Because splitting the votes away from the Democratic Party in key states only hurts Democrats.
The third party votes in some areas during 2016 could have made the difference.
A third party run is absolutely fucking stupid.
Democratic Presidential Primaries & Caucuses |March OT| Last Tuesday was 1000 years ago, old news no one cares about (Discussion Guidelines in OP)
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Because splitting the votes away from the Democratic Party in key states only hurts Democrats.
The third party votes in some areas during 2016 could have made the difference.
A third party run is absolutely fucking stupid.
We don't think it. We know it. It's an absolute certainty.
Bernie knows it too.
What is it
Bernie supporters saying Biden is isolating people
Bernie supporters saying Biden people shouldn't not vote Bernie just because Bernie people are mean to people.
You can't have it both ways.
because that's how the electoral system works? It's winner take all in most states
i prefer this over folks pretending we're all on the same side lol. the worst part is the norm being presented as progressive change.
hopefully bernie doesnt endorse biden, but he probably will since he did it for Hilary.
1) Sanders making rounds on Fox News in not an approval of the channel. The truth is that a lot of people watched the channel and is not a bad idea to present your ideas there. That said is a laughable idea to not support a candidate over this, specially compared to Biden.
2) Is Sanders protecting women's right for abortion? If a Yes, what's the problem? Actually Biden is less trust worthy in this regards looking at what he said about the Hyde Amendment.
3) Sanders has changed his position regarding gun control and the NRA, something he himself acknowledged.
No one gives a flying fuck about what she gets out of it. We care about getting progressive policy passed. Endorsing Bernie Sanders when he is assuredly going to lose anyway (tonight will make that abundantly clear for the few of you still clinging onto this ridiculous notion that he has a chance) does literally nothing but I guess she can pass the purity test by swearing fealty to the One True Progressive.
I don't know what her next step is. Not sure I really buy she has much leverage on Biden. But endorsing Bernie accomplishes absolutely nothing, may as well make a play to get the guy who is actually gonna be the nominee and therefore has the biggest say to support something like student debt cancellation or a wealth tax (lol).
I say all this as someone who voted for Bernie last week. But it's time to move on. Not saying to suck it up, but the best we can do now is pushing Biden to the left. Because he is our nominee.
Huh?
Both should be trying to appeal to the others supporters and extend an olive branch. Equating "Bernie Bros" to Trump supporters only does harm. Same goes for Bernie attacking the more moderate voters and not trying to reach them.
...and yet dont blame the bernie bros and girls for either muddying the waters incredibly so or just plain abstaining.
useless fucking grifters whos main interest in reacting and stoking fire about the "establishment". thats where the money is. watching it all burn wouldnt be so bad to them.
i remember when i used to be all in on leftist youtube too.
We don't know that the reason why Warren didn't do anything is simply because people told her to eat shit on Twitter or something. But even if it were - a notion I reject, fuck off with that reductive essentializing Bernie Bro bullshit -... So what? Welcome to the life of any politician with any modicum of influence and power. You're gonna get called out and insulted publicly en masse. Especially in the Twitter era. Comes with the territory. If you can't take it, well, that's too bad. Maybe you shouldn't have run for the highest office in the most powerful country on Earth in front of millions of people, at a time where climate change threatens to kill us all and far-right governments rise everywhere. I'm not gonna weep over a US Senator who, when the going gets tough, just retreats and does nothing. A US Senator who openly ran on a progressive platform of offering healthcare for all and dismantling corrupt banks and conglomerates. Yes, I expected her to have the moral fortitude to endorse the only other progressive candidate in the race. Even she had some kind of beef with them. Even if some people were mean to her. Even if that candidate didn't have much of a chance to win. Have some moral character if you're gonna act like you're the people's champion with a plan. I get that some of you don't get that. Or think it's just 'virtue-signaling' or some shit. It's not. It's called having standards for your politicians and recognizing the urgency of embracing progressive policies.
If Bernie had been the one who very clearly tanked his campaign from the beginning and Warren had a shot, you can bet I would have urged him to drop out before Super Tuesday, or right after it at the latest. Even if I liked Bernie's policies more. Because they were the two most progressive candidates, who wanted some change for the poor and for the planet. Because I know a united progressive front is the only way we can even begin to fight effectively against corporate interests and limp-wristed centrists who'd rather play nice to the Republicans than fight for the people. Because it's not about them, it's about us. And winning this thing so they can better serve us. The only credit she deserves is undermining Bloomberg's candidacy, and now he's back as a glorified Biden surrogate who'll probably have some hand in the government anyway. A mostly hollow victory.
Power should be spoken truth to, and it should be expected to have some moral consistency, politicking be damned. We've been so used to politicians playing the game of politics instead of genuinely trying to stand for the people that we praise their clever politicking and villify those who try to stay stalwart supporters of the people even when the risks are high. Fuck that noise. Power deserves to be publicly called out and mocked endlessly when it fails to meet any sort of expectations. And boy, did she fall short.
If Bernie had been the one who very clearly tanked his campaign from the beginning and Warren had a shot, you can bet I would have urged him to drop out before Super Tuesday, or right after it at the latest. Even if I liked Bernie's policies more. Because they were the two most progressive candidates, who wanted some change for the poor and for the planet. Because I know a united progressive front is the only way we can even begin to fight effectively against corporate interests and limp-wristed centrists who'd rather play nice to the Republicans than fight for the people. Because it's not about them, it's about us. And winning this thing so they can better serve us. The only credit she deserves is undermining Bloomberg's candidacy, and now he's back as a glorified Biden surrogate who'll probably have some hand in the government anyway. A mostly hollow victory.
Power should be spoken truth to, and it should be expected to have some moral consistency, politicking be damned. We've been so used to politicians playing the game of politics instead of genuinely trying to stand for the people that we praise their clever politicking and villify those who try to stay stalwart supporters of the people even when the risks are high. Fuck that noise. Power deserves to be publicly called out and mocked endlessly when it fails to meet any sort of expectations. And boy, did she fall short.
Agreed.
Bernie is so much better than Biden but the position of Bernie or Bust is against everything Bernie stands and signals that you can tolerate a fascist in the White House.
The kind of people who watch Fox News aren't open to sanders ideas. Why even give that channel the credibility and ad buys?
Just voted in Michigan. Not good that the polling place was empty. This place is usually popping right about now.
But don't worry folks. I'm sure my vote for Bernie is what will ultimately tip the scales and get the win. You can thank me here with a sweet tag or letting me have a cool signature. :)
But don't worry folks. I'm sure my vote for Bernie is what will ultimately tip the scales and get the win. You can thank me here with a sweet tag or letting me have a cool signature. :)
1. Giving Fox News credibility is not a good move. You think his 90 minutes every 3 months is going to erase the thousands of hours of propaganda they spew? Who Fox News is like exclusively 55+ white conservatives watching—they're not going to vote for Progressives, ever. It would be like Biden doing a Town Hall hosted by Breitbart.
2. Is your point that attacking organizations like Planned Parenthood is fine as long as you defend Abortion? You realize PP does a lot more than push Abortion right? It's actually one of the least common services they offer. In many places PP is the best (reproductive) healthcare women have access to.
3. He still waffles on the issue, and it's hugely important to a lot of Democratic voters. Biden has been aggressively pro-Gun Control his entire career, and has passed legislation to prove it.
again, why should she give an endorsement to Bernie? It's not worth it at this point. Once he got blown out in such huge margins ST with support in California being much lower than he had hoped and losing Texas, there's no reason to endorse. She also doesn't need to immediately endorse Biden again because there's no advantage right now. It does nothing for the progressive needle that couldn't be better served by putting backroom pressure on the person who will be the nominee and ensuring some level of his admin will be progressive allies.
yessir.
imagine "blood and teeth" warren fighting the long and seemingly without end fight against bankers and ultimately being tight because of so called online leftists.
nah, its a cop out.
Voted for Bernie this morning.
The movement is the movement, just because your candidate didn't make it doesn't mean throw in with the dude who has LEAST in common with what you think. Voting for Biden in the primary is basically saying you also think the healthcare system just needs "a little tweaking" and that the climate only needs to be dealt with via Paris climate accord.
Basically it sounds like this mod and others are basically just the equivalents of Bernie or Bust people, only for Warren.
Now in the general, yes vote for Biden if he wins, but don't pretend to be for progressive values if you vote for a corporate centrist.
She was the only candidate who talked about adrewssing Trumps crimes too /:
this is a fantastic post, thanks for taking the time to be thoughtful :)
Just Jill Steins votes alone would have made up the difference in PA, MI, and WI. In Florida Johnsons voteshare is larger than the difference.
PA
Trump - 2,970,733
Clinton - 2,926,441
Difference - 44, 292
Gary Johnson - 146,715
Jill Stein - 49,941
WI
Trump - 1,405,284
Clinton - 1,382,536
Difference - 22, 748
Gary Johnson - 106,674
Jill Stein - 31,072
MI
Trump - 2,270,543
Clinton - 2,268,839
Difference - 10,704
Gary Johnson - 172,136
Jill Stein - 51,463
FL
Trump - 4,617,886
Clinton - 4,504,975
Difference - 112,911
Gary Johnson - 207,043
Jill Stein - 81,731
Someone explain to me how it'll be the Bernard Brothers fault if Trump gets re-elected, when the turnout for Joe has absolutely trounced Bernie in the primary. Apparently the kids who would vote for Bernie don't vote at all so what vote is being split here?
Look I'm voting for Biden in November but some of this feels like a preemptively blaming Bernie for 4 more years of Trump and not, you know, the guy who literally tells people to their face to vote for Trump when they criticize him and compares cancer patients and protesters to Trump supporters for not kneeling down to suck his dick.
Look I'm voting for Biden in November but some of this feels like a preemptively blaming Bernie for 4 more years of Trump and not, you know, the guy who literally tells people to their face to vote for Trump when they criticize him and compares cancer patients and protesters to Trump supporters for not kneeling down to suck his dick.
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Joe "why don't you go vote for Trump" Biden continues to build those bridges.
It's folks who only paid attention to the 2016 and 2020 presidential elections and literally nothing else. So they only know Elizabeth Warren as the lady who didn't endorse Bernie Sanders, the first and only progressive in government, in 2016 and ran against him in 2020. Despite her having a long record of fighting Wall St. and the uber wealthy and more recently being one of the loudest voices against Trump and his dogshit appointments and policies.
Besides his record being appalling the biggest turn off about Joe is his stereotypical Boomer mentality.
I think that's what grinds my gears about him the most.
Thank God nobody even remembers Tulsi Gabbard exists for when she eventually tries to run 3rd Party.
I have a friend who voted for Gary Johnson in MI in 2016 and boy do I still not understand that choice.
Why don't you apologize to this person and then be smart and take a timeout for a day. There is no place for this.
I feel a small portion of the people who watches that channel have the same needs for M4A and other progressive policies that other people that don't watch it and they just don't know or have been heavily brainwashed into believing they don't. Maybe is worthless try to gain those people or maybe not. I still think is a ludicrous beef to have with Sanders. Is not like he going to Fox News is going to validate the bullshit it spews.
Biden has already said he would not Pardon Trump.
He also said that he would not personally order his DOJ to investigate Trump and the previous administration but that he would leave that up to his DOJ to do on their own, which is what you want in a President. President's are not supposed to be the ones ordering the DOJ to investigate anyone.
Biden Says He Won’t Pardon Trump if Elected
“It wouldn’t unite the country,” Biden said during an interview with Iowa Radio.
www.thedailybeast.com
okay when bernie speaks about talking to republicans but when biden flirts with idea...
for some reason i thought trump won florida by way more than that. i guess its not a lost cause.
i was not responding to that user. It was to add on to the fact that there's a lot of desire to tell People to ignore their feelings when getting harassed and doxxing while at the same time getting upset about Warren not endorsing Sanders cause it hurts your feelings.
Newsweek: Republican Mayor Drops Donald Trump for Joe Biden in Key Swing State of Michigan.
www.newsweek.com
I just like this mayors rationale:
"While Taylor, a life-long Republican, voted for President Donald Trump in 2016, he said he would cast his ballot for Biden this year because Trump is "deranged."
Republican Mayor Drops Trump for Joe Biden in Key Swing State of Michigan
Michigan Republican Mayor Michael Taylor said he's voting for Joe Biden because he "can appeal to moderates and Republicans like me who don't want to see four more years of President Trump."
www.newsweek.com
I just like this mayors rationale:
"While Taylor, a life-long Republican, voted for President Donald Trump in 2016, he said he would cast his ballot for Biden this year because Trump is "deranged."
I mean he could try appealing to... I don't know... Democrats?
Fine. Next time make it more clear. I'm not the only one that thought you were rude.
The thing is, Bernie did it at a time when people were actively trying to get advertisers to dump FOX News by painting them as the partisan, racist, hacks they are. He knew that campaign was going on. By going on when he did he helped FOX fight against that image and in turn fight the campaign against them. He helped undermine that campaign, he couldn't stand in solidarity with them instead? It's the Dem primary, he didn't need Republican voters. It didn't really help him at all if we're being honest. It's one thing to do it in the general, but the primary?
Like, I support the guy and will still absolutely vote for him when NY votes, he's been my second choice after Warren for a while now, but let's not pretend he isn't in the wrong here. He fucked up and should have done better.
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Mehdi Hasan on Twitter
“I am a long-standing admirer of Elizabeth Warren but her ongoing silence is bonkers and I fear she may one day - when it’s too late - regret it, even if her supporters don’t. I mean - Bloomberg and Dimon? And that doesn’t prompt her to endorse Bernie? Then what will?? https://t.co/g92JFQxQJn”
twitter.com
These picks....
Edit: I'm a big dumb dumb
Its the only way to ... Do what exactly? Re-elect Donald Trump?
Like people see the Trump admins response to Corona virus and they're like "yeah, yeah we def need 4 more years of this."
Mehdi Hasan on Twitter
“I am a long-standing admirer of Elizabeth Warren but her ongoing silence is bonkers and I fear she may one day - when it’s too late - regret it, even if her supporters don’t. I mean - Bloomberg and Dimon? And that doesn’t prompt her to endorse Bernie? Then what will?? https://t.co/g92JFQxQJn”
These picks....
take it with a grain of salt
Mehdi Hasan on Twitter
“I am a long-standing admirer of Elizabeth Warren but her ongoing silence is bonkers and I fear she may one day - when it’s too late - regret it, even if her supporters don’t. I mean - Bloomberg and Dimon? And that doesn’t prompt her to endorse Bernie? Then what will?? https://t.co/g92JFQxQJn”
These picks....
oh we're still giving axios credibility on Biden's picks like even if you take it at its word it's a list of guesses from the writers with maybe a few guesses from some advisors of dubious proximity to Biden.
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Yup. People genuinely need to know more about the media entities that they consume news from. That said, it's hard to do that without understanding some sites are worse thasn others through trial and error.
For other people's reference, Politico got quite a bit better when people left to start Axios. And Politico is still shit, but not as bad as before.
Like Cody said, Trump has a low approval rating, both Biden and Bernie shows them winning against Trump. Trump supporters voted for him because he promise to bring back jobs and drain the swamp and not just voting for him because he's racist. Obviously he lied.
It would make Trump more irrelevant than hurting the Democrats.
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You misunderstood me, I think. The harassment is part of why she's not endorsing Biden (the rest being timing, most likely).
The reason she isn't endorsing Bernie is... Well, this is all speculative, of course. But simply put, I think it's more a reflection of the weakness of Bernie's campaign. Endorsing her like minded progressive isn't going to get the movement anything if it doesn't put him over the top, and right now, there's no reason to think it would. I would actually say that this has been true for a while. People cracked wise about Moderate Voltron, but like, Bernie's campaign was always relying on the field just never consolidating and them coasting to a win with 35% of the vote, and the moment that Biden hit his target in SC, it was basically doomed. If I'm Warren, I'm looking at that and... I'm not optimistic. Bernie's campaign was a lot weaker than we'd realized at the time, clearly.
So, yeah. Might as well back the winning horse and try to steer it in your direction. Remember that thing a few days ago about potential treasury nominees? Warren vs Jamie Diamone? That kind of decision could come down to whether or not progressive voices like hers are inside or outside of the discussion.
So yeah, I get it. You invoked AOC, and by everything I've seen, she gets it to. She's sharp as hell, I'd follow her lead, imo.
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People tend to react to adversity by seeking safety, not change. 4 more years of Trump will not improve the left's odds. Assuming we even have elections then.
Longer than that. I'd put her impact in forming the CFPB and financial regulatory reform up against anything Bernie has done.
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