Digital Foundry: Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze - Switch vs Wii U: What Are The Enhancements?

[Musouka]

Very true although we don't know if the game is using 100% GPU power docked either. I would assume Nintendo would use whatever mode that they used for MK8 and that's 1080p60 and 720p60 and obviously they are different game but it's an interesting comparison.

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True.

Anyway, I somehow doubt they were utlizing the higher speed RAM of the Docked mode fully as that would have introduced more restrictions than seen here.

However, the possibility remains that while they might not have really maxed out the memory bandwidth in Docked, they still could have used more bandwidth than available in Portable (like ~11% more, for instance, instead of the full 20% more). That and perhaps not enough optimization could very well be the roots of the issue.

 

[1000% H]

Yours? Yes, I did. I was trying to post something at least as ridiculous.

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You literally mirrored your argument by comparing a stationary console to a mobile handheld.

 

[PlayBee]

You literally mirrored your argument by comparing a stationary console to a mobile handheld.

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If you can't even understand when you're being mocked then there's no point in arguing with you. Ignored.

 

[Deleted member 32018]

The Wii U is always hooked up to what is essentially an unlimited supply of power. It does not have to divvy it out over the course of hours.

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Yes and if the battery life is 5+ hours then that's fair and downclocking or not using the GPU at 100+ for battery life could be a thing. It would be the first time it's happened with a 1st party game though and the first time a Wii U port has not had parity on an undocked Switch.

 

[1000% H]

Yes and if the battery life is 5+ hours then that's fair and downclocking or not using the GPU at 100+ for battery life could be a thing. It would be the first time it's happened with a 1st party game though and the first time a Wii U port has not had parity on an undocked Switch.

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That's not me disregarding the similar power of the two, that's just me keeping in mind their differences.

If you can't even understand when you're being mocked then there's no point in arguing with you. Ignored.

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Good luck.

 

[JershJopstin]

648p/1080p docked is definitely a curiosity. I'd be interested to know why that's the case, given what other games have led us to expect the difference from handheld to docked to be. Regardless, I'm excited to pick this up - if not day 1, then by the end of May. I managed to miss out on this despite owning a Wii U, but I'd rather pay the $40 difference to have it on the Switch with those improvements (especially the load times, those look horrid).

 

[Deleted member 32018]

That's not me disregarding the similar power of the two, that's just me keeping in mind their differences.

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And that's fine for you to do so, but you have to understand that others will compare the power of the 2 and consider it to be a downgrade from that, which again is also fine. The main reason why I'm personally annoyed that it's 648p is because it will give the haters something else to shit-talk about on the Switch.

 

[Skittzo]

One thing to consider is battery life - it makes sense to target the lower clocks to squeeze more playtime out of the battery. It's more important to extend battery life in this case especially when the loss in resolution is so subtle in action.

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I like this theory. Games like Skyrim, DOOM and BotW likely use the boost mode clocks, such that they all eat up battery life at about the same rate. For a 2D platformer it might be more important to prioritize battery life, so maybe they decided not to use the boost mode clocks, which would mean the GPU is clocked 2.5x lower in handheld mode, rather than only 2x lower. Therefore it's more difficult to maintain 720p.

 

[1000% H]

And that's fine for you to do so, but you have to understand that others will compare the power of the 2 and consider it to be a downgrade from that, which again is also fine. The main reason why I'm personally annoyed that it's 648p is because it will give the haters something else to shit-talk the Switch about.

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If they genuinely believe playing the Wii U on a TV offers the same thing as playing the Switch wherever, that's all on them.

 

[Deleted member 6733]

Great analysis as usual Dark1x

I never got around to picking this up for the U so I'm likely to get for the Switch. It looks superb.

 

[Minsc]

I like this theory. Games like Skyrim, DOOM and BotW likely use the boost mode clocks, such that they all eat up battery life at about the same rate. For a 2D platformer it might be more important to prioritize battery life, so maybe they decided not to use the boost mode clocks, which would mean the GPU is clocked 2.5x lower in handheld mode, rather than only 2x lower. Therefore it's more difficult to maintain 720p.

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It would be great if it were an option if this is the case, to have it use boost mode at the cost of battery life or not use it and give more battery life.

Anyway, you can defintely say that it is the definitive release of the game, so eventually when I play it, I'll be happy to know it's not downgraded, and all the other improvements in the OP sound great.

 

[2112]

Full price?

 

[hibikase]

Well look at it this way, 648p handheld is still better than 480p on the Wii U gamepad.

 

[Deleted member 32018]

True.

Anyway, I somehow doubt they were utlizing the higher speed RAM of the Docked mode fully as that would have introduced more restrictions than seen here.

However, the possibility remains that while they might not have really maxed out the memory bandwidth in Docked, they still could have used more bandwidth than available in Portable (like ~11% more, for instance, instead of the full 20% more). That and perhaps not enough optimization could very well be the roots of the issue.

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Isn't the undocked bandwidth still higher than the Wii U's? I guess the eDRAM may have been used heavily in the Wii U version and that could lead to issues but I'm not sure.

 

[Pal]

I couldn't care less about 648P. On such a tiny screen, it's ridiculous to think it will impact your experience. If anything, this will look sharper than on your huge TV. Still not purchasing the game though. I've barely played TF on my Wii U and there's barely any worthwhile upgrade in the Switch version. 1080P upgrade? I just said I couldn't care less about the resolution.Slightly better texture filtering on a 2D platformer? Gimme a break. Funky Kong? Heh. That's a nice distraction. If it was packed with new contents, I'd be okay to spend $92 (Canadia monies) on it but in its current state, that a huge fucking no. I guess I'll simply consider TF as one of the few reasons I am keeping my Wii U. I'll play in 720P while others will play in 1080p. They'll have 2.25 times the fun I'll have for sure >_>

 

[bionic77]

I am in the minority here but I will take less loading over resolution all day.

Disappointing about the portable res though.

 

[New Fang]

I am in the minority here but I will take less loading over resolution all day.

Disappointing about the portable res though.

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The resolution has absolutely nothing to do with loading times.

 

[Medalion]

The resolution has absolutely nothing to do with loading times.

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...don't think they were implying that it was

 

[Deleted member 5764]

The resolution has absolutely nothing to do with loading times.

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I don't think they meant a direct correlation there. I read it more as them being happy with shorter load times to the point that it outweighs their disappointment with the handheld resolution. Not that they believe the res is lower so that load times can be quicker.

 

[hibikase]

Again, shit post for it being lower res than last gen? Surprised how far some are ready to go just to defend their favorite console.

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It's not lower res than last gen when comparing non-handheld to non-handheld. You're trying too hard. Anyway, off to the ignore list you go.

 

[New Fang]

...don't think they were implying that it was

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I don't think they meant a direct correlation there. I read it more as them being happy with shorter load times to the point that it outweighs their disappointment with the handheld resolution. Not that they believe the res is lower so that load times can be quicker.

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It's certainly worded in a way that it could be interpreted the way I did.

It's not lower res than last gen when comparing non-handheld to non-handheld. You're trying too hard. Anyway, off to the ignore list you go.

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Speaking of trying too hard.....

 

[hibikase]

Speaking of trying too hard.....

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What the fuck are you even implying?

 

[Schreckweg 5000]

Sounds good though I own the Wii U version and plan on holding off on the Switch version for a while.

Also I find it funny at all the negative hot takes when DF was so positive on the port from my interpretation.

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Business as usual. Helps that noone watches videos these days

 

[Snorkel the dolphin]

I don't see what the problem is. I'm going to be playing it at 1080p 60fps. Better than the Wii U

 

[New Fang]

What the fuck are you even implying?

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Comparing the Wii U's streaming tablet solution, to the Switch's screen seems like a stretch. They're really not comparable things.

 

[hibikase]

Comparing the Wii U's streaming tablet solution, to the Switch's screen seems like a stretch. They're really not comparable things.

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That's exactly the opposite of what I was saying?

 

[1000% H]

What the fuck are you even implying?

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I've already gone through this with other people.

Wii U gamepad doesn't matter.
Switch docked doesn't matter.
Only Wii U on TV and Switch undocked matter.

You don't compare gamepad to undocked.
You don't compare console to docked.
You only compare console to undocked.

They've made up their minds and won't budge. No need to get heated.

 

[Mutagenic]

I've already gone through this with other people.

Wii U gamepad doesn't matter.
Switch docked doesn't matter.
Only Wii U on TV and Switch undocked matter.

You don't compare gamepad to undocked.
You don't compare console to docked.
You only compare console to undocked.

They've made up their minds and won't budge. No need to get heated.

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You only compare console to undocked and then say you get a better resolution by playing on the Switch. Amazing.

 

[1000% H]

You only compare console to undocked and then say you get a better resolution by playing on the Switch. Amazing.

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Use your context clues.

 

[New Fang]

That's exactly the opposite of what I was saying?

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I see that now. Sorry, I got your post a bit mixed up with the multiple from 1000% H. ;)

 

[ILikeFeet]

Much like Edge Review threads and Valve threads, clearly Era isn't mature enough for civil discourse on video game resolutions

 

[hibikase]

This thread is a goddamn mess of misunderstandings and false equivalences.

I see that now. Sorry, I got your post a bit mixed up with the multiple from 1000% H. ;)

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Cool, no harm done.

 

[disparate]

TF Switch's performance versus the WIi U version of the game is uniquely worse versus other Wii U to Switch ports. Yes 1080p is nice when plugged in yet this game is worse in a way that other stuff like Mario Kart and Zelda aren't when it's unplugged. It's fair for people to not want to drop another 60-80 dollars for this considering.

I mean I guess it's nicer than the dog's breakfast that was Xenoblade 2.

 

[Mutagenic]

Use your context clues.

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You can't have it both ways. You get called out for your stupidity time and time again and simply blame others for not applying context. It's mind-boggling.

 

[1000% H]

You can't have it both ways. You get called out for your stupidity time and time again and simply blame others for not applying context. It's mind-boggling.

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What are the 'both ways'?

 

[hibikase]

Much like Edge Review threads and Valve threads, clearly Era isn't mature enough for civil discourse on video game resolutions

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Resolution and framerate is this community's religion.

 

[Poison Jam]

I wonder if the lower handheld resolution is due to bandwidth differences. I don't recall there being a ton of alpha effects and such, but Wii U had 32MB of very quick embedded memory that would have been used for the framebuffer and more.

It's pretty much the one aspect where Switch can't best the Wii U.

 

[Laserbeam]

that video made me really excited to play through this game again. Damn.

 

[Dark1x]

I like this theory. Games like Skyrim, DOOM and BotW likely use the boost mode clocks, such that they all eat up battery life at about the same rate. For a 2D platformer it might be more important to prioritize battery life, so maybe they decided not to use the boost mode clocks, which would mean the GPU is clocked 2.5x lower in handheld mode, rather than only 2x lower. Therefore it's more difficult to maintain 720p.

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Exactly. I think people need to keep this in mind - not all Switch games use the same performance profile in portable mode. Battery life with games like Doom isn't great. I wish I had time to measure DKC TP but I can say that, based on my extended time with the game on a flight, it's better than your typical Switch game. The drop to 648p is barely noticeable but an increase in battery life is certainly useful.

 

[Euman]

Whoa, I never heard about those WiiU load times. Glad that got improved!

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Yeah I was playing the other night after not touching it for a few months. Had almost enough time to make a quick sandwich while waiting for the level to boot.

 

[Skittzo]

Exactly. I think people need to keep this in mind - not all Switch games use the same performance profile in portable mode. Battery life with games like Doom isn't great. I wish I had time to measure DKC TP but I can say that, based on my extended time with the game on a flight, it's better than your typical Switch game. The drop to 648p is barely noticeable but an increase in battery life is certainly useful.

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It would be nice if they offered the option to use boost mode for those that notice the resolution being under 720p. I play in portable mode exclusively but 90% of the time I'm plugged into an outlet, so battery life isn't a concern.

 

[Mutagenic]

The resolution inconsistency will certainly be better than what I experienced on Vita time and time again. HSG, Wipeout...even later titles like P4G. You rarely found native games on that thing.

 

[memoryman3]

Bayonetta 2 does burn through the Switch's battery...maybe it was worth reducing the resolution? Dunno, can't say for sure until I take image shots.

 

[fauxcalin]

What are the 'both ways'?

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From what I gather the both ways he's referring to are 1. Your concession that we should compare Wii U on TV to undocked switch while also saying that 2. The resolution is higher on switch even though (1.) would contradict that.
I'm don't give a fuck about resolution but I am interested in this debate and just want to see if I'm following you right cause I (think?) I agree with your point but am getting confused

 

[~Fake]

1080p docked its a great number. Looks pretty sharp for me.

 

[Imitatio]

That's certainly a very interesting resolution in handheld mode. I personally think that most games look fine with 600p and above on the Switch's screen. Mario + Rabbids is a great example in my opinion.

Going drastically below that line starts to hurt some of the experiences though. I loved Xenoblade 2, especially for being able to play it where- and whenever, but the resolution of around 400-500p was noticeable, no doubt about that. Didn't lessen my personal enjoyment but I can see why some might be underwhelmed.

The resolution with DKTF seems absolutely fine to me in comparison, though it would certainly be nice to have native res for most titles, especially first party stuff.

 

[KRBM]

Let's not make 648p the new 30fps-Kirbygate. According to DF it's completely fine at Switch's ppi.

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30fps in Kirby is still a huge disappointment. 648p in DKCTP is not really an issue at all in comparison.

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Yeah that's what I meant. The 30fps in that game is ridiculous (whether the devs were lazy or had their priorities mixed up), but 648p on a 720p screen with 234ppi is not worth complaining about.

 

[bionic77]

TF Switch's performance versus the WIi U version of the game is uniquely worse versus other Wii U to Switch ports. Yes 1080p is nice when plugged in yet this game is worse in a way that other stuff like Mario Kart and Zelda aren't when it's unplugged. It's fair for people to not want to drop another 60-80 dollars for this considering.

I mean I guess it's nicer than the dog's breakfast that was Xenoblade 2.

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I wouldn't buy it again if I had a Wii U, but I never played any of the games on that system and I always wanted to try this and Mario especially as I have heard so many great things about them.

I would rather get it for $40 but if it is as good as people claim I don't mind paying full price for a game I never played before.

According to Dark it has better battery life too. That to me is pretty substantial depending on how much of an increase you get.

 

[Simba1]

For those worried about resolution in handheld, it's really difficult to tell. It looks ever so slightly softer but it doesn't really stick out. Tom and I counted a lot of pixels to be sure of 648p and I even busted out a microscope on the Switch LCD just to confirm it doesn't line up with the grid. Scaling on a fixed pixel display usually annoys me but it really looks fine here and it's amazing to see this game running on a handheld.

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One thing to consider is battery life - it makes sense to target the lower clocks to squeeze more playtime out of the battery. It's more important to extend battery life in this case especially when the loss in resolution is so subtle in action.

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Exactly. I think people need to keep this in mind - not all Switch games use the same performance profile in portable mode. Battery life with games like Doom isn't great. I wish I had time to measure DKC TP but I can say that, based on my extended time with the game on a flight, it's better than your typical Switch game. The drop to 648p is barely noticeable but an increase in battery life is certainly useful.

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Dont bother, for some people obviously 648p is deal breaker compared to 720p resolution, like we are talking something like 480p vs 720p and not only about 15-20% higher pixel count where most people wouldn't even notice difference between 648p and 720p on 6.2" screen.

Also, keep up with great job. :)

 

[memoryman3]

648p to me is honestly fine. I could not notice when the resolution switched in Splatoon 2 multiplayer.

But it will lack that screenshot crispness factor that MK8 had...