Vintage

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,305
Europe
It gave you the most recent results from the look of it. Try adding "OT" to your search if you want the OT.
Is it most recent by creation date? Because the OT thread had post just minutes ago, and it's nowhere near top results. IMO if I search by "relevance" it should display threads by popularity? What does "Order by relevance" do?

Funny enough, when I search "steam deck ot" it displays only 4 results and NONE of those are that OT thread. It shouldn't be that hard to search for the main hub of anything, especially when it's very active has 8000+ replies...
 
OP
OP
B-Dubs

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
General Manager
Oct 25, 2017
33,097
Is it most recent by creation date? Because the OT thread had post just minutes ago, and it's nowhere near top results. IMO if I search by "relevance" it should display threads by popularity? What does "Order by relevance" do?

Funny enough, when I search "steam deck ot" it displays only 4 results and NONE of those are that OT thread. It shouldn't be that hard to search for the main hub of anything, especially when it's very active has 8000+ replies...
That particular thread is over a year old, which is likely the issue you are finding. Again, my suggestion would be to add "OT" to your search when looking for an OT.
 

Vintage

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,305
Europe
That particular thread is over a year old, which is likely the issue you are finding. Again, my suggestion would be to add "OT" to your search when looking for an OT.

Yes, I added "OT" and nothing came up. Yes, I know the thread was created a while ago. It does not matter. It's an active thread and the main hub for Steam Deck community.
Imagine you're new here and want to find a place to discuss your Steam Deck, so you search for it. Here's a task for you - find that thread using search (in the first page of search results), but pretend you don't know the exact spelling of the thread, creation date or anything.
 

Ashes of Dreams

Fallen Guardian of Unshakable Resolve
Member
May 22, 2020
14,796
Yes, I added "OT" and nothing came up. Yes, I know the thread was created a while ago. It does not matter. It's an active thread and the main hub for Steam Deck community.
Imagine you're new here and want to find a place to discuss your Steam Deck, so you search for it. Here's a task for you - find that thread using search (in the first page of search results), but pretend you don't know the exact spelling of the thread, creation date or anything.
You probably couldn't find it because it's called OT2 and not OT. I think it's per word so OT wasn't picking up OT2.

But in this instance if you WANT the OT, wouldn't you just search Steam Deck in the Hangout section? Wouldn't that solve it?
 

Vintage

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,305
Europe
You probably couldn't find it because it's called OT2 and not OT. I think it's per word so OT wasn't picking up OT2.

But in this instance if you WANT the OT, wouldn't you just search Steam Deck in the Hangout section? Wouldn't that solve it?

Well that won't work because It's not in Hangout section, but I can't know this without searching.
I used this Steam Deck thread as an example, literally just looked at the main forum, picked a random thread and tried searching for it and it didn't show up in any searches. However, this was my consistent experience with searching for threads for a long time now. Maybe it's just my problem, but I don't see how it's a good user experience when I search by relevance and the biggest main OT for a topic is not even in the first results page.
 

Ashes of Dreams

Fallen Guardian of Unshakable Resolve
Member
May 22, 2020
14,796
Well that won't work because It's not in Hangout section, but I can't know this without searching.
I used this Steam Deck thread as an example, literally just looked at the main forum, picked a random thread and tried searching for it and it didn't show up in any searches. However, this was my consistent experience with searching for threads for a long time now. Maybe it's just my problem, but I don't see how it's a good user experience when I search by relevance and the biggest main OT for a topic is not even in the first results page.

I feel like "relevance" is such a nebulous term that it's hard to really pinpoint what it means in this context. I have no idea how the back-end for this search works and what the "relevance" option is even looking for. Usually it's some algorithm balancing date, frequency of posts, or usage of terms. I'm honestly not sure if it would recognize an old thread like an OT as being more relevant than recent news threads, so I can't comment on that. All I know is that I never use it in any website that has it, from Reddit all the way to here. It's always a mixed bag. In this case the OT was on the second page, so it's not like it's buried, but it's never going to be a human curated list, you know?

I use searches a lot and I look for threads a lot. There's a lot of threads on this forum so I know it can be a lot to sort through some times. In the case of the Steam Deck OT, I'm not sure why it's in Gaming and not in Hangouts because I don't fully understand the OT culture here tbh, but it's actually irrelevant to the situation since your problem would have occurred no matter where it is. Right now if you extend the search to the whole forum, it IS the option that will come up when you search "Steam Deck OT" and I think that's because they actually edited the title from "OT2" to "OT 2" so what I said in my previous post has been addressed. But you can test this yourself. Do a title search on the whole forum for "OT" and then "OT2" or "OT10". Because there's no space, it registers those as different words. This is the correct way the search feature should work, of course. You can't have it able to tell that "OT10" should also come up for "OT" without it also including ANY word with the letters o and t next to each other, like every thread with the word "other" would come up.

So the problem here isn't with the search feature, it's with how people label their threads. That's what your actual issue with finding the Steam Deck OT was and it's why someone trying to find the current, say, Genshin Impact OT, couldn't just search "Genshin Impact OT" and see it as the first result, they'll only see the original one. If you want this problem to be addressed, people just need to put a space between OT and the number for all OTs moving forward. I feel like a lot of examples of people not being able to find something with the search feature usually boils down to something like this, you have to be particular with your wording and most people don't title their threads with the search function in mind.

Not trying to dismiss you or anything mind you, I don't work on the forum or anything so I've got no skin in the game, just legitimately trying to be helpful.
 

DownUnderCoder

Administrator
Dec 15, 2018
647
is there a way of doing an exact phrase search for anything that contains a space in it?
Use quotes; "exact phrase search"

Unrelated question, don't know where to ask this. But why is superscript and subscript disabled?
They where somewhat enabled, but not working correctly. Should be fixed now.

I feel like "relevance" is such a nebulous term that it's hard to really pinpoint what it means in this context. I have no idea how the back-end for this search works and what the "relevance" option is even looking for. Usually it's some algorithm balancing date, frequency of posts, or usage of terms.
Search "relevancy" is frankly something of a confusing and complex mess that algorithmically tries to get something which "looks right" for search results.

But tokenization of how to split words for the most relevant search results is frankly an unsolvable problem. OT vs OT2 is just one of those really hard things for a computer to get right. At least without having multiple research teams and significant development resources.

Much easier just to get the thread labelled/tagged with something useful
 
Last edited:
Jun 17, 2023
580
They where somewhat enabled, but not working correctly. Should be fixed now.
Holy fuck. Thanks. Thank you very much.
yJM1I2H.jpg

Superscript​ and Subscript​ are back on the menu.
 
Last edited:

DownUnderCoder

Administrator
Dec 15, 2018
647
You probably couldn't find it because it's called OT2 and not OT. I think it's per word so OT wasn't picking up OT2.
Some changes have been deployed so threads tagged "OT" (ie with the thread tag OT) as if they had that in the title which should handle the case of OT2/OT30/whatever. It is a manual process to tag threads with OT as not all thread creators have used it, but a number has been bulk updated.

Autocomplete search for "stream deck OT" should also return more relevant search hits instead of the incorrectly truncated list it had before.
 
Jun 17, 2023
580
DownUnderCoder

Hey mate, thanks for the fix earlier on sub and sup. I just checked the BB list and I think see an edit:
Ta7GVvj.png

9NpKrUM.png

I feel these are quite redundant. Though, I get that one is for text, while the other is for numbers.
 

DownUnderCoder

Administrator
Dec 15, 2018
647
It showing twice is a bug, but it needs more debugging on how to fix that while retaining the copy & paste support.
 

Ashes of Dreams

Fallen Guardian of Unshakable Resolve
Member
May 22, 2020
14,796
Some changes have been deployed so threads tagged "OT" (ie with the thread tag OT) as if they had that in the title which should handle the case of OT2/OT30/whatever. It is a manual process to tag threads with OT as not all thread creators have used it, but a number has been bulk updated.

Autocomplete search for "stream deck OT" should also return more relevant search hits instead of the incorrectly truncated list it had before.
Oh wow. When I made that post I honestly didn't think it was something that could be fixed, figured it was just a quirk of all search engines and that people would need to be more specific with their thread titles. But that did indeed completely solve the issue. Using my Genshin Impact example, searching just "Genshin Impact OT" as a title search on the whole forum brings up a list of all of them. Very cool.
 

PaulLFC

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,179
Unsure if this is an Era issue or with XenForo itself, but as it's a Search-related issue I thought I'd bring it up.

Sometimes, when you click on the search box, instead of the keyboard appearing, it will rapidly flash and then disappear. You have to navigate to another page to get search to work again, which can make searching a thread tricky.

This has been happening for a long time, but I was never sure whether it was an Era issue or my phone/keyboard app. However I've now seen it across 2 phones (OnePlus 7T and Samsung Galaxy S23+), and across different keyboards (SwiftKey and Samsung Keyboard). So I think it's unlikely to be a setup issue.

Here's a video of the issue:


View: https://youtube.com/shorts/Ns48Yy0d0S8
 

Spoit

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,080
Unsure if this is an Era issue or with XenForo itself, but as it's a Search-related issue I thought I'd bring it up.

Sometimes, when you click on the search box, instead of the keyboard appearing, it will rapidly flash and then disappear. You have to navigate to another page to get search to work again, which can make searching a thread tricky.

This has been happening for a long time, but I was never sure whether it was an Era issue or my phone/keyboard app. However I've now seen it across 2 phones (OnePlus 7T and Samsung Galaxy S23+), and across different keyboards (SwiftKey and Samsung Keyboard). So I think it's unlikely to be a setup issue.

Here's a video of the issue:


View: https://youtube.com/shorts/Ns48Yy0d0S8

Prety sure that's something to do with the CSS. Probably abusing !important. Other xenforo don't have that problem since the default is a popup card with the advanced search instead of that bar that's stuck to the top of the screen
 

PaulLFC

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,179
Prety sure that's something to do with the CSS. Probably abusing !important. Other xenforo don't have that problem since the default is a popup card with the advanced search instead of that bar that's stuck to the top of the screen
Thanks for confirming. Hopefully as it's Era-specific it's something the tech team will be able to look into when they have chance.
 
Jun 17, 2023
580
Unsure if this is an Era issue or with XenForo itself, but as it's a Search-related issue I thought I'd bring it up.

Sometimes, when you click on the search box, instead of the keyboard appearing, it will rapidly flash and then disappear. You have to navigate to another page to get search to work again, which can make searching a thread tricky.

This has been happening for a long time, but I was never sure whether it was an Era issue or my phone/keyboard app. However I've now seen it across 2 phones (OnePlus 7T and Samsung Galaxy S23+), and across different keyboards (SwiftKey and Samsung Keyboard). So I think it's unlikely to be a setup issue.

Here's a video of the issue:


View: https://youtube.com/shorts/Ns48Yy0d0S8
That happens on a regular. You need to scroll to the top of the screen (until you can't scroll anymore) so it won't act that way. It's the same for the forum stats, if you aren't at the top it won't show.
 
OP
OP
B-Dubs

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
General Manager
Oct 25, 2017
33,097
I'll see if there's something we can do about the mobile issues. That said, put it in the tech thread with your phone model and whatever browser you use. That sort of info helps a lot.