantastic run of episodes. First off, it just *looks* wonderful (well, maybe relative to classic Who standards, but good looking is good looking!). The film look is so much better that it's almost cruel to have to go back to videotape after seeing how great the show looks this way. It's not even just the picture quality, or the use of color - the first time Doctor Who appeared in color -- but even standard production design stuff, like the sets and even the costumes, are all noticeably stronger.

The Brigadier is back, now in what will be a full-time role, and is as charming in his gruff military manner manner as ever. This is also the first appearance of new companion Liz Shaw, who right off the bat proves she can her own against both the Brig and the Doctor, matching wits -- scientifically and rhetorically -- with either one. The burgeoning rapport between the Brig and Liz, and the way the mystery of the Autons unfolds (who are exponentially creepier and more interesting here than whatever RTD was doing in Rose), is so interesting on its own that it doesn't even matter the Doctor does little or nothing in the first two episodes. This is a really excellently paced story, with some solid creep factor going on and lines that feel as sharp as any modern episode's dialogue.

And as much as I had railed on Pertwee's Doctor when I first watched a few of his episodes last year, he comes off as immediately likable and compelling to me here. I'm not sure what changed -- maybe seeing the Second Doctor's end in The War Games, and how the Third Doctor comes into the action here, helps put the chip on his shoulder into better context. Or maybe he'll develop into more of an asshole later on. Or maybe The Daemons was just a poor pick for a first-time Pertwee story. Whatever the case, Pertwee makes the Doctor his own in no time. For me, this ranks just below The Eleventh Hour as one of Doctor Who's best 'new Doctor' stories ever. Fantastic stuff. Whatever sour taste The Daemons and The Three Doctors left in my mouth about the Third Doctor's era has been totally wiped out by this, and I'm really looking forward to seeing more.
 

M.Bluth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,261
Saw earlier on my Google feed that the Mirror is reporting the show might move to Sunday nights.
But IIRC, that seems to be floated around every other year to avoid Strictly, yet it never happens...
 

8bit

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,390
Long form Sunday night drama slot would probably suit Chibnalls vision though, given his recent works.
 

EvilRedEye

Member
Oct 29, 2017
747
Video quality-wise it's downhill from Spearhead From Space as a lot of the early Third Doctor stuff had to have the colour data recovered from Betamax home recordings.