Dark Souls 3 is Rough to Start as a Pyromancer. [I got no Souls and I must Scream]

[jman1954goat]

Just reached the Cathedral of the Deep and Man do I Feel under leveled. Every area has been a struggle and I die to early Bosses way more than any other Souls Games so far (Dark Souls 3 seems the Hardest the people who think its easier are Crazy)

The main struggle is I am Soul Starved. In most games I am holding on to my consumable Souls but I have burnt them and all the Five free Levels from Mage Guy (R.I.P.) and I and still thirsty in the Soulless Desert that is DS3. They Hand out so Few souls both Consumable and Enemies even tough guys drop at such a Low rate.

Now I am not actually Under leveled I am around 40 which is a decent spot for were I am I think the Problem is Its so Much Harder to Start Pyromancer vs a Basic Sword and Board Type Build.

If I was as an Example running Dex I would need to Level these 4 Stats (sprinkle a few here or there for something else but Primarily Hard focus these 4)
Vigor
Vitality
Endurance
Dex

But I am trying to Do Strength and Pyromancy for the first time since DS3 is the last game and Fire is so important to the themes of Dark Souls. To rune Pyro I have Less Estus Flask as I need to Dedicate 2 Spots to Mana Flask

I need Vitality Put my Souls into 7 stats.
Vigor
Vitality
Endurance
Strength
Attunement
Intelligence
Faith

I feel Like I am playing Hard Mode because others have More Estus flask Heals and Hit Harder with Way more stats into there Melee and Health.

Mana is not limitless so being pyro means I still have to get in there and Fight with Axe in 90% of encounters just with less Health and Damage especially since Fireballs are slow to cast and travel not very Far.

The biggest saving Grace is Great Combustion Does Outrageous Damage to Bosses.

P.S. Game is Pretty Freaking Great so Far just Give a Brother some Souls.

 

[99humanity]

Pyromancy characters you gotta rush to catacombs and smouldering lake. All the good shit is there. Once you get great chaos fireball/flame vestiges/etc you start to feel a lot stronger

 

[Nephtes]

Yeah, pyromancer gets no early love in DS3. I think it's a reaction to how over the top Pyromancy was in Dark Souls, they nerfed it hard in 2 and 3.

My second time through the game I rolled a knight and pretty much stomped the game right through to the end without difficulty.

 

[jman1954goat]

Pyromancy characters you gotta rush to catacombs and smouldering lake. All the good shit is there. Once you get great chaos fireball/flame vestiges/etc you start to feel a lot stronger

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More spells would not solve my primary issue right now without the Allotment spots and int/faith to leverage them while trying to balance using enough stats on strength/Vigor etc to not get blown up in melee combat.

 

[Igniz12]

I have burnt the all and the Five free Levels from Mage Guy (R.I.P.)

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You monster....

 

[99humanity]

More spells would not solve my primary issue right now without the Allotment spots and int/faith to leverage them while trying to balance using enough stats on strength/Vigor etc to not get blown up in melee combat.

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True I get it. I did a pyro char recently and it's definitely way harder in the beginning. Lotta things to sink souls into. I farmed a bunch in smouldering lake

 

[Lumination]

Sounds like a combo of:

1. Pyromancer is weaker in DS3 compared to DS1
2. Classic RPG problem of multi-spec classes being weak early while their stats are still too spread out to hit reasonable minimums

 

[Hoggle]

Typically when I play a build like this (and I haven't yet in DS3), I focus all my early levels into the melee side of things and when I'm far enough in to get the good spells I start distributing points into those stats.

 

[Deleted member 4090]

DS3 is just excruciating to start as a caster. Build variety, especially for casters, is far less supported than it was in DS2, often requiring VERY specific rings or rushing to specific parts.

Unless you are looking stuff up in a guide, the game is much easier and simpler with a regular physical build.

 

[neatsaux]

It's a rough start for sure, but eventually you can create one of the most powerful builds in the game (Dark Pyromancer)

 

[Akira86]

Pyros will have to roll and jump with the rest of them, so it's best you learn how to duck and fight early on so you can duck and cast later.

 

[It's mido]

STR and Pyro? Sounds like a perfect candidate for the Demon's Fist!

You could try pumping VIG and subsisting on a raw infused weapon with minimum STR and DEX requirements to get you through the early game until you can get a respectable amount of INT and FTH for your spells and finally the STR you need for your weapon of choice.

 

[ClearMetal]

My first full playthrough of DS3 was as a pyromancer and I do not remember having this problem. (Note that this was also my first foray into caster builds in Dark Souls in general.) Which is weird, because nowadays when I try another pyro build I run into this every time. It drives me nuts, haha.

I think it's simply because I know have deeper knowledge of how the game works and what you can do with your class... if you have the souls.

With casters in general I find myself wanting to do everything at once, even attempting melee combat because only relying on spells in the early game is a pain. But that's simply not possible without a ton of investment. Whereas melee builds are very straightforward in terms of core stats—even if you use support spells you still don't have to level Intelligence/Faith that much, and Attunement usually not at all.

It does get better later, though. And you could always choose to go full melee in the beginning and respec for a more focused pyro build once you have the spells. Because that's another problem in DS3 I think: you get a weapon like the Claymore literally 10 minutes into the game and you can complete the game just fine with your starting Broadsword, Battle Axe or what have you. But it's not until the second half of the game before you really start collecting your better spells. It's what kept me from doing a Strength/Faith battle cleric build because running up to an angry mob and using Force to no effect just isn't a lot of fun. Don't get me started on the wet noodle that is Lightning Spear in DS3.

 

[JudgmentJay]

Yeah, pyro (and magic/faith) has a bit of a slow start compared to a straight melee build since you need to spread your stats around more, but the payoff is worth it.

You could co-op some bosses to farm some souls, but I recommend you just keep on pushing through. The build will come together on its own.

 

[Jombie]

I would stick to melee until you get the rings and spells from the catacombs and smouldering lake.

 

[jman1954goat]

My first full playthrough of DS3 was as a pyromancer and I do not remember having this problem. (Note that this was also my first foray into caster builds in Dark Souls in general.) Which is weird, because nowadays when I try another pyro build I run into this every time. It drives me nuts, haha.

I think it's simply because I know have deeper knowledge of how the game works and what you can do with your class... if you have the souls.

With casters in general I find myself wanting to do everything at once, even attempting melee combat because only relying on spells in the early game is a pain. But that's simply not possible without a ton of investment. Whereas melee builds are very straightforward in terms of core stats—even if you use support spells you still don't have to level Intelligence/Faith that much, and Attunement usually not at all.

It does get better later, though. And you could always choose to go full melee in the beginning and respec for a more focused pyro build once you have the spells. Because that's another problem in DS3 I think: you get a weapon like the Claymore literally 10 minutes into the game and you can complete the game just fine with your starting Broadsword, Battle Axe or what have you. But it's not until the second half of the game before you really start collecting your better spells. It's what kept me from doing a Strength/Faith battle cleric build because running up to an angry mob and using Force to no effect just isn't a lot of fun. Don't get me started on the wet noodle that is Lightning Spear in DS3.

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off topic but where is your avatar from?

 

[Ferrs]

More spells would not solve my primary issue right now without the Allotment spots and int/faith to leverage them while trying to balance using enough stats on strength/Vigor etc to not get blown up in melee combat.

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Why would you level STR on Pyro build though? As a Pyro you don't level any offensive stat, not even you need much stamina or health, just go all in with FTH/INT. Once you get Vestiges or Chaos Fireball you just bomb the shit out of stuff from safe distance, you never go on melee range. Those 2 spells does outrageous damage.

 

[jman1954goat]

Why would you level STR on Pyro build though? As a Pyro you don't level any offensive stat, not even you need much stamina or health, just go all in with FTH/INT. Once you get Vestiges or Chaos Fireball you just bomb the shit out of stuff from safe distance, you never go on melee range. Those 2 spells does outrageous damage.

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Because it's a pyro strength build

I still need to hit stuff especially with limited mana this early

 

[Ferrs]

Because it's a pyro strength build

I still need to hit stuff especially with limited mana this early

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I think you would best suited fire(and later chaos) infusing a weapon instead of split levels that much IMO. That many stats will certainly gimp you until you are very advanced I think.

 

[Yatahaze]

saint tree bellvine casting speed buff works on pyromancies, that + the black flame spell pretty much makes everything a cake walk because it can stagger nearly everything and the saint tree bellvine (available from the cathedral of the deep) gives you max cast speed instead of needing to wait for the sage ring + 2 in ng++.

 

[Freshmaker]

Because it's a pyro strength build

I still need to hit stuff especially with limited mana this early

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I infused a short sword with chaos to deal with that issue.

 

[ClearMetal]

off topic but where is your avatar from?

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Fire Emblem Heroes, a mobile spinoff/gacha game.

 

[Ruisu]

Imo pyromancers have to use fire weapons that have no scaling so you don't need to invest in dex or str, and then rush Smoldering Lake to get a Chaos Gem so your weapon actually scales with INT and FTH, leave the pyromancy spells as support for your melee weapon.

But then again I'm the kind of player that doesn't see the point in playing dark souls and using spells as your main combat tool.

 

[We_care_a_lot]

look at it this way, pyro was easy mode in dark souls1, it's hard mode in 2 or 3. It's viable, just not till much later on.

 

[Randam]

OP, why are you randomly capitalizing words? :D

 

[Morrigan]

You monster....

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Only way to get the ring that makes you look human as a phantom, so I do it every playthrough lol

OP, why are you randomly capitalizing words? :D

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It is a mystery that stubbornly refuses to be solved.

 

[III-V]

I just made a Pyro build in DS3. Was not bad.

You can use the axe or grab the Lothric Knight sword and use a RAW gem on it.

First level
1: VIG to 27
2: END to 25
3: ATN to 14
3: INT/FTH to 35

Then go and backfill VIG and END to 35 and finally bring INT/FTH to 40.

For spells use fire orb and the One that sets your weapon on fire.

This will get you to end game. Respec then if you want to play some specific build.

 

[DaciaJC]

At least you pyromancers get a usable spell at the start. We clerics don't get crap until hours into a run (Lightning Spear), and it does piss-all damage unless you're in point-blank melee range. :|

 

[Sinatar]

Magic in general is a lot worse in DS3 then the other two due to how much faster and more aggressive the enemies are. You don't really have time to snipe them down as they run at you.

 

[Xiaomi]

Pyromancer was one of the easier playthroughs I had. Great Chaos Fire Orb one-shots a couple of tough bosses so definitely get down to the smoldering lake and get the pyromancy tome asap. Other than that I found it went well with Dex weapons, first the bandit's knife which is super fast and has outrageous bleed, and then later a special curved sword you get from the DLC.

If you're low on souls try getting summoned and helping people out for a bit.

 

[Toxi]

At least you pyromancers get a usable spell at the start. We clerics don't get crap until hours into a run (Lightning Spear), and it does piss-all damage unless you're in point-blank melee range. :|

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To be fair, we get rewarded for that struggle by utterly annihilating boss health bars once we get Lightning Stake and some Faith investment.

 

[Noobcraft]

Pyromancy characters you gotta rush to catacombs and smouldering lake. All the good shit is there. Once you get great chaos fireball/flame vestiges/etc you start to feel a lot stronger

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This.

I have a pyro build in ds3 (no weapon level upgrades, SL8) that has beaten every boss except Midir and Soul of Cinder without summoning other players. I did summon Lapp for the demon prince (that was a hard fight), and Orbeck for the twin princes. Once you get the Izalith spells it's pretty easy. Boulder heave is also surprisingly good. Gael and Friede can both be beaten relatively easily with the storyteller's staff.

 

[DaciaJC]

To be fair, we get rewarded for that struggle by utterly annihilating boss health bars once we get Lightning Stake and some Faith investment.

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True, true.

 

[Zera Bloodwinter]

Yeah I roll mainly Pyro in all DS games and have had no issue at all. Many call Pyro easy mode to be honest. I'm not getting into that but I'm going to reiterate that I've had NO trouble at all as a Pyro in DS3 except for two bosses but those can be worked around with some poison :-)

Never found myself starved for souls or anything of the sort.

 

[najaschade]

Currently replaying the game in coop with a friend and he's playing pyro and I'm a sorcerer and he definitely struggled a bit more than me, but we've gotten to the smoldering lake last session and seems like that's where pyro builds really come together.

 

[Kupo Kupopo]

Yeah I roll mainly Pyro in all DS games and have had no issue at all. Many call Pyro easy mode to be honest. I'm not getting into that but I'm going to reiterate that I've had NO trouble at all as a Pyro in DS3 except for two bosses but those can be worked around with some poison :-)

Never found myself starved for souls or anything of the sort.

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whoa! just about to post exactly this! replayed ds3 a couple months back, & it was my first shot as going pyro in any souls game, & i had no real problem at all. granted, i summoned some boss help, but i've hit the stage where, having beaten the games once, i now cut myself a little slack, no matter what my character build is...

 

[Anoregon]

I'm playing DS3 for the first time at the moment and went pyro. TBH playing pyro is what has allowed me to finally get seriously into a From game for the first time, I love having the ability to blast AoE fireballs. I am scouring the area maps on the wiki though, because there are some items/npcs that are absolutely critical for a pyro character. If I was going in blind I probably would have had a real shitty time.

 

[Ashodin]

I went STR/FTH and I'm having a blast with Lightning damage. Got the full Paladin look too:

 

[Futaleufu]

It's a weird opinion considering the very first boss and those weird monsters that spawn from zombies are all weak to fire and stunned by it.

 

[Richietto]

I miss Dark Souls 1 pyromancy. Busted as hell.

 

[KennyLinder]

It's interesting as I've recently started DkS3 and the guides (which I am using, especially for Platinum) say to use Knight and generally stay away from magic. Total opposite from Dark Souls 1 which had insane caster magic and ridiculous boss melting pyro! Good times!

Total lack of ranged weapons right now is a bastard though, but like others have said, the combat is so much faster in '3, I am not sure how much help it would actually be..

 

[skeezx]

i don't think i ever did a pyro build in DS3 before. did it all the time in DS1, drawing a blank on DS2

sigh.. okay i'll install DS3 again

 

[4KLobster]

Like pointed about above: melee build first then respec to Pyro once you get the strong spells is quite straightforward (though hitting the boss in first phase of Nameless King with fire/darkballs is still hell - yes, I hate the first phase of that fight...).

 

[jman1954goat]

yo I think I found an actual viable farming spot outside the cathedral.

Umbasa

From the Cleansing Church bonfire there is a drop down then 3 of the crawly guys that give 600 then a double sword bro that gives 800 then a bunch of responding ones that you can beat on for like 20 each.

 

[Anoregon]

So as someone who has been enjoying a pyro build in DS3, would DS1 remastered be a good choice? since apparently pyro is even better there?

 

[jman1954goat]

Going to pump strength to 24 to wield cleaver then just stop there and boost all my other stuff.

Almost killed patches swung twice in him but then thought better if it.

 

[jman1954goat]

spells from the catacombs and smouldering lake.

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Chaos Fireball is crack.

Just reached irythall I'm starting to feel more comfortable with my character.

Ds3 is so much harder than ds1 and Demon's chugging at a good pass though.

 

[GnarlyCupcakes]

Absolute best advice for early game casters.

Make friends with Yoel, take his totally free levels, let him croak and get the Dark Hand off his lady friend that replaces him.

No stat requirements, hits like a mac truck, punch your way to victory

 

[Toxi]

Absolute best advice for early game casters.

Make friends with Yoel, take his totally free levels, let him croak and get the Dark Hand off his lady friend that replaces him.

No stat requirements, hits like a mac truck, punch your way to victory

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This is good advice. Also good if you want to fight the Dancer early.

 

[LossAversion]

Astora's Straight Sword was godly when the game came out and was easily enough to carry Pyro builds to the mid-late game. Apparently they nerfed it in a patch but I played with it recently and it was still fine all the way to the smouldering lake. Pyromancy is incredible once you get the right spells. I can't play DSIII as anything else. I've tried multiple times to play with different builds but I always end up missing Pyromancy too much. It's so god damn fun.

Nothing beats deleting people from the game with Chaos Bed Vestiges.