Fallout exploding in interest thanks to its TV show REALLY highlights how botched the handling of Halo’s own show was

[SunBroDave]

Halo was a terrible IP to do a live action of, specially one centered around the master chief

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Halo had every opportunity to be a successful show, but the people working on it completely squandered it.

The original Halo was basically Aliens crossed with Rambo, two of the most famous 80's action movies, and we literally just had The Mandalorian which was an incredibly popular show about a guy who basically never takes his helmet off. On top of that, there's the old unproduced Alex Garland script that already exists which largely successfully adapted Halo 1 into a feature film.

Hell, as an alternative to Halo 1, they could have also just started the show with Halo Reach, which was probably the strongest dramatic narrative experience that's ever been in a Halo game, with a bunch of characters with clear and vibrant personalities, a clearly understandable plot and stakes, is practically already episodic in structure, and has a killer ending.

The ingredients and the resources were there, including a decent enough budget to do it right, but the people working on the show just took it in completely the wrong direction.

 

[Trup1aya]

Writers probably have a lot more to work with in the Fallout universe. MC also isn't a very interesting protagonist by himself because he is the silent type, so he needs good supporting characters. I thought the pilot made Infinite work well. I haven't seen the Halo show myself.

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That's not really an excuse. There are good supporting characters to pull from in Halo. Cortana and Halsey are used to great effect in the show. But many of the characters, whether pulled from the books/games or created exclusively for the show, were poorly written/utilized. And the Shows version of Master Chief basically amounts to a character assassination.

 

[spookyduzt]

What works well with Fallout and TLOU is that the show respects its source material. Halo on the other hand just shits all over it, kinda like how 343 has handled the franchise.

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This is a large part of it. Halo was made the way Hollywood used to do video game & comic book adaptations. Oh, you want me to write an adaptation of an IP that is so successful and popular it actually warrants attention from Hollywood? Well it's a trashy video game made for sweaty mouth breathers, so being a big Hollywood writer I'm going to make my own version of this, change all the shit that made it popular in the first place, and it will be better in every way.

 

[Kinthey]

Resident Evil didn't get any cross-promotion with that godshitawful tv show they did either.

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Resident Evil adaptions really show that what matters the most in the end is talent. The unfaithful movies don't work and the faithful animated movies don't work either because the quality just isn't there. Though at least the animated movies remain interesting for fans as they're supposed to be canon

 

[Azerth]

its pretty telling that we still havnt heard that its been renewed for s3

 

[wwm0nkey]

Definitely not no one, especially the early ones. Edit: Also they wouldn't keep making them if no one read them.


In Season 2, they very much did not disregard book lore. It had fucking Onyx in it, which has only ever been seen or mentioned in the books. The Rubble from Season 1 and Season 2 is also a location that has only ever been seen in books.

You can not like the execution all you want, but to say they disregarded the books is not accurate.

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Season 1 for sure did. I would argue while they did have areas from the books in S2, it was still handled way outside the realms of what their purpose actually was.
S2 spoilers
Also the flood were wack as shit and not saving them for the ring sucked ass too

 

[wwm0nkey]

its pretty telling that we still havnt heard that its been renewed for s3

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it wasn't even really renewed for S2, just like Velma, it had a 2 season deal from the get go

 

[Mr Evil 37]

Season 1 for sure did. I would argue while they did have areas from the books in S2, it was still handled way outside the realms of what their purpose actually was.
S2 spoilers
Also the flood were wack as shit and not saving them for the ring sucked ass too

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Like I said, you can not like the execution, but if they disregarded the books then nothing from the books would be in the show. That isn't the case. And some of the stuff they pulled from the books has not even appeared in the games.

 

[Quinton]

Paramount+ is by no means the low-subscription-count service it once was; it's made impressive gains. (As a Star Trek fan, this pleases me! More people are tuning in as a result!)

But it's still nowhere near the level of Amazon. I think a better adaptation of Halo's IP certainly helps, yeah. But I'm not sure it can get anywhere especially close to what a big Amazon launch can achieve for the games.

 

[NDA-Man]

Resident Evil adaptions really show that what matters the most in the end is talent. The unfaithful movies don't work and the faithful animated movies don't work either because the quality just isn't there. Though at least the animated movies remain interesting for fans as they're supposed to be canon

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Much as I hate to say it, the Paul Anderson movies "worked". They didn't make ten of them because they failed. I dunno, saying that the Anderson films didn't work is like saying Fast and Furious failed because it is not true cinema.

 

[wwm0nkey]

Like I said, you can not like the execution, but if they disregarded the books then nothing from the books would be in the show. That isn't the case. And some of the stuff they pulled from the books has not even appeared in the games.

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disregarding their purpose is still disregarding imho. I am not saying stuff from the books just flat out wasn't in there, just parts of them were ignored outside of a "hey here is reference to thing"

 

[Neuromancer]

The Halo show was actually produced by Showtime. My conspiracy theory is they put it on Paramount+ to "bury" it because they knew how poorly received it was going to be and didn't want to tarnish Showtime's brand.

 

[empurror]

can't believe they messed up the halo show so bad tbh lol

 

[Servbot24]

Twisted Metal was on Peacock and did great?

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You're kind of proving their point if Twisted Metal
is the best example you have

 

[Abrasion Test]

I maintain this is a bigger fumble than anything the games have done.

 

[c2c]

As someone who was in high school when Halo 2 and 3 released, I still find it hard to believe how irrelevant that IP has become.

 

[NDA-Man]

Also, Twisted Metal... I haven't watched the show, and TM's continuity is fucked anyways, but it's not a terribly faithful adaptation, either. Just a good one.

 

[chickenandrofls]

Halo like Twisted Metal was on a streaming service nobody cares about. Even putting aside peoples opinion on quality of the shows if it's not on Netflix, Prime, Disney+ or HBO it's going to have a hard time reaching a mass casual appeal. Who talks about any of the shows on those streaming services?

 

[Siden]

Everyone saying that Master Chief isnt an interesting character is correct because of dialog, but neither is the mandalorian who is also just as silent as MC is. There is no reason they couldnt have just developed Halo with the same mindset as Mandalorian.

 

[Kinthey]

Much as I hate to say it, the Paul Anderson movies "worked". They didn't make ten of them because they failed. I dunno, saying that the Anderson films didn't work is like saying Fast and Furious failed because it is not true cinema.

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True they worked in the sense that they were a success. I meant it more in the sense of it being perceived as a well regarded adaptation

 

[Z-Beat]

I think Halo officially lost my interest with how they were handling The Flood. Took away the most interesting thing about them and effectively just made them zombies. Also kinda undermines the importance of the rings because if wiping the galaxy was your way of dealing with relatively basic zombies then what kind of advanced race were you.

Couldn't get enough of those, not like we had 7 Walking Dead tv shows

 

[Unicorn]

They really could have just adapted The Fall of Reach novel for the first 2 seasons and it would have been great. But nope had to get into weird shit. Also WTF at.

-Dr. Halsey's rapey lab assistant?
-Cortana getting cucked by MC having sex with a PoW (and thus committing a war crime)

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Yoooooo wtffff

 

[wwm0nkey]

Yoooooo wtffff

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Just screams Halo right?

 

[Thrill_house]

I think it is a setting problem. I'll be honest with you: Halo is one of the most boring non interesting sci-fi settings I have dealt with. Master chief is a silent nothing character anf there isn't an interesting world around him to flesh out.

Fallout has so much pizzazz and personality in the games and they nailed translating that into something new and interesting for the show.

You couldn't pay me to watch some sleep inducing halo tv show. I don't give a shit about the world, boring ass non character master chief or any of the other details in the setting. Its just not interesting in the slightest.

 

[Dasnap]

What works well with Fallout and TLOU is that the show respects its source material. Halo on the other hand just shits all over it, kinda like how 343 has handled the franchise.

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'Respect the source material' has been a known rule of adaptation for decades but creators still seem to forget it.

 

[Soap]

Halo like Twisted Metal was on a streaming service nobody cares about. Even putting aside peoples opinion on quality of the shows if it's not on Netflix, Prime, Disney+ or HBO it's going to have a hard time reaching a mass casual appeal. Who talks about any of the shows on those streaming services?

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Star Trek.

But therein lies a bigger problem for Halo, why in the world would you choose the Halo TV show over one of the many Trek shows on Paramount+?

For me, the Halo tv show feels like it is afraid to say anything of substance. We could have had a great show about religion and the military, a new battlestar galactica, but instead we got the most service level boring science fiction one can imagine.

 

[thewienke]

I hope Halo gets a Season 3 because Season 2 was legitimately good. I think they're finally cooking.

But even basic CG stuff costs a fortune and Halo uses quite a bit so I struggle to believe it'll get renewed in this era of television austerity.

 

[Spacejaws]

Have Paramount Plus for Paw Patrol. Wouldn't have it otherwise so got to watch one episode but couldn't stand the Elites all being 15 foot hulking monsters, double the size of Spartans I think. I'm not a megafan of the games or lore but that wasn't the impression I remember of the Elites. I remember them being closer to large humanoids and being kinda almost lean/nimble for their size instead of slow hulks.

As shallow as it is but that put me off right away haha.

 

[I KILL PXLS]

It was a terrible first season in a platform no one has, and as usual with Microsoft, didn't care for anyone outside of US/UK and didn't release anywhere else for months.

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I like the show more than most here, but this is basically it. In order for the games to get the bump these shows or movies can cause, they need to be A) Pretty good and B) People need to know they exist (Witcher on Netflix, TLoU on HBO, Fallout on Prime). Halo S1 was divisive at best and it was on a streaming platform that barely anyone has. Could MS still have cross promoted more? Sure, but it wouldn't have made a difference. The Witcher 3 got a bump despite the fact that the people behind the show aren't involved at all with the people behind the game.

Have Paramount Plus for Paw Patrol. Wouldn't have it otherwise so got to watch one episode but couldn't stand the Elites all being 15 foot hulking monsters, double the size of Spartans I think. I'm not a megafan of the games or lore but that wasn't the impression I remember of the Elites. I remember them being closer to large humanoids and being kinda almost lean/nimble for their size instead of slow hulks.

As shallow as it is but that put me off right away haha.

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They're maybe a bit taller in the show (or maybe the Spartans are a bit shorter), but they're pretty consistent with the games. Scale gets skewed in the games a bit because you forgot that you're playing as a 7.5-8ft character. You see a Needler in the game and get a certain idea of the size, and then you realize how huge it actually is when a regular human holds one.

 

[Doskoi Panda]

I will always think it was a profoundly stupid decision to allow the creative decisions for this show to be made by people with an expressed lack of interest in the IP itself.

 

[Trup1aya]

Will stuff like Fallout always make for better adaptations because there isn't a direct story or lore to portray?

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Fallout TV show tells an original story that embraces the lore from the games.

There's no reason a Halo TV show couldn't do the exact same thing. Instead they chose to tell an inferior original story that tramples on the lore.

 

[Spacejaws]

They're maybe a bit taller in the show (or maybe the Spartans are a bit shorter), but they're pretty consistent with the games. Scale gets skewed in the games a bit because you forgot that you're playing as a 7.5-8ft character. You see a Needler in the game and get a certain idea of the size, and then you realize how huge it actually is when a regular human holds one.

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I think it's less how tall they are and more how buff and slow they are. They remind me more of Krogans in Mass Effect than Elites.

Found this video that kinda shows the difference a bit better than I can explain.

View: https://youtu.be/LP2ykgslmiQ?si=q4qipD_pb2vuxEYb

Yea smaller Spartans don't help. They look almost double their height.

 

[Trup1aya]

Definitely not no one, especially the early ones. Edit: Also they wouldn't keep making them if no one read them.


In Season 2, they very much did not disregard book lore. It had fucking Onyx in it, which has only ever been seen or mentioned in the books. The Rubble from Season 1 and Season 2 is also a location that has only ever been seen in books.

You can not like the execution all you want, but to say they disregarded the books is not accurate.

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Superficially including locations from the lore doesn't change the fact that the lore was largely disregarded. Onyx in the books was not a place where marines were given a 3 week crash course on being a Spartan. Nor was it the source of a flood outbreak

 

[Scarecrow]

S2 spoilers
Also the flood were wack as shit and not saving them for the ring sucked ass too

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Aw man. I haven't watched any of the Halo show, but what did they do to them?

 

[chickenandrofls]

Star Trek.

But therein lies a bigger problem for Halo, why in the world would you choose the Halo TV show over one of the many Trek shows on Paramount+?

For me, the Halo tv show feels like it is afraid to say anything of substance. We could have had a great show about religion and the military, a new battlestar galactica, but instead we got the most service level boring science fiction one can imagine.

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You could argue that Star Trek is the biggest show on Paramount but something like Fallout has almost as many ratings on IMDb in one week as Discovery has in 7 years. By week 2 it will most likely pass it. I don't think all of the original ST shows on Paramount+ together would add up to something like Witcher/TLOU. I know this isn't the best way to look at overall popularity but with the way streamer viewership ratings are calculated/shown there's never a perfect comparison anyway. I'm sure someone with time on their hands could dig into the Nielsen ratings or something to get another comparison but I think the point is still valid.

 

[Slaythe]

Honestly this is so bad they have to kill it and pretend it never happened like the Capcom RE movies.

Like at this point they can not salvage this, nothing they can do can bring in *new* fans.

 

[Patitoloco]

Honestly this is so bad they have to kill it and pretend it never happened like the Capcom RE movies.

Like at this point they can not salvage this, nothing they can do can bring in *new* fans.

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I kinda honestly think the Resident Evil films actually got a lot of people into the series, even if they were completely wack in comparison.

 

[Drachen]

At least Halo fans are getting new games. Sure Fallout fans are getting hyped, but for what? To replay games from 2010 and 2015 with absolutely nothing new on the horizon anytime soon.

 

[NDA-Man]

Honestly this is so bad they have to kill it and pretend it never happened like the Capcom RE movies.

Like at this point they can not salvage this, nothing they can do can bring in *new* fans.

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The TV show or Halo in general?

At least Halo fans are getting new games. Sure Fallout fans are getting hyped, but for what? To replay games from 2010 and 2015 with absolutely nothing new on the horizon anytime soon.

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Hang out in the Halo OT and see how happy Halo fans are.

And 76 came out and is getting substantial new content. Frankly, it's post launch and ongoing support blows Halo Infinite's death twitches (and playercount) out of the water.

 

[FarSight XR-20]

I was keeping track of the pre-release marketing for the hype and it's an area where Amazon/Bethesda killed it too (besides the quality of the show). Even in my place I saw 4 or 5 different billboards when going to the gym or to work.

View: https://twitter.com/ChuckPatton9/status/1781747222541119840?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1781747222541119840%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

Giving Halo to somewhat unknown showrunners and a new streaming service that hadn't even launch (and it didn't even launch worldwide at first) was non sense decision from the start. You can see Bethesda put a lot more of attention into it than MS. Nolan was a fan of Fallout, he chose showrunners who loved the games and they had Altman on set every day.

"Todd was just such a great collaborator," Wagner said. "It never felt like he was trying to get in there and force us to do things we didn't want to do. He would just get us to read the scripts and be like, 'You know what? We got in trouble in that area. Keep an eye on that.' It was great advice from a guy who's already had similar conversations. That was unbelievably helpful. And then James Altman from Bethesda was on set every day, assuring us that we were getting it right and not accidentally blowing up 25 years of canon. So, if we ever did blow up the canon, we did it with intention."

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Halo S2 was a lot better but the damage done by S1 is done unfortunately.

Spoiler: Fallout marketing campaign

 

[NDA-Man]

As an aside, absolutely nobody in Hollywood wanted to do a Halo movie back when Halo was the biggest IP in gaming. Reason being they dis want to put up with MS.

Like for all we say MS should've been more involved... their involvement doomed the possibility of a Halo adaptation back when the IP legit had momentum. Like Halo has been on a downslope for well over a decade. If MS couldn't dictate things when Halo was relevant, why think they could now?

 

[Trup1aya]

At least Halo fans are getting new games. Sure Fallout fans are getting hyped, but for what? To replay games from 2010 and 2015 with absolutely nothing new on the horizon anytime soon.

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Both Fallout and Halo have gotten 1 new game since 2015. I would not be surprised if the next fallout arrives before the next Halo.

 

[LAA]

Yeah I don't know what's going on with Halo anymore, I kinda wish Xbox would just sell it back to Bungie/PS at this point, because it doesn't seem to be system seller it used to be for them and it almost feels even they don't really believe in it any more.
I read a disappointing stat that 343 have worked with Halo longer than Bungie at this point, and 343 still don't seem confident with what to do with it, the narrative for their games hasn't been great too when they've essentially dropped everything from the last game and started again, they just haven't committed to something. Infinite isn't going well, progression system is terrible, it's whole model seems based on monetisation, and to think of the amount of armour you got in past Halos for free, not even a fraction of it here (I know it's different because it's f2p and you can get some stuff for free, but still)

The series, I have actually been giving another chance recently, but I have criticisms, really how it's going non-canon (i.e. I thought Cortana chose her Spartan), and what I believe is actually canon, but it's just a big disconnect as someone who only really played the games, Master Chief spending the majority of the time with his helmet off, it just never happens in the games so seeing it happen casually and frequently in the series, it just makes me think "this isn't Chief", even though in the books I hear it's the same.

I don't expect them to do it, but I think the best Halo media outside of the games I've seen is the Halo Legends collection, I thought it was neat having a bunch of episodes in a bunch of different art styles.

 

[the lizard]

Fallout just has more gen pop appeal. It's got a colorful world and characters that doesn't revolve around the military and has the potential to say interesting things about society. Halo frankly doesn't have any of that

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Fallout is probably easier to get into, though, since a lot of the humor and personality translate well. In Halo, you're a jacked up usually silent space marine shooting things for 8 hours. Then there is multiplayer which isn't fun for new casual players.

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The original Halo games had a ton of humor, everything after 3 got way too serious

 

[Trup1aya]

Fallout just has more gen pop appeal. It's got a colorful world and characters that doesn't revolve around the military and has the potential to say interesting things about society. Halo frankly doesn't have any of that

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Halo has the potential to say interesting things about society. It's a story of late stage capitalism, meets religious zealously, meets fascism. the IPs handlers have chosen not to saying anything interesting.

 

[Mukrab]

There was a Halo show on Paramount+?

(Seriously - I didn't know.)

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Yes and master chief has sex with a refugee or prisoner of war, however you wanna see it, while cortana watches.

I wish i was joking

 

[Jawmuncher]

I do agree that Fallout is probably easier to make your own story within that universe for TV. However, I disagree that Halo isn't a good fit or have appeal. There's a lot to work with there and the show at present effectively just threw that out the window.

Even some of the interesting new ideas it use it doesn't commit to.

 

[the lizard]

Halo has the potential to say interesting things about society. It's a story of late stage capitalism, meet religious zealously, meets fascism. the IPs handlers have chosen not to saying anything interesting.

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sure - that's fair. but you could say that about anything. but social commentary (whether you think it works or not) is built into Fallout's DNA (thanks, I suppose, to its IP handlers)… whereas you can't say the same thing about Halo.

 

[Buckle]

Should have kept the helmet and his pants on.