thanks for this informative post. Should be threadmarked imo.
Cory Barlog Slams PlayStation for Charging Five Months Minimum Wage for a PS5 in Brazil
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We have the resource here of divided payments. Every console have this option of paying 10x without interest.
See the example below. Series S at amazon br. 10x of 279 BRL. Quite affordable for the middle class here.
Amazon BR series S
I wish I could cut through all the snark and condescension in the thread and understand why this is happening. Can someone please explain or direct me to a post about why this happens and what Sony or any vendor for that matter can do about it? It's not Sony price gouging from what I gather. I'm seeing tariffs being mentioned but then there's clearly something else occurring.
Producing the console locally helps.
No, companies are not obligated to do that and shouldnt be slammed if they don't, but you asked for a solution and that one works. It worked for sega and it worked for microsoft during the 360 and start of x1 days where they built a lot of ground they didnt had in the country.
Scalping is not really a smart idea around here since people could usually just go to Paraguay or Lethen and escape it, or just dont bother, since be it with scalpers or official stores it will still be expensive, but on stores at least they can pay it in 12x or 24x or hell even 36x and 48x installments
For hardware is producing the console on factories inside the country. For software is just implementing regional pricing instead of flat out converting dollars to reais. Both were already done by different companies at different times regardless of how stupid the taxes here are. Subscription services also help out on the software side, just like netflix and spotify made far more accessible to consume video and music than having to buy dvds-blu rays or albums
Minimum wage in Brazil: R$ 1.100
PS5 in Brazil: R$ 4.699
Almost five minimum wage. Its not only the PS5, the Xbox SX is expensive too (R$ 4.599). If only the hardware was so expensive, we can live with that, the real problem its the price of the games.
One PS5 game on launch here its R$ 350, so almost 32% of the minimum wage. I buy all the games i want on launch with vouchers to get discounts.
Brazil import tariffs is absurd, the PS5 and Xbox are not fabricated here, so they are expensive, like the majority of imported products. And the Real (R$) is so devaluated right now compared to dolar, so the products get even more expensive.
The user TameLucas did explain this very clearly:
disheartening that these boxes, ultimately designed to be sold at loss, are becoming luxury items in multiple markets.
pretty much same situation in turkey,
though i applaud microsoft, they at least region-priced gamepass there, should be something like $3.5/ month.
thats insane value and has been a kiss of life for gaming community there.
pretty much same situation in turkey,
though i applaud microsoft, they at least region-priced gamepass there, should be something like $3.5/ month.
thats insane value and has been a kiss of life for gaming community there.
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Hardly. Seeing the exchange rate as is for the last year, I would say they are already taking a bigger loss here on hardware than they are elsewhere. PS5 at 399/499 is already sold at lost everywhere and their pricing on hardware, which was what was discussed on those tweets, are leveled with Microsoft's, at least for the moment.
But games? Yeah, that is some crazy unjustifiable shit right there.
To complement my others posts about the price of the PS5 here in Brazil, take a look on my receipt of my PS5:
The last price is only the tariffs, so R$ 2.826,92 of the PS5 is tariffs cost, 60% of the price of PS5 in Brazil.
The last price is only the tariffs, so R$ 2.826,92 of the PS5 is tariffs cost, 60% of the price of PS5 in Brazil.
That's some bullshit.
The official price of the PS5 here in Chile is 866 USD.
Series X is 700 USD for reference.
PS4 and X1 were sold at the same price, So I don't know what is happening with their pricing here this gen.
The official price of the PS5 here in Chile is 866 USD.
Series X is 700 USD for reference.
PS4 and X1 were sold at the same price, So I don't know what is happening with their pricing here this gen.
Wait until you see many months of minimum wage it goes for in Venezuela
Having the option the pay in installments is great, but not particularly helpful when we consider the median income in 2021 is about R$993.00.
Also worthy of note, sharing your account with a friend or family is easy and often means you pay 50% on digital games if both of the parties chip in.
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With these prices I think I'd just stick with the Sega Master System
Now we're on the topic of Brazil there is one thing I've always wondered. On Twitter I always see a lot of Brazilian people asking for games to be translated into Brazilian Portuguese. Is there any particular reason for that? Does the majority of the Brazilian people not really comprehend English fluently?
I'm curious because as a Belgian (Flemish) native it's very rare to have games localized into Dutch (BotW in Dutch was HUGE), but no one really cares since English comprehension is so prevalent.
I'm curious because as a Belgian (Flemish) native it's very rare to have games localized into Dutch (BotW in Dutch was HUGE), but no one really cares since English comprehension is so prevalent.
Reading your posts, it sounds like if Sony wants to help/try harder in Brazil, introducing PS Now yearly cards, (going from your graphic, PS Now is in Brazil now right?) and possibly an all access program like Xbox, would be more beneficial for gamers there.
To complement my others posts about the price of the PS5 here in Brazil, take a look on my receipt of my PS5:
The last price is only the tariffs, so R$ 2.826,92 of the PS5 is tariffs cost, 60% of the price of PS5 in Brazil.
Ok. Now get the R$ 1.842 left after removing the taxes and apply the US$ to R$ from november (R$ 5.40) and you see that Sony is actually selling a PS5 to you for US$ 341.
EDIT: actually, less than that, since in that US$ 341 is the seller margin as well.
There's no PS Now here and I doubt it would make that much sense as a streaming platform. Downloads and local play, yeah, could work.
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A few things I want to clarify:
- No, it's not just taxes. Dollar conversion too, but they absolutely could do regional pricing. And it does make business sense because it benefits Sony to have a bigger customer base. Games and services can recoup losses. They don't reduce prices because they know there are rich people who pay these prices. That's the logic.
- Scalping wouldn't be a problem because it would still be expensive even with regional pricing.
- The argument that gaming is a luxury is silly. I'm sure none of you would say that if these consoles cost in your countries as much as they do here. You all have regional pricing already because they define their prices based on your market conditions, not ours. We just get the consequences of it.
- No, it's not just taxes. Dollar conversion too, but they absolutely could do regional pricing. And it does make business sense because it benefits Sony to have a bigger customer base. Games and services can recoup losses. They don't reduce prices because they know there are rich people who pay these prices. That's the logic.
- Scalping wouldn't be a problem because it would still be expensive even with regional pricing.
- The argument that gaming is a luxury is silly. I'm sure none of you would say that if these consoles cost in your countries as much as they do here. You all have regional pricing already because they define their prices based on your market conditions, not ours. We just get the consequences of it.
Looking at your info graphic that you posted earlier, honestly it makes cloud gaming with Game Pass Ultimate look like the most reasonable option that's currently available.
It's still expensive, equal to like 5% annual earning for a minimum wage worker, but yeah like you said it's in the realm of potentially fitting into the typical family budget. I'm guessing with the chip shortages, that might delay setting up new assembly lines for domestic production. At the very least, the games and other software services should have regionally adjusted pricing though.
Thread title is quite sensational... for all we know, Cory is well aware of the super high tariffs in Brazil and those are the "bullshit" he is referring to. He doesn't slam Playstation anywhere.
Work on better ways to make sure only people from a region can use regional prices. Don't punish everyone in there because some first worlders want to be cheap. It can be done, it just need people wishing to do it.
Its not really relevant if its helpful or not, paying in installments is already something most here do whether is sensible to get the product or not. Case in point, iphones. People definitely shouldnt be locking themselves for two, three years paying for one, but they still do.
Sharing is not really widespread here and the few that do mostly share with people from their family who can't chip in with 50% of the cost of games. Sharing with friends isnt that common and knowing the "jeitinho brasileiro" most would be wary of doing it. Too easy for someone to abuse your trust and fuck you over in the end, and with consoles being as expensive as it is you definitely dont want risk them getting banned for anything.
Fuck Sony. I'll get a PS5 in 3-4 years and buy all exclusives second hand so I can still have some money to feed my cats at the end of the month. A Game Pass Ultimate subscription is 450 reais while a PS5 title is 350 day one and it hardly gets discounts.
Sooo yeah the tarrifs are insane. Why the hell are import costs so damn high.To complement my others posts about the price of the PS5 here in Brazil, take a look on my receipt of my PS5:
The last price is only the tariffs, so R$ 2.826,92 of the PS5 is tariffs cost, 60% of the price of PS5 in Brazil.
Prices are far worse in Uruguay, but the reason is import taxes and a government that doesn't regulate prices, couple that with the scarcity of the products and it allows the sellers to charge whatever they want, hardly something Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo can do something about.
Until people manage to sell it to foreigners at a nice profit :^)
Gotta protect our Zeebos.
As already said, they could avoid some of these taxes with local manufacturing, but... can't compete with China's labor costs.
Started as an attempt of "incentivizing" people to buy regional products by making everything else out of reach during the military days, just stuck since them for whatever reason. Plus electronic games were tied to gambling products taxes till very recently (if they still arent)
our educational system is really poor, theres an argument to be made that many don't even know portuguese properly, let alone a foreign language
don't let a bunch of more fortunate people on the internet give you an impression brazil is a bilingual place. it isnt.
you're vastly overestimating how easy it is to actually sell stuff to people outside here. it would be still costly and a bother
Makes sense I'm very well aware of the cost issues because someone I'm dating lives in Brazil and tells me about not just the import fees, but also just how the currency is abroad and that also can make things way more expensive.
It's the same situation almost across all of LATAM, here both Series X and PS5 are over 1,200 USD but we get so few units that barely anyone cares about it.
Yeah its sucks sony pulled out of manufacturing there. Would reduce prices throughout Latin America, but it seems the Brazilian govt needs to revamp a lot of shit to make that even remotely conducive.
Thanks for posting this and bringing up game prices as well. Forking almost a thousand dollars for a PS5 is just the first step in a big investment that is definitely way too expensive. These companies seem to have no concept of regional pricing, and Microsoft seems to be the only one making an effort.
I can afford this shit, but it's definitely, by a large margin, not representative of most people who love games in Brazil. And Sony is now even pushing for $70, which only makes it worse.
Mine says R$2382,39 (50,70%), so I'm guessing it's my state tax making a difference here. According to my receipt, federal tax is 25,70% of the product price while my state tax is 25% of the product price.To complement my others posts about the price of the PS5 here in Brazil, take a look on my receipt of my PS5:
The last price is only the tariffs, so R$ 2.826,92 of the PS5 is tariffs cost, 60% of the price of PS5 in Brazil.
Why there are both federal and state taxes over product price beats me. I'm assuming the federal tax is mostly for imports.
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You are absolutely right. It's still heavily inaccessible and limited to a very small percentage of the population even with the option of paying in installments.
I just wanted to provide additional context about brazilian market / consumers. Paying in installments isn't as popular in many developed countries, but in Brazil it's pretty much the only way most people can afford to buy expensive stuff (computers, phones, tablets, consoles and more), so it's useful to look at those numbers from that perspective that other countries may not be as used to.
If it wasn't for that payment option, I doubt many people outside of the 6% wealthy class would have access to gaming at all. If I'm not mistaken, middle class (667 to 3755 BRL) and lower-income class (<667 BRL) accounts for 47% of the country each, so 94% in total.
Thanks for the response. I assume they've ran the numbers and went with the option best for them (cheaper/slave labor + facing the tariffs) vs that option which would be best for everyone, which is just depressing really.
It may be a cultural (and educational) question, that is related to how familiar and confortable a country is with English and other foreign languages.
For instance, in Portugal we (typically) consume media in its native language with Portuguese subs, but our neighbours in Spain and our siblings in Brazil dub over it. A funny thing I noticed recently was when watching F1 post-race interviews. The Portuguese presenters waited for the driver to finish answering (in English), and then provided a quick overview of what was said. When I watched the Spanish broadcast, they were translating what was being said live simultaneously.
They'd have to be able to buy units to do that. Not many could do it.
There are a lot of us who don't. English classes aren't mandatory here. Localization is essential if you truly want to get more customers.
Yeah, here you have stores charging $ 1550 and $ 1750 for the PS5 SKUs, $ 750 for a Series S and $ 1400 for the Series X. How the hell can you justify the $ 350 difference between a disk edition PS5 and a Series X is beyond me, but as you said, few units so it doesn't matter.
Yup America north and south should raise wages past 20hr so people can afford rent and live life,
it's only fair
Oh, absolutely. Minimum wage in Brazil hasn't actually increased in years, it has just been adjusted to match inflation.
The latest data (2014) by British Council shows that only 5% of Brazilians aged over 16 have some knowledge of the English language, with only 1% stating that they speak it fluently.
It's surely improving, though, with younger people (18-24) this percentages raises to about 10%.
For context, I'm a 25 years old Brazilian. I started learning English at the age of 5 because of video games. I didn't have access to English courses at school until I was 11, and honestly, it's limited to a VERY BASIC level. I would never be able to say I'm able to speak, read or write in English if it wasn't for my self-learning through videogames - something that most people won't have access to. My parents (~50yrs) didn't have any English lessons at school, while my older brother (30+) only had 2-3 years of English studies.
Maybe with hardware but there's no excuse for their software prices.
As expected, this thread does not really match the title. It's not surprising, but it is disappointing to keep seeing things like this.
It isn't Xbox or PlayStation's decision to make their console nearly unaffordable for most people. That doesn't make any sense.
It isn't Xbox or PlayStation's decision to make their console nearly unaffordable for most people. That doesn't make any sense.
This is my understanding of why I, an American, have two years of PS+ sitting in my account right now for less than $60 when I bought codes from CDKeys.
Isn't this related to the tariffs there? To get around it i think they need to be manufactured locally.
Shame about the prices of consoles and services, I can understand hardware price is beyond control of Sony, but when you put it in perspective with the price to mantain a ecosystem paint a lack of interest to improve the situation.
It's also popular in México too. It's how I always get my consoles.
It's also popular in México too. It's how I always get my consoles.