2020 Democratic Presidential Primary | OT | Hickenlooper makes it to the debate

Unknown Unknown · Feb 25, 2019

KingK said:
Sure thing,
1. Pete Buttigieg
2. Elizabeth Warren
3. Bernie Sanders
4. Kamala Harris

After that I don't really have a solid ranking. I just know that Biden and Booker are dead last.

I really recommend people check out Mayor Pete's various NPR interviews from last week, as well as his Morning Joe segment on YouTube. He's smart as hell, and seems best positioned to unite the party's factions (while being firmly in the progressive wing himself) and win a general as long as he could start gaining name recognition. He's fantastic at challenging establishment framing on policy questions and reframing it from a progressive angle. Plus he seems the most willing to push for the big structural changes needed to enact a lot of this policy. Hoping he at least gets enough donations to make the debates.

I just watched some Mayor Pete. There is an engaging presence just waiting there for the right expression and catch hold. He needs a CNN town hall. Undecided Dems that are leaning to support him need to show it now, show it early, show it strong before the chance is gone. Wear that support on their sleeves literally and figuratively. I would like to see him speak to large crowds.

When thinking of public speaking, motivation and the candidate going through this process, leading up to general election then the inauguration and the millions and millions they'd need to engage over that period of time and afterward, at that level, there are only a few of the candidates who seem like they could fully deliver.

Bernie Sanders
Beto O'Rourke
Kamala Harris
Marianne Williamson

There might be a couple that have it in reach and could still surprise though. Buttigieg2020!

Soul Skater · Feb 25, 2019

Hillary: Bernie spent too much and traveled too many places trying to help me get elected.

Wrap it up folks. He's done

pigeon · Feb 25, 2019

JustinP said:
FFS he was reporting back on their visit as part of their sister city program. The whole point is to be friendly.

http://burlingtonyaroslavl.com/about-us/

I don't think Kirblar is commenting on Bernie here so much as the tankies in our midst

Deleted member 22490 · Feb 25, 2019

pigeon said:
I don't think Kirblar is commenting on Bernie here so much as the tankies in our midst

The imaginary tankies

Kirblar · Feb 25, 2019

JustinP said:
FFS he was reporting back on their visit as part of their sister city program. The whole point is to be friendly.

http://burlingtonyaroslavl.com/about-us/

This is another visit the next year, going the other direction.
https://www.nhregister.com/neighbor...in-went-grocery-shopping-in-Clear-5759129.php

"When I saw those shelves crammed with hundreds, thousands of cans, cartons and goods of every possible sort, for the first time I felt quite frankly sick with despair for the Soviet people," Yeltsin wrote. "That such a potentially super-rich country as ours has been brought to a state of such poverty! It is terrible to think of it."

So no, it's not really cool. Their economic system was destroying them from within. Any visit organized by advocacy groups is gonna show you the good parts and leave out the bad.

Deleted member 31817 · Feb 25, 2019

Helio said:
The imaginary tankies

Or the 3 people he quoted praising the USSR

Either or

Chaos Legion · Feb 25, 2019

Melkr_ said:
Can poorly researched hit pieces like this constitute a dragging? More like they only help him re-build a narrative of the media / mainstream against him.

I was referring to the fact that Bernie is going to go under significantly more scrutiny than he did in 2016. I don't understand how that is debatable. He's not a saint and I'm sure with all eyes focused on him, something substantial will arise.

Anyway, current ranking:
1. Beto
2. Kamala
3. Biden

Brown and Klobuchar would round out my top 5 though, but doubt either have a chance. Not really feeling anyone else, but would love for an Obama type dark horse to enter and galvanize the party.

Madison · Feb 25, 2019

Psychoward said:
Or the 3 people he quoted praising the USSR

Well thats...certainly one way to see it.

Kirblar · Feb 25, 2019

Trying to attack someone on carbon emissions from a private jet is "how you doing fellow kids" nonsense and deserves to be mocked for the sheer ridiculousness.

pigeon · Feb 25, 2019

Fork said:
Well thats...certainly one way to see it.

So how do you see it?

Deleted member 31817 · Feb 25, 2019

Fork said:
Well thats...certainly one way to see it.

>Video of man praising the ussr

>Praise man for the video

What else is the takeaway here exactly

Deleted member 22490 · Feb 25, 2019

Psychoward said:
Or the 3 people he quoted praising the USSR

Either or

tankies defend the ussr no matter what or ignore the indefensible shit like the holomodor.

Thinking that what Sanders said in the video was cool is no where near tankie level.

sphagnum · Feb 25, 2019

Kirblar said:
This is another visit the next year, going the other direction.
https://www.nhregister.com/neighbor...in-went-grocery-shopping-in-Clear-5759129.php

So no, it's not really cool. Their economic system was destroying them from within. Any visit organized by advocacy groups is gonna show you the good parts and leave out the bad.

Disgusting, the election-stealing thief Boris Yeltsin praising the products of imperialistic super exploitation of the third world and the market economy founded on the wage slavery of the proletariat. Typical capitalist roader!

Tomohawk · Feb 25, 2019

OtherWorldly said:
Arline stuff is fluff. If this is true , it's another example of sanders ego and arrogance

Has politico always been anti bernie this is some mountain out of an ant hill shit.

shamanick · Feb 25, 2019

Kirblar said:
It's not cool in the slightest. The USSR was trash.

Good thing he wasn't unequivocally praising the USSR. Did you watch the video?

brainchild · Feb 25, 2019

Kirblar said:
The USSR was trash.

The USA IS trash, right now, in 2019.

Kirblar · Feb 25, 2019

Tomohawk said:
Has politico always been anti bernie this is some mountain out of an ant hill shit.

The second part is actually an issue but the stupid carbon shit headlining will mean no one actually gets to it.

I almost wonder if this is them deliberately going for hate-clickbait.

brainchild said:
The USA IS trash, right now, in 2019.

It's not. It's got major issues, but "literally unable to keep food on store shelves" being a problem isn't one of them.

Soul Skater · Feb 25, 2019

Kirblar said:
Trying to attack someone on carbon emissions from a private jet is "how you doing fellow kids" nonsense and deserves to be mocked for the sheer ridiculousness.

Have a pretty good feeling Hillary and her buddies are gonna over reach so hard trying to stop Bernie from getting the nomination they'll actively damage Kamala, Biden or whoever by being so transparent about it

JustinP · Feb 25, 2019

pigeon said:
I don't think Kirblar is commenting on Bernie here so much as the tankies in our midst

Doesn't seem like it:

Kirblar said:
This is another visit the next year, going the other direction.
https://www.nhregister.com/neighbor...in-went-grocery-shopping-in-Clear-5759129.php

So no, it's not really cool. Their economic system was destroying them from within. Any visit organized by advocacy groups is gonna show you the good parts and leave out the bad.

Watch the video. He's not arguing the US should seize the means of production and mimic all aspects of USSR life.

Bernie and his wife were praising things like their public transit and arts -- this childish attitude where you can't praise any aspect of a problematic nation, especially in the context of a friendly sister city program where you'd naturally compliment things you liked about your hosts, is just dumb.

Madison · Feb 25, 2019

Psychoward said:
>Video of man praising the ussr

>Praise man for the video

What else is the takeaway here exactly

Ok I"ll explain myself.

Me (and other people) respecting Bernie for being a part of a cultural experience no longer possible and sharing what impressed him about said system doesnt mean that Im (or they are) praising the USSR.

Its possible to listen to someone talk about the Soviet Union, its also possible to be interested in knowing about a system with different flaws and positives than what we have right now. That doesnt mean I want that system or that Im praising it. Im interested in knowing about Desarrollismo but I wouldnt exactly support a candidate running with that ideology.

I am not saying in any way that the atrocities and human rights violations committed by the soviets didnt happen, I think that any pretense of the USSR being socialist was dropped the second they massacred the hungarians when they tried to do their own socialist system. But I am also interested in knowing about what that system also meant in terms of positives, and the video shows a bit of that, which is why I find it interesting and cool.

sphagnum · Feb 25, 2019

The USSR and the US were both evil so who gives a shit if Bernie thought their train stations and theaters were nice?

This was during Gorbachev's time, when the Cold War was actively ending and a thaw had set in. It's not like he was there during Stalin's reign talking about how wonderful the aesthetics of the penal colonies were.

lmcfigs · Feb 25, 2019

He said 3 good things about the USSR, Kirlblar. Not that their entire economy was great.

Damaniel · Feb 25, 2019

weirder said:
Anyone want to share their candidate rankings for the start of the week?

#marianne2020

Harris, Warren, O'Rourke, Inslee, Buttigieg, Yang, Gillibrand, Biden, Sanders, Klobuchar, Booker

I know there's others in the race but they're not on my radar. Curious to see if any show up and who they are.

It's far too early for me to commit to anything right now, but based on what I know, I'd rank this way:

Harris
Warren
Sanders
O'Rourke
...
Biden
...
...
Booker
The rest
...
...
...
...
Gabbard - The only candidate I'd have to think twice about voting for (though I'd still take her over Trump any day of the week)

Yang and Inslee are great candidates to push for single important issues (and to get those ideas into the debates), but I don't think they have any chance at the nomination.

I really hope we're not forced to go with Biden. I like him as a person, but I think his brand of centrism and his desire to try to cross the aisle just isn't what I'm looking for this time around. He'd be perfectly competent (hence his placement in the middle somewhere), but completely uninspiring.

pigeon · Feb 25, 2019

Kirblar said:
The second part is actually an issue but the stupid carbon shit headlining will mean no one actually gets to it.

I almost wonder if this is them deliberately going for hate-clickbait.

It is.

lmcfigs · Feb 25, 2019

Yes it is very petty and troubling if Bernie really did that.

Suzushiiro · Feb 25, 2019

OtherWorldly said:
Arline stuff is fluff. If this is true , it's another example of sanders ego and arrogance

Given the schedule I'm thinking they were justified in flying private.

Cocaloch · Feb 25, 2019

I've yet to see an actual tankie on this site even though I hear about them constantly. Almost like people just use the word as a vapid pejorative.

pigeon · Feb 25, 2019

sphagnum said:
The USSR and the US were both evil so who gives a shit if Bernie thought their train stations and theaters were nice?

This was during Gorbachev's time, when the Cold War was actively ending and a thaw had set in. It's not like he was there during Stalin's reign talking about how wonderful the aesthetics of the penal colonies were.

Right. Bernie was there doing diplomacy. So it's fine and I don't blame Bernie for that. But the correct reaction to "this guy is saying nice things about a totalitarian murder state because it's his job" is probably not "sugoi ne", it's more like "well at least he knows how to say nice things about a bad situation professionally."

Tomohawk · Feb 25, 2019

Bernies cant compliment aspects of USSR? How do yall feel about complimenting israel an apartheid state.

sphagnum · Feb 25, 2019

I think what we can all agree on is that it's OK to say positive things about abjectly awful countries that commit daily human rights abuses (America, China, Israel, the UAE, etc.) so long as they are capitalist.

But when a country has a rickety economic system, then we can agree that they're not just problematic, they're especially bad!

samoyed · Feb 25, 2019

Cocaloch said:
I've yet to see an actual tankie on this site even though I hear about them constantly. Almost like people just use the word as a vapid pejorative.

You're back! And you changed your avatar.

That is

pigeon said:
sugoi ne

Suzushiiro · Feb 25, 2019

weirder said:
Anyone want to share their candidate rankings for the start of the week?

#marianne2020

Harris, Warren, O'Rourke, Inslee, Buttigieg, Yang, Gillibrand, Biden, Sanders, Klobuchar, Booker

I know there's others in the race but they're not on my radar. Curious to see if any show up and who they are.

Please be one of them I don't particularly care which it is at the moment tier: Warren, Sanders
Like what I've heard but haven't looked too closely also they don't stand a chance in hell with a field this crowded tier: Buttigieg, Yang
Eh, could be worse I guess tier: Gillibrand, Booker
For the love of christ please run for/stay in the Senate and let someone else take out Trump so we can maybe have a majority in 2021 tier: O'Rourke, Brown
I'll support them over Trump but for the love of fuck can I please not have to do that tier: Harris, Biden, Klobuchar

Tfritz · Feb 25, 2019

Tomohawk said:
Bernies cant compliment aspects of USSR? How do yall feel about complimenting israel an apartheid state.

tbh i don't think calling israel an apartheid state is really much of a compliment

pigeon · Feb 25, 2019

sphagnum said:
I think what we can all agree on is that it's OK to say positive things about abjectly awful countries that commit daily human rights abuses (America, China, Israel, the UAE, etc.) so long as they are capitalist.

But when a country has a rickety economic system, then we can agree that they're not just problematic, they're especially bad!

Did you have to give all the good arguments away to somebody else who needed them more because this is really below your standard

Soul Skater · Feb 25, 2019

Edit: forget it

Cocaloch · Feb 25, 2019

samoyed said:
You're back! And you changed your avatar.

That is

Yes, my 30 days in the desert are done. Truly I've had time to think on my despicable actions and grow as a person.

Tfritz said:
tbh i don't think calling israel an apartheid state is really much of a compliment

I think it's fairly obvious an apartheid state was meant to be an appositive there.

kambaybolongo · Feb 25, 2019

Tomohawk said:
Has politico always been anti bernie this is some mountain out of an ant hill shit.

Since day one lol

They're essentially publishing tabloid gossip from disgruntled Clinton staffers

Kirblar · Feb 25, 2019

Cocaloch said:
I've yet to see an actual tankie on this site even though I hear about them constantly. Almost like people just use the word as a vapid pejorative.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/i-...-subreddit-loves-communism.29285/post-5536289

They exist.

samoyed · Feb 25, 2019

Soul Skater said:
Edit: forget it

I saw that bro don't think you can hide that shade.

Soul Skater · Feb 25, 2019

samoyed said:
I saw that bro don't think you can hide that shade.

Jas · Feb 25, 2019

Bernie Sanders: The would-be first Jewish president is poised to break the bipartisan consensus on the Jewish state.

Cocaloch · Feb 25, 2019

Kirblar said:
https://www.resetera.com/threads/i-...-subreddit-loves-communism.29285/post-5536289

They exist.

That's certainly on the spectrum of being a tankie, and I guess I should have emphasized the second part of that statement. Certainly I don't see any of the more prolific posters that are called tankies actually being tankies.

As an aside it's a good thing I am in total lockstep with the moderation team here or I'd need to point out that banning someone for "historical revisionism" is uh interesting.

pigeon · Feb 25, 2019

Do a search for the guy I had to report for "supporting dekulakization"

Deleted member 2145 · Feb 25, 2019

ex hillary staffers gonna fuck around and get trump elected twice

Tom Nook Says... · Feb 25, 2019

RailWays said:
Sanders

Buttigieg

Warren

Harris

Yang

This is my exact top five, except I'd rearrange it:

1) Harris
2) Buttigieg
3) Yang
4) Bernie
5) Warren

Bernie and Warren are basically tied for #4 but I have a little more faith in Bernie to beat Trump. I know Buttigieg and Yang are both long-shot candidates but I find them both really appealing. I initially thought Yang would be weird the way most single-issue fringe candidates are, but he's actually a damn good candidate and has a really robust platform. We're honestly spoiled this election cycle in terms of good options. Harris remains #1 because she is continually proving to be the most savvy campaigner while not backing down from progressive policies on 9 out of 10 issues. When I think "Who would I want to see debate Trump the most" it's hard to think of someone other than Kamala.

Tfritz · Feb 25, 2019

Jas said:
Bernie Sanders: The would-be first Jewish president is poised to break the bipartisan consensus on the Jewish state.

It'd be nice, but I'm afraid he'll back down like he did in the 2016 cycle after the backlash.

Kirblar · Feb 25, 2019

Jas said:
Bernie Sanders: The would-be first Jewish president is poised to break the bipartisan consensus on the Jewish state.

I suspect he's not gonna broach this topic until after the Israeli elections because it's a very different type of conversation depending on the political outcome. Even AIPAC's unhappy about Netanyahu's proposed coalition plans.

Soul Skater · Feb 25, 2019

1) Bernie
2) someone who shows me they don't suck and can win over the course of the next year
3) don't care

Unknown Unknown · Feb 25, 2019

Williamson brought reparations to the national conversation to round out a memorable Black History Month.

How will Women's History Month begin?

Latpri · Feb 25, 2019

Indiana Jones said:
This plane thing is a big waste of time. If Hillaryworld wants to attack Bernie, they can start by pointing out, from experience, that being the runner-up from the last Dem primary brings with it a lot of baggage that can easily blow up in your candidate's face.

None of the people Hillary surrounded herself with were very smart. This is why her campaign failed and these attacks look pathetic

2020 Democratic Presidential Primary | OT | Hickenlooper makes it to the debate

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