Battle Passes are turning games into work instead of fun

[Hamster Plugin]

Today marks the start of a new season in Apex Legends and a new expansion for Destiny 2, both games that I'm interested in playing. But both games feature a battle pass system, in which you must grind to gain levels. This makes playing both games very difficult.


In Apex Legends, in order to max out your battle pass at level 110, you must gain at least 8 levels per week. To do so, you must finish 10 Daily Challenges every week for 2 battle pass levels and get 24000 additional experience points to get 3 more battle pass levels. This requires you to play for 4 out of 7 days each week because you get 3 daily challenges every day so you get your 10th on day 4. This is the minimum requirement that also assumes that you are going to finish each of the 3 weekly challenges that are not time limited so you reach your required rate of 8 levels per week.

In Destiny 2, the exact requirements are currently unknown but there are 100 battle pass levels to do and there are microtransactions tied to it so it will most likely not be an easy task. What has been announced is that you must gain XP by playing the game. There are no announced weekly chores so far, so this is probably going to be easier than Apex Legends, but you still must play actively to get the XP needed.


It's getting to the point that games are now demanding you to complete your chores rather than let you have fun at your own pace. Can you even play two games like this simultaneously? There is absolutely no way I could fit in a third game like this with yet another Battle Pass with possible time limited challenges. Is this fun any more?

 

[Bedameister]

Yeah, that's why I'm avoiding GaaS games. I thought I would try Gears 5 again after not playing any MP games in ages. I had fun at first but then I saw that there are unlockables and challanges that have to be done within a time span and I just said fuck it.

(except for Pokemon GO of course. I'm a sucker for Pokemon GO)

 

[Falus]

It's not fun unless you live for that game. I stopped playing game that require this.
i love destiny 2 gameplay but the weekly chores drove Me away. It didn't need battle pass even the first one. Wait for weekly reboot. Go there do this. Repeat that. Oh and these daily activities too

 

[MidnightMania]

Exactly why I stopped playing Fortnite. Played 4 full seasons and didn't really play anything else and it had an affect on my attitude towards games. I didn't want to play anything else and was starting to resent it. Now that I've stopped playing Fortnite, I enjoy gaming again.

 

[texhnolyze]

Me reading the OP:

 

[Pankratous]

Yeah. I enjoy the battle pass in Apex for the amount of content I get the low price, and supporting an otherwise free game, but fuck me I am not paying for Season 3 BP. Feels like I've been working at home on Apex for the last few months on S1/S2.

 

[Cliff Steele]

The only Battle Pass that I have ever seen that asked a reasonable amount of time to get to max level is Red Dead Online's.

But I get what you are saying. I like destiny but I'm not going to play it anymore because of the passes. I don't want to spent all my time just playing one game and if I'm not getting the pass I have serious FOMO. I don't know why.

And yes, games become a chore because pubs want to arbitrarily lengthen the time that a player spends in-game and tie you to their product.

 

[Banzai]

Absolutely, I had to stop playing Fortnite because of it. Too much busywork. Now I don't get any battle passes anymore and just try to play the game for the fun of it. That way I can stop whenever I want instead of feeling forced to keep playing because "I get this battle passes value in ingame curreny back if I grind enough!"

 

[Alienous]

Well that's the idea behind selling microtransactions. When they give you the opportunity to earn them it isn't them being generous, it's there to be tedious and contrast how much easier it would be to pay for them. It's just about wearing down your resolve.

 

[Putosaure]

Yeah wanted to get the Battle Pass for Rocket League, but I'm afraid I'll feel that I have to play the game to make it worth it. So... no.

 

[Noppie]

One could always simply play the games without going for the battle pass. Aren't those cosmetics only for most games?

 

[SirKai]

I'm still on the Apex high but I played Apex for about 50 hours in Season 2 and finished the Battle Pass a month ago (and it ends tomorrow). I do totally sympathize with the mantra about how task oriented these games are, and how they do everything they can to be one of the few games you dedicate time to (which is really obnoxious), but I thought the Season 2 BP was really reasonable. Once I got to levels 85-90 I stopped worrying about doing specific challenges, unless they were REALLY simple, like Play as X Character or Land in 4 Locations, and still leveled up very briskly. If the S3 BP is similarly designed then I think it'll be fine as long as MHW Iceborne doesn't drag me away too much.

 

[sredgrin]

They are meant for people that have it as their lifestyle game. Yeah, you're probably not gonna fit 2 or 3 games into your rotation like this, they are built that way.

It will be "playing your way" for a lot of their audience already. You just aren't the audience.

 

[Pellaidh]

Destiny 2 was already grindy as hell before, so I'm hoping that the season pass will make it somewhat better. At the very least, tying at least some progression to XP that you can earn anywhere you want seems like a good change. As opposed to before, where you had to play specific game modes to get decent loot, even if you hated them.

But for other games, yeah it's kind of a pain, similar to subscription MMOs. Makes it feel like you have to play the game non-stop just to get your money's worth. Daily quests have been a thing in free to play games since forever, but at least those generally didn't require you to pay real money to get them.

 

[leng jai]

Sounds like the future for subscription service games.

 

[Greywaren]

I never purchase Battle Passes for this very reason. I get stressed because I have a deadline to finish the challenges and I don't want any more deadlines. I want games to be fun and relaxing, so that's not for me.

But I'm not against them, either. People who spend a lot of time playing a single game can get a lot out of them, and as long as it's not locking major content behind a paywall I'm fine with them.

 

[Rodelero]

I'm glad someone has made this thread because I broadly agree. While I can see why people are generally in favour of Battle Passes as opposed to certain other monetisation schemes, I absolutely despised the Battle Pass system in Fortnite after a few cycles of it. The challenges are very often less fun to complete than playing the game normally. In Fortnite particularly they also have a dramatic effect on the way the game is being played by others that can lead to a lot of very dull matches (because so many people die early dropping at the key location of the week).

Then there's the more ethical side of them as monetisation. They are clearly designed to make users play the game in a habitual manner (not necessarily for all that long but very frequently).

 

[Rickenslacker]

One could always simply play the games without going for the battle pass. Aren't those cosmetics only for most games?

Click to shrink...

Yeah, but they usually prey on FOMO in that while they're cosmetic, they're usually exclusive to that battle pass. So once the opportunity passes, it's gone for good.

 

[0ptimusPayne]

Agreed. Bought season two battle pass for Apex to support the devs, and was done with the checklist after week 4. It really did feel like busting out your chores, just to be able to relax and enjoy the game without having to worry about getting 100 headshots with an lmg.

 

[nofriendo]

One could always simply play the games without going for the battle pass. Aren't those cosmetics only for most games?

Click to shrink...

Exactly, I still play these games but not to grind out battle pass levels. If you enjoy playing them then you will move up through the levels and if you only casually play you don't have to care about them. You don't have to part take in it to enjoy playing a game.....

Would be interested to know if the people here saying they have stopped playing games because of a battle pass would buy the items independently ?

 

[giancarlo123x]

Red dead has the best battle pass. Used the gold I easily earned in game to get it and hit all 70 levels within a week since all you need is 1k xp every level and everything you do gives you that.

 

[Eggiem]

The worst thing is that they want to hook you forever. Almost everything is too grindy these days.

 

[Remo Williams]

I just play as much as I feel like, and don't bother myself with reaching the max level or any such nonsense. The incentives to play more are sometimes alluring, but you can ignore them if you value playing for fun above all else.

 

[Static]

I don't know about others, but Apex and Fortnite give you enough of their premium currency through the pass to allow you to buy the next pass. And they sell those levels to boot. In other words, they want you to buy levels, and they want you to just miss your battle pass goals to have to pay actual money for the next battle pass. The unreasonable time demands are all part of the plan. Unless you're playing a lot of this game, you probably aren't supposed to "make it."

 

[J2d]

Somewhat agree but I still love em, only tried two (dota and gears) and felt like they gave plenty of time to complete.

 

[Deleted member 2254]

Fortnite has the worst version since it pushes you towards playing the game in "wrong" ways to have a chance to finish the pass. The others make sense if you play a lot: Rocket League, in particular, is very easy to finish if you play somewhat regularly and you don't really have to do anything outrageous to get it done. The one in Apex Legends on the other hand is very grindy, and unless you're already going to play every other way it's just not really worth bothering with it.

 

[Noppie]

Yeah, but they usually prey on FOMO in that while they're cosmetic, they're usually exclusive to that battle pass. So once the opportunity passes, it's gone for good.

Click to shrink...

Yeah I get that, but the game is still the same. I used to play Fortnite only to do challenges, gotta get to tier 100 right? But guess what, the game is still fun while just... playing the game. If you can get over that mental barrier, and you can, it's still very fun and easy to play the games without having to do the battle passes.

 

[Ravelle]

I'm playing Siege and their cosmetic shop is a mess, you can earn almost everything with earned points but every color swap costume is between 10L and 22K which is a lot of playing for a different color and it's an insult to your investment. Not every character has the same amount of items up for sale, the year 1 and 2 operations stick lack any unique looking items and elite skins.

I play that game weekly and progress a lot without any reward so a battlepass that gets me new gear every level would be nice.

 

[Patapuf]

Battle passes are just like achievements.

Do them for games you enjoy playing anyway and stop when you start doing them for their own sake.

I get it, FOMO and not wanting to "waste money" can be a strong pull, but one should ask, "is it worth it to buy one with the amount i play?" instead of " i want to get the max reward".

 

[leng jai]

I've heard countless people say they would rather have lootboxes back after looking at the Battle Pass in Gears 5.

 

[.exe]

Timed events, limited availability of rewards, seasons, weekly/daily activities are at the foundation of emulating the work treadmill and exploiting the fear of missing out. But the battle passes are so generous, they say. The rewards so good. In the "good ones" everything is tuned to be just a few matches away. Sure, you could just not get the battle pass, avoid engaging with the Skinner box. But why not marvel at how impeccably many of these systems are designed to keep you hooked or engaged? Plus, the trap or the lure may seem obvious or uninteresting to you, but then you're not the target most likely — just like loot boxes aren't designed to be a spending trap for many but just a few whales. There is a reason Epic and EA were cagey about player engagement data in the UK inquiry and it's not "trade secrets".

 

[Vex]

What makes it worse is that there are games that didn't have it before that now have it added in or added in a sequel.

It's really annoying. This shit was never a good idea.

 

[DixieDean82]

You should see the ones they've had in Blops 4. They consist of mostly shitty stickers and emblems, with one or two nice skins. And best of all if you reach level 50 you get a 'weapon bribe' loot box. This does not even guarantee you a new weapon, just a chance at one.

 

[Imitation Of Life]

You are right. I hate it. These games want you locked in forever. I want to come and go as I please and not miss something cool because want grind my was off with this season bullshit. Bungie is going as far as taking stuff(abilities) away from you after the season ends.

I'm edging closer back to avoiding these online GaaS again, but they are so addictive. I did decide not buy Shadowkeep at launch so that is a step towards getting off of the treadmill. Having Borderlands 3 made it easy to hold off.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

They definitely can take a lot of work to get everything and should only be used if you enjoy the game.

Fully completed the last 6 battle passes I think for fortnite and while I have really enjoyed my time it has reduced the amount of other games I have been playing for sure.

Great thing is that it has probably saved me money since I have got probably over 1,200 hours or more entertainment and only spent about £20 (BP once and some additional v bucks) since I unlock the battle pass for free each season.

 

[nofriendo]

Really dont like putting a positive spin on microtransactions, but if you look at the games offering battle pass they for the most part of offering either the full game for free or a lot of content for free. Destiny 2 today will patch in a bunch of stuff for all players. Yes, there is the Shadowkeep expansion as well but I skipped the last season pass but was still able to play destiny when I like. Its not perfect but is it a good middle ground ?

 

[chainlinkspiral]

I've really enjoyed Fortnite's season pass, and haven't missed a season. RDR2's Outlaw Pass was also a lot of fun, but went really quick. I am curious how Destiny's goes. I liked Apex Legend up until the first season pass sucked much of the joy out of it, but Season 3 looks pretty good after a decent Season 2. Dauntless seems fine, and Rainbow 6 Siege's probably isn't for me, but I still like their character passes.

Invest your time how you please, and move on if you aren't getting anything out of it, really.

 

[SmartWaffles]

For a lot of other games Battle Pass is pretty much the only meaningful work you can do in the season. Not actually in Destiny 2's case, the Season Rank there is just a small side upgrade to everything else in the game, you can pretty much ignore that it exists and get everything done by playing meaningful activities. According to Bungie to max out the ranks it's less than 80 hours across 3 months which is hardly a blip for dedicated players.

 

[.exe]

Really dont like putting a positive spin on microtransactions, but if you look at the games offering battle pass they for the most part of offering either the full game for free or a lot of content for free. Destiny 2 today will patch in a bunch of stuff for all players. Yes, there is the Shadowkeep expansion as well but I skipped the last season pass but was still able to play destiny when I like. Its not perfect but is it a good middle ground ?

Click to shrink...

Consider whether the alternative is a feasible product in today's environment if the plan is to only support that game. For the ones that are also €60, the pass is just a side hustle. The ones that are free are the most pernicious. It's not that they give you the game for free. You're offering your time and attention in return for the possibility of getting hooked. It's designed to be free in order to lure as many people as possible into the grind. Don't think of it as generous, think of it as devious. Like you said, it's not right to praise how big the cheese on the mouse trap is. It's still a trap for many, even if you have the capacity to grab the cheese unscathed.

 

[callamp]

The worst GaaS are closer to 'Games as an Obligation'. The constant need to stay involved almost everyday was why I eventually gave up on Destiny, never even considered similar games, and instead invested in a wider variety of games.

 

[RoninStrife]

OP, I thought I was the only one that feels this way. When I hear the words "Battle pass", I cringe. It's become a second job, draining fun from our favorite hobby.

 

[Deleted member 59126]

It's not fun unless you live for that game. I stopped playing game that require this.
i love destiny 2 gameplay but the weekly chores drove Me away. It didn't need battle pass even the first one. Wait for weekly reboot. Go there do this. Repeat that. Oh and these daily activities too

Click to shrink...

Yeah, the daily grind is why I don't play multiplayer games anymore. I feel like it asks too much from you as a player. You spend too much time attempting to stay ahead of the pack, have the best guns, the best looking armor, a great kill death ratio. These are all emotional addictions which gives you a false sense of achievement in exchange for massive amounts of your time.

Single player games I can pause.. Turn them off! Heck if need be, I can put them down for a few months, spend time with something else in my life and pick them right back up again. Games can be a rewarding hobby, instead of an addictive daily chore.

 

[CosmicElement]

That's why I stopped playing Fortnite. After a while I realized I wasn't playing for the inherent fun of the game, I was just doing my dailies to GTFO and play other games.

 

[Budi]

Heh I used to think that battle pass is pretty good form of monetization, but then I tried it myself.

I played a ton of Dota Underlords before it had any cosmetics and progression. Then they added proto pass, which is a free battle pass to all the users. It was cool to get neat cosmetic rewards while having fun, but when I capped the pass and couldn't gain xp anymore I dropped the game. Started to feel like it was a waste to play if I didn't get rewarded for it. Battle pass caused this shift in priority for me, do I play to play or do I play to get cosmetics.

Now battle pass is still much better than selling loot boxes, but you're 100% right how it can make a game feel like a chore. Same goes for daily missions/quests tbh.

Edit: They uncapped the XP in Dota Underlords so I can gain xp again, but no new cosmetics yet.

 

[Mendrox]

Yeah and people are that stupid and even pay for having to do the work.

 

[Galkinator]

I say it all the time, GaaS is the worst thing to happen to gaming.
We can only blame ourselves though, it's more successful and profitable than it has any right to be.

 

[RoninStrife]

The worst GaaS are closer to 'Games as an Obligation'. The constant need to stay involved almost everyday was why I eventually gave up on Destiny, never even considered similar games, and instead invested in a wider variety of games.

Click to shrink...

It's why I ditched Mortal Kombat 11. And I was dumb enough to buy the $100 edition with season pass.. Goodwill that Netherrelm will never get from me again.
Not Terminator or anyone else entices me to re-download it and play it again. This GaaS system is a joke.

I bought Soul Calibur a week ago and dang, it feels like I bought a proper game, and not a Free to play one with filler content packed to the skies!

 

[Stuart Gipp]

I both do and don't agree. On one hand it's cool to have cosmetics etc thrown at you if you're going to be playing anyway. On the other, it does create something of a sense of compulsion, like you're losing out by not playing.

 

[Love Machine]

With the amount of time I can dedicate to Apex, it's just not worth investing in one.
I'm fine with just pushing aside all of that stuff and enjoying the core game.

I play solely with a group of RL friends who always get the BP, and are very vocal about what they "need" every day/match.
It's sometimes tough being the odd one out (more general frustration at their forced behaviour than FOMO), but as long as the game is fun and we get a few wins here and there, I'll stick around.

Ultimately, S3 has me excited, and I don't care what the devs think of us "freeloaders".
I understand the draw for dedicated players, and I understand the need to monetise a free game. At least Apex isn't too obnoxious about it (aside from numerous "unread" style icons/prompts).

Edit:
I want to also mention that I dislike a lot of the stuff you can get from BPs in general (at least in regard to Apex).
The majority is super gaudy/tacky, and pretty jarring even in the relatively crazy Titanfall universe. I don't want to run around as a demon or have a gun made of bones or something... I enjoy splashing on a new skin here and there, and making that choice for myself. I don't need random "legendary" handouts based on an arbitrary progress bars to feel engaged.

The whole concept just really isn't for me.

 

[CasualsareFilth]

Agreed.