LB will be Devil Trigger, LT will be max-exceed/rev and presumably RT for some sort of switching mechanic. There's not going to be a dedicated dodge unless there's a specific style for that
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Devil May Cry 5 Reveal Trailer (PS4/XB1/PC - Spring 2019)
- Thread starter Sargerus
- Start date
If it's anything like Give me God of War, then it'll be a tough but fair challenge. I was very pleasantly surprised that a game so focused on reinventing itself in terms of narrative also featured a finely tuned yet very demanding difficulty setting. Before playing it, I assumed it wouldn't be as hard as the games that came before; after playing it, it's clear that it's just as challenging yet much more balanced than the settings in previous GOW games.
Huh, too bad, that was one of the best features in DMC2 and DmC.
By needlessly having to use three fingers for a single, basic action, of course!
That will suck balls. It's one of the 2 major things I wanted fixed. A modern action game without dedicated dodge button isn't acceptable. Even DMC2 got that right.
Maybe but problem is sacrificing estate on the controller limits things they can do elsewhere.
Single button dodge will probably still be in for Dante via Trickster.
Switching could be d-pad also, but I think dedicated dodge if it was in would already be shown on that sheet
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Watching the trailer even you see a lot of lock-on and side-roll type dodging but none of the Dark Souls/God of War style rolling away from stuff.
Lock-on rolling isn't such a hassle I think so long as the camera remains obedient and doesn't obstruct your view making it hard to see where Nero is facing.
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Additionally not to get all DMCV defence force on it, but almost near every action will probably require some sort of three-button input anyway. Stinger, air-dash etc etc. Unless they include the double tap stick actions like Bayonetta (which is more difficult to pull off imo)
Single button dodge will probably still be in for Dante via Trickster.
Switching could be d-pad also, but I think dedicated dodge if it was in would already be shown on that sheet
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Watching the trailer even you see a lot of lock-on and side-roll type dodging but none of the Dark Souls/God of War style rolling away from stuff.
Lock-on rolling isn't such a hassle I think so long as the camera remains obedient and doesn't obstruct your view making it hard to see where Nero is facing.
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Additionally not to get all DMCV defence force on it, but almost near every action will probably require some sort of three-button input anyway. Stinger, air-dash etc etc. Unless they include the double tap stick actions like Bayonetta (which is more difficult to pull off imo)
Why? It's only been a month since reveal lol.
Or you can just press the jump button.
Both the regular jump and hop have enough invincibility frames to let you dodge most attacks.
And unlike regular dodges in other games, jump dodging lets you start attacking pretty much at any point in its animation. So can go straight into an attack or use guns to delay your descent (to avoid a boss combo attack for example).
DMC's jump dodging is way underrated imo.
Thing is I don't really see a way you make it through the game without a majority of your time being on R1, analog direction and some sort of face button input. So the need for dedicated dodge doesn't feel as urgent here as in Bayonetta, where dodging is how you link a long combo together, do witch time or close the distance between enemies. Dodging is core to Bayo, but not DMC I feel.
In DMC dodging is just for avoiding damage 90% of the time. For Nero distance closing happens with his grabby arm (tho status of that in V is uncertain...) and Dante still has got his single dodge input (probably).
In DMC dodging is just for avoiding damage 90% of the time. For Nero distance closing happens with his grabby arm (tho status of that in V is uncertain...) and Dante still has got his single dodge input (probably).
I don't really understand the outcry for a dodge button. I admit I play these games really casually but the only time I let go of the lock-on button is when I want a different target.
I had the most bad experience with it in Vergil battle 3 because the camera changing often and I jumped instead of rolling -> got hit multiple times. If they finally figure out the camera everything is fine by me.
I had the most bad experience with it in Vergil battle 3 because the camera changing often and I jumped instead of rolling -> got hit multiple times. If they finally figure out the camera everything is fine by me.
Going backwards from DmC(and bayo and Ninja gaiden And god of war and basically every other action adventure game not beholden to 2001 DMC1 control schemes) huh
Cool cool itsuno
Cool cool itsuno
Dodge button kinda feels like a standard for the genre now. Bayonetta has one and that's not a "casual" game.
Just finished listening to the podcast, it was pretty awesome seeing some of the faces behind division 1, feel like Capcom needed something like this desperately last gen, for quite a long time I feel like gamers have dehumanized the people working in Capcom into nothing but a bunch of suits and higher ups, but now people will get to see that there are a lot of talented, passionate developers working in the company thanks to the Capcom Confidential podcast.
Would be cool if Reuben and other voice actors behind Capcom's most iconic characters show up in future episodes.
Would be cool if Reuben and other voice actors behind Capcom's most iconic characters show up in future episodes.
While I wish there was a dedicated dodge button... exceed system is more than just a visual affect, it's a core part of Nero's playstyle.
Gbraga is quoting Devil Trigger.
Seriously. dodge button is a standard thing in any action game and not just character actions games these days. Even TLOU2 is gonna have that. Pressing three buttons to do something as basic as dodging in 2018/9 is just bizarre.
While I agree that a dodge button is ideal, I think the dodge being ass and jumping actually being more efficient in avoiding damage is a much bigger issue than having to lock-on to dodge. If they make dodge actually feel powerful, it'll go a long way to make it feel smoother.
Agreed, and it's also the importance of having english speaking people in Capcom Japan. Capcom USA always had a lot of good people, but without being part of the actual development, their interactions with the community were limited to repeating information that was already officially revealed, which definitely didn't help with the image of "people in suits selling you stuff".
Yeah, the Exceed system is character defining and was honestly a stroke of genius.
Whoops.
The jump is DMC's universal dodge button.
Whether you are using Nero or Lady or Dante, you can use this button to dodge.
These other games you mention don't have this.
(can't tell you how many times I tried jump dodging in Bayo by mistake lol)
For nero that is counteracted somewhat by table hopper. Fewer recovery frames giving you greater time to wail on enemies.
Ultimately I think it comes down to how good the camera will be. The cumbersomeness of three-button dodge is lessened by the fact that nearly everything in DMC requires three buttons outside of shooting, jumping and vanilla combos. I don't think that'll be as much a hurdle for people as they'd think so long as they plan on using a lot of that stuff. But the real issue is having a handle of what direction you're faced in.
I did a replay of DMC4 on LDK mode recently and I had great issues with finding my orientation cause of all the stuff on screen and the dated camera, so lots of the directional-context-driven stuff like that air-streak thing where almost random chance while I know they wouldn't be if I could rely on lockon pinning the camera behind Nero (or making him extremely visible).
Again I think with Bayo it's such a different ball game, dodging is movement in Bayo. You're always dodging to get to things in that game. It's why you are able to buffer attacks into dodges in that game (least I think it's why).
These DMC games have never quite been that cept in 2 and reboot.
Ultimately I think it comes down to how good the camera will be. The cumbersomeness of three-button dodge is lessened by the fact that nearly everything in DMC requires three buttons outside of shooting, jumping and vanilla combos. I don't think that'll be as much a hurdle for people as they'd think so long as they plan on using a lot of that stuff. But the real issue is having a handle of what direction you're faced in.
I did a replay of DMC4 on LDK mode recently and I had great issues with finding my orientation cause of all the stuff on screen and the dated camera, so lots of the directional-context-driven stuff like that air-streak thing where almost random chance while I know they wouldn't be if I could rely on lockon pinning the camera behind Nero (or making him extremely visible).
Again I think with Bayo it's such a different ball game, dodging is movement in Bayo. You're always dodging to get to things in that game. It's why you are able to buffer attacks into dodges in that game (least I think it's why).
These DMC games have never quite been that cept in 2 and reboot.
Erm control schemes arent universal in action games
- Ninja gaiden - no dodge button, has jump button
- MGR - no dodge button, has run+jump buttons
- Bayonetta - dodge/run button, has jump button
- GOW4 - Dodge button, run button
- Nioh - Run/dodge button. A unique dodge on each stance, so dodging can require three buttons
I wonder if turbo mode will be exclusive to Xbone X (and naturally PC) given that it's probably the only console that could handle it.
This is not a GoW thread so I won't get too deep into it but give me GoW is one of the silliest and most ill tuned hardest difficulty in a recent action game. It's an absolute slog and completely unfun experience where you take too long trying to kill random mooks while avoiding one shots off screen. Terrible difficulty tuning and I am glad that some people on Era took it to task. One of these days I am going to make a thread highlighting it though not many people will understand since very few people bothered with the game after beating once.
Agreed. Offscreen death projectiles are the lamest way to increase difficulty, and GoW loved them. Ninja Gaiden 2 fucking loved them, too. Thank god Sigma 2 had the sense to cut back on some of that nonsense.
For games that are all about precision, needing to dodge with frame-perfect accuracy against attacks you can't even see coming is just abysmal design.
DMC fans be slacking.
Here is the folder with blurry statics (hidden message) that DMC5Info talked about. I swear if this was in some Kojima game the fans have had figured this shit out in like an hour lol
DMC1 was a brand new genre. I give it kind of a pass even though I don't like it that much.
Ninja Gaiden 2 doesn't get that kind of pass. Itagaki should've known better.
Yeah I know, it was 2001 a different time.
Stuff like that is why 3 and 4 did that thing where enemies (usually) hold back attacking if they're off screen I think
GMGOW mode was the most unfun and unbalanced mode that i've ever played in any video game.
3 also still had those annoying-ass angel enemies that could phase through terrain and attack you out of nowhere. But thankfully they don't pop up very often.
I actually really enjoyed playing the game on Give me God of War, I thought it was a better experience than Give me a Challenge, but it definitely has some glaring balancing issues. The first few hours are way too hard, and it still gets mashy in later areas. It wasn't fine tuned at all. They gave enemies devil triggers, made them tougher and that's it. It didn't feel properly playtested. It gets SO much easier once you get to Alfheim that either they didn't tune the first few hours properly or they didn't make the rest of the game hard enough. Either way, it's a huge balancing issue.
Yeah we sorta figured out that the control scheme will eventually add more stuff like exceed and devil trigger as the demo/full game goes on, I don't think that a confirmation was needed for this but it's appreciated.
But why would they omit the taunt button from the first control scheme that'll greet GC's demo players?
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Balance is one of the worst things in GoW and that's why replaying that game is a slog to me, tanky enemies are trash.
Those shallow rpg elements just make it harder to balance the game and they didn't add anything good to the game.
If they nail the NG+, it could really help with that. Balancing the whole game around the assumption that the player has the best gear already can make things a lot of fun.
I'm trying to imagine how they'd balance the super-boss for NG+ and just shuddering. God, that fight sucked. Making it harder...woof.
So, any idea when the next trailer is coming out?
I know Gamescom is the 21st so the demo footage will mostly show up around then but for some reason I have it in my head that's something's happening on the 19th?
I know Gamescom is the 21st so the demo footage will mostly show up around then but for some reason I have it in my head that's something's happening on the 19th?
Nice, thanks!
Also I'm sure the music video stuff is a wild goose chase. I know we're all hyped but we'll be getting more game footage shown, and whatever is in the music video will be more apparent later on anyway.
Don't let me stop you from having fun with it, though.
Also I'm sure the music video stuff is a wild goose chase. I know we're all hyped but we'll be getting more game footage shown, and whatever is in the music video will be more apparent later on anyway.
Don't let me stop you from having fun with it, though.
Yeah, not to derail this thread or anything, but having gotten through every challenge the game has in Gimme GOW mode, I disagree entirely. I mean, I can understand why some people got overwhelmed by attacks from far or from their flanks, but one-shoots were very rare (provided you had equipment to put you in fighting terms with high level enemies) and by no means hard to avoid (or rather, challenging, but never frustrating). Enemies only have enough health to pose a challenge and survive one or two juggles, they aren't by no means damage sponges. Alas, my opinion is that Gimme GOW was an amazing experience, even if it frustrated some people. I'm looking forward for NG+ to maybe reevaluate my opinion, but now and then I'll do some runs in Niflheim or Muspelheim just for the fun of it.
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Going backwards? Nah man, a 17 year-old PS2 game is the be-all end-all of action game control schemes, obviously.
Holy shit, the camera was a piece of shit in that part I give you that.
MGR is my favorite action game in the past five years, but I'm pretty sure I could look up videos of its camera being just as bad. The camera have been the curse of character action games for a long time.
I hope DMC5 is wide open areas + free camera all the way through.
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Exactly. I couldn't have said it any better. Jump is essentially a dedicated dodge button. I guess people don't use it in that way.
Yeah, it's really good to see that the people that are promoting the game actually worked on it. Matt Walker is the type of person that should be doing PR for this game.
Not that important really as people portray it to be. DMC2 dodge was basically irrelevant since the whole gameplay was badly broken from the get go, and DmC dodge wasn't as welcomed by the core base as they were forced to add classic manual lock-on later on in DE.
DMC never needed dedicated dodge mechanic, by who knows if we finally get to see something similar in DMC5, albeit utilized more seamlessly, blending into the gameplay and not actually compromising it.
People mentioning GoW, it was a complete mechanical overhaul from hack 'n slash into fully fledged Action RPG. DMC5 is not projected/promoted as such.
Having lock-on on doesn't disable the dodge button. And it's a toggle, so it didn't change the game as much. In fact, having lock-on on with Vergil mapped to one of the dodge buttons makes you lose a function (either warp up or warp down). Not that Dante needed two dodge buttons with identical functionality, but I always remapped one of the dodges for Dante in DmC to be a button combination (the gun special function) and it always felt great.
I personally think classic DMC dodging (sans 2 or using Trickster) is clunky, but I don't think it breaks the game or anything. It just feels much better to dodge with a dodge button, is all. The air dodge in DmC is also a great function that I miss a lot in other DMC games.
And GOW was and is a character action game through and through. It might've embraced RPG elements in its latest iteration, but that's relegated to stats only, the combat is typical of character action games.
Playing Bayonetta or DmC really opened my eyes to how much I missed a dodge button in DMC3 and 4. Like, I don't mind that the jump button works the way it does, but I think it's a less than optimal situation.
It is somewhat clunky i agree, but a reworked classic dodge mechanic fits DMC5 much better than a dedicated dodge button imho. But i might be wrong since we need to know the full control scheme and gameplay mechanics before we get at it.
After playing GoW for the most part, i can tell that not only RPG elements are relegated as a (broken) mechanism implemented, but the whole combat feels clunky and somewhat problematic as the closer camera pretty much guarantees off-camera hits no matter what you do (esp, in higher difficulties), And d-pad down as a 180 degree turn compromises the entire flow of the battle which is a shame because combat is so-well designed and organic, but the OTS camera really brakes the whole premise.
After playing GoW for the most part, i can tell that not only RPG elements are relegated as a (broken) mechanism implemented, but the whole combat feels clunky and somewhat problematic as the closer camera pretty much guarantees off-camera hits no matter what you do (esp, in higher difficulties), And d-pad down as a 180 degree turn compromises the entire flow of the battle which is a shame because combat is so-well designed and organic, but the OTS camera really brakes the whole premise.
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Yeah, it's just conjecture at this point. I'm hoping to get a feel to how DMC5 actually handles dodging during BGS.
Never thought that stats or the camera messed with my experience. I mean, the camera may require players to adapt, but I had no problem with it on Gimme GOW and certainly never got hit unfairly due to it. Gotta say I rarely used the 180 turn, much better to adjust your bearing while dodging, attacking or performing a runic move IMO.
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The only thing they need to do with DMC5 is to make the dodge omnidirectional. That would solve all the issues. You are playing a DMC game with lock on pressed for 90% of the time anyway and in that sense the Jump button becomes the dodge button.
DMC 3 and 4 don't allow enemies to attack offscreen. It's actually a way to cheese DMC 4 bloody palace pretty easily.