SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,647
Gotta get rid of Krakoa and bring the X-Men back to the 90s for the MCU!

bleedingcool.com

Tom Brevoort Told To Move X-Men Away From Krakoa Over Studio Concerns

Tom Brevoort, the new Group Editor of the X-Men titles, has been revealing motivations and making a few criticisms of his own.

and some tidbits about some of Hickman's intended story ideas.

bleedingcool.com

Jonathan Hickman's Namor, Franklin, Sam & Bobby Plans We Never Got

Jonathan Hickman's Krakoan Age of the X-Men is coming to an end, and it seemed to be one that happened quite abruptly,

I know people want to make Tom Brevoort the enemy but I just...don't care. Especially seeing how many of Hickmans ideas were stonewalled. Like, I'm supposed to care about what everyone else had planned? Why?
 

Devourself

Member
Aug 28, 2023
87
Texas
So, I haven't read Marvel in years. I have a friend telling me to read USM. Should I read Ultimate Invasion first, or just jump in with the new Ultimate titles?
 
Oct 29, 2017
4,312
I know people want to make Tom Brevoort the enemy but I just...don't care. Especially seeing how many of Hickmans ideas were stonewalled. Like, I'm supposed to care about what everyone else had planned? Why?
I mean it's hard for me to care for his original ideas without knowing much about them. Nothing really convinces me it would be any better than what we got.

So, I haven't read Marvel in years. I have a friend telling me to read USM. Should I read Ultimate Invasion first, or just jump in with the new Ultimate titles?
It's good and it's gonna give you context for the new Ultimate universe so I see no reason why not
 

kmfdmpig

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
19,554
I feel like it should be up to the next run's writer to determine how much of the prior run is retained and how much is reverted toward the norm. If the new writers don't give a shit about what the old one did then let them write the more default characters. If they think there is more to mine in the updates then let them cook.
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,647
I mean it's hard for me to care for his original ideas without knowing much about them. Nothing really convinces me it would be any better than what we got.


It's good and it's gonna give you context for the new Ultimate universe so I see no reason why not

It's kind of the principle of it. You gave Hickman the X-Men to do transformative things with it, and he got off to a great start. And instead of letting him helm it, they very quickly started going "Well, Dan Slott wants Franklin so he's retconning Franklin's status as a mutant that's been canon for decades".

I never cared about Krakoa much to begin with so the appeal was whatever story Hickman was telling.
 

Drayco21

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,480
I feel like it should be up to the next run's writer to determine how much of the prior run is retained and how much is reverted toward the norm. If the new writers don't give a shit about what the old one did then let them write the more default characters. If they think there is more to mine in the updates then let them cook.

My opinion seems kind of out of vogue in capeshit books these days, but I feel like the Marvel Universe would be in a better place if editorial forced stricter continuity consistency from run to run. Every new writer wants to give the characters a hot new costume, a new side kick or supporting cast, new powers, new team line-ups and all of it gets to last all of a dozen issues most of the time before the next writer takes over with some crackerjack "new" idea that's going to fizzle out and be replaced again next year and it just makes everything hollow. If a new creative team wants to retcon the shit out of the prior run or totally abandon its characters and concepts for something new, it had better be for some incredibly compelling reasoning. Writers get far too much leeway to just fuck around with whatever they want without any weight or consequence anymore.

But that's in a vacuum generally speaking. I've got no real horse in the Krakoa vs. non-Krakoa status quo for the X-Men. I'm sure the desire to return them to a more traditionally super heroic story style for the MCU was a big push factor, but it also feels like its a natural part of the modern X-Men. They're gonna go establish a weird sovereign nation, forget all their leaders are scumbags and run themselves into the ground every couple of years until we're all dead of old age any more - whether they call that place Krakoa, Utopia, Genosha or M-Town
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,202
I think it's possible to show apathy toward the X-books and still think Brevoort is a bozo. The two things are not mutually exclusive.
 

Memento Mori

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,946
It's kind of the principle of it. You gave Hickman the X-Men to do transformative things with it, and he got off to a great start. And instead of letting him helm it, they very quickly started going "Well, Dan Slott wants Franklin so he's retconning Franklin's status as a mutant that's been canon for decades".

I never cared about Krakoa much to begin with so the appeal was whatever story Hickman was telling.
Having read all of Slott's Fantastic Four, there was no reason Franklin couldn't be a mutant in it. Someone should have vetoed it.
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,647
My opinion seems kind of out of vogue in capeshit books these days, but I feel like the Marvel Universe would be in a better place if editorial forced stricter continuity consistency from run to run. Every new writer wants to give the characters a hot new costume, a new side kick or supporting cast, new powers, new team line-ups and all of it gets to last all of a dozen issues most of the time before the next writer takes over with some crackerjack "new" idea that's going to fizzle out and be replaced again next year and it just makes everything hollow. If a new creative team wants to retcon the shit out of the prior run or totally abandon its characters and concepts for something new, it had better be for some incredibly compelling reasoning. Writers get far too much leeway to just fuck around with whatever they want without any weight or consequence anymore.

But that's in a vacuum generally speaking. I've got no real horse in the Krakoa vs. non-Krakoa status quo for the X-Men. I'm sure the desire to return them to a more traditionally super heroic story style for the MCU was a big push factor, but it also feels like its a natural part of the modern X-Men. They're gonna go establish a weird sovereign nation, forget all their leaders are scumbags and run themselves into the ground every couple of years until we're all dead of old age any more - whether they call that place Krakoa, Utopia, Genosha or M-Town

I can agree with this. They're trying to have their cake and eat it too, but no. You're playing in the same toybox everyone else is. If you want a separate universe, go pitch that.

Having read all of Slott's Fantastic Four, there was no reason Franklin couldn't be a mutant in it. Someone should have vetoed it.

I might be remembering this wrong but I think Slott was pretty hype about keeping Franklin away from the X-Men and Krakoa.
 

Porl

Member
Nov 6, 2017
8,338
Having read all of Slott's Fantastic Four, there was no reason Franklin couldn't be a mutant in it. Someone should have vetoed it.
I feel like it was pretty clear that Slott just went "i'm not sure what plans the x-office has for him but i don't want them to mess up my stories with their crossovers or whatever, i want no part of that" which just feels really petty
 

Memento Mori

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,946
I feel like it was pretty clear that Slott just went "i'm not sure what plans the x-office has for him but i don't want them to mess up my stories with their crossovers or whatever, i want no part of that" which just feels really petty
That's exactly what it was. With the effect of keeping Franklin away from the best Fantastic Four writer in many years.
 
Oct 29, 2017
4,312
It's kind of the principle of it. You gave Hickman the X-Men to do transformative things with it, and he got off to a great start. And instead of letting him helm it, they very quickly started going "Well, Dan Slott wants Franklin so he's retconning Franklin's status as a mutant that's been canon for decades".

I never cared about Krakoa much to begin with so the appeal was whatever story Hickman was telling.
I'm good with what we got because we basically got Spurrier, Ewing and Gillen getting the main piece of the line for themselves and doing cool things with it. I think the worst part of this era was X of Swords and that's on Hick-Man. G.O.D.S. sucked and USM is pretty good but I can't say I'm super crazy for it.

Just not super excited for him lately. Well there's that Doom one shot, hopefully it's good, his Doom was usually a fun read.
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,647
I'm good with what we got because we basically got Spurrier, Ewing and Gillen getting the main piece of the line for themselves and doing cool things with it. I think the worst part of this era was X of Swords and that's on Hick-Man. G.O.D.S. sucked and USM is pretty good but I can't say I'm super crazy for it.

Just not super excited for him lately. Well there's that Doom one shot, hopefully it's good, his Doom was usually a fun read.

I only read one issue of GODS but what I read I thought was quite good. And Ultimate Spider-Man is basically the only good Spider-Man comic right now. I think everyone just has different opinions. I prefer Ewing to Hickman and Gillen's about even with him. Nonetheless, if they were going to have their own era I would've preferred if they'd been given the reigns to remake everything themselves.
 

Naijaboy

The Fallen
Mar 13, 2018
15,567
I swear I will get into the free comics I got in time. As for the usual list:

Shazam throws curveball at the whole family as they navigate their new home as well as their potential new lives as a legal family. We get a good balance of the kids here so far (though Billy, Mary and Darci get the big roles, as expected if you've read the mini). We get some signs of Billy's powers going awry due to re ent circumstances as well as a curveball that could upend the entire family (another good example of bleeding the movie elements into the comics).

Birds of Prey reveals the one behind the attempt to kill Barbara, though it leaves more questions than answers. The characterization is great, but the Birds will need a lot more firepower for something like that. Hopefully we'll get more info on why this villain wants to break up the group so badly.

Poison Ivy gets us back into the action with all of Ivy's past returning to haunt her. Okay, now I see why people may not like Janet from HR. I'm... not as sure if Pamela's close enough to care about her survival. But it does lead to a desperate ploy she may not survive through.

Again, it's crazy how well Ryan North understands the Fantastic Four and how to put them in situations that reveal how they tick. Here, we get the classic rivalry between Johnny and Ben. It's just pure fun all around as they try to one-up each other. We also see the effects of celebrity status on those who run the risk of hiring known superheroes, with the Fantastic Four being the rare people known identities. Again, filler can be great and this book is a perfect example of that.

As for Usagi Yojimbo... poor Yukichi. Dude got the equivalent of getting his favorite jewelry broken. It may be his harshest lesson yet on the realities of the outside world. I hope he can recover from this.

List:
Blue Beetle #9
 

Double 0

Member
Nov 5, 2017
7,531

IMO, it's FF with the Twilight Zone Pulp Sci Fi upped to eleven. Just as the covers suggest. Hence the numerous one and done stories with a central hook and a specific dynamic explored.

When I realized it, it shocked me how little this style gets explored when it comes to the FF. Over at DC, Tom King practically has a monopoly over that pulp style, but it tends to get explored through characters like Adam Strange or Green Lantern which leans more on Flash Gordon rather than TZ.
 

Vic_Viper

Thanked By SGM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,190
IMO, it's FF with the Twilight Zone Pulp Sci Fi upped to eleven. Just as the covers suggest. Hence the numerous one and done stories with a central hook and a specific dynamic explored.

When I realized it, it shocked me how little this style gets explored when it comes to the FF. Over at DC, Tom King practically has a monopoly over that pulp style, but it tends to get explored through characters like Adam Strange or Green Lantern which leans more on Flash Gordon rather than TZ.
Gotcha. Im more of a fan of the overarching narrative and the one and dones kinda turned me off of North's FF. I keep hearing great things, but maybe ill enjoy it more when I can binge it.
 

Vic_Viper

Thanked By SGM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,190

Sagroth

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,920
Mr. Sinister is Hope's bio dad now?

bleedingcool.com

Hope's Father And What Happens To The Mutants (X-Men Forever Spoilers)

The previous X-Men Forever flashed back Mister Sinister approaching one Louise Spelding, the mother of Hope Summers, Mutant Messiah.

Reading the rest of that article…so is it possible that they're tabling Krakoa for now in order for Hickman to have a shot at doing his other planned arcs later on? Is this new, back-to-basics era there to buy time?
 

kmfdmpig

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
19,554
In a recent Word Balloon interview Mark Russell mentioned his fondness for JLI and interest in doing a run on it, if given the choice. Based on Wonder Twins and One-Star Squadron I think he'd be a great choice for it (as would Kelly Thompson).


Glad that Elseworlds are officially back. I'd like to see more focus on other characters like Green Arrow, Wonder Woman and Superman, however.
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,647
In a recent Word Balloon interview Mark Russell mentioned his fondness for JLI and interest in doing a run on it, if given the choice. Based on Wonder Twins and One-Star Squadron I think he'd be a great choice for it (as would Kelly Thompson).

I haven't read a ton of his work, but he seems to like subversive kinda comics. That being the case, I'd honestly rather him just do something new. I don't need more "Actually, the JLI were awful people" comics.

Glad that Elseworlds are officially back. I'd like to see more focus on other characters like Green Arrow, Wonder Woman and Superman, however.

They're "back" but its just all Batman. :(
 

kmfdmpig

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
19,554
I haven't read a ton of his work, but he seems to like subversive kinda comics. That being the case, I'd honestly rather him just do something new. I don't need more "Actually, the JLI were awful people" comics.



They're "back" but its just all Batman. :(
I don't think he'd turn it into them being awful. Wonder Twins, for example, showed how fucked up society is, but treated the characters well, as did Flintstones.
 

KtotheRoc

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
56,879
aiptcomics.com

X-Men goddess Storm to join the Avengers in August 2024

Earth’s Mightiest Heroes recruit Storm in 'Avengers' #17.

Storm is joining The Avengers (she had previously been a member for all of five minutes during Bendis' run just before AvX).

What a strange relaunch this is for the X-Line. Storm is one of the most prominent members of the X-Men but she's going to be on The Avengers.
 

Drayco21

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,480
Storm is like the one major X-Men I don't think adds anything to the Avengers lol - she's not really bringing anything you don't get with Thor already.

I guess it'll be interesting to have her and T'Challa in a book together at least, and I trust Jed MacKay so I'm sure he'll do great work with the character regardless.
 

Hewlett

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,189
Is Arakko still going to survive into the new Breevort era? If so, it seems like a huge wasted potential to not have a rebooted X-Men Red (or call it whatever) featuring Apocalypse and Storm guiding the Arakkii through the new era, dealing with cosmic threats and political intrigue.
 

Vic_Viper

Thanked By SGM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,190
Also coming from DC is a Tom King Wildstorm 6 issue Black Label book. Finally!

aiptcomics.com

DC announces new Wildstorm DC Black Label series ‘Jenny Sparks’ for August 2024

'Jenny Sparks' is a six-issue miniseries launching this August.

She looks badass
Jenny-Sparks-1-preview-1-min.jpg
 

kmfdmpig

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
19,554
In other Tom King news - he mentioned that his Hollywood stuff (heavily rumored to be co-writing the Lanterns show) has led to him scaling back how many comics he writes. Although I guess other than this Jenny Sparks book and Wonder Woman, which he hopes to write for years he'll be basically down to just those as Penguin, Animal Pound, and Helen of Wyndhorne are all wrapping up in the near future and Love Everlasting is either wrapping or going on a long pause.
 

bluexy

Comics Enabler & Freelance Games Journalist
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
14,546
In other Tom King news - he mentioned that his Hollywood stuff (heavily rumored to be co-writing the Lanterns show) has led to him scaling back how many comics he writes. Although I guess other than this Jenny Sparks book and Wonder Woman, which he hopes to write for years he'll be basically down to just those as Penguin, Animal Pound, and Helen of Wyndhorne are all wrapping up in the near future and Love Everlasting is either wrapping or going on a long pause.
you hate to hear it.
 

Freezasaurus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,202
It's like the big two read "The Tipping Point" and got to the section about Ragu or watched Gladwell's Ted Talk and how Ragu went on to make 36 variations of spaghetti sauce and went: "yeah, we should do this".
Eh, I think it speaks more to their main DCU lineup being mid and people wanting something different. That's one thing I have to hand it to DC for when they launched the New 52. They put out a lot of series that would have never seen the light of day otherwise.

I'm definitely in for more Dark Knights of Steel. And some of these other books sound interesting too.
 

Porl

Member
Nov 6, 2017
8,338
I haven't read a ton of his work, but he seems to like subversive kinda comics. That being the case, I'd honestly rather him just do something new. I don't need more "Actually, the JLI were awful people" comics.
Eh, a lot of his comics are "subversive" when it comes to the world, not the characters. Wonder Twins was about the prison industrial complex but the protagonists were still the Good Guys mostly (It's been a while since i read it)
 

kmfdmpig

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
19,554
It's like the big two read "The Tipping Point" and got to the section about Ragu or watched Gladwell's Ted Talk and how Ragu went on to make 36 variations of spaghetti sauce and went: "yeah, we should do this".
I love the concept of Elseworlds, so I think the key is just maintaining a level of quality. Lots of books in recent years were Elseworlds like anyway (vs Vampires, DCeased, Dark Knights of Steel, Jurassic League, DC Mech, Wonder Woman Dead Earth, etc..). This seems more like a way to better classify what they were already doing than a move to open the floodgates to out of continuity stories.
 

tim1138

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,236
There's a new James Stokoe story in this week's Godzilla 70th Anniversary one shot 😍
 

Naijaboy

The Fallen
Mar 13, 2018
15,567
Storm is like the one major X-Men I don't think adds anything to the Avengers lol - she's not really bringing anything you don't get with Thor already.

I guess it'll be interesting to have her and T'Challa in a book together at least, and I trust Jed MacKay so I'm sure he'll do great work with the character regardless.
That's what I'm worried about. The Marvel Voices February issue this year hinted at them getting back together.
 

Drayco21

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,480
I read the first issue of Sentry and dropped it. Didn't hate it but it didn't grab me. I'll give it a chance because Dazzler is a stupid character and I like that, but that creative team does not inspire great confidence