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CAPCOM: The hardest part of remaking Resident Evil 2 was...

Pepin

Pepin

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Oct 27, 2017
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...the giant alligator?!

Had the pleasure of speaking to Capcom producers Tsuyoshi Kanda and Yoshiaki Hirabayashi at E3 this year.

At one point during the interview, we started talking about the hardest part of recreating the game (I was expecting it to be re-jigging the controls, or making the environments work from a non-fixed point camera or something)

The answer... surprised me. FULL INTERVIEW HERE.

Choice quotes:
KANDA: [laughter] 20 years ago, the graphics that we had weren't photoreal and that meant you could get away with… a lot of things. Things that maybe you couldn't today. You could be fantastical with the creatures and it wouldn't stand out too much.

So making a giant alligator - that's a real challenge [laughter]. Trying to update that into a game where you've got scanned faces, motion-captured actors, photorealistic environments… it's really, really hard. Where do you even start!
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HIRABAYASHI: It was tricky to do without changing the game's tone a lot. We're competing with people's memories with this game, too, and that's really hard. Trying to make a convincing scene where a human-sized character - a guy with a knife - is taking on an alligator… that's really silly. People don't remember it as silly because the whole game was groundbreaking at the time, but that moment was ridiculous. It was a difficult process for us, making that work today.
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HIRABAYASHI: Perhaps they have the perfect version of the game in their heads and what we do undermines that? We're just trying to make a game that feels right and feels like what you might remember from a gameplay perspective the first time.
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Hope thread topic isn't too bait-y - didn't want to post an open spoiler in the thread title.

Lock if thread needs remaking in 10 years
 
Dreamboum

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Oct 28, 2017
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I think DuskGolem had said that they ditched the alligator in this remake before changing their minds
 
Metalgus

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Oct 27, 2017
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Thats funny, but it does make a lot of sense. The spiders in the sewers are pretty big too. Might have been a problem as well.
 
Jawmuncher

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With how the game is looking. I could see the alligator being hard to fit in. It was never really scary, kinda goofy, and comes out of nowhere.
 
OP
OP
Pepin

Pepin

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Oct 27, 2017
281
London
Jawmuncher said:
With how the game is looking. I could see the alligator being hard to fit in. It was never really scary, kinda goofy, and comes out of nowhere.
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In the interview, they seemed pretty pleased with how far they got with it - the fact they were close to cutting it but 'figured it out' means they found a good solution, I think

Can't wait to see what it looks like with those shiny graphics
 
Dragon1893

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Oct 25, 2017
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Yeah, I can see that. Back them the visuals left a lot to the player's imagination so you could indeed get away with a lot of things. They also seem well aware of the fact that nostalgia plays a huge role here and living up to that is a tricky task.
 
AuthenticM

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I mean it wasn't goofy at all in RE5. I know they weren't as big, but still. I don't see any issue.
 
Encephalon

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Oct 26, 2017
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"It won't be faithful one to one," Lunn noted of the new game.

...

"So for example, there is a part where you're walking through the police station, and a lurker walks by the window. In the original game that happens every single time. We don't include that because of the jumpscares, the puzzles, and because we want you to be challenged by that stuff. We want you to be scared by that stuff, not just repositioned to a new part of the building, but sort of reimagined.

"Because we don't want you to know exactly how the puzzles are solved, we don't want you to know exactly where the enemies are going to be. We want to surprise you. So, we have changed things a bit. But on the whole, the main idea, the main arcs of the story are very similar. But there are going to be some new surprises in there as well."
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That's okay, the REmake wasn't either, which this is looking very similar to.
 
gfxtwin

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I mean, REmake had the Yawn and it looked amazing. Gigantic mutated animals are a RE staple. The Salamander in RE4 was the size of a whale. That game also had an ogre from Lord of the Rings. And the corniest one is probably RE0's giant vampire bat. Maybe they meant silly in the sense that it was an alligator in a sewer, which is an old urban legend that has about as much truth to it as the premise of a plesiosaur being in a loch. But perhaps the workaround was adding a tunnel to RE2's sewers that deposits near a creek, and the alligator emerges from the mouth of said creek. Or there could be a specific reason for it being in the sewers that is explained by a file. Whatever the case, I'm glad it's included. It's an iconic moment from that game and a fun homage to cheesy horror movies about giant alligators that were a bit of a thing in the 80's and 90's.
 
kc44135

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Hm, fascinating. This does seem like it would be one of the hardest things to REmake, all things considered. Will be very interesting to see what changes are made to the best part of RE2. Also, I now decree this is the best thread on Era.
 
immortal-joe

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Can they decide that giant spiders are also goofy and replace them with more zombies or something. Please?
 
OutofMana

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That's a pretty funny lighthearted response. I was going to hold off on replaying the game in preparation for the remake, but opted to watching Maximilian DOOD's play through it instead. I remember the alligator scene being a huge wtf moment back in the day. It's going to be spooky as hell and I hope it has the same impact the original had.
 
gfxtwin

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Jraphics Horse said:
Oh is that what it is? I thought that was an alligator too tbh. Not that you'd expect one in 'Spain'
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Pretty sure it was based on those giant salamanders native to China and Japan, which would explain the size - they can almost grow as big as alligators.

japanese-Giant-Salamander.jpg


Haven't ever heard of them being found in Europe, though there is also a species native to the US so maybe there are some over there that haven't been discovered. I guess it's possible it was intended to be a mutated version of a regular salamander (smaller species are found in Europe) but it resembles the larger ones. Doesn't make much sense, but it doesn't really need to as 90% of the zaniness in RE games can be explained away by a virus strain or file, much like how nanomachines function in the MGS universe. :p
 
Yautja_Warrior

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You would think a giant hulk of a monster like Mr X or William Birkin, which mutate (sometimes on screen) would be harder to make and are more unbelievable than a big Alligator, guess not lol.
 

Deleted member 34949

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So can we lose the giant spiders, too? Thanks.

(I know the sewers wouldn't be the sewers without them, but spiders scare the shit out of me, lol. Always dreaded going into the sewers)

Encephalon said:
That's okay, the REmake wasn't either, which this is looking very similar to.
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REmake almost seemed designed with the express purpose of fucking with the expectations of people that knew the original game front to back, so it's good to see they're likely taking the same approach here.
 
Gradon

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Seven Force said:
REmake almost seemed designed with the express purpose of fucking with the expectations of people that knew the original game front to back, so it's good to see they're likely taking the same approach here.
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I can't wait for Mr. X to bust through a wall of a save room.
 
Eisen Sora

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Well, there were alligators in Resident Evil 7 too ( in the End of Zoe DLC), make one of those big and you have the job done
 
GAMEPROFF

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I encoutered the Alligator on sunday for the first time and dont think it was silly at all. No idea where that strange opinion comes from.
 
Al3x1s

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Yeah I don't get it, what does he mean where do they start? It's just an alligator, but gigantic. They used to exist, even. Undead humans aren't more realistic, lol. I guess they could make him a little bit smaller than in the original, He might even be scarier like that, able to maneuver and move around faster but still looking like something that can kill you with one tail swipe, charge or bite. I mean, there's tons of video footage out there if they want to get the animations and everything right. Not that they should worry, I mean, they get the animations of monsters in Monster Hunter just fine, lol.
 
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Almagest

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It's problematic because of everything else being photorealistic. If they don't nail everything including movement etc. the creature will break immersion hard.

Birkin and other monsters won't produce the same effect because there's no real equivalent to compare, but you can go to YouTube and see alligators anytime.
 
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Pepin

Pepin

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Oct 27, 2017
281
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Almagest said:
It's problematic because of everything else being photorealistic. If they don't nail everything including movement etc. the creature will break immersion hard.

Birkin and other monsters won't produce the same effect because there's no real equivalent to compare, but you can go to YouTube and see alligators anytime.
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A bit of the interview that's going live later has them talking about the Licker, and how they loved approaching that because it's a fantastical thing, they have a framework for it, but nothing is set in stone.

I guess being an alligator, they've got a lot of reference points they feel they have to draw on. The Licker is just this otherworldly creature with a ridic tongue
 
Masterspeed

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That was one of my worries and other boses and such. I was wondering how they expect to do certain scenes, but I have faith from everything I've heard.
 
scitek

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Oct 27, 2017
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I mean, they don't have to exaggerate the size too much, really. This thing was caught two weeks ago in a Florida park. 13 feet long.

Shamrock%20Park%20gator_1531150145515.JPG_91910824_ver1.0_640_480.jpg
 
Asbsand

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Isn't Photogrammetry more of a work-efficient method than a "highest of quality" sort? I don't see the alligator being a challenge due to the hardship of getting one scanned, it's about having the manpower to create photoreal assets without the ease of photogrammetry and those tools. I think Capcom saved a buttload of money from using photogrammetry once they acquired the technology for it, and the fact that they stopped using union actors further tells me they're conserving on their budget for game development.

As for Lickers the skin seems to look impressively authentic but I really think the base rig and behavior for it adopted the molded crawlers from RE7.
 

Cybersai

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But you don't fight the alligator with a knife, you run away from it then shoot the gas tank in it's mouth
 
Shauni

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gfxtwin said:
Pretty sure it was based on those giant salamanders native to China and Japan, which would explain the size - they can almost grow as big as alligators.

japanese-Giant-Salamander.jpg


Haven't ever heard of them being found in Europe, though there is also a species native to the US so maybe there are some over there that haven't been discovered. I guess it's possible it was intended to be a mutated version of a regular salamander (smaller species are found in Europe) but it resembles the larger ones. Doesn't make much sense, but it doesn't really need to as 90% of the zaniness in RE games can be explained away by a virus strain or file, much like how nanomachines function in the MGS universe. :p
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Jesus Christ, the fuck is that?
 
eso76

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Yeah, I'm sure bringing in a live alligator to scan wasn't easy, but that's nothing compared to the mocap session that followed.
 
gfxtwin

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Lol, imo everyone is WAY too worried about this. Capcom are making a AAA Resident Evil game which means world class artists are going to be involved. They're definitely not going to cut corners by recycling animations from RE7 or something, lol. Everything we've seen of RE2make suggests that isn't the case.

And it probably wouldn't be tough to make an alligator model. At worst they have the talent to make it from scratch, and for all anyone knows they got hooked up with a taxidermist who gave them one to scan in. Edit and stylize it as needed and there ya go.

My guess is the most challenging aspects of transplanting it to a hyperreal RE2 is figuring out a backstory of how it ended up in a sewer and making it look and move like the 9 ton animal it will be. It's gonna be a massive overhaul from how it was done in the OG game.
 
Asbsand

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Someone said they have "world class artists" working on this? Last I checked that would be a guy who simply applied a job as a rookie artist a couple of years ago and landed a position as art director.
 

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I have a feeling that it's not going to be as big of an alligator was we saw in the original and that they'll ground it more or make it smaller and faster in some way.
 
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