Making that empty space feel purposeful is what makes games like RDR2 and BOTW shine to me, but that's a hard thing to quantify and not everyone is gonna get the same feeling from such games that others do
I hope that BoTW2 makes BoTW look like a tech demo in comparison. As much as I got out of BoTW2, it's hard not to see ample room for improvement, even if everyone's idea for what constitutes improvement to BoTW might differ.I agree with you that RDR2 did just that. I just found it less so in BOTW. Still a phenomenal game in my opinion, I just hope there's a little more life and random occurrences between villages in BOTW 2.
Yeah, while I can respect what they achieved it still fell into the same Open World trappings and shortcomings with iterative content, completely wonky difficulty and progression scaling etc.
They give you basically every ability right from the start, so you would expect the game to gradually get more complex with what you can do with them but instead its all over the place in a bad way and having very limited enemy and weapon types also does not scale into a 100+ hr massive open world game like, at all.
None of those are even close when it comes to game design and gameplay.
Disco Elysium, Kentucky Route Zero, Pathologic 2 and Yakuza 0 are up there for me too.
I hope that BoTW2 makes BoTW look like a tech demo in comparison. As much as I got out of BoTW2, it's hard not to see ample room for improvement, even if everyone's idea for what constitutes improvement to BoTW might differ.
This sums up a lot of the issues that I had.
On top of that, I thought the main dungeons were very weak and anti climatic. I'm actually far more interested in Skyward Sword (with button controls) than BOTW2. I just think the traditional Zelda formula is incredibly strong. And it got watered down alot in BOTW.
Yeah, they will. TLOU2 just needs a next gen 60fps port with MP included. RDR2 just needs a next gen 60fps port with controls that are as responsive as they are on PC as a baseline.
I feel like these games seem to have the same polarizing response as BOTW... near-universal critical acclaim, but internet folks either love them or hate them. There are some peeps in the middle, but most threads are usually a dual echo-chamber of love/hate.On a personal level, BOTW was nowhere close to being the best game of all time. Solid 7/10 for me.
I liked these more:
The Last of Us 2
or
Red Dead Redemption 2
It's maybe worth mentioning that none of these games have sustained any kind of large ongoing community the way BOTW has (even the one game there that's got an ongoing multiplayer component). Their Twitch channels are ghost towns. Twitter hashtags go days without a post. None of the usual fanfiction or fanart hubs see much of any traffic. And they're all newer than BOTW is.Easily if you game outside of Nintendo. God of War and The Last of Us Part II immediately come to mind. I'd even throw Red Dead Redemption 2 into the mix.
That begs the question if a "GOAT" has to be groundbreaking or just has to be incredibly great.I'm confident about this prediction because the two games are so highly regarded because of their execution of the thing they are doing, rather than being something fundamentally groundbreaking or new. If that's the case for the game, there will inevitably be a better version of it in a few years.
Some games came out in 2020 that are considered the new decade, so that skews things.Wikipedia has a page "List of video games considered the best", which includes games based on the number of times major media outlets calls a game "best of the generation" or included on a "best of the decade" list or whatever. Breath of the Wild is the most recent game included that meets Wikipedia's standards, so I guess the answer is no.
List of video games considered the best - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
I agree with this.It's maybe worth mentioning that none of these games have sustained any kind of large ongoing community the way BOTW has (even the one game there that's got an ongoing multiplayer component). Their Twitch channels are ghost towns. Twitter hashtags go days without a post. None of the usual fanfiction or fanart hubs see much of any traffic.
I think all those things are probably better indicators of how a game is gonna be looked at by gamers in the coming years than say, a BAFTA award.
Wouldn't this make Minecraft the GOAT then if going off twitch streams?It's maybe worth mentioning that none of these games have sustained any kind of large ongoing community the way BOTW has (even the one game there that's got an ongoing multiplayer component). Their Twitch channels are ghost towns. Twitter hashtags go days without a post. None of the usual fanfiction or fanart hubs see much of any traffic. And they're all newer than BOTW is.
I think all those things are probably better indicators of how a game is gonna be looked at by gamers in the coming years than say, a BAFTA award.
Wouldn't this make Minecraft the GOAT then if going off twitch streams?
It's not really my thing, but I think Minecraft is unquestionably more influential than any of those games in the post I was replying to.Wouldn't this make Minecraft the GOAT then if going off twitch streams?
Agree with all of this. BOTW is so exciting of a game to think about because on top of just being an incredible game in its own right with an open design ripe for unique permutations, it feels like so many elements about it - even its flaws - speak to would-be designers and players to imagine dozens of different solutions and ways to approach the implications of its mechanics. At least two developers this last year put out games that were so blatantly compared so as to feel like they had their own "solutions" (Genshin and Immortals), and I think the assimilation of the things BOTW did, learning from them, both everything it did well and did less so, is only really gonna continue. That's especially the case for Nintendo, as this massive sea change is only gonna inspire new paths for Zelda, and opportunities to go into truly new, bolder directions.It's a phenomenal game that will remain talked about for years to come and for good reasons. There have been quite a few outstanding games, arguably more complete overall experiences than BotW, since then but I think when it comes to long term impact and mindshare it's going to stick around as much or more than those other games.
I think in large part due to how unique the game is, or at least appears to be, from person to person. A lot of these other games are much more linear and more importantly have incredibly well developed cinematic storylines that encompass all aspects of their experiences, but that in part means the major moments almost everyone remembers are moments everyone else experienced already too. There's discussion there but it will eventually burn out since it's the same for everyone. There isn't the same sense of newness there to discover later on. For a game like BotW though due to its structure and extremely robust gameplay and simulation systems that spur experimentation which results in a lot of relatively unique circumstances and memories. BotW is a poster child for emergent gameplay. It's that element which makes it possible for people to share stories about something they did or discovered 4 years later that results in numerous multipage threads all the time with people sharing their personal experiences with the game and things they did.
Really I only see BotW2 supplanting it in this regard since it has the opportunity to not only do more and better of all the stuff BotW did do while also add in and fixing all the stuff it didn't.
you're delusional if you actually believe that.The best game I've played in the last510 years was Outer Wilds
TLOU2 and RDR2 won't even be mentioned in GOAT conversations in a few years, get outta here with that
I dunno, the trailer stuff is more about delivery than anything. It is the best because it combines several sequences of BotW to deliver a sense of awe that most trailer fail to evoke. But, naturally, this is all subjective.I could list the games but like that one guy who keeps posting that same darn trailer for the game exclaiming it the best trailer ever despite many people rightly seeing it doesn't actually represent the game well, they will just ignore it and still say it's apparently the best of all time ever. Probably until the direct sequel comes out.
I mean, I think it does, and a lot of others do.People mentioning TLOU II must be tripping... It's a great game but it doesn't even surpass TLOU I...
This is how we're judging whether or not a game is considered one of the best of all time now? Fan art and hashtags?It's maybe worth mentioning that none of these games have sustained any kind of large ongoing community the way BOTW has (even the one game there that's got an ongoing multiplayer component). Their Twitch channels are ghost towns. Twitter hashtags go days without a post. None of the usual fanfiction or fanart hubs see much of any traffic. And they're all newer than BOTW is.
I think all those things are probably better indicators of how a game is gonna be looked at by gamers in the coming years than say, a BAFTA award.
Too bad mostly all of those sequence were just in optional flashbacks. Made my expectations through the roof.I dunno, the trailer stuff is more about delivery than anything. It is the best because it combines several sequences of BotW to deliver a sense of awe that most trailer fail to evoke. But, naturally, this is all subjective.