[Famitsu] Nintendo President says, "game development will become even longer, more complex, and more sophisticated in the future"
- Thread starter DriftingSpirit
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Yeah, this is the big problem the industry is facing right now. Development time and costs are out of control to the degree that most studios put out a game a generation and generations are longer than ever.
Retro put out the entirety of the Metroid Prime Trilogy in just 5 years. FIVE years. The gap between The Last of Us part 1 and The Last of Us part 2 was longer. You could have fit the entire trilogy in that gap and still had room for another game.
If studios and publishers don't figure this all out there's going to be real trouble down the line.
Retro put out the entirety of the Metroid Prime Trilogy in just 5 years. FIVE years. The gap between The Last of Us part 1 and The Last of Us part 2 was longer. You could have fit the entire trilogy in that gap and still had room for another game.
If studios and publishers don't figure this all out there's going to be real trouble down the line.
The Last of Us isn't a good comparison because there was Uncharted 4 and Uncharted: Lost Legacy between the two games. Mass Effect 1-2-3 always works though.
What was he supposed to learn? They have to progress eventually, it's inevitable, it's just a matter of how they grow and adapt, and we don't know that answer yet.
It's not just Iwata or him - it's the entire industry dealing with this phenomenon. Why should Nintendo be immune?
There's competing ideas that costs need to come down and games need to be made faster because they take too long, but also bigger and with more and continuous content.
But at the same time, no layoffs, no AI, better working conditions with unions and no crunch.
Think they're in tension.
But at the same time, no layoffs, no AI, better working conditions with unions and no crunch.
Think they're in tension.
You can't really do trilogies like this anymore. Best case scenario, it takes 2 generations instead of the 1 that ME took.
Nintendo is just behind the curve. All the problems AAA publishers are facing today, Nintendo will face soon. This happened before. A lot of developers struggled with HD development, and Nintendo temporarily avoided that by releasing a non-HD console. But when Nintendo finally had their own HD console out, they struggled like all the developers before them.
he isn't wrong. hopefully nintendo does not fall into the same pitfalls all big publishers have fallen, though.
All three major players face this problem, there's no getting around it.
What do we players want is the question? Do we want better graphics? Do we even want larger worlds? How much more fidelity and larger textures do we fucking need?
Things will likely even out in the long-term, but there's gonna be a lot of shifting and victims before this industry reaches a place of stability it seems.
What do we players want is the question? Do we want better graphics? Do we even want larger worlds? How much more fidelity and larger textures do we fucking need?
Things will likely even out in the long-term, but there's gonna be a lot of shifting and victims before this industry reaches a place of stability it seems.
even as they struggled it allowed them to keep costs down
While your overall point remains true, they were hit hard by Covid.
Gotta remember that Covid hit Nintendo pretty hard here, that surely added dev time to TotK.
They will still make smaller games, I'm sure.
He is probably referring to their mainline Zeldas, Marios, etc.
He is probably referring to their mainline Zeldas, Marios, etc.
I really don't understand why companies understand this, yet still green light projects that later corroborate the problems they're outlining?
Lower budgets, descope games, lower graphics, whatever. Make GameCube level games if thats what it takes to make studios sustainable. I think we'd be fine with Wind Waker or Prime or Mario Galaxy level games.
Like… stop hitting yourself with the stick?
Lower budgets, descope games, lower graphics, whatever. Make GameCube level games if thats what it takes to make studios sustainable. I think we'd be fine with Wind Waker or Prime or Mario Galaxy level games.
Like… stop hitting yourself with the stick?
At least Nintendo does a bunch of mid budget type games. If Square Enix goes full bore with AAA, Nintendo should embrace the world of 2D pixel HD jrpg's. Zelda already takes a long time to make. Best of luck to GameFreak. I can live with one Xenoblade and Fire Emblem game a gen. Fire Emblem pixel HD remakes
Are indies releasing games at a pace that suggests this is the end all answer?
They are expanding their circles beyond the gaming industry (entertainment industry, theme parks, movies, TV dramas, manga, novels, etc.), but they are not expanding as in acquisitions, branching offices, mass hiring, etc.
Yeah I'm definitely worried for the fact that Nintendo can't really lag behind anymore. Hopefully their expansions and their general style of making games keeps them from dealing with this as much as others have. One of the good things they have going for them, though, is a lot of their series have already been a one or two per console thing.
Sure but being behind the curve is a big advantage. You are entering a development environment where the relevant toolset has reached maturity and a lot of headache inducing issues have already been figured out. Creating a PS4 level game today would be far less costly than it would have been in 2013 and so on and so on.
Nintendo are already quite well equipped to deal with these issues regardless due to them being able to sell large numbers of games that are naturally lesser inscope. Unlike their counterparts they have cultivated an audience as accepting of a 2D side scroller as much as a AAA Zelda. The next Mario Party is not going to require a massive explosion in scope and budget, same with any of their successful 2D games
They've balanced things exceptionally well with the switch. The trickiest part for them is the ratio of Nintendo to third party/indie software sales. I think a thread the other day mentioned Nintendo software made up 80% of software sales for the switch. If they can lean on third party games more they'll be in a better spot. That old mantra of people only buying nintendo hardware for nintendo games is hard to shake.
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't ToTK ready for about a year and mainly in bugfixing / waiting for a good time to release? Or am I mistaking it for another title?
You're not wrong but it is still likely more costly and more complicated to make than what would be your PS3-level game you'd been creating up to now.
Considering how common the sentiment is on the internet that the Switch is "unplayable" due to it's tech specs, I think this is a real reach.
For Nintendo it'll help that, despite advancing toward high-end hardware, they're most likely still going to keep their games mid-budgeted and not prioritize hardware fidelity. Still it's unfortunate to anticipate that some games like Zelda will inevitably take even longer than they already do to materialize.
Yeah, People say Nintendo have avoided what the rest of the industry have been doing but argue it's more them being behind the curve for while and that there already there now with TOTK was probably good indication of that maybe even before that given how they used wiiu ports to cover certain games that have gone entirely without otherwise. Long dev time, increased price. Same thing when transition to HD, same true for how they'll deal with costs and sophistication of game development as they're heading towards a new generation with better hardware with more expectations. Metroid prime still isnt out for long while, We haven't seen a new mario 3D game as well which longest it's ever been with 7 years.
We do hear that stuff a lot of forums or whatever, but it hasn't seemed to affect sales at all, so I think that market of people is probably just irrelevant and not worth spending a boatload of money to please. its probably safe to write them off and target the people who will actually buy your games
This feels like it could be a much bigger problem for Nintendo when compared with Sony/Microsoft, simply because Nintendo consoles are much more reliant on first party software.
www.resetera.com
If the output slows down, their next console will suffer.
It might be wise of them to get the next 3D Mario, Mario Kart, and Animal Crossing out within the first 12 months of the Switch 2 to give it a nice boost for the next 3-4 years.
81% of Nintendo's software revenue came from first-party in the last fiscal year
EDIT: Didn't find any proper explanation in the documents themselves if this is based on units or revenue, but I found an old thread from Daniel Ahmad, and he also says this is revenue based...
www.resetera.com
If the output slows down, their next console will suffer.
It might be wise of them to get the next 3D Mario, Mario Kart, and Animal Crossing out within the first 12 months of the Switch 2 to give it a nice boost for the next 3-4 years.
Selling to an audience of just Resetera does not pay for game creation as a whole.
What you really are arguing for is a significant reduction in headcount since that is where the majority of game development costs come from. But "games will look the same forever but with new levels" is not a long term salable strategy.
Yes they've been recruiting heavily for several years now. Clearly will continue given the additional building and planned recruitment expenses.
I think that quote might have been taken out of context a bit, but TotK went through a long polishing phase is what I believe they were trying to say. That should count as dev time though, I don't really want Nintendo to cut corners there.
i mean, this is debatable, while with the WiiU they had some bizarre years without "ambitious AAA HD" games, they did delivered with the Switch in that regard, stuff like Smash, Pikmin 4, Animal Crossing, Zelda and Mario look pretty on par with modern home-console games.
like, if you compare the first "HD Kirby" with the last one on the Switch, the difference is pretty big
(...they just need to learn what antialiasing is)
The last iterations of Wind Waker and Mario Galaxy were in HD so I'm not sure what this even means.
When I heard they delayed the Switch 2 to "strengthen their games line-up", I knew it was because games are taking longer to develop than they anticipated and suggested they might buy SEGA to bolster their output going forward (one of their closest partners with good synergy). Sounds like that might be what they are really thinking
Absolutely. But the point was that being behind the curve generationally provides them with a sizable advantage - so whilst they may encounter the same general issues as everyone else it would not anywhere near as pronounced. Take something like DLSS as an example. Because they are a generation behind the cutting edge curve that technology is now matured and at a point where they'll be able to make good use of it to save themselves a ton of potential headaches and give themselves way more headroom during developement across the board.
Sounds like AAA games need to go back to their pixel roots. And midi soundtracks! Retro revolution!
It sucks hearing that but at least with Nintendo you are very likely get a great game no matter how long it takes. Plus they make a lot of other stuff so even if the next Zelda or mario takes ages there's something else in the meantime
They kind of mitigate these issues by aiming for lower spec hardware (and streamlining their dev pipeline combining handheld and console development), but it's still coming. They dealt with the transition to HD just like everyone else (it just happened a gen later).