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Chuds angry after Warhammer 40k confirms existence of female Adeptus Custodes
- Thread starter Saucycarpdog
- Start date
I would love to see them 1v1.Pfft. Shadowsun has an actual Gundam
On my experience, Morvenn takes it.
That lady is a walking tank.
The chuds are idiots, female characters are awesome in WH40K.
Inquisitor Greyfax is a favorite of mine.
Yeah, some of the coolest/strongest/most dangerous characters we have right now are female characters.
Celestine, Yvraine, Morvenn, Stern, Tona Criid, Greyfax, Amberly Vale, etc etc.
I'm not familiar with Warhammer at all ( mostly know of it through a friend who enjoys the video games, and a coworker who paints the figures, which is really awesome), and even if it is a retcon, so what?
Long running, successful IPs/franchises get retconned all the damn time. It's an inevitability as generations grow up, fresh creators continue the world and lore, and the world changes, so the IP tends to change as well to reflect that.
It's amazing to me how butthurt some of these jackasses get at the mere thought of women, people of color, and LGBTQ+ existing in their male power fantasies, and not simply to exist as love interests, eye candy, cannon fodder for male power fantasy character development
Long running, successful IPs/franchises get retconned all the damn time. It's an inevitability as generations grow up, fresh creators continue the world and lore, and the world changes, so the IP tends to change as well to reflect that.
It's amazing to me how butthurt some of these jackasses get at the mere thought of women, people of color, and LGBTQ+ existing in their male power fantasies, and not simply to exist as love interests, eye candy, cannon fodder for male power fantasy character development
Only one Tau generally does 1v1 combat and even the Tau don't want to be near that guy. Shas'la Kais is basically the Doom Guy, I recommend reading Fire Warrior.
Just saw the tweet were they say they have been around since the beginning, cool.
Also, everyone familiar with the setting knows everyone in 40k is a piece of shit, makes no sense to gatekeep who gets to be a terrible person.
This isn't even a first major faction retcon. For example, Necrons used to be just pretty much mindless murder automatons, and they were overhauled into a mechanical species with biological past, individual personalities, dynasties and more elaborate motives than just wiping out the biological intelligent life just because they're evil.
I had one of these idiots complaining at me the other days that they'd be adding female orks next. What amused me most is that their core complaint was how ridiculous it was that Games Workshop was clearly just trying to attract new people to the hobby to make more money. I would think having more people enjoy the thing you like would be a good thing. But no. They went rabid the same way I remember someone getting when the local golf club started to admit women as members and how it had ruined their safe space.
The hyprocrisy with the chuds is hilarious. They are all about "the lore got destroyed" yadda yadda. But the lore of 40k gets changed and retconned all the fucking time and nobody ever cares.
Example 1 : "Oh so those aliens that had FTL for decades, referenced in books and all, well we decided they never actually had access to that" Chuds : "ok".
Example 2 : "Oh, some of those hand crafted giants might actually have some boobs hidden underneath those bulky golden armor they are clad in from head to toe, we just never had mentionned them before" Chuds : "Waaaaaaah ! It's intolerable ! You destroy the lore !"
Totally not a problem of misogyny, no no no...
Example 1 : "Oh so those aliens that had FTL for decades, referenced in books and all, well we decided they never actually had access to that" Chuds : "ok".
Example 2 : "Oh, some of those hand crafted giants might actually have some boobs hidden underneath those bulky golden armor they are clad in from head to toe, we just never had mentionned them before" Chuds : "Waaaaaaah ! It's intolerable ! You destroy the lore !"
Totally not a problem of misogyny, no no no...
why do we continue to choose to give a shit about the fucking "chuds"? For Christ's sake, ignore them. Half of the self-ascribed value in life is "riling up the libs" and yet y'all continue to broadcast their chuddery for them
As a strategy video game fan, Warhammer is the only fanbase I've ever seen in the genre whose asshole minority are farther right than even the fandoms of historical strategy games, which already have some downright fascist weirdos. Don't know much about the actual tabletop game, but honestly I'm absolutely for anything that makes these assholes feel less welcome in fandoms, it's great to see them not be encouraged or placated. This is especially fantastic news with that in mind.
Exactly!
Like, most fandoms want the IP to feel more "real" or "believable" or "immersive" by having deeper, more complex lore as it ages, and yet, somehow having more believable and realistic representation is a bridge too far.
Even if the setting of the story isn't "our" Earth, or history, or even universe, there is going to be some level of diversity. It feels incredibly artificial to me when it's not.
I absolutely love The Lord of the Rings movies, but I admit the lack of people of color stood out to me like a sore thumb. As large as Middle Earth is, you're telling me that "human" race of that planet, and even the regions that the story takes place in, is only made up of white people? I was disappointed in the Hobbit Trilogy (which is unfortunate, because I truly love the book), but one of the things I appreciated was that Peter Jackson and the crew included a more diverse world, even if the people of color in the film didn't have major roles.
It's just one of those things I really notice these days as I get older, and I always appreciate when creators do that. A lot of modern fantasy games, for example, from Baldur's Gate 3, to FFVII Rebirth, to Dragon's Dogma 2, etc, get a lot of props from me for being inclusive.
And this doesn't just apply to people of color for me, though (I'm mostly speaking from that perspective as a Black man), but also when I see more, and better, representation of women, the LGBTQ+ community, and any marginalized group in my entertainment media. Whether it's big or small roles in the story. Like I said, it just makes the world feel more alive.
As I'm not overly familiar with the Warhammer lore, I can't speak to how extensive this "retcon" is, but I don't see why these revelations should be causing such an uproar among certain folks in the fandom, though it absolutely doesn't surprise me, unfortunately.
The retcon example you spoke of sounds like another great decision, as it appears to have added some more compelling layers to a pretty standard archetype in this genre.
I'm hoping that the idiots raising a stink about this continue to be a minority, and that the Warhammer creative teams actually expand on this new development of the IP in a significant way. I assume they will.
It all sounds rather intriguing to me, so maybe I'll start doing some diving into Warhammer myself to learn more about it, since it always looked pretty cool to me.
I don't get why they didn't just introduce female marines during 8th edition via Primaris.
Warhammer's story telling also makes this type of retcon very easy given so much of it is based through propaganda, altered or mythicised text or heavily biased sources. Like how whether or not the Tau are brainwashing arses or heavily flawed idealists is based on who's account you believe. Hell we don't know for sure WHAT YEAR it actually is in the setting's present because of that. You could easily explain it away through in-universe misogyny.
Played warhammer for the longest time. It's arguably the main reason I got better at reading.
It's always been a great litmus test for watching reactionaries since it is from the start very left wing (Thatcher being one of the huge ork warlords etc).
It's always been a great litmus test for watching reactionaries since it is from the start very left wing (Thatcher being one of the huge ork warlords etc).
Essentially it's a nothing retcon. Custodes are taken as kids and modified / hand crafted into giant uber beings. Always portrayed as dudes so far but without any reason why it should only be dudes in the lore. Chuds have found an bit from a codex that states that "sons" of nobility are taken for making them so are using it for their justification. But that's about it. There's really nothing stopping women to be chosen for the role.
I guess it boils down to idiots not realizing that Custodes are not the same thing than Space Marines. Space Marines can indeed only be dudes because the specific genes therapies and organs needed to make them are coming directly from the Space Marines primarchs (basically a bunch of space jesus dudes that are the "sons" of the emperor). So there's lore justifications for them to be dudes only. But it's only for them, Custodes are made with a completely different process, so the same limitation doesn't have to apply.
Also, to add to the "reasons", the big WH40K writers have gone on record several times saying "the only reason we write male-only Custodes is because the last time we asked we were told "We have male models only so no women". I suspect new female minis will be forthcoming sooner rather than later.
And I believe the Space Marines will follow suit a few years down the line.
And I believe the Space Marines will follow suit a few years down the line.
Ah got it. It definitely makes this even more idiotic.
Thanks for the further information about the lore of the Custodes! And yeah, there isn't any reason why they have to me only male, but even so, the lore can be changed and retconned at the creator's whim, and this change is so minor (and their "justification" so flimsy) that it's absolutely idiotic for dumbasses to be so butthurt about it.
Calling it now. The new Sororitas codex has mentiona of Cawl, and maybe some...."enhanced" sisters. 11th or 12th edition we get a Marine chapter beaten to a pulp that needs to recruit....and here comes Cawl going "Oh, look, I found a doodle the Emperor did about how we can make female Primaris, seems like I just left it in a stuck drawer for 9,000 years. Well, best getting cracking, lads, we've an Imperium to oppress...laters!"
You don't need Cawl for female Space Marines. There's still two missing Primarchs that nobody knows about or want to talk about. Just make them female and say they got stuck somewhere in the warp, a blackhole, a timeloop or whatever with their troops, bring them back and bam ! You now have fully female chapters for both the Imperium and Chaos.
This too is very viable. I just like the idea of Cawl going full mad scientist all over the place, and Sisters getting interesting things.
Still hoping for all those discarded Firstborn bikes to get some Fleur de Lys bolted on for the Holy Order of Our Lady of the Heavy Metal Speed Queens....
I would need so many heads with mohawks....
On that i can't fault you, Sisters getting anything new, i'm up for it.
since we have a bunch of warhammer people in this thread, what is a good novel to start out with? awhile ago i heard something about the emperor being dead but their body is still used to spread magic or some shit. it sounded interesting, is that 40k?
I've always gotten the impression that the asshole right-wing-ers of W40K are almost entirely confined to the video game side of things.
I mean, actually having the concentration, skill, patience and talent to clip out, assemble, basecoat, paint, highlight, and dot the pupils of a 32mm figure is beyond them.
So is sitting down and reading a rulebook.
So is going into a shop and politely socialising with other people to enjoy a game.
There was that one 'Austrian Painter' incident back in 2021 I think, but before and since then, nothing.
And I've not seen any of his painting, so I couldn't tell you if he dotted his pupils properly or not!
The Emperor is the beacon the Imperium uses for their Faster-than-light travel which involve going through The Warp (which is basically hell).
I started with the Ciaphas Cain omnibus but they're more 'funny' than the average 40k book so I'm not sure if they're a great start for the vibe...
With the best will in the world - no. There are entire stories featuring primary discussions from characters who met them that they were male. Even a story from a person who worked on their (in universe) creation that they should have made them female but didn't. That ship has sailed and been quadruple downed on. And nobody wants female marines that are stuck in two chapters and two specific colour schemes but couldn't be Ultramarines or Blood Angels etc. If they're going to do female marines they will just have to rip the bandaid off and say that Cawl or similar invented a way for their implants to work in women, and that's the only way to move forward.
Ah good old Saint Celestine and Inquisitor Greyfax.
Look I'm just saying that Celestine calling her Katarinya is a sign that they're good friends.
Anyway more women and fewer chuds in Warhammer is a great thing. Female Space Marines next damn it.
What if Chaos only exists cos The Imperium went woke.
If they give us Female Marines it means there will also be Female Chaos Marines, and I think that's neat.
Actually, are there Chaos Sisters 👀
If they give us Female Marines it means there will also be Female Chaos Marines, and I think that's neat.
Actually, are there Chaos Sisters 👀
In theory I don't have a problem with Space Marines always being "male", since the Sisters army is pretty damn awesome, but I'd guess that since the Sisters aren't Space Marines, they don't get the same level of support in new miniatures and rules?
I don't actually buy miniatures and Codexes, I follow the Universe mostly through PC games and fiction...
I don't actually buy miniatures and Codexes, I follow the Universe mostly through PC games and fiction...
Miriael Sabathiel is the only Sister of Battle to ever fall to Chaos. Any suggestions to the contrary are heresy in the extreme and definitely not at all supported by the heavily redacted and altered historical record.
Yeah, there's enough bits in the HH books to know they were sons and that their legions were purged, possibly split up between the other legions. With the lore having been so messy over the years, I think GW sees the books as something solid to lean on, so I'd be surprised if they go against them. That's why having women as custodes works so well. They might not have appeared in the stories, but nothing in them says they can't exist.
Female marines will probably need a big reboot of the setting before GW is willing to have that happen.
Literally nothing gets as much support as marines, but SoB are currently in the best place they've ever been right now. Just have to hope they don't ignore them for as long as they did last time.
Yup Sisters had NOTHING for an eternity, while still being stuck with metal minis. But since they did the revamp and full plastic lineup a few years ago, they are in a really good place now. And even manage quite well in tournaments.
I saw this news days ago and my first thought was his poorly chunk of the fanbase will react. The best part is they are hollering about it being woke and a retcon when it's not like GW has been trying to expand the player base for a decade now and has been retconning lore for far longer than that. Hell, the orcs used to undergo a sex change to become female back in the day before GW made them mushroom monster people.
FWIW they deny that connection. Something about not wanting to think of the witch while trying to have fun playing games.
Representation on the tabletop and relative popularity don't mean shit, otherwise Eldars would have something to talk about rather than FUCK AND ALL
Truth is Sisters only started to get any real support in the three years. That's god damn dismal (But that's true of most armies that aren't some variant of Space Marine)
They still don't have:
nearly the cache of books(not even a tenth if we're being honest)
nowhere near the amount of lore
Anywhere in the same realm of named characters
The orders aren't even 100th as expounded upon as even the most anemic Chapter.
We probably know more about the fucking Irons Hands than we do OUR MARTYRED LADY
Its been thousands of thousands of years. Let them do whatever they want with the story but I will never complain if when dealing with those sorts of timescales that you allow variations of the truth. History is flexible. People can be wrong, misremember, lie. There can be propaganda political reasons why people say things that are not true. Sometimes things just get mistranslated.
I do agree that I would not want female marines stuck to being in certain chapters. Its not ideal. But I'll take not ideal over the sausage fest we currently have.
I think the whole thing empowers certain shitty sides of the community. I once sculpted a set of heads for a lass who wanted to make a squad of female marines. She was really proud of the work she did with the painting and basing and tried to use them at her local group. It wasn't that they refused to let her play, but people there proceeded to rant and lecture at her for the duration of the game about how it wasn't possible and why she shouldn't do it and how.. .blah blah blah.
It soured her on the whole hobby and she did not go back there for a long time. She still plays Sigmar as far as I know but I don't think she bothers with 40k outside of games like Rogue Trader and Darktide.