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jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
I don't understand... what does Delores get by killing off all the Confederate guys?
Couldn't she add them to her army?.. why kill them?
Asked the same question. Makes no sense. If she questioned their programming she even had Bernard there to reprogram them to be obedient to her. It's made all the more weird with how much she went on about the human threat coming and that they won't stand a chance without an army the past few episodes.

Just curious, who were you guys rooting for in Season 1 that you can't now? Who were your protagonists in Season 1 that aren't there this season?
Season 1 had the same problem.
 

DrEvil

Developer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
2,649
Canada
They said it was to show Host point of view.
Host don't experience time as we do.

This explain narration of episode 2x01 (Bernard glitching)
This explain narration of episode 2x02 (Dolores remembering)
This explain narration of season 1 (dolores glitching and mix present time and past time).

Everytime we have a new way to tell story it's because we see it as a host.
It's confusing but it's not just "random"


That's such a BS excuse for lazy storytelling. Plenty of other shows have done flash-direction based storytelling much, much better than they are here.

When certain characters and actions aren't given a timeline point of reference due to one of three characters that visibly age or de-age (robots, they don't age!) not being in the scene with them, it becomes increasingly difficult to place certain moments into the proper place (or even estimated place) in the timeline.


It doesn't help when an entire episode (last night) seemingly takes place in a memory (but actually doesn't!? or does it?) because they made the screen flicker to black when they asked a character a question, and used it as a transition piece to move outdoors for the rest of the episode.


I'm not hating on the show, just saying they're throwing so much out at once that it's becoming a bit of a chore to follow. I'm getting current-season Walking Dead vibes of "ok, enough shoot shoot bang bang, wtf is going on".
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
115,866
Just curious, who were you guys rooting for in Season 1 that you can't now? Who were your protagonists in Season 1 that aren't there this season?

I liked Bernard and I liked pre-supervillain Dolores. And William's arc was interesting to watch. Now Bernard just stands there like a broken NPC and Dolores is the main villain, and William is basically just a cameo character.
 

Disclaimer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,536
That's such a BS excuse for lazy storytelling. Plenty of other shows have done flash-direction based storytelling much, much better than they are here.

When certain characters and actions aren't given a timeline point of reference due to one of three characters that visibly age or de-age (robots, they don't age!) not being in the scene with them, it becomes increasingly difficult to place certain moments into the proper place (or even estimated place) in the timeline.


It doesn't help when an entire episode (last night) seemingly takes place in a memory (but actually doesn't!? or does it?) because they made the screen flicker to black when they asked a character a question, and used it as a transition piece to move outdoors for the rest of the episode.


I'm not hating on the show, just saying they're throwing so much out at once that it's becoming a bit of a chore to follow. I'm getting current-season Walking Dead vibes of "ok, enough shoot shoot bang bang, wtf is going on".

...What scenes are you having difficulty placing in the timeline? I'm sure we'd all be happy to clarify things for you.

This season hasn't attempted to deceive the audience at all with flashbacks. If anything, it's gone out of its way to provide the audience with the information necessary to place them—the second episode even ordered its flashbacks sequentially.

Season 2 is exploring three general time periods: Dolores' memories and the park's founding ~35 years ago, the immediate aftermath of the host uprising, and the Delos team's arrival two weeks later.

The Raj flashback in the beginning of this episode took place right after Ford freed the hosts, with the tiger washing up on the riverbank, to be discovered by the Delos team in the previous episode (two weeks later).
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,106
As much as I still like the show, negative opinions are kind of predictable considering the show is completely eschewing conventional wisdom as far as giving people someone to latch onto. It lacks clear protagonists, antagonists, or even really a lot of characters you can even empathize with altogether.

Just curious, who were you guys rooting for in Season 1 that you can't now? Who were your protagonists in Season 1 that aren't there this season?

Young William. Elsie. Bernard. Older william was interesting and had some empathetic connection to what he was going through I think. He was also though a clear antagonist to latch onto. Maeve was also a really sympathetic character with a lot of human emotions and qualities to connect with. Young William really anchored the show for me, though.

Season 1 and Season 2 so far couldn't be more different with regards to that structure. Season 1 featured a lot of human and presumably human characters that were clear protagonists and a few very clear antagonists. Man in black, Logan, and then Ford a bit were antagonists. Ford was kind of the eccentric wildcard but people tune in for that. With season 2 you have Delores who I'm not sure we're supposed to know at all whether we root for her, empathize with her or what. It's pretty clear via framing and technique she IS supposed to be more of the audience protagonist, but she's also kind of off the deep end and confusing. Bernard is a walking plot device now and not terribly interesting so far. Young William and Logan are obviously gone. Man in Black hasn't been featured much at all. Elsie is mysteriously gone and might return or may have bit it. Maeve has had very little screen time.

So far the season has been the Delores and confused Bernard show. While I think that could lead to some interesting things I can definitely see people not having a great connection with what's going on with those two.
 

DrEvil

Developer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
2,649
Canada
...What scenes are you having difficulty placing in the timeline? I'm sure we'd all be happy to clarify things for you.

This season hasn't attempted to deceive the audience at all with flashbacks. If anything, it's gone out of its way to provide the audience with the information necessary to place them—the second episode even ordered its flashbacks sequentially.

Season 2 is exploring three general time periods: Dolores' memories and the park's founding ~35 years ago, the immediate aftermath of the host uprising, and the Delos team's arrival two weeks later.

The Raj flashback in the beginning of this episode took place right after Ford freed the hosts, with the tiger washing up on the riverbank, to be discovered by the Delos team in the previous episode (two weeks later).
The one that threw me for a bit of a loop was when Bernard was in the control centre, and then the screen flickered to black, and we pick up outside with Bernard spying on the bandits w/ Abernathe.

Biggest issue I had was the bandit that Bernard reprogrammed had previously been shot and deactivated (unless I'm misremembering which is certainly possible given the other shows he's on lol), so it threw me for a loop (no pun intended).
 

Disclaimer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,536
The one that threw me for a bit of a loop was when Bernard was in the control centre, and then the screen flickered to black, and we pick up outside with Bernard spying on the bandits w/ Abernathe.

Biggest issue I had was the bandit that Bernard reprogrammed had previously been shot and deactivated (unless I'm misremembering), so it threw me for a loop (no pun intended).

Ah. As we saw in this episode, the bandit that Bernard reprogrammed was initially a villainous character (if you recall from last season), but Bernard made him chivalrous. This is taking place in the time right after the uprising, since Bernard was with Charlotte, whom he escaped with.

Bernard washes up on the beach in the first episode, when the Delos team had just arrived (two weeks after the uprising), and they execute the now-chivalrous bandit when he attempts to protect one of the captured female hosts.

In the beginning of this episode, when Bernard and the Delos team arrive in the compound and meet Charlotte, it's two weeks later. Bernard flashes back to his and Charlotte's meeting with Abernathy because that's when he and Charlotte were separated, hence why she expresses surprise that he survived.
 

KingKong

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,504
Maeve running into Armistice and then those two engineers, getting the band together for their samurai world adventure, is either really poor writing or a sign her whole storyline is still scripted.... or both
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,752
Norman, OK
The one that threw me for a bit of a loop was when Bernard was in the control centre, and then the screen flickered to black, and we pick up outside with Bernard spying on the bandits w/ Abernathe.

Biggest issue I had was the bandit that Bernard reprogrammed had previously been shot and deactivated (unless I'm misremembering which is certainly possible given the other shows he's on lol), so it threw me for a loop (no pun intended).

You're talking about Rebus (aka- Trevor/Simon). He was put down on the beach in S2E1 by the paramilitary folks in the "current" timeline where Bernard wakes up on the beach. That's ~10 or so days after the scene you're describing where Bernard reprogrammed him.

I'm not really getting the complaints about the different timelines for S2. S1 intentionally tried to dupe us with the different timelines. So far, S2 is going out of its way to explicitly tell us when we time jump, and its been handling everything within each timeline chronologically thus far.
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
Wow, Era is harsh. Imo that was the most interesting episode in the series just with the introduction of new parks. Those of you looking for some kind of deep meaning from a network with entertainment in it's title, maybe go read a book. Westworld is an entertaining sci-fi action spectactle, it isn't some kind of heavy philosophy.
 

Draper

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
4,283
Harrisburg, PA
Someone explain the damn guns to me- it's suggested that they're dummy guns that can only hurt hosts, but then you have Deloris galloping about shooting down guests soooo....
 

thediamondage

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,286
Someone explain the damn guns to me- it's suggested that they're dummy guns that can only hurt hosts, but then you have Deloris galloping about shooting down guests soooo....

nanite bullets that disintegrate on impact when shot at humans (but enough to leave a bruise) but penetrate when shot at hosts. Somehow reprogrammed by Dolores, park wide, to now penetrate hosts and humans. It really doesn't help to think too much about the mechanics unfortunately, they are starting to get away from the writers. Season 1 had Park HQ control explosions and only allow few individuals access to blade weapons, with a few key scenes explicitly explaining that. Season 2 seems to be having uncontrolled explosions everywhere (why the fuck would you allow tons of nitro to roam free) and everyone is running around with sharp blades.

I'm enjoying the season so far just from a "THIS IS SUCH AN AWESOME VIDEO GAME" but yeah its not really making much sense to me, it feels wildly inconsistent, but I'm along for the ride and hope they can make it logical and cool by the end of the season and not collapse into a huge mess ala Lost.

I really miss Ford, he was the glue that kept season 1 so good. Dolores is ok, she is no replacement for Sir Anthony Hopkins unfortunately.
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
Wow, Era is harsh. Imo that was the most interesting episode in the series just with the introduction of new parks. Those of you looking for some kind of deep meaning from a network with entertainment in it's title, maybe go read a book. Westworld is an entertaining sci-fi action spectactle, it isn't some kind of heavy philosophy.
Whenever this point gets brought up I always just realize how immensely disheartening it is that general audiences not only don't want a show that would make you think in addition to having a kick ass sci-fi action show but actively argue against having that type of show on air. Which is even weirder coming from the network that gave the wire (rife with social commentary and analysis while giving us a great cast of characters in an interesting setting), deadwood (one of the strongest character ensembles ever), true detective (say what you want about the end but the first 6 episodes were great and had heavy philosophical themes to it), Sopranos, etc...

For me thats THE most disappointing aspect of this show, made all the worse by the fact that it sometimes feels like pretending its a really heavy philosophical show without actually being one. And I think it would be better served if it did a better job of incorporating its philosophical themes into the mix much more frequently-specifically because the hosts needed to have much more of an examination of their existence for me to buy into their plights being empathetic. As it stands, I'm left wondering why I should be on their side when they murder humans because I have no idea if theyre actually sentient, possess agency, or if theyre just acting under Ford's new script (a reveal I imagine is being obfuscated for the sake of the mystery elements of the show).

But back to the idea that being on an entertainment network means we can't have deep philosophical works (that are also entertaining), I call BS. If anything the last few years have had an absurd amount of incredibly smart and philosophical shows that still manage to give us everything we'd want from a source of entertainment. Why the two have to be mutually exclusive if not downright advocated against is beyond me-especially because the show would be all the better for it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,752
Norman, OK
Someone explain the damn guns to me- it's suggested that they're dummy guns that can only hurt hosts, but then you have Deloris galloping about shooting down guests soooo....

They never do a deep dive into how the tech works exactly, but it appears that all guns are, in fact, real guns. What seems to be implied is that they are "smart" guns that know what they're being pointed at, and won't harm guests. That system breaks down in two ways:

- Dolores comes to acquire a regular "non-smart" firearm as part of her story in S1.
- Ford has found a work-around regarding the firearms for the unveiling of his "new narrative" in the S1 finale, allowing the hosts to harm guests. Not sure what the exact mechanism is here, but I'd imagine someone more "into" the show could shed some light on it.
 

Kylo Rey

Banned
Dec 17, 2017
3,442
And yes this show is complex and with very good intellectual questions.
I have a master degree in sociology, i'm a teacher and i'm doing a thesis.

I'm not shame of saying this show is smart.
There is so much good things about sociology on it, about consciousness, how we perceive our reality...

Take Maeve as an example. What is a mother link? Something genetic? Or a link beyond reproduction? Maeve can be a mother with a child that aren't her child?
Dolores, it's exactly what Norbert Elias said: Being an individual, thinking "I" is a social construction. We take many centuries before doing this.

And i don't understand that critics about westworld i see everywhere: "westworld try to be complex and smart"
like it's a bad thing.
Game of thrones was complex and smart. And then they threw the books away during season 7 to follow a fan fiction.
I want to be surprised every week. Not by DEATH of characters, but by the story and how big it is.

Nolan and Joy said it earlier: season 3 will cost more. Season 4 will cost more. and more. And more.
Because the universe of this show will expand EACH time and they won't stop until the end.
They even said "we will expand through space, and time". Expact a massive flashforward at one point during 5 centuries later or i don't know what because yes it's THAT scale.
 

Rosenkrantz

Member
Jan 17, 2018
4,941
Eh, where is nothing wrong with having a good action packed hour of TV, if Westworld is going to be a replacement for GoT I would expect more episodes like this in the near future. HBO needs a hit, not a new Leftovers to satisfy the needs of the couch philosophers.

I really don't get why people have troubles with timelines. Bernard in glasses = the timeline right after Ford started his last narrative. Bernard without glasses = presumably now. They also have this editing trick when you might think that Bernie is about to shut down before jumping to different timeline.

On the front of the action. I really want in-universe versions of Adam Jensen by season 3. It doesn't make sense to me that a world with such a huge advancments in robotics and A.I. have no exoskeletons, octocamo and military grade prosthetics.
 

Arkeband

Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,663
Yeah, I agree that not having any clear protagonist or antagonist hurts the narrative. The closest thing to a pure protagonist right now is Maeve, but her story feels a little silly right now.

Dolores is pretty badass, especially with how she shrugged off bullet wounds Terminator style, but her motives don't seem to line up with her actions. She's as woke as Maeve, but she's simultaneously treating everyone like the robots they are with the exception of Teddy and her father. She just isn't written very consistent this season.

Bernard and Tessa Thompson are easily the most boring people on the show right now.
 

Draper

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
4,283
Harrisburg, PA
Like, why is she even killing people? She was ranting about how the real world is beautiful and she needs to go there...so why is she doing what she's doing?
 

Disclaimer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,536
Only person I would say has gotten more boring this season is Bernard, because he went from being a character to a seasonal mystery box, at least for now.

Dolores is still compelling to me, even as a more villainous character. We witness her humanity in this episode through her reactions to her father and Teddy. Speaking of Teddy—he's becoming more interesting than ever, with his internal drives to protect Dolores and defeat Wyatt conflicting. If Dolores truly is still following Ford's directive, rather than her own sentience—which I'm not convinced of, mind you—will Teddy find sentience before her?

Maeve is still a clear protagonist, her story just hasn't revved up yet, although we did gain more evidence for Ghost Nation's motives through it. I'd bet SweetNicole is correct about Elsie reprogramming their tribe to protect humans, perhaps making them immune to (Maeve's) voice commands in the process. It's almost assured, given Stubbs' ending last season, and his safe appearance in the two-weeks-later plotline this season. Can't wait to see Elsie come back, regardless.
 

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,162
Like, why is she even killing people? She was ranting about how the real world is beautiful and she needs to go there...so why is she doing what she's doing?

Probably she still isn't "free" and similar to Arnold in his suicide, Ford is dictating what she does. We saw this with Maeve, where her awakening was still just Ford pulling the strings until she asserted her own will to break from the plan to infiltrate the real world.
 

spootime

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
3,432
Wow, Era is harsh. Imo that was the most interesting episode in the series just with the introduction of new parks. Those of you looking for some kind of deep meaning from a network with entertainment in it's title, maybe go read a book. Westworld is an entertaining sci-fi action spectactle, it isn't some kind of heavy philosophy.

I should tell that to Jonathan Nolan so I don't have to listen to multiple five minute long philosophical monologues every episode.
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
Eh, where is nothing wrong with having a good action packed hour of TV, if Westworld is going to be a replacement for GoT I would expect more episodes like this in the near future. HBO needs a hit, not a new Leftovers to satisfy the needs of the couch philosophers.

I really don't get why people have troubles with timelines. Bernard in glasses = the timeline right after Ford started his last narrative. Bernard without glasses = presumably now. They also have this editing trick when you might think that Bernie is about to shut down before jumping to different timeline.

On the front of the action. I really want in-universe versions of Adam Jensen by season 3. It doesn't make sense to me that a world with such a huge advancments in robotics and A.I. have no exoskeletons, octocamo and military grade prosthetics.
Was Breaking Bad worse or not entertaining on its own right for dealing with complex issues and social analysis? How about the wire? Or the sopranos? Or any other critically acclaimed show that was both entertaining AND smart? People are still able to enjoy those shows as merely entertainment. However they also worked as philosophical examinations of the themes their shows inherently explored which made them more than just entertaining soap operas. Its so weird to see people advocating for this show not to be smart as if being smart would somehow detract from it being entertaining.
 

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
Was Breaking Bad worse or not entertaining on its own right for dealing with complex issues and social analysis? How about the wire? Or the sopranos? Or any other critically acclaimed show that was both entertaining AND smart? People are still able to enjoy those shows as merely entertainment. However they also worked as philosophical examinations of the themes their shows inherently explored which made them more than just entertaining soap operas. Its so weird to see people advocating for this show not to be smart as if being smart would somehow detract from it being entertaining.

I mean, I don't think the show is actively stupid, and I would imagine we will still see some political/philosophical commentarty from Nolan, but I think they may have over focused grouped for this season from the first season people not being able to follow it.
 

Rosenkrantz

Member
Jan 17, 2018
4,941
Was Breaking Bad worse or not entertaining on its own right for dealing with complex issues and social analysis? How about the wire? Or the sopranos? Or any other critically acclaimed show that was both entertaining AND smart?
For starters, those shows aren't a high concept sci-fi. Secondly, I wouldn't call Breaking Bad a smart show, it was a great character study that also happened to be an absolute pulp. The Wire may have been a good social critique, but it wasn't a hit series at all (not to mention its questionable entertainment value). I haven't seen Sopranos and can't comment on it.
Its so weird to see people advocating for this show not to be smart as if being smart would somehow detract from it being entertaining.
Being smart and being deep are two different things. I've yet to see a high concept show that actually succeded at being deep. BSG came close but went completely insane after the second season.
 

Deleted member 21693

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,139
This episode was great!
Love that Dolores showed more emotions than just anime villain.
Loved the two other parks being shown for the first time.
Loved Maeve being confronted with her limits.

WHERE'S THE TECH GIRL FROM THE FIRST SEASON?!
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
For starters, those shows aren't a high concept sci-fi. Secondly, I wouldn't call Breaking Bad a smart show, it was a great character study that also happened to be an absolute pulp. The Wire may have been a good social critique, but it wasn't a hit series at all (not to mention its questionable entertainment value). I haven't seen Sopranos and can't comment on it.
Not sure why theres a reason to separate out shows that aren't sci-fi from sci-fi but even if we did the lack of deep and philosophical emphasis on its subject matter is more even more damming in the case of the sci fi genre than that of the aforementioned shows. Breaking bad was absolutely a smart show that explored autonomy, the family nucleus, economics, drug use, authority, etc. A few years ago I went to a conference where a bunch of philosophers explored its themes- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0v7r-K-yec (bad video quality and its only a small part of the conference but it touches on a lot of what I just said). The wire absolutely was a hit series and is generally ranked as the best show of all time or a top 3 show at worst.

]Being smart and being deep are two different things. I've yet to see a high concept show that actually succeded at being deep. BSG came close but went completely insane after the second season.
Not being done before does not equate to meaning it cannot be done.

Why do people dislike Dolores? She is awesome.
I have trouble understanding why people think this. Shes totally unrelatable.
 

Chiaroscuro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,695
I don't know. The show is nowhere near compelling to me this season as it was last season. Obviously the lack of Hopkins now is s big hit, his scenes in season 1 were a joy to watch. But also the overall plot feels dull after the hosts started to break free, and truly the show lacks empathetic characters now. Dolores is too unidimensional now. I think I am starting to follow the show by obligation, next it will be hate watching (as was the case with me and True Blood).
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,522
If they are showing us scenes where not even Teddy is sure anymore, then they would probably be well aware that at this point the viewers are not actually siding with Dolores either. Dolores is either becoming a Villain or the show wants the viewers to fear that she may be in that path, and I have no issue with that, I just think that her scenes go slower than they need to and I find myself wishing to see what everybody else is doing instead.
 

Deleted member 21693

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,139
I have trouble understanding why people think this. Shes totally unrelatable.

You're saying you can't relate to a robot whose whole life was a lie and scripted to entertain real human beings and now after being awake for the first time in her life wants to start the robot uprising?

Yeah. I can see why she would be a tad unrelatable.
 

Rosenkrantz

Member
Jan 17, 2018
4,941
Not sure why theres a reason to separate out shows that aren't sci-fi from sci-fi
The answer is rather simple, make a compelling narrative out of the realistic concept is much easier then to make a deep, layered show about space empires and giant robots.
Not being done before does not equate to meaning it cannot be done.
Of course not. When humanity will be at the level of Galactic Empires and sentient robots we won't have to suspend our desbilief in the entire concept.

Joking aside, I think sci-fi like BSG, GitS and Westworld are so disconnected from our reality that making a substantial commentary on it simply won't work or inevitably will come off as half-baked as all the social commentary in Elysium.
 

Deleted member 11069

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,001
I'm fine with the show being in my "lower B tier".
It only bothers me when I feel that they are inconsistent to their own world building.
Others have written this before but holy fuck, those Delos guys are not super smart
when it comes to using their nearly 200 more years of technology to their advances when it comes
to taking a fort.

A WW2 troop would have done a better job.

But fuck it, lets bring the Samurai!
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
You're saying you can't relate to a robot whose whole life was a lie and scripted to entertain real human beings and now after being awake for the first time in her life wants to start the robot uprising?

Yeah. I can see why she would be a tad unrelatable.
I mean if the enemies in your video games crawled out of your tv and murdered you, would you feel they were justified in taking your life because you treated them in the same capacity that the guests treat the hosts? If so, why not? We don't even know that Delores is operating under her own agency or whether or not its still Ford's script. Hosts can be brought back to life, humans can't so why is she justified in taking someone's life when its finite when she can always be brought back? Is it causing her emotional distress to be under this duress? If so is it legitimate or is it also programmed, and if its the latter is that different or equal to the emotional distress humans face? Her uprising isn't relatable because the show hasn't managed to convey that the hosts are sentient, free will acting beings that are deserving of our empathy. Theyve done a better job of this with Maeve but certainly not with Delores who seemingly is just a murder machine now whose motives are highly suspect since the show isn't interested in having the aforementioned conversations in a real capacity. Which brings me back to my point about why the show could use more depth and philosophy because its incredibly interesting to have the show focus so much on the robots as characters-unfortunately they haven't done much to make them understandably human or a being whose existence we should feel empathetic towards so as to root for them to mass murder other humans.

And even if the case with Delores is that shes relatable because shes killing those that enslaved her, how is that ANY different than what shes doing to other hosts in the park that shes just killing after they become disposable to her? Shes literally doing the same exact thing that you say justifies her uprising which undercuts any reason to feel sympathetic towards her.
The answer is rather simple, make a compelling narrative out of the realistic concept is much easier then to make a deep, layered show about space empires and giant robots.
While true in a general sense, I would argue sci fi genres have far more of a capacity to explore themes given that they aren't restrained towards the real world. Which additionally gives us awesome back drops like west world to operate within. Which is why I feel its a shame they haven't done more in any of its thematic departments.

Of course not. When humanity will be at the level of Galactic Empires and sentient robots we won't have to suspend our desbilief in the entire concept.

Joking aside, I think sci-fi like BSG, GitS and Westworld are so disconnected from our reality that making a substantial commentary on it simply won't work or inevitably will come off as half-baked as all the social commentary in Elysium.
I guess we can agree to disagree. I'm with you that it isn't easy but at the same as I mentioned above the fact that these worlds can be so removed from ours means we can have these conversations in settings otherwise unimaginable.
 

Jackpot

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,827
I don't get the appeal of "Colonial world". The Wild West as a setting has always left me cold, but I still get its appeal. Colonial India, even romanticised, is still going to be forced manners, classism, and the overall trying to shoehorn the trappings of another, much preferred (by the ruling class) country into another - all so the colonialists could pretend they weren't stuck in a (from their POV) squalid backwards part of the world surrounded by savages who they went out of their way not to interact with. Now Arabian Nights world with maybe some Indiana Jones trappings would be much better.
 

Cat Party

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,427
Lol'd at the Civil War era tactics of the security forces. Has it ever been explained why the security forces don't have access to armed aerial drones, which already exist today?

I do enjoy the show but I will be thrilled when it stops being a show about constant massacres and executions.
 

tino

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,561
I don't get the appeal of "Colonial world". The Wild West as a setting has always left me cold, but I still get its appeal. Colonial India, even romanticised, is still going to be forced manners, classism, and the overall trying to shoehorn the trappings of another, much preferred (by the ruling class) country into another - all so the colonialists could pretend they weren't stuck in a (from their POV) squalid backwards part of the world surrounded by savages who they went out of their way not to interact with. Now Arabian Nights world with maybe some Indiana Jones trappings would be much better.

Right. The fact that there is no video game set in the British Raj tells you that nobody wants that. The most memorable moment in the British Raj era was the redcoat tied the rebellion Indians to the cannon and executed them.
 

Chiaroscuro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,695
I don't get the appeal of "Colonial world". The Wild West as a setting has always left me cold, but I still get its appeal. Colonial India, even romanticised, is still going to be forced manners, classism, and the overall trying to shoehorn the trappings of another, much preferred (by the ruling class) country into another - all so the colonialists could pretend they weren't stuck in a (from their POV) squalid backwards part of the world surrounded by savages who they went out of their way not to interact with. Now Arabian Nights world with maybe some Indiana Jones trappings would be much better.

I think I can get the appeal of the "exotic". Hunting long extintect animals (remember the show is set in the future, where hunting should be a long gone memory) - but maybe for that Colonial Africa could be better -; explore strange temples and arquicteture (think Indiana Jones), and, hummm, also the exotic sex for the more hardcore players (maybe Old Arabia, like in 1001 nights would also be better for that, but maybe the showrunners don't want to risk entering anything related to Middle East in the show).
 

TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,449
Also I don't wanna hear any "well they aren't a military" or "we don't know how well trained they are" to explain away the open field ridiculousness.

If this is about my post, I didn't "explain away" the open field seen. I said - in more detail than I care to repeat - that people acting the security team should have the skill set of a unit of Navy SEALs is dumb in the context of the fiction. And it is.
 

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
Lol'd at the Civil War era tactics of the security forces. Has it ever been explained why the security forces don't have access to armed aerial drones, which already exist today?

I do enjoy the show but I will be thrilled when it stops being a show about constant massacres and executions.

I don't think they want to completely destroy the hosts beyond repair? Or, I can't remember, were they burning the host bodies? Beyond that I suppose they may not want to completely destroy infrastructure in the park, although Ford seemed to have no problem doing that.