Game Of Thrones "Stuff" That Confuses You (SPOILERS)

[UltraMagnus]

SPOILERS (GO AWAY IF YOU DON'T WANT SPOILERS)


Doing a rewatch of Game of Thrones. I'm just curious on something (I haven't read any of the books, only watched the show). The Wall is something the White Walkers apparently can't cross, right? Not just because it's a giant ass wall, but because it has magic woven into it that doesn't allow them to pass. In fact it was from what I take it built for this express reason ages ago.

So exactly then what was the Night King's plan for crossing the wall? Wait for the "good guys" to listen to a really bad plan on Tyrion's part and bring a dragon basically right to him, hit the dragon with an ice spear and reanimate it? How would he gotten the army of the dead past the wall otherwise?

Am I missing something on this? If anyone has any other GoT plot points that don't seem to add up, feel free to add them in this thread!

 

[Neece]

SPOILERS (GO AWAY IF YOU DON'T WANT SPOILERS)


Doing a rewatch of Game of Thrones. I'm just curious on something. The Wall is something the White Walkers apparently can't cross, right? Not just because it's a giant ass wall, but because it has magic woven into it that doesn't allow them to pass. In fact it was from what I take it built for this express reason ages ago.

So exactly then what was the Night King's plan for crossing the wall? Wait for the "good guys" to listen to a really bad plan on Tyrion's part and bring a dragon basically right to him, hit the dragon with an ice spear and reanimate it? How would he gotten the army of the dead past the wall otherwise?

Am I missing something on this? If anyone has any other GoT plot points that don't seem to add up, feel free to add them in this thread!

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It's speculated that the Night King has similar abilities to Bran and the 3 eyed raven, meaning he has premonitions and visions or whatever. If that's true then it's possible the Night King saw himself crossing the wall with a dragon, like Jojen had the greensight to see things in advance.

People also speculate that the Night King is a Stark.

 

[UltraMagnus]

It's speculated that the Night King has similar abilities to Bran and the 3 eyed raven, meaning he has premonitions and visions or whatever.

People also speculate that the Night King is a Stark.

Click to shrink...

But if he hadn't have gotten the dragon, basically they'd be stuck on the other side of the Wall? I dunno it just seems kinda funny to me.

 

[Kevers]

But if he hadn't have gotten the dragon, basically they'd be stuck on the other side of the Wall? I dunno it just seems kinda funny to me.

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I imagine it's not much of an issue to go around it by sea

 

[Neece]

But if he hadn't have gotten the dragon, basically they'd be stuck on the other side of the Wall? I dunno it just seems kinda funny to me.

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I think the implication of him having visions like Bran/Jojen/3 eyed raven is that the Night King always knew he would cross the wall with a dragon. Just like Jojen knew when he would die well before it happened.

 

[PallasAthens]

But if he hadn't have gotten the dragon, basically they'd be stuck on the other side of the Wall? I dunno it just seems kinda funny to me.

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It's definitely possible that the Night King foresaw Daenarys getting dragons, which is why he started marching south after she reached of age to be married(And thus sets off the whole chain of events of the Wildlings amassing their tribes and marching towards the walls themselves.)

He was basically waiting for the right time. After all, if the Night King/White Walkers have lived for thousands of years, why hadn't they marched to the wall before? No reason to. Especially if they knew there would be a moment where a full grown dragon would come to them in the north for them to take.

So it gives credence to the Night King having some seer abilities before he became the Night King?

 

[UltraMagnus]

It's definitely possible that the Night King foresaw Daenarys getting dragons, which is why he started marching south after she reached of age to be married(And thus sets off the whole chain of events of the Wildlings amassing their tribes and marching towards the walls themselves.)

He was basically waiting for the right time. After all, if the Night King/White Walkers have lived for thousands of years, why hadn't they marched to the wall before? No reason to. Especially if they knew there would be a moment where a full grown dragon would come to them in the north for them to take.

So it gives credence to the Night King having some seer abilities before he became the Night King?

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Weren't there dragons before though? I mean not recently, but why panic now over dragons, there's been many Targareyns with dragons, no?

 

[Redfox088]

Time travel shenanigans....GOT and other highly popular series with a lot of mysterious plot points seem to love going down this path.

 

[Antrax]

Maybe book spoilers

Spoiler

isn't there a potential magical item hidden deep in the North (where the wildlings don't want to go) that can supposedly bring down the Wall? I remember something to that effect, and while I also remember that not panning out (they don't find anything), that doesn't really prove its non-existence. "Absence of evidence" and all that

 

[PallasAthens]

Weren't there dragons before though? I mean not recently, but why panic now over dragons, there's been many Targareyns with dragons, no?

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There were, but I don't think any of them ever went beyond the wall on their dragons? Since the Targaryen lineage has only been interested in ruling the 7 kingdoms, I doubt any of them went north or even had inclinations of going north on their dragons. So the Night King never made any move against them-Daenarys might be the only Targaryen to go beyond the wall

Maybe book spoilers

Spoiler

isn't there a potential magical item hidden deep in the North (where the wildlings don't want to go) that can supposedly bring down the Wall? I remember something to that effect, and while I also remember that not panning out (they don't find anything), that doesn't really prove its non-existence. "Absence of evidence" and all that

Click to shrink...

Spoiler: book spoilers

Yeah, it's a Horn that what's his face, Theons uncle has in the book. It's set up as a potential weapon to bring down the wall, but whether or not it succeeds in the books might...never...be known? and they excised it from the show canon

 

[Window]

The Cersei *book spoilers*

Spoiler

younger brother prophecy

from the books which people keep bringing up again and again in the TV show thread (even though it was never in the show).

 

[UltraMagnus]

There were, but I don't think any of them ever went beyond the wall on their dragons? Since the Targaryen lineage has only been interested in ruling the 7 kingdoms, I doubt any of them went north or even had inclinations of going north on their dragons. So the Night King never made any move against them-Daenarys might be the only Targaryen to go beyond the wall

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But she only goes north of the wall because the White Walkers have been aggressively moving south and amassing a giant army, heh. Maybe they should have just left it alone as with the past.

Also, how many Ls has Tyrion taken as Hand of the King/Queen. Yikes.

 

[PallasAthens]

But she only goes north of the wall because the White Walkers have been aggressively moving south and amassing a giant army, heh. Maybe they should have just left it alone as with the past.

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ah technically she goes north to save Jon Snow, not to combat white walkers. She was even resistant to going beyond the wall otherwise and didn't want to waste time up there.

 

[SupremeWu]

The Night King is a character that you don't have any idea what he knows, by design, so speculating on why he does things is futile until they show more.

 

[UltraMagnus]

ah technically she goes north to save Jon Snow, not to combat white walkers. She was even resistant to going beyond the wall otherwise and didn't want to waste time up there.

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But the only reason Jon Snow goes there is because he needs to abduct a wight to convince her and Cersei that the Army of the .... oh I've gone cross eyed ;)

 

[UltraMagnus]

The Night King is a character that you don't have any idea what he knows, by design, so speculating on why he does things is futile until they show more.

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It's also wonderfully convenient for plot, lol.

 

[PallasAthens]

But the only reason Jon Snow goes there is because he needs to abduct a wight to convince her and Cersei that the Army of the .... oh I've gone cross eyed ;)

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Right, that's Jons objective. Daenarys objective is to conquer the kingdoms.

It's only when Daenarys hears that Jon is stranded beyond the wall that she's almost hesitant to waste time going up there, but then you get the glory shot of her coming in and changing her mind, and when she actually sees the undead method.

So if it wasn't for Jon, if he never met Daenarys, chances are she would have never gone beyond the wall and the white walkers would have to remain beyond the wall, in fact he would've never amassed his armies.

 

[SupremeWu]

It's also wonderfully convenient for plot, lol.

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It's a work of fiction, so everything is in service of the plot by design. Some characters know things that haven't been revealed. Is this complicated or what.

 

[UltraMagnus]

It's a work of fiction, so everything is in service of the plot by design. Some characters know things that haven't been revealed. Is this complicated or what.

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Just making light of it. I sure hope George RR Martin has all this stuff figured out.

 

[Deleted member 30544]

I believe that what the OP is asking is not conclusive at this point in both; the show and the books like other posters said.

There is also speculation that the night king is a good guy trying to save Westeros or that his intentions are more complicated than just end all life, but I don't believe those theories.

 

[RatskyWatsky]

Just making light of it. I sure hope George RR Martin has all this stuff figured out.

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A lot is different in the books - like, the Night King isn't even in them.

 

[UltraMagnus]

A lot is different in the books - like, the Night King isn't even in them.

Click to shrink...

But there is reference to a character called the "Night's King" in the books from my understanding (the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch).

 

[Deleted member 17643]

I'm worried that when the next book actually comes out I'll have forgotten nearly every detail. I'm definitely not doing a reread.

 

[RatskyWatsky]

But there is reference to a character called the "Night's King" in the books from my understanding (the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch).

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Right, but they're completely different.

I'm worried that when the next book actually comes out I'll have forgotten nearly every detail. I'm definitely not doing a reread.

Click to shrink...

Audiobooks!

 

[signal]

I need a 70,000 word paper on the history and rules behind invoking Sumai.

 

[Deleted member 2809]

The night King is BvS lex luthor except his plan don't fail

 

[CloudWolf]

But there is reference to a character called the "Night's King" in the books from my understanding (the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch).

Click to shrink...

Yeah, but that's a totally different character than the Night's King in the show. The Night's King in the books is a dude that fell in love with an Others/White Walkers woman and proclaimed himself king and did horrible things. He was killed when the King-Beyond-the-Wall and the Starks teamed up to battle him. While a prevailing theory is that the Night's King is part of the Others' plan to get beyond the wall, there's no relation to the Night's King and the existence of the Others (unlike in the show, where the Night King was the first).

 

[BDS]

Remember when Littlefinger brought Sansa Stark, a wanted fugitive, to the North and then publicly betrothed her to Ramsay? Remember how Cersei had publicly accused Sansa of poisoning Joffrey? But nobody really has any reaction. Littlefinger just chills for a while, even traveling back to King's Landing at one point, and nobody bothers him. Littlefinger is also giving away the woman he has a creepy sex predator crush on, and giving her to a psychotic rapist and abuser, for essentially no real gain at all. His plan is apparently to have Sansa take over Winterfell after Stannis defeats the Boltons in combat. But what if Stannis loses? Which is, you know, what ends up happening? Did he have no backup plan here at all? Why didn't he just wait for Stannis to defeat the Boltons beforehand, and then swoop in with Sansa? It's not like Stannis would have any major issue with giving Sansa her family's lands back, provided she bent the knee. Littlefinger could have had the same exact outcome without jeoparding the health and safety of both himself and Sansa. Why did Littlefinger suddenly lose all his brain cells between seasons 4 and 5?

See, in the books it was Jeyne Poole, disguised as Arya, who was betrothed to Ramsay, which made more sense because Arya was not a fugitive wanted by the crown and Cersei was willing to let the Boltons have her as part of their alliance. But D&D decided to just swap out one Stark sister for another and it no longer made sense.

 

[CloudWolf]

Littlefinger's plan in the show makes no sense and is the worst change from book to show IMO. Littlefinger is supposed to be the cunning, smart villain who is secretly playing all sides and making sure he always gets out on top and no blame ever comes his way. But in the show he's an idiot who apparently lucked into his first plan working, since clearly he just does stuff without thinking them through.

 

[Kaim Argonar]

I'm worried that when the next book actually comes out I'll have forgotten nearly every detail. I'm definitely not doing a reread.

Click to shrink...

If it comes out.

 

[Pyramid Head]

There were, but I don't think any of them ever went beyond the wall on their dragons? Since the Targaryen lineage has only been interested in ruling the 7 kingdoms, I doubt any of them went north or even had inclinations of going north on their dragons. So the Night King never made any move against them-Daenarys might be the only Targaryen to go beyond the wall

Spoiler: book spoilers

Yeah, it's a Horn that what's his face, Theons uncle has in the book. It's set up as a potential weapon to bring down the wall, but whether or not it succeeds in the books might...never...be known? and they excised it from the show canon

Click to shrink...

Different horn I think.

Spoiler

Euron has a 'dragon binder', which supposedly takes control of dragons. It's 'the horn of Jaromun' which is said to have the capability to destroy the wall. Unless Euron has that too? Been a while since I last read the books.

 

[CloudWolf]

Different horn I think.

Spoiler

Euron has a 'dragon binder', which supposedly takes control of dragons. It's 'the horn of Jaromun' which is said to have the capability to destroy the wall. Unless Euron has that too? Been a while since I last read the books.

Click to shrink...

Spoiler

Different horns, yeah. The Horn of Joramun is supposedly hidden Beyond the Wall, the Dragonbinder horn that Euron has comes from Valyria.

 

[Deleted member 2809]

Remember when Littlefinger brought Sansa Stark, a wanted fugitive, to the North and then publicly betrothed her to Ramsay? Remember how Cersei had publicly accused Sansa of poisoning Joffrey? But nobody really has any reaction. Littlefinger just chills for a while, even traveling back to King's Landing at one point, and nobody bothers him. Littlefinger is also giving away the woman he has a creepy sex predator crush on, and giving her to a psychotic rapist and abuser, for essentially no real gain at all. His plan is apparently to have Sansa take over Winterfell after Stannis defeats the Boltons in combat. But what if Stannis loses? Which is, you know, what ends up happening? Did he have no backup plan here at all? Why didn't he just wait for Stannis to defeat the Boltons beforehand, and then swoop in with Sansa? It's not like Stannis would have any major issue with giving Sansa her family's lands back, provided she bent the knee. Littlefinger could have had the same exact outcome without jeoparding the health and safety of both himself and Sansa. Why did Littlefinger suddenly lose all his brain cells between seasons 4 and 5?

See, in the books it was Jeyne Poole, disguised as Arya, who was betrothed to Ramsay, which made more sense because Arya was not a fugitive wanted by the crown and Cersei was willing to let the Boltons have her as part of their alliance. But D&D decided to just swap out one Stark sister for another and it no longer made sense.

Click to shrink...

but
the
budget

 

[UltraMagnus]

Yeah, but that's a totally different character than the Night's King in the show. The Night's King in the books is a dude that fell in love with an Others/White Walkers woman and proclaimed himself king and did horrible things. He was killed when the King-Beyond-the-Wall and the Starks teamed up to battle him. While a prevailing theory is that the Night's King is part of the Others' plan to get beyond the wall, there's no relation to the Night's King and the existence of the Others (unlike in the show, where the Night King was the first).

Click to shrink...

Some people seem to think the Night King and the Night's King are the same person, but I don't know how that would make sense time line wise.



There is definitely in the show though this image of the TV Night King, he very clearly seems to have 12 of his undead buddies with him, making him the 13th, doubt that was not done on purpose (one is kinda obscured by his left arm).

 

[Coyote Starrk]

If you think the show has some crazy questions and theories then you should read the ones from the books lol


https://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/109496-a-compendium-of-theories-v2/



The Game of Thrones Compendium of Theories

Spoiler: Book Spoilers

The Varys-Illyrio Conspiracy
Since they met in the dungeons during Games of Thrones, much has been made of these two enigmatic characters who seem to find themselves in the midst of it all. Their history has been revealed slowly over time and may be the key to their connection and their plotting.

The Grand Tyrell Conspiracy
Cersei's downfall and arrest by the High Sparrow was due to the plotting by the Tyrells to remove her from power. They manipulated Cersei into her scheme against Margaery Tyrell in a manner that would prove ineffective so that she would effectively reveal her own crimes.
- Loras and Dragonstone: Was Loras Tyrell truly injured on Dragonstone? And if he was, was there some ulterior motive in his seizing the castle with so much bloodshed?

The Grand Faceless Men Conspiracy
Valar Morghulis. Behind the scenes of it all, the Faceless Men are pulling the strings and manipulating the world to achieve their own end. To what end? As a "death cult," naturally to bring "peace" to all mankind via conspiring with the Others.

Tywin Knew About the Purple Wedding
A bold theory that Tywin knew about the plot to kill Joffrey and let it happen. He viewed Joffrey as incompetent and likely to be as bad a king as Robert and Aerys. Joffrey had already shown he would defy the regent when he foolishly decides to kill Ned, so replacing him with Tommen would allow Tywin to control the realm with better ease.

Targaryan and Blackfyre Alliance Theory
"Black or Red, a dragon is still a dragon." - Illyrio Mopatis

The Great Northern Conspiracy - Part 1 - Part 3 - Part 4
The Northern Lords are aware of Robb Stark's will and are playing Stannis and Ramsey against each other with the goal of crowning Robb's heir-declarant Jon Snow as King in the North

Southron Ambitions
According to Lady Barbrey Dustin, who hates the Starks for first not letting her marry Brandon Stark and then dragging her forced husband into the rebellious war of Robert Baratheon, there's more to Robert's Rebellion than meets the eye. In fact, Lord Rickard Stark was embroiled in a grand conspiracy with the other great houses.

The Northmen Inside Winterfell
Has Mance retaken Winterfell, conspired with Northern Lords, and written the "Pink Letter" to Jon?

Varys and the Antler Men
Varys has the great stabilizer of the status quo? A conspiracy theory that sees Varys has "pruning" the middle class during times of danger in order to maintain the feudal system of Westeros.

Grand Vale conspiracy
Revolving around Yohn Royce's recognition of Sansa. Vale lords are moving against LF to take him down.

Citadel's Grand Conspiracy
Discussing the possible plot of Maesters of Citadel to eradicate all magic from Planetos


TRUE IDENTITIES

Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon (Reference guide v.81)
The much discussed and evidenced theory that Jon Snow is not Lord Eddard's bastard, but actually the son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark who ran off together to the "Tower of Joy." Lyanna died giving birth to Jon and made Ned promise to protect him. The implications of this theory include that Jon Snow has a greater role to play in the story as a Targaryan, born of Ice and Fire, and potentially Azor Ahai or The Prince That Was Promised.

Howland Reed + Ashara Dayne = Meera & Jojen
"[A] theory... that Ashara Dayne is still alive, living in the Neck, and married to Howland Reed. I believe they met at Harrenhal, fell in love, and married. Meera was conceived almost immediately, and it was a pregnant Ashara who went back to Starfall or King’s Landing—perhaps forcibly sent there by her parents. After the Tower of Joy, Howland picked up Ashara from Starfall, along with their daughter, and went North. The story was put about that Ashara died, and she assumed the name Jyana Reed."

Aerys + Joanna = Tyrion
The hypothesis that Tyrion is actually the bastard son of Aerys Targaryan the Mad King and Joanna Lannister (the wife of Tywin Lannister who was Aerys's Hand), either through rape or love. It is unclear whether Tywin knew about it or suspected it and it is debated as to how it might affect the relationship of Tywin and Tyrion. If true, Tyrion would be half-(albeit bastard)-Targaryan.

The Knight of the Laughing Tree - Potential Identities
While traveling north, Meera Reed tells Bran the tale of the Knight of the Laughing Tree, a mystery knight who showed up at the Tourney of Harrenhal and defeated three knights whose squires had attacked a crannogman (thought to be Howland Reed). It is often thought that the knight is Lyanna Stark in disguise and lends itself to the popular Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon theory.

Cold Hands is the Night's King
Cold Hands, the mysterious undead "man" who saves Samwell Tarly and brings Bran to the cave, is the Night's King, the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch who fell in love with a woman (who may have been an Other) and declared himself king at the Nightfort.

The Gravedigging Hound
A well laid out analysis of how the briefly mentioned novice gravedigger on the Quiet Isle is actually, as many suspect, Sandor Clegane, aka the Hound.

Beneath the Armor of Ser Robert Strong
The well theorized idea that the true identity of Ser Robert Strong, the newest edition to the Kingsguard and savior of Cersei, is Ser Gregor Clegane, the Mountain that Rides, as reanimated by Qyborn.

The Golem and the Gravedigger
A more in-depth look at the fates of The Hound and the Mountain and their "resurrections."

Alleras the Sandsnake
A complete analysis of Alleras the Sphinx and "his" true identity as Sarella the Sandsnake, bastard daughter of Prince Oberyn.

Aegon is Legitimate
Contrary to the growing popularity of the (F)aegon theory, this claims Aegon is actually the legitimate Aegon Targaryen

Three-Eyed Crow is Brynden Rivers *CONFIRMED*
Simply that the true identity of the Three-Eyed Crow in the Cave and of Bran's dreams is Brynden Rivers, aka Bloodraven, a legitimized Targaryan bastard who fought as a loyalist against the Blackfyre rebellion.



S+B=M; The Identity of Melisandre

A theory that explores the idea of Melisandre being the child of Shiera Seastar and Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers, the Great Bastards of Aegon IV.

The Green Grace is the Harpy or is it Shavepate?
Some agree that Hizdahr zo Loraq was too obvious a choice and thus wrongly accused by Shavepate and Barristan as being the Harpy and poisoner of Dany. So who else can manipulate the city and has something to gain? The Green Grace most obviously (female as a harpy) or maybe a traitorous Shavepate with a more devious plan.

Is Septa Lemore actually Ashara Dayne, Serra Mopatis, Wenda the White Fawn, Tyene's Mother or Mellario of Norvos

The Sailor's Wife - Littlefinger and Tysha
Tysha, the not-really-a-whore first love and wife of Tyrion Lannister, is the subject of much theorizing after her disappearance post-abuse by Tywin's men. She is much on Tyrion's mind throughout the series, never more so then when he kill's his Tywin whose last words include the answer to where she is as "Wherever whores go." It's possible Tysha is the much talked about "Sailor's Wife" in Braavos, a whore who insists men marry before bedding her. Or possibly the simple answer to "Where do whores go?" is the obvious "Littlefinger's brothels!"



The Young Falcon - or the Young Mockingbird?

A discussion of the possibility that Robert Arryn is in fact the son of Lysa Arryn and Petyr Baelish

Septon Chayle is the Hooded Man TWOW Spoilers
The murders in Winterfell were committed by the Spearwives and Big Walder, while the Hooded Man that Theon encounters is Septon Chayle, the little-noted Septon that was supposedly killed when the sea came to Winterfell.

Missandei the Faceless One
A more detailed and supported account of the oft-mentioned theory that Missandei, wise beyond her years, is something other than a simple 11-year-old slave-girl. Rather than an innocent, sweet handmaiden, the theory posits that she is a dedicated faceless man/woman (and possibly a descendant of the Children of the Forest), which would go along way to explain her knowledge, abilities, and influence over Dany.



Lem Lemoncloak = Richard Lonmouth



(f)Aegon Blackfyre

One of many discussions regarding the identity of Young Griff who claims to be Aegon Targaryen, son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Elia Martell. Instead of being who he claims to be, Aegon is in fact the Blackfyre pretender, boy raised to believe he is something he is not.



THE BRIGHTFYRE THEORY

Illyrio Blackfyre + Serra Brightflame = Young Griff







MYSTERIES



The Hooded Man of Winterfell
Theon runs into a mysterious hooded figure while at the Bolton's Winterfell who is very possibly the Ghost of Winterfell responsible for at least some of the unexplained murders happening. But Who is this man that recognizes Theon as "kinslayer?" (Note: The link is to a particularly helpful post in the thread - see the full thread for more discussion.)

Hatching a Dragon: A Summerhall Theory
How visions and prophecies of "dragons" refer not to the fire-breathing beast, but to those of "Targaryen" lineage. Such a shift in interpretation could have major effects on the understanding of major prophecies like Azor Ahai and the Prince that was Promised.

The Drowned King and the Faceless Crow
A complete analysis of whether or not King Balon Greyjoy was murdered by a faceless man, hired by his brother Euron Greyjoy.

Oberyn Poisoned Tywin - There's Something Rotten in King's Landing
A rundown of the evidence that Oberyn Martell had managed to poison Tywin Lannister with the substance known as "Widow's Blood" and subsequent discussion.

Syrio Forel, Alive and Full-Faced from the Never-Ending Fight
Syrio, Arya's "dancing" teacher in King's Landing, is oft inferred dead but presumed living either through escaping Ser Trant or as the faceless man from the black cells,Jaqen H'ghar (the latter being said by many as impossible due to the timing of events). As the former First Sword of Braavos, Syrio's incredible skill and speed enabled him to dispatch the guardsmen and endure an unending battle against Trant until he gave up.

The Pyre Revisited
A reexamination of what transpired on that fateful day when Dany entered the bonfire of Drogo's funeral pyre and emerged The Mother of Dragons. GRRM himself has revealed that Targaryens are not fire-proof, so how exactly did she emerge unscathed? Perhaps it was actually the witch, Mirri Maz Duur, and her wailing gone-wrong that changed the course of history and saved Dany from a foolish mistake.

Shireen's True Purpose
With Jon stabbed and dying/dead at the Wall and many of us readers convinced of Jon's greater importance and role to play in the story, he must be returned from the brink of death in some manner. This theory suggests Melisandre will invoke blood magic and sacrifice Shireen to use her royal blood as the medium with which to bring back Jon.





ANALYSES



Winterfell Huis Clos - A True Queen - The Black Bat - The Princes of Dorne

A remarkable amount of analysis from Branvras on the topics of Theon in Winterfell, the hidden importance of matrilineal lineage (Stark and Tully), and Quentyn Martell's foolhardy quest. Winterfell Huis Clos (Sartre's "No Exit") is a must read perspective on the cliffhanging validity of the letters from Winterfell at the end of ADWD.

Ice and Fire Assessment/Theory
A "Look at the Valyrians and First Men and a speculation of their history and purpose," the dualism and parallels between the two, and the inevitable clashes that have shaped the history of men.

From Pawn to Player: Rethinking Sansa (RESOURCES)
An amazingly extensive analysis of Sansa Stark and her roles and relationships in the world from Princess-to-be to UnKiss to Alayne Stone.

If It's Chains You Want, Come With Me...
A look at all things happening around the Citadel from the Sphinx to Jaqen H'Ghar

North is No Place for a Blackfish
An analysis of the whereabouts of Brynden Tully after having escaped the siege at Riverrun

The Mastermind and the Gold Digger
An expose and comparison of the backstory, persona, modus operandi, and endgame of Varys and Littlefinger.

Drawing Blood from a Bolton
An extensive look at the Boltons and their odd views on blood and life. It is hypothesized that the Boltons are the product of the Night's King and his Other bride, while Roose is specifically after some form of ice magic (that may have initially corrupted the Others).

Mocking Bird: The Petyr Baelish Story
As High as Honor - Tyrion, Tyrell, Tully - Along Came a Spider
An extensive, three-part analysis of the great schemer Lord Petyr Baelish from his ascent to the Eyrie to his dealings with Varys.

The Mad Genius of Petyr Baelish
Another detailed analysis of the mind of Petyr Baelish and the machinations that makes him one of the great champions of chaos in Westeros



Ice and fire animal project: Wolves, Lions, Stags

An extensive analysis about animal symbolism in ASOIAF.



She-wolves of Winterfell: Analyzing Northern women

Adjacent project of Animal project focusing on Northern women, including three Stark women - Lyanna, Sansa and Arya



Discussing morality in ASOIAF



Foreshadowing and symbolism in Sansa's Snow castle scene

An analysis about snow castle Sansa builds in Eyrie with all the scenarios and interpretations the scene might have hinted to us.



Danerys Targaryen: Agent of change

Discussion about the impact of Daenerys Targaryen and her possible role in the Westerosi future



Robert's rebellion: Just War

Analysis about RR being legally justifiable



Food code of Ice and Fire



Cat/Ned/Jon triangle

Analysis that helps us determining the Stark triangle dynamics



Catnapping

measured look at the wisdom of Catelyn's arrest of Tyrion



Sansa+Ned: What's the difference?

Comparative analysis of Sansa's and Ned's path in AGOT, focusing on introductory characters biases



Cult of Red God

Examining the priests, beliefs and method of Faith of R'hllor



Conversation with dying man

Analysis of Varys' conversation with Kevan during Kevan's last moments.



Theory of elements in ASOIAF

Comprehensive analysis about classical elements (fire, water, air and earth) and their use in ASOIAF





Rhaegar and Lyanna: What do we really know?

A look at the knowns and even more numerous unknowns of the details of Rhaegar and Lyanna during the Rebellion



The Lordly Lion: A Series of Essays Discussing Tywin Lannister







PROPHECIES

Lightbringer is the Night's Watch
The legend of Azor Ahai's sword, known as Lightbringer, used to defeat the Others is a metaphor. Lightbringer is actually the Night's Watch, wielded by Azor Ahai reborn, Jon Snow, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch.



R+L= LIGHTBRINGER

The prophecy's interpretation of Jon Snow being the Lightbringer.



Jon Snow: THREE HEADED DRAGON

An interpretation of the prophecy suggesting that Three headed dragon is not 3 person, but one - Jon Snow.



House of the Undying and Red wedding

Detailed analysis of the vision in House of the Undying that is taken to be foreshadowing Red wedding







OTHER TOPICS



The Wall, the Watch, and a Hersey - Heresy 38
The first and most recent topics in the incredible line of heresy threads. "Its an eclectic thread all about challenging orthodoxy, as we try to figure out what’s really going on not in the Game of Thrones but the over-arching Game of Ice and Fire." By rejecting the orthodox views on certain ideas and theories, new understanding may come to light regarding the great questions of the series.

Jon Snow at the Crossroads of Resurrection Mythology
Sometimes answers to the mysteries of the Song are aided by understanding where GRRM's mind has borrowed his ideas from. The mythology of many cultures are admittedly woven into the Song and Jon Snow may be at the heart of much of it.

Patchface Project
For that prophetic fool who hangs around Stannis's court, a thread devoted to answering his mysteries (including foreseeing the Red Wedding) by starting from only the facts that are known.

Night's King - A Turn From Fire to Ice: The Story of Stannis Baratheon *WARNING: TWOW SPOILER*
...Or will Stannis turn away from fire to ice be the Night's King Reborn?

Heresy of the Night's King
Some information and observations about the Night's King from the heretics.

Sansa, The Hound, Brienne and The Valonquar
Marriages, Battles, Murders... When plot-lines collide in Westeros: a fight between the Vale and Harrenhal, a wedding between Sansa and Harry the Heir, the Brotherhood without Banners, Jamie and Brienne and UnCat...

A Big ol' Theory of Dorne and Aegon
A series of conclusions and thoughts trying to reconcile the seemingly useless goings-on of the Dornish (Quentyn Martell and Gerold Dayne, Darkstar) and Varys's unnecessary lie to Ser Kevan Lannister as he lay dying about Aegon's return (if Aegon is really a Blackfyre).

Heir to the North: Jeyne's Hips Don't Lie? (NOTE: The discrepency in anatomy has been corrected in foreign editions.)
The case for Robb Stark's son and rightful heir to the North via Jeyne Westerling. iIn large part the theory is prompted by two different descriptions of Jeyne's anatomy, once from Catelyn as having good birthing hips and once from Jamie as having narrow hips.

The Others and the Children
The two sides north of the Wall are actually "cousins," according to the Theory, two sides of a coin. During their conflict with the First Men, the Children embraced nature while the Others abandoned it for the icy tundras of the deep north and turned to warging to raise an army of undead. Note: GRRM has described the Others as inhuman, elegant, and dangerous, but also opposes creating characters of pure evil.

Jojen Paste
A slightly gruesome theory that Jojen was ground up into the paste that Bran ate while in the Cave with Leaf, a Child of the Forest, and the Three-Eyed Crow. Bran reckons the paste tastes like blood and afterwards he is unable to find the Reeds (while Jojen has had an impending sense of doom

 

[UltraMagnus]

Remember when Littlefinger brought Sansa Stark, a wanted fugitive, to the North and then publicly betrothed her to Ramsay? Remember how Cersei had publicly accused Sansa of poisoning Joffrey? But nobody really has any reaction. Littlefinger just chills for a while, even traveling back to King's Landing at one point, and nobody bothers him. Littlefinger is also giving away the woman he has a creepy sex predator crush on, and giving her to a psychotic rapist and abuser, for essentially no real gain at all. His plan is apparently to have Sansa take over Winterfell after Stannis defeats the Boltons in combat. But what if Stannis loses? Which is, you know, what ends up happening? Did he have no backup plan here at all? Why didn't he just wait for Stannis to defeat the Boltons beforehand, and then swoop in with Sansa? It's not like Stannis would have any major issue with giving Sansa her family's lands back, provided she bent the knee. Littlefinger could have had the same exact outcome without jeoparding the health and safety of both himself and Sansa. Why did Littlefinger suddenly lose all his brain cells between seasons 4 and 5?

See, in the books it was Jeyne Poole, disguised as Arya, who was betrothed to Ramsay, which made more sense because Arya was not a fugitive wanted by the crown and Cersei was willing to let the Boltons have her as part of their alliance. But D&D decided to just swap out one Stark sister for another and it no longer made sense.

Click to shrink...

I know some people love Littlefinger, but man he completely set off the War of 5 Kings, what a jerk, lol.

 

[BDS]

Some people seem to think the Night King and the Night's King are the same person, but I don't know how that would make sense time line wise.



There is definitely in the show though this image of the TV Night King, he very clearly seems to have 12 of his undead buddies with him, making him the 13th, doubt that was not done on purpose (one is kinda obscured by his left arm).

Click to shrink...

It's fairly obvious that with six episodes left we're not going to be getting a big infodump on who the Night King is. The timeline also doesn't add up at all, since the Night King was (as seen in a flashback in the show) a man that was transformed by the Children of the Forest during their war; i.e., before the Wall was ever built. So he couldn't have ever served in the Night's Watch. GRRM has also said the character doesn't exist in the books. I'm thinking that perhaps D&D had some ideas about the two characters being the same or something when they originally introduced him in season 4, but eventually changed their minds.

 

[UltraMagnus]

If you think the show has some crazy questions and theories then you should read the ones from the books lol


https://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/109496-a-compendium-of-theories-v2/



The Game of Thrones Compendium of Theories

Click to shrink...

Tywin knowing about the Purple Wedding plot before hand but letting it happen anyway is the most Tywin thing ever.

 

[Coyote Starrk]

Tywin knowing about the Purple Wedding plot before hand but letting it happen anyway is the most Tywin thing ever.

Click to shrink...

Right?!?!?


Also I really like the "Tywin was poisoned" one. It matches what we know of Oberyn so damn well.

 

[UltraMagnus]

It's fairly obvious that with six episodes left we're not going to be getting a big infodump on who the Night King is. The timeline also doesn't add up at all, since the Night King was (as seen in a flashback in the show) a man that was transformed by the Children of the Forest during their war; i.e., before the Wall was ever built. So he couldn't have ever served in the Night's Watch. GRRM has also said the character doesn't exist in the books. I'm thinking that perhaps D&D had some ideas about the two characters being the same or something when they originally introduced him in season 4, but eventually changed their minds.

Click to shrink...

It's just a hunch, but I think GRRM has kinda grown weary of the show's popularity and things being changed, so he's kinda let the show go off in a direction that isn't going to actually match the "real ending" which will be in the books.

That's why he's in no rush to finish the book series either.

Probably not, but, I can't shake that feeling. But if once the show if off the air, his writing pace magically quickens all of the sudden ... lol ... he can always say he changed his mind on certain plot points when he got to them in the books.

 

[KuroNeeko]

Who the crap is the Night King?

 

[Croc Man]

Littlefingers plan made no sense but at least we can take his word at face value and say it was a genuine mistake. However Sansa 's pov for marrying Ramsay makes even less sense. Littlefinger gives her the pep talk, she's going to take control of her life. Is she just getting close enough to avenge her family? Start a war between the Boultons against the Lannisters. Turns out there was no plan.

 

[m23]

So when Bran was in the tree with the 3 eyed raven and went to the vision where he was surrounded by White Walkers and got touched by the Night King - was that the moment the magic from the tree and wall disappeared?

 

[demosthenes]

If you think the show has some crazy questions and theories then you should read the ones from the books lol


https://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/109496-a-compendium-of-theories-v2/



The Game of Thrones Compendium of Theories

Spoiler: Book Spoilers

The Varys-Illyrio Conspiracy
Since they met in the dungeons during Games of Thrones, much has been made of these two enigmatic characters who seem to find themselves in the midst of it all. Their history has been revealed slowly over time and may be the key to their connection and their plotting.

The Grand Tyrell Conspiracy
Cersei's downfall and arrest by the High Sparrow was due to the plotting by the Tyrells to remove her from power. They manipulated Cersei into her scheme against Margaery Tyrell in a manner that would prove ineffective so that she would effectively reveal her own crimes.
- Loras and Dragonstone: Was Loras Tyrell truly injured on Dragonstone? And if he was, was there some ulterior motive in his seizing the castle with so much bloodshed?

The Grand Faceless Men Conspiracy
Valar Morghulis. Behind the scenes of it all, the Faceless Men are pulling the strings and manipulating the world to achieve their own end. To what end? As a "death cult," naturally to bring "peace" to all mankind via conspiring with the Others.

Tywin Knew About the Purple Wedding
A bold theory that Tywin knew about the plot to kill Joffrey and let it happen. He viewed Joffrey as incompetent and likely to be as bad a king as Robert and Aerys. Joffrey had already shown he would defy the regent when he foolishly decides to kill Ned, so replacing him with Tommen would allow Tywin to control the realm with better ease.

Targaryan and Blackfyre Alliance Theory
"Black or Red, a dragon is still a dragon." - Illyrio Mopatis

The Great Northern Conspiracy - Part 1 - Part 3 - Part 4
The Northern Lords are aware of Robb Stark's will and are playing Stannis and Ramsey against each other with the goal of crowning Robb's heir-declarant Jon Snow as King in the North

Southron Ambitions
According to Lady Barbrey Dustin, who hates the Starks for first not letting her marry Brandon Stark and then dragging her forced husband into the rebellious war of Robert Baratheon, there's more to Robert's Rebellion than meets the eye. In fact, Lord Rickard Stark was embroiled in a grand conspiracy with the other great houses.

The Northmen Inside Winterfell
Has Mance retaken Winterfell, conspired with Northern Lords, and written the "Pink Letter" to Jon?

Varys and the Antler Men
Varys has the great stabilizer of the status quo? A conspiracy theory that sees Varys has "pruning" the middle class during times of danger in order to maintain the feudal system of Westeros.

Grand Vale conspiracy
Revolving around Yohn Royce's recognition of Sansa. Vale lords are moving against LF to take him down.

Citadel's Grand Conspiracy
Discussing the possible plot of Maesters of Citadel to eradicate all magic from Planetos


TRUE IDENTITIES

Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon (Reference guide v.81)
The much discussed and evidenced theory that Jon Snow is not Lord Eddard's bastard, but actually the son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark who ran off together to the "Tower of Joy." Lyanna died giving birth to Jon and made Ned promise to protect him. The implications of this theory include that Jon Snow has a greater role to play in the story as a Targaryan, born of Ice and Fire, and potentially Azor Ahai or The Prince That Was Promised.

Howland Reed + Ashara Dayne = Meera & Jojen
"[A] theory... that Ashara Dayne is still alive, living in the Neck, and married to Howland Reed. I believe they met at Harrenhal, fell in love, and married. Meera was conceived almost immediately, and it was a pregnant Ashara who went back to Starfall or King’s Landing—perhaps forcibly sent there by her parents. After the Tower of Joy, Howland picked up Ashara from Starfall, along with their daughter, and went North. The story was put about that Ashara died, and she assumed the name Jyana Reed."

Aerys + Joanna = Tyrion
The hypothesis that Tyrion is actually the bastard son of Aerys Targaryan the Mad King and Joanna Lannister (the wife of Tywin Lannister who was Aerys's Hand), either through rape or love. It is unclear whether Tywin knew about it or suspected it and it is debated as to how it might affect the relationship of Tywin and Tyrion. If true, Tyrion would be half-(albeit bastard)-Targaryan.

The Knight of the Laughing Tree - Potential Identities
While traveling north, Meera Reed tells Bran the tale of the Knight of the Laughing Tree, a mystery knight who showed up at the Tourney of Harrenhal and defeated three knights whose squires had attacked a crannogman (thought to be Howland Reed). It is often thought that the knight is Lyanna Stark in disguise and lends itself to the popular Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon theory.

Cold Hands is the Night's King
Cold Hands, the mysterious undead "man" who saves Samwell Tarly and brings Bran to the cave, is the Night's King, the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch who fell in love with a woman (who may have been an Other) and declared himself king at the Nightfort.

The Gravedigging Hound
A well laid out analysis of how the briefly mentioned novice gravedigger on the Quiet Isle is actually, as many suspect, Sandor Clegane, aka the Hound.

Beneath the Armor of Ser Robert Strong
The well theorized idea that the true identity of Ser Robert Strong, the newest edition to the Kingsguard and savior of Cersei, is Ser Gregor Clegane, the Mountain that Rides, as reanimated by Qyborn.

The Golem and the Gravedigger
A more in-depth look at the fates of The Hound and the Mountain and their "resurrections."

Alleras the Sandsnake
A complete analysis of Alleras the Sphinx and "his" true identity as Sarella the Sandsnake, bastard daughter of Prince Oberyn.

Aegon is Legitimate
Contrary to the growing popularity of the (F)aegon theory, this claims Aegon is actually the legitimate Aegon Targaryen

Three-Eyed Crow is Brynden Rivers *CONFIRMED*
Simply that the true identity of the Three-Eyed Crow in the Cave and of Bran's dreams is Brynden Rivers, aka Bloodraven, a legitimized Targaryan bastard who fought as a loyalist against the Blackfyre rebellion.



S+B=M; The Identity of Melisandre

A theory that explores the idea of Melisandre being the child of Shiera Seastar and Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers, the Great Bastards of Aegon IV.

The Green Grace is the Harpy or is it Shavepate?
Some agree that Hizdahr zo Loraq was too obvious a choice and thus wrongly accused by Shavepate and Barristan as being the Harpy and poisoner of Dany. So who else can manipulate the city and has something to gain? The Green Grace most obviously (female as a harpy) or maybe a traitorous Shavepate with a more devious plan.

Is Septa Lemore actually Ashara Dayne, Serra Mopatis, Wenda the White Fawn, Tyene's Mother or Mellario of Norvos

The Sailor's Wife - Littlefinger and Tysha
Tysha, the not-really-a-whore first love and wife of Tyrion Lannister, is the subject of much theorizing after her disappearance post-abuse by Tywin's men. She is much on Tyrion's mind throughout the series, never more so then when he kill's his Tywin whose last words include the answer to where she is as "Wherever whores go." It's possible Tysha is the much talked about "Sailor's Wife" in Braavos, a whore who insists men marry before bedding her. Or possibly the simple answer to "Where do whores go?" is the obvious "Littlefinger's brothels!"



The Young Falcon - or the Young Mockingbird?

A discussion of the possibility that Robert Arryn is in fact the son of Lysa Arryn and Petyr Baelish

Septon Chayle is the Hooded Man TWOW Spoilers
The murders in Winterfell were committed by the Spearwives and Big Walder, while the Hooded Man that Theon encounters is Septon Chayle, the little-noted Septon that was supposedly killed when the sea came to Winterfell.

Missandei the Faceless One
A more detailed and supported account of the oft-mentioned theory that Missandei, wise beyond her years, is something other than a simple 11-year-old slave-girl. Rather than an innocent, sweet handmaiden, the theory posits that she is a dedicated faceless man/woman (and possibly a descendant of the Children of the Forest), which would go along way to explain her knowledge, abilities, and influence over Dany.



Lem Lemoncloak = Richard Lonmouth



(f)Aegon Blackfyre

One of many discussions regarding the identity of Young Griff who claims to be Aegon Targaryen, son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Elia Martell. Instead of being who he claims to be, Aegon is in fact the Blackfyre pretender, boy raised to believe he is something he is not.



THE BRIGHTFYRE THEORY

Illyrio Blackfyre + Serra Brightflame = Young Griff







MYSTERIES



The Hooded Man of Winterfell
Theon runs into a mysterious hooded figure while at the Bolton's Winterfell who is very possibly the Ghost of Winterfell responsible for at least some of the unexplained murders happening. But Who is this man that recognizes Theon as "kinslayer?" (Note: The link is to a particularly helpful post in the thread - see the full thread for more discussion.)

Hatching a Dragon: A Summerhall Theory
How visions and prophecies of "dragons" refer not to the fire-breathing beast, but to those of "Targaryen" lineage. Such a shift in interpretation could have major effects on the understanding of major prophecies like Azor Ahai and the Prince that was Promised.

The Drowned King and the Faceless Crow
A complete analysis of whether or not King Balon Greyjoy was murdered by a faceless man, hired by his brother Euron Greyjoy.

Oberyn Poisoned Tywin - There's Something Rotten in King's Landing
A rundown of the evidence that Oberyn Martell had managed to poison Tywin Lannister with the substance known as "Widow's Blood" and subsequent discussion.

Syrio Forel, Alive and Full-Faced from the Never-Ending Fight
Syrio, Arya's "dancing" teacher in King's Landing, is oft inferred dead but presumed living either through escaping Ser Trant or as the faceless man from the black cells,Jaqen H'ghar (the latter being said by many as impossible due to the timing of events). As the former First Sword of Braavos, Syrio's incredible skill and speed enabled him to dispatch the guardsmen and endure an unending battle against Trant until he gave up.

The Pyre Revisited
A reexamination of what transpired on that fateful day when Dany entered the bonfire of Drogo's funeral pyre and emerged The Mother of Dragons. GRRM himself has revealed that Targaryens are not fire-proof, so how exactly did she emerge unscathed? Perhaps it was actually the witch, Mirri Maz Duur, and her wailing gone-wrong that changed the course of history and saved Dany from a foolish mistake.

Shireen's True Purpose
With Jon stabbed and dying/dead at the Wall and many of us readers convinced of Jon's greater importance and role to play in the story, he must be returned from the brink of death in some manner. This theory suggests Melisandre will invoke blood magic and sacrifice Shireen to use her royal blood as the medium with which to bring back Jon.





ANALYSES



Winterfell Huis Clos - A True Queen - The Black Bat - The Princes of Dorne

A remarkable amount of analysis from Branvras on the topics of Theon in Winterfell, the hidden importance of matrilineal lineage (Stark and Tully), and Quentyn Martell's foolhardy quest. Winterfell Huis Clos (Sartre's "No Exit") is a must read perspective on the cliffhanging validity of the letters from Winterfell at the end of ADWD.

Ice and Fire Assessment/Theory
A "Look at the Valyrians and First Men and a speculation of their history and purpose," the dualism and parallels between the two, and the inevitable clashes that have shaped the history of men.

From Pawn to Player: Rethinking Sansa (RESOURCES)
An amazingly extensive analysis of Sansa Stark and her roles and relationships in the world from Princess-to-be to UnKiss to Alayne Stone.

If It's Chains You Want, Come With Me...
A look at all things happening around the Citadel from the Sphinx to Jaqen H'Ghar

North is No Place for a Blackfish
An analysis of the whereabouts of Brynden Tully after having escaped the siege at Riverrun

The Mastermind and the Gold Digger
An expose and comparison of the backstory, persona, modus operandi, and endgame of Varys and Littlefinger.

Drawing Blood from a Bolton
An extensive look at the Boltons and their odd views on blood and life. It is hypothesized that the Boltons are the product of the Night's King and his Other bride, while Roose is specifically after some form of ice magic (that may have initially corrupted the Others).

Mocking Bird: The Petyr Baelish Story
As High as Honor - Tyrion, Tyrell, Tully - Along Came a Spider
An extensive, three-part analysis of the great schemer Lord Petyr Baelish from his ascent to the Eyrie to his dealings with Varys.

The Mad Genius of Petyr Baelish
Another detailed analysis of the mind of Petyr Baelish and the machinations that makes him one of the great champions of chaos in Westeros



Ice and fire animal project: Wolves, Lions, Stags

An extensive analysis about animal symbolism in ASOIAF.



She-wolves of Winterfell: Analyzing Northern women

Adjacent project of Animal project focusing on Northern women, including three Stark women - Lyanna, Sansa and Arya



Discussing morality in ASOIAF



Foreshadowing and symbolism in Sansa's Snow castle scene

An analysis about snow castle Sansa builds in Eyrie with all the scenarios and interpretations the scene might have hinted to us.



Danerys Targaryen: Agent of change

Discussion about the impact of Daenerys Targaryen and her possible role in the Westerosi future



Robert's rebellion: Just War

Analysis about RR being legally justifiable



Food code of Ice and Fire



Cat/Ned/Jon triangle

Analysis that helps us determining the Stark triangle dynamics



Catnapping

measured look at the wisdom of Catelyn's arrest of Tyrion



Sansa+Ned: What's the difference?

Comparative analysis of Sansa's and Ned's path in AGOT, focusing on introductory characters biases



Cult of Red God

Examining the priests, beliefs and method of Faith of R'hllor



Conversation with dying man

Analysis of Varys' conversation with Kevan during Kevan's last moments.



Theory of elements in ASOIAF

Comprehensive analysis about classical elements (fire, water, air and earth) and their use in ASOIAF





Rhaegar and Lyanna: What do we really know?

A look at the knowns and even more numerous unknowns of the details of Rhaegar and Lyanna during the Rebellion



The Lordly Lion: A Series of Essays Discussing Tywin Lannister







PROPHECIES

Lightbringer is the Night's Watch
The legend of Azor Ahai's sword, known as Lightbringer, used to defeat the Others is a metaphor. Lightbringer is actually the Night's Watch, wielded by Azor Ahai reborn, Jon Snow, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch.



R+L= LIGHTBRINGER

The prophecy's interpretation of Jon Snow being the Lightbringer.



Jon Snow: THREE HEADED DRAGON

An interpretation of the prophecy suggesting that Three headed dragon is not 3 person, but one - Jon Snow.



House of the Undying and Red wedding

Detailed analysis of the vision in House of the Undying that is taken to be foreshadowing Red wedding







OTHER TOPICS



The Wall, the Watch, and a Hersey - Heresy 38
The first and most recent topics in the incredible line of heresy threads. "Its an eclectic thread all about challenging orthodoxy, as we try to figure out what’s really going on not in the Game of Thrones but the over-arching Game of Ice and Fire." By rejecting the orthodox views on certain ideas and theories, new understanding may come to light regarding the great questions of the series.

Jon Snow at the Crossroads of Resurrection Mythology
Sometimes answers to the mysteries of the Song are aided by understanding where GRRM's mind has borrowed his ideas from. The mythology of many cultures are admittedly woven into the Song and Jon Snow may be at the heart of much of it.

Patchface Project
For that prophetic fool who hangs around Stannis's court, a thread devoted to answering his mysteries (including foreseeing the Red Wedding) by starting from only the facts that are known.

Night's King - A Turn From Fire to Ice: The Story of Stannis Baratheon *WARNING: TWOW SPOILER*
...Or will Stannis turn away from fire to ice be the Night's King Reborn?

Heresy of the Night's King
Some information and observations about the Night's King from the heretics.

Sansa, The Hound, Brienne and The Valonquar
Marriages, Battles, Murders... When plot-lines collide in Westeros: a fight between the Vale and Harrenhal, a wedding between Sansa and Harry the Heir, the Brotherhood without Banners, Jamie and Brienne and UnCat...

A Big ol' Theory of Dorne and Aegon
A series of conclusions and thoughts trying to reconcile the seemingly useless goings-on of the Dornish (Quentyn Martell and Gerold Dayne, Darkstar) and Varys's unnecessary lie to Ser Kevan Lannister as he lay dying about Aegon's return (if Aegon is really a Blackfyre).

Heir to the North: Jeyne's Hips Don't Lie? (NOTE: The discrepency in anatomy has been corrected in foreign editions.)
The case for Robb Stark's son and rightful heir to the North via Jeyne Westerling. iIn large part the theory is prompted by two different descriptions of Jeyne's anatomy, once from Catelyn as having good birthing hips and once from Jamie as having narrow hips.

The Others and the Children
The two sides north of the Wall are actually "cousins," according to the Theory, two sides of a coin. During their conflict with the First Men, the Children embraced nature while the Others abandoned it for the icy tundras of the deep north and turned to warging to raise an army of undead. Note: GRRM has described the Others as inhuman, elegant, and dangerous, but also opposes creating characters of pure evil.

Jojen Paste
A slightly gruesome theory that Jojen was ground up into the paste that Bran ate while in the Cave with Leaf, a Child of the Forest, and the Three-Eyed Crow. Bran reckons the paste tastes like blood and afterwards he is unable to find the Reeds (while Jojen has had an impending sense of doom

Click to shrink...

Whew boy, this post. Good bye being productive for the next week.

 

[Coyote Starrk]

Whew boy, this post. Good bye being productive for the next week.

Click to shrink...

Oh man. Don't I know it. Best part is reading the books again knowing all the theories. You can see the subtle clues and the hints that people are talking about.


Might as well put on a tinfoil hat while you read it I swear .

 

[Hollywood Duo]

I've always been of the mind that there is no
magic protection spell on the Wall. The White Walkers could have gone through whenever they wanted but it was pointless until they had the dragon on their side. This is from a tv show perspective not book.

So when Bran was in the tree with the 3 eyed raven and went to the vision where he was surrounded by White Walkers and got touched by the Night King - was that the moment the magic from the tree and wall disappeared?

Click to shrink...

Doubtful, I think the point of that scene was just to make Bran aware of who the Night King is.

 

[Seesaw15]

Its time loop destiny shit OP.

 

[demosthenes]

It's just a hunch, but I think GRRM has kinda grown weary of the show's popularity and things being changed, so he's kinda let the show go off in a direction that isn't going to actually match the "real ending" which will be in the books.

That's why he's in no rush to finish the book series either.

Probably not, but, I can't shake that feeling. But if once the show if off the air, his writing pace magically quickens all of the sudden ... lol ... he can always say he changed his mind on certain plot points when he got to them in the books.

Click to shrink...

Sweet summer child. The books are never coming.

 

[BossAttack]

Remember when Littlefinger brought Sansa Stark, a wanted fugitive, to the North and then publicly betrothed her to Ramsay? Remember how Cersei had publicly accused Sansa of poisoning Joffrey? But nobody really has any reaction. Littlefinger just chills for a while, even traveling back to King's Landing at one point, and nobody bothers him. Littlefinger is also giving away the woman he has a creepy sex predator crush on, and giving her to a psychotic rapist and abuser, for essentially no real gain at all. His plan is apparently to have Sansa take over Winterfell after Stannis defeats the Boltons in combat. But what if Stannis loses? Which is, you know, what ends up happening? Did he have no backup plan here at all? Why didn't he just wait for Stannis to defeat the Boltons beforehand, and then swoop in with Sansa? It's not like Stannis would have any major issue with giving Sansa her family's lands back, provided she bent the knee. Littlefinger could have had the same exact outcome without jeoparding the health and safety of both himself and Sansa. Why did Littlefinger suddenly lose all his brain cells between seasons 4 and 5?

See, in the books it was Jeyne Poole, disguised as Arya, who was betrothed to Ramsay, which made more sense because Arya was not a fugitive wanted by the crown and Cersei was willing to let the Boltons have her as part of their alliance. But D&D decided to just swap out one Stark sister for another and it no longer made sense.

Click to shrink...

Yes, all of this plus more.

 

[Disclaimer]

It's an exercise in futility to try to rationalize a lot of show-only elements, because the writers themselves don't write within the confines of in-universe cohesion and consistency.

They write what sounds, like, totally cool to them, what actresses' boobs they want to see (all of them), and haha omg poop/cock jokes.

Edit: I forgot an important fourth writing tool: the no purpose (NOT) SHOCKING DEATH.