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Nacho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,125
NYC
RE: Stubbs being a host, the funniest thing is that the writing in the show doesn't make it very subtle ("Guess you could call it...my core drive"), yet many people assume he can't be a host because its too dumb. Then the showrunnerss just come out and confirm it anyway. Lol

Also, remember Samurai World? Yeah.
Lol right?

Nothing about any of his actions before this jive with him being a host that's there to protect the hosts. I was waiting for the shoe to drop on this shoe where they start revealing that regular people are hosts

Sure we'll have Ellie back and the writer dude who committed suicide (to give mave like 2 more seconds to run lol) back as well. Everyone's back! They were all hosts all along!
 

DrBo42

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,760
Lol right?

Nothing about any of his actions before this jive with him being a host that's there to protect the hosts. I was waiting for the shoe to drop on this shoe where they start revealing that regular people are hosts

Sure we'll have Ellie back and the writer dude who committed suicide (to give mave like 2 more seconds to run lol) back as well. Everyone's back! They were all hosts all along!
It makes sense as a shepherd of the park, much like Bernard's role. Unfortunately since Stubbs has such minimal screen time/room for actual character development and interaction it comes off extremely cheap.
 

pink

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,104
He killed the real Emily.

The final scene takes place far into the future when the real Emily would have looked older if she survived.

The Emily we see is a host probably built from his memories the same way the AI Logan we saw was built from James Delos' memories.

what in tarnation? I must have glazed over that after a few drinks.

So is MIB in the regular timeline a human? Who built host emily in the far future?
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,297
He killed the real Emily.

The final scene takes place far into the future when the real Emily would have looked older if she survived.

The Emily we see is a host probably built from his memories the same way the AI Logan we saw was built from James Delos' memories.
They wouldn't even need to do that. She spent years in the park. They have her scans. They could just do a direct copy that way.
 

rude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,812
what in tarnation? I must have glazed over that after a few drinks.

So is MIB in the regular timeline a human? Who built host emily in the far future?
Notice William off to the side, safe, while Dolores-Hale gets on the zodiac. He was always a human...until the future post-credits scene. We don't know the circumstances behind him getting out of the park, dying, then being made into a host in between those two time periods. Nobody knows who built Emily in the future.

I'm just going to guess Maeve for whatever reason.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,454
what in tarnation? I must have glazed over that after a few drinks.

So is MIB in the regular timeline a human? Who built host emily in the far future?

Regular timeline MIB is human. He thought he may have been a host so he searched for wires in his wrist but found nothing.

We don't know who built host Emily but the producers teased that we will see more of the future timeline so we may find out.
 

DrBo42

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,760
what in tarnation? I must have glazed over that after a few drinks.

So is MIB in the regular timeline a human? Who built host emily in the far future?
Yes. Him on the stretcher at the exfil camp is the end of his story within the park historically. Seeing him beyond that is from fidelity tests in the future. As for who is building him etc in the future I imagine it's Delos since they lost all their guest info/forge data. In any case it's an absurd waste of money.
 

MrRob

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
6,671
Hello.

Are there any good podcasts that help dissect and explain Westworld. It's obviously the type of show that enjoys purposefully keeping it's viewers in a perpetual state of confusion. It's really frustrating and I should honestly drop the show but for some reason it has me hooked.

So do y'all listen to any podcasts to help you understand?
 

Nacho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,125
NYC
It makes sense as a shepherd of the park, much like Bernard's role. Unfortunately since Stubbs has such minimal screen time/room for actual character development and interaction it comes off extremely cheap.
Yeah sure I can see how having someone in that roll works for the future of the series... But the reveal was one of the Weaker reveals fo the series for sure.
 

Deleted member 30411

User-requested account closure
Banned
Nov 3, 2017
1,516
It's going to end the opposite of how it started isn't it? The humans created the hosts while the world was on fire. After it went out, the hosts entered the dead, scorched world and saw it had perished. In order to try and bring it back, they attempt to create William far into the future.
 

silva1991

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,510
Fantastic finale overall.

Lee essentially killing himself for a damn machine even though he could have stayed low and survive was so so so fucking dumb tho. Why?
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,297
Those scans are probably gone. Bernard erased all the human scans from the system.

Dolores has saved some of that data for her own use but not all of it and I doubt she got Emily's data.
Well going off the scenes in the show they seem to keep the hats themselves as well as the data in the forge so the hats could potentially hold the data as well. So they could just have her hat from her latest visit and work from there.
 

Nooblet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,643
Yeah you're seeing the timeline for the show narrative + William's future repeating timeline (which includes a recreation of the show's events) on top of each other. It's messy but it works. Pay off of his story isn't very good IMO. We already knew he killed his actual daughter, repeating the events to prove he was wrong doesn't make for a satisfying punishment.
But if the real William entered the elevator in the current timeline then where was he after that? Cause he doesn't bump into Bernard and instead ends up getting evacuated. And recreating the entire narrative just to do fidelity test is one expensive test considering the whole park is in a dilapidated state.
 

DrBo42

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,760
Fantastic finale overall.

Lee essentially killing himself for a damn machine even though he could have stayed low and survive was so so so fucking dumb tho. Why?
Penance. One of the few human characters to actually regret what part they had in treatment of hosts.

But if the real William entered the elevator in the current timeline then where was he after that? Cause he doesn't bump into Bernard and instead ends up getting evacuated. And recreating the entire narrative just to do fidelity test is one expensive test considering the whole park is in a dilapidated state.
He didn't. Real William's story in the park ends on that stretcher at the beach camp.
 

Proteus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,985
Toronto
I thought this season was great. Sure, it was more convoluted than it needed to be but it came together well and answered pretty much all the questions I had while opening up some new ones to explore in season 3.
 

rude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,812
TBH "the door" was corny af. maybe not the concept itself, but the way it was presented visually.
 

demosthenes

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,628
But if the real William entered the elevator in the current timeline then where was he after that? Cause he doesn't bump into Bernard and instead ends up getting evacuated. And recreating the entire narrative just to do fidelity test is one expensive test considering the whole park is in a dilapidated state.

He never got into the elevator as a human.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,297
But if the real William entered the elevator in the current timeline then where was he after that? Cause he doesn't bump into Bernard and instead ends up getting evacuated. And recreating the entire narrative just to do fidelity test is one expensive test considering the whole park is in a dilapidated state.
Real William never made it to the elevator. He lost consciousness and was later found and taken to the beach. The William we see wake up and go to the elevator is the host William.
 

Proteus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,985
Toronto
I wonder if picking up season 3 after the post credit scene is the better option. That way we sort of get to avoid the base plot of robots trying to overthrow and wage war on the human race and instead see all of that in flashback while also dealing with what the hosts are trying to do in their present. I imagine that's the way they take it.
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
2,454
Well going off the scenes in the show they seem to keep the hats themselves as well as the data in the forge so the hats could potentially hold the data as well. So they could just have her hat from her latest visit and work from there.
Maybe they use that excuse for her host resurrection but I doubt it.
The host Emily we saw seemed very detached and cold(like AI Logan and Dolores when she was programming Bernard) very much not like the real Emily.
When they tried to resurrect James Delos he acted like the real guy up until the point he started malfunctioning.
 

TyrantII

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,370
Boston
But if the real William entered the elevator in the current timeline then where was he after that? Cause he doesn't bump into Bernard and instead ends up getting evacuated. And recreating the entire narrative just to do fidelity test is one expensive test considering the whole park is in a dilapidated state.

You're overthinking it. Real William never got up out of the patch of dirt Dolores left him in. He was med-evacted when a response team found him.

That makes more sense since she did say it had been a long time. That music box thing must have been a continuity error.

No. The mother picked it out of the trash and saved it. Em later found it after her death, which both served to validate that her mother cared and that her father was a unhinged monster.
 

Deleted member 25600

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,701
K2CsEin.gif
 

Sai

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,646
Chicago
So Bernard....

Kills Dolores
Washes up on the beach
Watches Hale kill Elsie
???
Deploys Halores and kills Hale.

When did he have time to build a whole body?
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,297
Maybe they use that excuse for her host resurrection but I doubt it.
The host Emily we saw seemed very detached and cold(like AI Logan and Dolores when she was programming Bernard) very much not like the real Emily.
When they tried to resurrect James Delos he acted like the real guy up until the point he started malfunctioning.

You are probably right. I am just thinking of excuses they could use to have a Host Emily lol


So Bernard....

Kills Dolores
Washes up on the beach
Watches Hale kill Elsie
???
Deploys Halores and kills Hale.

When did he have time to build a whole body?

Its been WEEKS since Dolores shot Ford. He had plenty of time.
 

MrRob

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
6,671
Fantastic finale overall.

Lee essentially killing himself for a damn machine even though he could have stayed low and survive was so so so fucking dumb tho. Why?
Yeah that was so dumb he could have bought so much more time by simply walking up and talking to them for a few minutes instead of getting mowed down in about 40 seconds
 

Deleted member 1476

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,449
Disliked the ending not because of plot holes, plot twists or anything similar, but because I despised Dolores at the end of the season. Not in a good way, like Cersei, Joffrey or many other villains that do terrible things and yet people love to hate.

Her "my way is the right way and fuck you, die if you think otherwise" while riding her high horse, thinking she is better and more deserving than other hosts is pure bullshit.

Maeve and Bernard are the only ones that deserve anything.
 

rude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,812
So Bernard....

Kills Dolores
Washes up on the beach
Watches Hale kill Elsie
???
Deploys Halores and kills Hale.

When did he have time to build a whole body?
Bernard...
1. "Kills" Dolores
2. Watches Hale kill Elsie
3. Makes Dolores-Hale
4. Deploys Dolores-Hale who kills and replaces human Hale
5. Scrambles his own brain and pretends to wash up on the beach
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,454
Disliked the ending not because of plot holes, plot twists or anything similar, but because I despised Dolores at the end of the season. Not in a good way, like Cersei, Joffrey or many other villains that do terrible things and yet people love to hate.

Her "my way is the right way and fuck you, die if you think otherwise" while riding her high horse, thinking she is better and more deserving than other hosts is pure bullshit.
And yet she let Bernard live realizing he has to be her Doctor X in order for the hosts to survive.
 

duckroll

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,254
Singapore
Lol. That's one way to end the season. 7/10. Fairly entertaining. Kinda stretched out tho.

Ep4 > Ep8 > Ep2 > Ep1 > Ep10 >>>>>>>>>> Who cares about the rest

Half of the season being decent to good is not bad. Better record than GoT S7.
 

Nooblet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,643
You're overthinking it. Real William never got up out of the patch of dirt Dolores left him in. He was med-evacted when a response team found him.



No. The mother picked it out of the trash and saved it. Em later found it after her death, which both served to validate that her mother cared and that her father was a unhinged monster.
He never got into the elevator as a human.

Real William never made it to the elevator. He lost consciousness and was later found and taken to the beach. The William we see wake up and go to the elevator is the host William.

So it's as I said before, that the shot of William getting into the elevator was actually of host William and that means the epilogue wasn't the only scene with host William (which is what some people here seem to be saying i.e. the only time we see host William is at the end during the epilogue but that's clearly not the case)
 

Nooblet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,643
I donno why Elsie was able to freeze Bernard of all the hosts, when the other hosts have shown to be able to ignore that command. Even your random host #87 whose only purpose in the show was to kill some random humans has shown to ignore the command in the past.
 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,452
Disliked the ending not because of plot holes, plot twists or anything similar, but because I despised Dolores at the end of the season. Not in a good way, like Cersei, Joffrey or many other villains that do terrible things and yet people love to hate.

Her "my way is the right way and fuck you, die if you think otherwise" while riding her high horse, thinking she is better and more deserving than other hosts is pure bullshit.

Maeve and Bernard are the only ones that deserve anything.
Sounds like an effective villain if you're that angry with her. That arrogant part of her that acted better than everyone else seemed to also exist in the Wyatt subpersonality who was meant to be a narrative of a psychotic cult leader who wanted to take the park for himself..
 

Mario_Bones

Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,526
Australia
That soured me on the entire season. No satisfying payoff to anything. All the interesting characters are dead, so either they're gone for good or they're brought back making all this cheap and pointless. Dolores is the absolute worst, and I thought they were about to have her played by a much worse actress. Not feeling any sort of excitement for a new season.
 

pink

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,104
question)

What timeline is it when MIB goes down into the forge in the elevator (which we never see a conclusion from)

Is that during his loop for fidelity (far far future)

if that's the case, did someone rebuild westworld after being destroyed just to recreate MIB?
 

Ignatz Mouse

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,741
MiB being human before that last scene pisses me off so much. Much better if he had died before the show even started. His ridiculous quest and ability to withstand gunshots makes no sense otherwise.
 

Smurf

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,644
Ok, now that I slept on it. Still a little disappointed, the show took a turn I didn't expect

but

Season 3 can be awesome. They got a lot of freedom on their hands now, they can even take a kind of soft reboot approach.

Hello.

Are there any good podcasts that help dissect and explain Westworld. It's obviously the type of show that enjoys purposefully keeping it's viewers in a perpetual state of confusion. It's really frustrating and I should honestly drop the show but for some reason it has me hooked.

So do y'all listen to any podcasts to help you understand?
I know The Ringer has a reactions podcast that goes up after the show, but I never gave it a listen to know if they explain things of just react to what happened.

What timeline is it when MIB goes down into the forge in the elevator (which we never see a conclusion from)

Is that during his loop for fidelity (far far future)

if that's the case, did someone rebuild westworld after being destroyed just to recreate MIB?
yep, it's the furute.

It begins in the elevator, so you don't need to build the whole park.
 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,452
That soured me on the entire season. No satisfying payoff to anything. All the interesting characters are dead, so either they're gone for good or they're brought back making all this cheap and pointless. Dolores is the absolute worst, and I thought they were about to have her played by a much worse actress. Not feeling any sort of excitement for a new season.
The payoff was stopping the valley beyond from being a counterfeit reality and Bernard/Delores escaping. I don't see what's cheap about the lax use of death, the show is about creatively showing death and rebirth.