I don't think it was in the script. They sprung it on her, which means she and her family would had to essentially tell the people in power to fuck right off with that shit, which isn't the easiest thing to do in that industry.
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'Stranger Things' Creators Respond to Claims of Verbal "Abuse" By Former Crew Member
- Thread starter ZattMurdock
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I don't think it was in the script. They sprung it on her, which means she and her family would had to essentially tell the people in power to fuck right off with that shit, which isn't the easiest thing to do in that industry.
They might be under an nda.
Yes, even their recollection of the fact makes them sound like complete dicks. The girl was laughing about it, but who knows what was the feeling then. Or if it happened to someone else.
"You were so freaked out that was like: well, I've got to make her do it now!"
What a scumbag.
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So is it a lie or is it just not a big deal?
And then the old "you can't boycott everything" for the trifecta. :lol
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They are already coming forward. Lori Grabowski is a big time Script Supervisor for every single blockbuster production in the USA right now, including Black Panther and Avengers: Inifinity War, and she has come forward. It's just that people keep demanding more "proof" of the abuse, like the word of the people coming forward isn't good enough. In my experience dealing with this kind of thing, all you have is eye witnesses. Here we go, we have an eye witness coming forward AND a victim coming forward. People like to sugarcoat it because "oh it's a tv set, get used to the abuse". FUCK. THAT. SHIT. There's a reason that this people are singling out the Duffer Brothers and not other productions.
More articles are out, so as I noted yesterday, this thread will stay open for more discussion now.
This is a situation that will likely evolve/take shape over time. Please try to avoid dismissing/downplaying accusations, but take care to not vilify anyone immediately.
This is a situation that will likely evolve/take shape over time. Please try to avoid dismissing/downplaying accusations, but take care to not vilify anyone immediately.
The people rushing to defend this because it's "normal" for film and TV sets to be hostile work environment are so gross. Come on. They don't have to be like that at all.
One thing to keep in mind is this woman likely has worked in the industry for years and has probably dealt with what you're describing on plenty of sets and is still calling out the Duffers. It's entirely possible they crossed the line.
User warned: invalidating allegations of verbal abuse. Abusive industrial practices are not immune from criticism.
What abuse, though? That's what I don't get. The people coming forward aren't saying shit. Like what did these guys actually do that was out of line?
From what I've seen, it sounds like they were just huge dicks. Which sucks, but it's simply not worthy of the same level of attention as sexual harassment or assault. Those are accusations that warrant outrage. These don't seem to be.
I'm willing to listen to what the accusers have to say. I'm not willing to burn people alive before the full details come out. I haven't heard enough yet, that's not underplaying, that's literally...you haven't said enough to convince me one way or the other. I agree it's a good thing that victims or potential victims both feel more empowered to come forward about abuse and that the audience is willing to listen and demand action. But I'm also wary of things being taken too far. For example, I don't know how threats of being fired were made - if you did a poor job at something, and your boss gets angry and threatens to fire you...no, I'm not going to consider that abuse right off the bat without more indicating that a line was crossed.
And the kissing thing was so overblown. Nothing there indicated malice to me either, and from the interviews, it was clear that the other kids were the ones pushing for it and teasing the poor girl the whole day, so it seemed like it was more a case of nerves.
And the kissing thing was so overblown. Nothing there indicated malice to me either, and from the interviews, it was clear that the other kids were the ones pushing for it and teasing the poor girl the whole day, so it seemed like it was more a case of nerves.
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Thank you.
And once again, thank you. That's the obvious case here, and the fact that someone like Grabowski is coming forward actually shows how fucking serious this was. They literally don't have nothing to gain from something like this. It's not hard to understand that we are talking about seasoned Hollywood workers here that are coming hard against the Duffer Brothers for a reason. I don't think a boycott is a case here but they getting called out and cleaning up their act is important.
What part of this is fine to you?
The fact it was kids the same age that made fun of her for having to do something she didn't agree to from the start? How is that better?
Verbal abuse is abuse. They're the bosses of the Stranger Things set and they're being accused of creating a hostile work environment for employees.
No, it's not as bad as sexual abuse. I also don't know what that has to do with anything.
I kind of feel like when you work in that kind of industry and have a clash of creative/business people on top of deadlines among everything else there's going to be some friction time to time, heated words, insults thrown.
Though you can definitely take it too far, like David O Russel on I Heart Huckabees
I hope they can get it under control and make the set less toxic and abusive.
Though you can definitely take it too far, like David O Russel on I Heart Huckabees
I hope they can get it under control and make the set less toxic and abusive.
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I don't think it's deserving of outrage, but acknowledgement. Of course that sexual harassment / assault / abuse is worse and worthy of outrage. No one is calling their heads or asking for a boycott of Duffer Brothers. Once again, I think they delivered two great seasons of a TV show and I look forward for them to keep getting better at their craft, and that includes them getting their act together when it comes to this. It's clear to me that whatever happened, it was bad enough to make these people to came forward. Not every thing deserves outrage, but dismissing verbal abuse as something they shouldn't be called out on is also wrong.
Hollywood business idea: professional listener. You hire yourself and your crew out to sets and the cast, director, etc of movies and shows can sit in a room and yell and scream at you super loud however long they want and you take it and look really sad or maybe yell back if they wanna pay extra. At the end you bring out a puppy to lick their face so they feel good. No one is hurt, you make a ton of money as a roving shrink, and I'm sure studios would love to pay for something that keeps crew morale itself decent.
Use the sound proofing ideas from Nathan For You to make sure no one else sees or hears it, have a roaming mobile van and maybe have cell phone jammers and stuff so no one can record people getting angry either.
Use the sound proofing ideas from Nathan For You to make sure no one else sees or hears it, have a roaming mobile van and maybe have cell phone jammers and stuff so no one can record people getting angry either.
I think there's a difference between downplaying allegations, and wanting to know what they actually are.
Simply saying "they were verbally abusive" isn't enough for many of us to make a judgement one way or another. I've seen people in my workplace try to argue that "hurry the hell up" constitutes abuse so unless someone wants to come forward with an actual quote, I'm not sure what value these allegations have.
Simply saying "they were verbally abusive" isn't enough for many of us to make a judgement one way or another. I've seen people in my workplace try to argue that "hurry the hell up" constitutes abuse so unless someone wants to come forward with an actual quote, I'm not sure what value these allegations have.
if twitter existed fifty years ago, stanley kubrick would have been crucified.
not saying that's bad, just sort of interesting to think about.
somebody post that christian bale clip
not saying that's bad, just sort of interesting to think about.
somebody post that christian bale clip
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We aren't talking about people that just started working in Hollywood. We are talking seasoned women workers that are coming forward saying they were abused. Peyton Brown came forward first at the Women's International Day and her denounce was met with hate and people calling her a liar, one step ahead of what some were doing here. Grabowski is a seasone Script Supervisor in Hollywood and she ALSO is stepping forward. We are talking about people that work on sets every other day. Whatever it happened, it was enough for them to come forward and speak up against it. Do you really think if it was just "arguings" they'd step up? Because I don't think so.
I hear you, and the fact we're not talking about some green interns does give the allegations slightly more weight.
But, why hasn't anyone provided an actual example of what was said? I just don't get it.
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Like Bronson said, the story is still developing. I'm sure that THR or other trade will tell Grabowski's and Brown's version of the story eventually.
So basically we know nothing about this situation. Other than she felt verbally abused.
Basically there is nothing to discuss unless more comes out.
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I disagree, and I feel like that's you yet again underplaying the situation. We aren't talking about people that don't work in the industry constantly. Why aren't we taking their words that verbal abuse happened again? What would it change if they went through great detail about what happened? What matters is that it's very likely that it did happened and that they responded. This isn't about "accusing without proof", we are talking about verbal abuse here, and that's hard to prove, what we have is an eye witness and what it seems like someone that went through the verbal abuse. Once again, why that is not enough for you not see that as reprehensible?
User Banned (3 Days): Derailment + Hostility - PM an admin or use the report function if you have a comment on moderation
Seriously? He gets a warning because his opinion isn't deemed worthy to the mods sensibilities when he makes a good point? What the fuck is wrong with you people? And you wonder why this forum is seen as toxic by so many people? Seriously. What the hell os wrong with you as a mod?
Uh, no, the fact that she didn't actually seem to be against it. You're saying just because it wasn't originally scripted, if they add it, and she's not forced to do it, we should burn it all down? We already had a thread closed on this because, given what we know, those comments were really taken out of context.
This has been my experience in the entertainment industry as well. It's... sadly something to be expected under the extremely stressful working conditions a large scale collaborative project brings.
But, presumably Stranger Things isn't at all her first set, and I think maybe what she is referring to is something beyond the usual scope of generalized tantrums. Because it's an incredibly vague post that still demands action, perhaps we won't know until someone is willing to be more explicit in the details.
Underplaying what?
Nothing has been stated except she feels that she was verbally abused and that people possibly were fired or quit over the matter.
I've met tons of people in similar high stress jobs who claim similar things.
Unless she substantiates more on her initial claims or more staff come out corroborating her story I am not sure what you want people to take away?
Yes, jobs in industries designed around deadlines can lead to you being yelled at by upper management.
Is that something that can change? Not really because it is a stress reaction and unless these industries stop having deadlines people will remain to be people.
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There also seems to be a huge conflation between this and the #metoo movement.
Unless more comes out this has nothing to do with sexism or sexual harassment.
And I am sure you love to backseat mod.
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1. I don't think you've read the TOS, but discussing the mod team decisions on public forum is a no-no. You can reach out to them via PMs.
2. I don't think the majority on this board bothers with what the opinion of this "many people" you are talking about, because if they don't understand that underplaying verbal abuse is wrong, they better get a warning so they rethink that.
3. Based on the way you're behaving here, I don't think I care about what you think about this particular subject either.
In light of the now moderation-backed opinion that verbal abuse is just as objectionable as any other kind of abuse, I present the following hypothetical:
Is Gordon Ramsey a serial abuser?
I wouldn't have thought that before, but the shoe fits, doesn't it? Hell, he on-camera reduces people to tears for the viewer's amusement, and he definitely gets angry as fuck off camera. Are there professions where getting loud, screaming-at-the-top-of-your-lungs angry is acceptable?
Is Gordon Ramsey a serial abuser?
I wouldn't have thought that before, but the shoe fits, doesn't it? Hell, he on-camera reduces people to tears for the viewer's amusement, and he definitely gets angry as fuck off camera. Are there professions where getting loud, screaming-at-the-top-of-your-lungs angry is acceptable?
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Again, we are talking about people USED to deal with this kind of pressure. Whatever it happened, it crossed a boundary, one that made them call them out on it. Threats and verbal abuse that make people quit their jobs or get fired for that seems like one of these occasions. High pressure jobs don't justify you getting threatned or forced to quit.
I try to treat people well and expect the same back. If you cross that line again and again, no wonder that you get into trouble.
And I am saying I've met plenty of people used to this pressure who literally reach a breaking point. Maybe try reading my post in full next time.
Nothing she has stated is indicative anything more than that.
Okay are people not reading what Lori Grabowski posted? This is beyond accusations.
Also I won't trust what Netflix has to say about this after it took them so long regarding Danny Masterson from The Ranch. They are protecting one of their best shows.
Also I won't trust what Netflix has to say about this after it took them so long regarding Danny Masterson from The Ranch. They are protecting one of their best shows.
I was considering posting something along those exact lines, but didn't want to invoke the ire of a mod. From what I understand, Mr. Ramsay is almost exactly the way he is on TV in his restaurants, and he learned to be that way from the chef under whom he apprenticed.
Don't make this a thread listing examples (video or text) of what you think happened in style or what you think happened in substance. Stick to discussing the contents of the OP.
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The accuser stated "TIME IS UP" twice in her Instagram post and used the #timesup hashtag. If anyone is willfully conflating this with #metoo, then it's kind of Peyton Brown's doing.
Okay please elaborate because there are two things to discuss based off the OP.
1. I was verabally abused and people were possible fired.
2. We are sorry that she feels that way.
I just want to know how I need to frame my opinions; as I don't want to ire the mods over having different opinions.
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Verbal abuse is still abuse. #MeToo and #TIMESUP encompass both.
I think what folks are trying to get at is, and I mean this in the best way possible, is this a Christian Bale thing, or a Bill Cosby thing?
Like, is this just a series of freakouts that went too far and have now become a pattern of normalized on-set interactions of assholishness, or, is this systemic, conscious, and purposeful exploitation of a position of power, and a further deceptive cover-up?
Seems more like the former to me, which is sad to be sure, but is far less charged, and likely, sadly, far more common. But detail is important, and knowing how much it's a conscious abuse of power versus a behavior that was never challenged and just ran away with itself is still kinda murky. It's bad, but the specific shape and form of bad is still kinda important I feel. And yeah, I'm sure it's a hazy mishmash in reality, but that's the point, details will help to illuminate the murk.
Like, is this just a series of freakouts that went too far and have now become a pattern of normalized on-set interactions of assholishness, or, is this systemic, conscious, and purposeful exploitation of a position of power, and a further deceptive cover-up?
Seems more like the former to me, which is sad to be sure, but is far less charged, and likely, sadly, far more common. But detail is important, and knowing how much it's a conscious abuse of power versus a behavior that was never challenged and just ran away with itself is still kinda murky. It's bad, but the specific shape and form of bad is still kinda important I feel. And yeah, I'm sure it's a hazy mishmash in reality, but that's the point, details will help to illuminate the murk.
Please don't try to conflate this with sexual abuse, unless she states it is.
There is a league of difference between an asshole and a rapists.
Sadly Hollywood is filled with both.
Anyone using those hastags at this point understands that they largely connote misbehavior of a sexual nature though.
isn't that textbook for things we later find out they were highly uncomfortably doing and nervously laughed in the moment. You don't know if it was really bad til they say otherwise b/c there's a track record
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