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Why women criticise sexualised character designs (READ OP)
- Thread starter Persephone
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Yeah, it'll be Maid and bikini, probably succubus too. I imagine some responses will ask "when you say 'nun' is that a 'sexy nun' :D
I asked for Valkyrie and other: vampire hunter, just for a laugh!
Does it really need to be explained why guys like seeing women in bikinis?
Yeah it's cliched but so are a lot of things. All those costume designs sound like cliches.
I don't think there's anything wrong with that. It's just some of those you don't like.
They are all cliches but at least the others have some vague reason to be in or around a supernatural 18th century castle, whereas modern beachwear is just pure fanservice- note that I didn't object to the sexualised-by-definition 'succubus' option in a game with demons here.
No, it doesn't need to be explained why some fans want ridiculous skimpy outfits for a female main character, that doesn't make the fact that it seems to be a dlc option far more often with female characters ok. In the same way, a TV cop show doesn't need to have a DVD extra where all the female officers are now in lingerie in their office and courtroom scenes for no reason other than fanservice.
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Most of the time it's usually relegated to a specific scene or a bonus costume as in this case.
So at least it's optional. Yeah you wouldn't see this in a TV show but different medium. If it's only one optional costume then yeah I'd rather have the other ones. But like if the beachwear is just one of several costumes I don't think it hurts anyone. People are going to rule 34 her anyway the devs are just giving them something official in-game.
Video games are interactive. These days people want more and more options on how they play their games. If a bikini would bother you so much, I don't think you'll be forced to play the game that way. But the option is there for people that want it.
That's really a shame...her original design looks fantastic.
Yeah, options are good, that's fair enough.
However, I'm not sure why, because any attractive character is going to have sexualised fan art etc made of it, that automatically needs to be acknowledged in modern games with official sexy outfits. No specific case hurts anyone, but they all contribute to the background radiation of what's seen as the 'normal' way to treat female characters differently to the male ones.
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I'm not suggesting I would be forced to do so. I'm saying that, by having the initial suggestions immediately leap to beachwear, it's reinforcing the player mindset about what such default options for female characters should be. If they had put 12 different supernatural ones instead (for example, replacing 'Maid' and 'Swimsuit' with 'Ghost' and 'Dryad'), I wonder how many players would still have used 'other' to say 'swimsuit'. It just feels a bit unoriginal when so many games do it, where players could have been nudged towards more fitting-for-the-setting, creative (and still attractive- art direction can go all over the place) options instead.
Maybe it's just a filter to see how many backers are actually interested in the setting and how many just want their cheesecake.
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Getting fed up with Bloodstained tbh. I'm a backer but somehow I expect the 5 million dollars game to not even be as good as Salt and Sanctuary or Hollow Knight (made by tiny indie devs). Few of their updates have gotten me excited at all. :/ Hope I'm wrong and gonna eat crow and all but yeah.
Not really a concern, all manga volumes in Japan are made out of recycle paper. It is the reason, along with it being black and white, why they were able to sell the 400-500 page Shonen Jump magazine for so cheap, 300 yen, or 2.87 us dollars.
Well I don't think it NEEDS to be acknowledged and personally I think we could do with way more non-sexualised women in video games. So I do agree with you here.
It's just I think fan service like this is just giving people what they want. Not ALL people, of course. So I don't really see it as an inherently negative things like all people do. I also think if you want to go in this direction it's best to go all the way instead of half assing it because that just feels disingenous to me. Like you want to design a sexy character but you also want to pretend you don't and this is a serious work of art.
If only this was just about options. We pretty much all know that saying "it's about options" is disingenuous. This is about wider systemic issues and how those lead to bikinis being considered an appropriate option in the first place.
At one point, Fire Emblem was a game pretty embedded with medieval politics and was a big influence for games like Final Fantasy Tactics. Let's just say... politics are not what people think the Fire Emblem series is about now.
And often when it comes for options for other groups of gamers that aren't the white straight male gamer, they are seen as a waste of resources, often by the same people who ask for optional fanservice.
Couldn't be more truthful. Not even just a "waste of resources," but derogatorily attacked as "shoehorned in," be it female inclusion, LGBT inclusion, racial inclusion, etc., as if non-straight white males have to justify their very existence with external merit, and then it's "so why can't they just be straight/white/men? Something something political correctness."
Can't count the number of times I've heard the incorrect statistic that LGBT people comprise sub-5% of the population, so really any more than 0-1 represented per game would be "unrealistic," conveniently bypassing the representation of actual same-sex couples.
Yet it's fine to put female characters in absurd and revealing outfits that make no sense, as "it's just a game! It doesn't have to be realistic!"
Thats more to do with whoever handles Fire Emblem being terrible at writing than to do with the fan service and shipping. Which could easily coexist in a game with a great story. You just need good writers but it seems they all left IS.
Impossible for those people to fathom what it would be like if, on a perpetual basis, men were paraded around in sexualizing clothing that served the theoretical non-straight male eye in every scrap of media, molding people's sub-consciousness to think of them as sexually-gratifying objects whose higher thoughts are less rational.
If the next male protagonist in FE were dressed provocatively, those people would loudly balk. (And even if they didn't, as someone who's attracted to men, I wouldn't be able to take the story/character's dramatic merits as seriously, because I've not been conditioned to think of men as objects created for my titillation.)
Let me put it another way, since many still fail to understand. Let's say the theatrical release of the first Lord of the Rings movie was considered a "game". And as such, you had the option to change Arwen's clothes to a bikini. So throughout the entire movie, only she (and no one else) is wearing a bikini. Do you think consumers would accept that? Do you think the director would accept that? I mean, it's just an option after all, right?
Hell, look at FF Mobius where this did happen. With the male protagonist being deemed too sexual by men and getting a costume makeover to cover more skin while multiple female characters wear the equivalent of bikinis made out of thin cloth.
Well if their was a poll put up for it like with Bloodstained then that more than likely suggests the director is okay with it. Which probably points to where the root of the problem exists.
Part of the problem, yes. But many of those dumb decisions you see may not even be a product of the director's intervention. In many cases it's the studio or larger groups funding the project. But this is what I mean when I talk about a systemic problem, particularly when people are more eager to place blame on individuals rather than the systems that surround them (individuals bear some responsibility, but they aren't the only arbiter when it comes to decision-making on large projects).
It's exactly this. I don't think many people would be surprised to find that many decisions made within studios aren't done purely for artistic merit. Hell, many decisions happen at levels completely removed from the higher ups within those studios... BUT, I have seen the exact opposite happen as well, where publishers end up taking the blame for completely boneheaded decision making made by studio leadership.
When it comes to sexy skins and such, I've found- at least in the US- that the big publishers don't outright mandate they be made and, in some cases, kill them before they see the light of day. Whether this is done because of fear of public reception or out of actual desire to change standards is somewhat ambiguous.
Hey, all. So I'm going to be playing Monster Hunter World soon once I finish up a few other games in my backlog. I've always meant to give this series a try and I always kinda assumed it did the Souls series thing where the armor for both male and female characters are largely the same, but apparently that does not seem to be the case. I've seen it brought up a few times in this thread. So, just how bad is it? Are there at least enough fully armored options for female characters that you can generally avoid skimpy stuff? If not then I guess I'll just roll with a male character if I have to.
It's....can get pretty bad. While there are armors for female characters that are fine, there are also baffling ones that equal a full plate armor for the men but a bikini for the women. However there are enough armors that are good that you can avoid them if you wish.
Monster Hunter's always been kinda bad about this, and World's really no different. There's some great looking armor, but there's also some that will make you roll your eyes into the back of your head.
It was just a wee bit easier to ignore on a PSP screen, for what it's worth.
I was thinking about this today. I am a hobbyist game dev and I was thinking about an erotic game I played a long time ago where you were sexually proactive, and the game essentially had you use a pink beam to put enemies in a "fuckable" state (mostly male, but a few female) and then you took the lead and had sex with them. This heals you, because you're a succubus, and you can choose to kill enemies too. It's just that the gameplay essentially incentivizes the 'healing.' the game actually ends with you fighting with the final boss and gaining sexual power over him.
After thinking about this for a while, it was one of the only porn games I've ever played where it wasn't the main female getting raped or in some sort of situation where sex is something that happens TO the main character, rather than the female MC being proactive. What would be a great way of executing this without it being straight up offensive, or avoiding pitfalls that would really keep women and men from enjoying it? Would like some thoughts, I was also thinking about Zero, the main character of Drakengard 3 with a male harem she has sex with whenever, being the only other example I could think of. Of course the only other example I can think of is from a Yoko Taro game.
After thinking about this for a while, it was one of the only porn games I've ever played where it wasn't the main female getting raped or in some sort of situation where sex is something that happens TO the main character, rather than the female MC being proactive. What would be a great way of executing this without it being straight up offensive, or avoiding pitfalls that would really keep women and men from enjoying it? Would like some thoughts, I was also thinking about Zero, the main character of Drakengard 3 with a male harem she has sex with whenever, being the only other example I could think of. Of course the only other example I can think of is from a Yoko Taro game.
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Ain't it the fucking truth. If Solid Snake constantly ran around in short shorts, I wouldn't find it sexy or cool, I'd find it fucking stupid.
For my part, I've resigned myself to play as a male. I made a female character too, and abandoned progress with her (largely because unskippable cut scenes make a second playthrough a complete drag -_-), I was fed up because even the "okay" (as in, non-bikini) armours often still a) looked worse, and b) still often featured that stupid-ass zettai ryouki shit, and considering you mix and match pretty often in this one, you can get horrible combinations with a ridiculous crotch gap or exposed thighs and the like.
That said my tolerance for shitty armour is on the fairly low end, these days, so it might not bother you as much as me. I've endured it more in the past, but in a game like MH where I fully customize my character, it's just aggravating. It's the first time I actually create/prioritize a male character over a female one in a game with a character creator. :(
I am waiting for the PC version and I hope mods are allowed so someone can change stuff like that.
I wish this would actually extend to actual options, such as GLBT characters, banana hammocks for the dudes, or a female/nonwhite character to play :P
Somehow, the options seem to start and end with "female characters in bikinis".
That shit's on Wikipedia now?
Satire is dead.
Big Boss would be more "confident" like this:
What's happening now is that my brain is playing out a scenario where Snake has to infiltrate Dr Frank N Furter's secret laboratory...
This should be in the OP.Big Boss would be more "confident" like this:
The actual name is Weebipedia. Let me prove my claim to you by referencing a website which doesn't make my statement, oh no, they just use the name themselves. And with that, notability is realised. Another victory for science!
Hah, speaking of pants... Did you all see the new characters revealed for Octopath Traveler? She's a huntress who wears, well, very snug and form-fitting clothes to say the least, and her artwork has a kind of "boobs & butt" pose.
But she has a shirt, and actual pants, and proper boots (no high heels bullshit). And she genuinely looks cool, instead of stupid. So you know what. I'll take it. Thank you, artist, for not giving her ZR and cleavage and a thong and high heels or whatever the fuck. xD
But she has a shirt, and actual pants, and proper boots (no high heels bullshit). And she genuinely looks cool, instead of stupid. So you know what. I'll take it. Thank you, artist, for not giving her ZR and cleavage and a thong and high heels or whatever the fuck. xD
Hah, speaking of pants... Did you all see the new characters revealed for Octopath Traveler? She's a huntress who wears, well, very snug and form-fitting clothes to say the least, and her artwork has a kind of "boobs & butt" pose.
But she has a shirt, and actual pants, and proper boots (no high heels bullshit). And she genuinely looks cool, instead of stupid. So you know what. I'll take it. Thank you, artist, for not giving her ZR and cleavage and a thong and high heels or whatever the fuck. xD
You can actually feel the notes from Square Enix begging Akihiko Yoshida to give one of the female characters actual pants instead of a skirt that's so short is looks weird and high heels. (Though technically I guess her tunic thing functions as the weird short skirt)
I like her snow leopard companion and furry boots/cloak, nice thematic design. Fur/leather vambraces carries it through, and that she's got some muscle tone as an archer/ranger type. Not convinced that a hunter tooled up for long hikes in cold weather with all that fur on her lower legs and shoulders would care for such a form-fitting tunic on her core, but hey, at least a simple tunic with a fur trim is a thematic step up from a bloody corset and suspenders or whatever :DHah, speaking of pants... Did you all see the new characters revealed for Octopath Traveler? She's a huntress who wears, well, very snug and form-fitting clothes to say the least, and her artwork has a kind of "boobs & butt" pose.
But she has a shirt, and actual pants, and proper boots (no high heels bullshit). And she genuinely looks cool, instead of stupid. So you know what. I'll take it. Thank you, artist, for not giving her ZR and cleavage and a thong and high heels or whatever the fuck. xD
I like her wild hair too, reminds me of that bit in Frozen where Elsa unties her hair. Maybe that's the wintry theme, or maybe it's that my daughter is obsessed with it (again) at the moment...
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I quite like the design (that's the merchant, right?), simple dress but with nice detail in the backpack and a feather in her hat. I do find the way young women are sometimes depicted with toes pointing inwards strange though, is it supposed to suggest 'insecurity' or 'childishness'? Seems painful to me!There's also this character:
No pants, but it isn't a belt skirt.
I love the way they've shown the characters in their natural environments, it really helps detail their backgrounds.
Bloke she's selling to looks like he isn't buying her sales pitch! :D
Yep:
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more at http://www.siliconera.com/2018/03/1...ility-battle-job-systems/#zgx4i3RPg81vqDos.99
She also seems to be the youngest(18) female character in this game. A young female character that isn't exposed like a piece of meat. wow. what a concept.
Also doesn't that game also feature some sort of seductress character? I never played the demo, but I think she was in that. I dunno.
Re: legs, when I was in Japan, I saw a lot of women standing like that over the course of months. They were also very often bow-legged. We couldn't really figure out why but maybe it has something to do with high-heels? This is not my expertise, but I saw a woman literally climbing Mt Fuji in high heels. I was... surprised, to say the least.
The youngest is 18? And she isn't objectified. Progress, people. :D
You're thinking of Primrose. She's a dancer and scantily clad indeed. While I think the outfit suits the character at first, considering where the story takes her, I thought it was dumb and probably out of character for her to remain dressed like that as she embarks on that journey. So yeah, the game won't fully escape from the rampant sexualization of JRPGs, but if it's just the one character, it's not too bad, for once. ._.
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