WackoWambo

Member
Jan 11, 2018
1,350
I'm glad Sony delisted the game in countries they don't currently support, so we don't have a helldivers situation.

That said, Sony needs to rapidly scale their PSN operations in unsupported territories. If you want to be the main console, you have to be available in as many places as possible.
 

dgrdsv

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,267
Could be wrong here but can you create a new Steam account using VPN in another country and buy it from there on that new account?
You need a local payment method for that (i.e. a credit card), and these aren't exactly easy to get in countries with PSN for those who are not residents of such countries.
 

reksveks

Member
May 17, 2022
3,913
Learning that shouting at consumers for pointing out legal inconsistencies (which helps no-one) is 'better' than shouting at a company because said company is unwilling to invest in a more flexible back-end.

We are going to be back here for Concord/FairGame$ so see you then.
 
Feb 19, 2023
1,989
My.. my.. my.. if it isn't the consequences of my own actions. -Helldivers protestor maybe.

What the fuck am I reading

This whole thing is incredibly stupid. Runaway hit with Helldivers II blown up because of stupid decisions. Potential hit with Ghost of Tsushima blown up because of stupid decisions. All because of... MAU numbers?

This industry is cooked. Shareholders will carry their moneybags to the Earth's core if they can.

It's not even shareholders, more like shitty executives at companies not named Nintendo. The vast majority of shareholders don't even know what MAU are, they just want to see their money go up.

It's up to company leadership to do that and they can do that without artificially increasing MAU numbers (i.e., you don't need a PSN to play these games on Steam like you do on PlayStation and, oh I don't know, maybe you should fix the backend issues that plague the service first) or fucking closing down a studio who just made a hit game and is your only presence in Japan (where you claim you want a foothold in) just because they don't currently have a game in development. Fucking clownshoes.
 

CheapJi

Member
Apr 24, 2018
2,574
I'm glad Sony delisted the game in countries they don't currently support, so we don't have a helldivers situation.

That said, Sony needs to rapidly scale their PSN operations in unsupported territories. If you want to be the main console, you have to be available in as many places as possible.
How did the helldivers situation affect you personally? I'm curious as to what exactly are you glad for?
 

DontHateTheBacon

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,076
This whole thing is incredibly stupid. Runaway hit with Helldivers II blown up because of stupid decisions. Potential hit with Ghost of Tsushima blown up because of stupid decisions. All because of... MAU numbers?

This industry is cooked. Shareholders will carry their moneybags to the Earth's core if they can.
Define "blown up?"
 

Rhaknar

Member
Oct 26, 2017
43,404
tenor.gif
 

DieH@rd

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,880
Revoking the access was a wild tale without basis on reality.

Use of foreign PSN accounts was never an issue, until mass refunds.
 

WackoWambo

Member
Jan 11, 2018
1,350
They didn't revoke their access, They just addressed the issue in the worst way possible by creating a bigger issue for new buyers.
Sony TRIED to revoke access to players in countries without PSN by requiring to link Helldivers 2 to PSN. Their intention wasn't to revoke access, but it would have been the outcome.

Sony backtracked, but they tried.
 

skullmuffins

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,459
Sony TRIED to revoke access to players in countries without PSN by requiring to link Helldivers 2 to PSN. Their intention wasn't to revoke access, but it would have been the outcome.

Sony backtracked, but they tried.
right but previously it was easy for people in unsupported regions to make a free PSN account for a different country. technically "against the TOS" but not difficult or enforced. it's not so easy to make an entire steam account for a different country
 

CheapJi

Member
Apr 24, 2018
2,574
Sony TRIED to revoke access to players in countries without PSN by requiring to link Helldivers 2 to PSN. Their intention wasn't to revoke access, but it would have been the outcome.

Sony backtracked, but they tried.
Fair, But they still literally made it worse. It's not something to be glad for.
 

David Matter

Banned
Apr 16, 2024
304
They didn't revoke their access, They just addressed the issue in the worst way possible by creating a bigger issue for new buyers.

Fair, But they still literally made it worse. It's not something to be glad for.
I doubt its a bigger issue, just go online to the toxic spheres of social media or forums where the helldiver backlash originated, there is literally 0 backlash or at least nothing "noisy" , people its like "oh, 170 countries delisted, BAD SONY, ok bye" nothing comparable to the helldivers 2 backlash, so for people that complained this is a non issue

Sony has to fix this of course, but seems like for majority of people this is a non issue as you are seeing any consequence online
 

CheapJi

Member
Apr 24, 2018
2,574
I doubt its a bigger issue, just go online to the toxic spheres of social media or forums where the helldiver backlash originated, there is literally 0 backlash or at least nothing "noisy" , people its like "oh, 170 countries delisted, BAD SONY, ok bye" nothing comparable to the helldivers 2 backlash, so for people that complained this is a non issue

Sony has to fix this of course, but seems like for majority of people this is a non issue as you are seeing any consequence online
Bigger issue for people where PSN isn't supported. should have been more specific on that one.

edit:

4DE87C54951DE11BBBA0ACE8142C052088211137
 
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aevanhoe

Slayer of the Eternal Voidslurper
Member
Aug 28, 2018
7,464
I'm glad Sony delisted the game in countries they don't currently support, so we don't have a helldivers situation.

Edit: on second thought, don't want to get into it. But it sucks the game is not available here anymore, and this is probably just the beginning.
 
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dex3108

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,229
I'm glad Sony delisted the game in countries they don't currently support, so we don't have a helldivers situation.

That said, Sony needs to rapidly scale their PSN operations in unsupported territories. If you want to be the main console, you have to be available in as many places as possible.

Issue ere is less about consoles and more about PC. Every single PC store/platform has world wide support and it had it since day they started operating. Regional accounts and limited country support is literally unknown issue for PC players. Then comes Sony and pushes for PSN that has that issue on PC.
 

AshenOne

Member
Feb 21, 2018
6,331
Pakistan
I'm glad Sony delisted the game in countries they don't currently support, so we don't have a helldivers situation.

That said, Sony needs to rapidly scale their PSN operations in unsupported territories. If you want to be the main console, you have to be available in as many places as possible.
People in these countries can't play a game at launch that is a fucking single player game with an optional Co Op mode.
Sony isn't going to 'scale their PSN operations in a day or nght.. we are talking about YEARS.. Y-E-A-R-S.
 

Bossking

Member
Nov 20, 2017
1,647
People in these countries can't play a game at launch that is a fucking single player game with an optional Co Op mode.
Sony isn't going to 'scale their PSN operations in a day or nght.. we are talking about YEARS.. Y-E-A-R-S.

PSN has been around for 17 years. If the 94 billion dollar corporation can't scale their service to support the rest of the world, then don't fucking require a PSN account on PC.
 

Leveean

Member
Nov 9, 2017
1,143
Out of region people could have just done what they have done for 17 years and use their nearest or preferred PSN region. Or just not use PSN features which are completely optional for this game.

Because outrage peddlers made a mountain out of the Helldivers situation they've forced Sony to react to potential legal issues which have not mattered for nearly 2 decades and made it worse for everyone.

You could say that this is Sony's fault for having bad regional support which is a true, but that is going to take many years to fix.
 
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Bossking

Member
Nov 20, 2017
1,647
Out of region people could have just done what they have done for 17 years and use their nearest or preferred PSN region. Or just not use PSN features which are completely optional for this game.

Because outrage peddlers made a mountain out of the Hellblade situation they've forced Sony to react to potential legal issues which have not mattered for nearly 2 decades and made it worse for everyone.

You could say that this is Sony's fault for having bad regional support which is a true, but that is going to take many years to fix.

God, did you even read the thing you typed

Like, gee buddy. I wonder what's different about this situation that wasn't the case these last 17 years. Maybe if we all get a group chat going on STEAM, we can brainstorm this and figure it out.
 

fallout

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,260
PSN has been around for 17 years. If the 94 billion dollar corporation can't scale their service to support the rest of the world, then don't fucking require a PSN account on PC.
The PSN account isn't required for anything but the multiplayer. It's wild to me that Sony is still so behind in this, but they're now following the rules. Don't sell games in regions that don't support PSN when part of your game requires it.
 

AshenOne

Member
Feb 21, 2018
6,331
Pakistan
PSN has been around for 17 years. If the 94 billion dollar corporation can't scale their service to support the rest of the world, then don't fucking require a PSN account on PC.
What is this response?

You're asking a rich corp to mend its ways and be 'more fairer' to all the people around the world globally and scale their operations at your whim.

You're right it is their fault on that but they don't care. They won't wanna support countries or scale to them, the ones which they don't think make them grow but don't bother stop from selling their games there via other platforms cause they don't enforce all their ToS and want as much money as they can if possible.

Thats how rich and greedy corps are. Some are better than others but thats it..

But this is reality...they want all your data if they can so they can put it up for show to their investors, use it for other means if you are using their services.

What you're asking is only important to you, not others who don't share your opinion about making a fucking PSN account that takes a few minutes with an overseas country..just so they can fucking play a Single player game.

Seriously its not so fucking hard to understand how you lot have taken part in ruining the chances of these people to play the game legally at launch and possibly for YEARS to come.
 

GrrImAFridge

ONE THOUSAND DOLLARYDOOS
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,731
Western Australia
The notion that users are to blame for this is patently absurd, divorced of logic, and void of critical thinking.

It was Sony's choice to attempt to retroactively enforce a PSN account requirement with Helldivers 2 that had nothing to do with the functionality of the game and everything to do with pumping up PSN MAUs, and it was Sony's choice to forcibly refund pre-purchasers of Ghost in countries where PSN isn't supported despite the fact the single-player campaign doesn't require a PSN account.

The only party at fault is Sony for engaging in an over-correction and doing exactly nothing over the past four years to marry its PC ambitions with the comparatively limited geographic footprint of PSN.
 

Leveean

Member
Nov 9, 2017
1,143
God, did you even read the thing you typed

Like, gee buddy. I wonder what's different about this situation that wasn't the case these last 17 years. Maybe if we all get a group chat going on STEAM, we can brainstorm this and figure it out.

Steam didn't change anything. Until yesterday, people in unsupported PSN regions were buying Ghost on Steam. They would have been able to play it just fine. They would have been able to use the PSN features too without much effort, just as they would have in Helldivers.
 
May 15, 2019
2,597
Is there a reason people who are fine with making an out of region PSN account can't just make an out of region Steam account
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,968
Is there a reason people who are fine with making an out of region PSN account can't just make an out of region Steam account
It's easy to do the first thing and less so to do the second. Pretty sure creating an out-of-region Steam account requires a VPN. Would payment even work? And who wants to have their library split like that?

--------

Anyway, If someone were to buy the game on say CDkeys, would they have a problem activating it? I don't think they would, but I won't spend $50US to try.
 

Asator

Member
Oct 27, 2017
943
The notion that users are to blame for this is patently absurd, divorced of logic, and void of critical thinking.

It was Sony's choice to attempt to retroactively enforce a PSN account requirement with Helldivers 2 that had nothing to do with the functionality of the game and everything to do with pumping up PSN MAUs, and it was Sony's choice to forcibly refund pre-purchasers of Ghost in countries where PSN isn't supported despite the fact the single-player campaign doesn't require a PSN account.

The only party at fault is Sony for engaging in an over-correction and doing exactly nothing over the past four years to marry its PC ambitions with the comparatively limited geographic footprint of PSN.
This.

I can absolutely understand people's frustration with their newfound inability to purchase Sony titles on PC, but this entirely Sony's fault. No one forced them to implement PSN requirements in their games. No one forced them to not support a vast amount of countries, including some EU nations (WTF?).

All of this is 100% Sony's fault, and the reasons for doing this aren't even good either. They just want to inflate the MAU of PSN and use their PC ports as a sort of trojan horse to get PC gamers in the Playstation ecosystem (which obviously won't work, but considering how dumb their decisions have been on this subject you can bet that they're hoping it'll happen).

Blame Sony for Sony's action, not users.
 

GrrImAFridge

ONE THOUSAND DOLLARYDOOS
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,731
Western Australia
It's a curious case as CD Keys specifically (still) states that it can be activated in my country. They really need to make sure.

Bear in mind that CD Keys is a "grey market" store that resells keys purchased in bulk from distribution partners associated with publishers, as opposed to receiving them directly from publishers, so it's not necessarily privy to official information.

CD Keys has a solid reputation for refunding affected users in situations like this, but I would play it safe and operate on the assumption that Sony has updated the game's licences to match the selective delisting.


Well on SteamDB says purchase and activation if i remember correctly.

Yeah, the PurchaseRestrictedCountries and AllowPurchaseFromRestrictedCountries flags control both, and SteamDB can no longer detect non-store packages for unreleased games, which makes it difficult to ascertain whether there are retail-specific/region-specific/etc. variants.
 
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reksveks

Member
May 17, 2022
3,913
which obviously won't work, but considering how dumb their decisions have been on this subject you can bet that they're hoping it'll happen

Think Sony's lack of PSN support globally is dumb as you can see from my previous posts on this thread but this is rather irrelevant. We should be hoping that more companies do join in and try and compete for PC Store distribution. Companies competing for your dollars/quids/euro = good.
 

senj

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,799
What is this response?

You're asking a rich corp to mend its ways and be 'more fairer' to all the people around the world globally and scale their operations at your whim.

You're right it is their fault on that but they don't care. They won't wanna support countries or scale to them, the ones which they don't think make them grow but don't bother stop from selling their games there via other platforms cause they don't enforce all their ToS and want as much money as they can if possible.

Thats how rich and greedy corps are. Some are better than others but thats it..

But this is reality...they want all your data if they can so they can put it up for show to their investors, use it for other means if you are using their services.

What you're asking is only important to you, not others who don't share your opinion about making a fucking PSN account that takes a few minutes with an overseas country..just so they can fucking play a Single player game.

Seriously its not so fucking hard to understand how you lot have taken part in ruining the chances of these people to play the game legally at launch and possibly for YEARS to come.
Did you really just write "Rich multibillion dollar megacorporations like Sony are never going to do the right thing and always going to try to harvest as much consumer data as possible for their own benefit unless they encounter significant push-back, therefore … Sony's actions here are the fault of non-billionaire individual consumers for attempting to push Sony into dropping said requirement, who ruined everything".

Like, no. That's not how this works. Sony "ruined the chances of these people to play the game legally" with their PSN requirements and regional restrictions horseshit. It is literally nobody's fault except the people at Sony making these decisions at Sony. Blaming the people who pushed back on Sony's crapass decisions is absurd.
 

David Matter

Banned
Apr 16, 2024
304
pretty obvious whas sony´s decision since they are the ones who can decide if delist or not a game in certain region, they are the ones who need to fix this region restriction issue, they cant ask for people to create and log in with a psn account if the psn account isnt even supported in that restricted region... who here thought it was steam decision? lol
 

chrominance

Sky Van Gogh
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,091
You're asking a rich corp to mend its ways and be 'more fairer' to all the people around the world globally and scale their operations at your whim.

You're asking the ENTIRE INTERNET to "stop snitching" so that people can continue to make PSN accounts out of region to get around the fact that Sony doesn't care about them. Which is the less likely outcome here? That Sony reverses course or that not a single person ever complains about something that was perfectly legitimate to complain about to keep this workaround forever secret?
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,968
pretty obvious whas sony´s decision since they are the ones who can decide if delist or not a game in certain region, they are the ones who need to fix this region restriction issue, they cant ask for people to create and log in with a psn account if the psn account isnt even supported in that restricted region... who here thought it was steam decision? lol
But if the PSN login isn't required/necessary, then why bother delisting? It makes more sense for Steam to not allow a game to be sold where features can't be accessed due to the country a person resides, which sounded like the case going by this:

GvJwwTR.png


So I can understand Sony delisting Helldivers 2 permanently if they were going forward with the account connection being mandatory, or temporarily while they figured out what they were going to do. But doubling down and adding more countries and delisting a whole other game makes even less sense than if it were Steam being cautious.

This just shows that Sony does actually care about people breaking their ToS then since they're straight up preventing PC players from even trying?
 

AshenOne

Member
Feb 21, 2018
6,331
Pakistan
Did you really just write "Rich multibillion dollar megacorporations like Sony are never going to do the right thing and always going to try to harvest as much consumer data as possible for their own benefit unless they encounter significant push-back, therefore … Sony's actions here are the fault of non-billionaire individual consumers for attempting to push Sony into dropping said requirement, who ruined everything".

Like, no. That's not how this works. Sony "ruined the chances of these people to play the game legally" with their PSN requirements and regional restrictions horseshit. It is literally nobody's fault except the people at Sony making these decisions at Sony. Blaming the people who pushed back on Sony's crapass decisions is absurd.
Yes I really did write that because thats how the reality works for non privileged people.

Saying that 'this is no one's fault but Sony's' just is so devoid of reality.

Just because what you are saying seems and IS logical, it doesn't mean Sony remains consistent with them and thats their problem but in order to correct that problem they need large scale changes possibly to ensure they support 100s of more of these countries. Do you really believe they'll do that overnight or in a week? This will take years and even then its not a fucking guarantee that it'll cover all the countries.

Ultimately just now because they enforced those ToS, who suffers because of that? Certainly not you lot.

Mate things have consequences no matter if its the responsibility of the company. It also depends WHO made them enforce those Terms of Service which renders all these people unavailable to play these games.

I'll say it again.

It takes two to clap. All of this crap didn't happen cause Sony one day decided that they'll just delist the game from these countries..

You lot made it happen for reasons only you care and because of that the game is unavailable to buy for those people.

Iam not saying this is all on you but at least accept your part in it.

Saying this isn't logical and this and that etc, conveniently ignores the consequences of your actions.

Same shit I read when i read defenders of region hopping for getting cheaper.. 'It is or it should be a free market and its on the company to provided the users with proper and equal priced products!'
 

GrrImAFridge

ONE THOUSAND DOLLARYDOOS
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,731
Western Australia
The only party that "forced" Sony to selectively delist is Sony. Furthermore, even if we assume that PC players were big bullies who coerced Sony into enforcing its own ToS, the fact remains that its games being available only in countries where PSN is supported would've happened later down the track regardless. It's unfortunate that it's happening now and in the messiest way possible, but, again, that's on Sony and not the fault of users lacking preternatural foresight.
 
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Rowsdower

Shinra Employee of The Wise Ones
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
17,432
Canada
Look, at the end of it all, we can point fingers all we want, it is on Sony to fix this. Whatever the reasons or causes or concerns it is up to Sony and Sony only to handle this going forward, and it was them that blundered their way into this mess in the first place.

You can give them time or the benefit of doubt or whatever, or not. That's entirely up to you.
 
Mar 7, 2020
3,144
USA
Yes I really did write that because thats how the reality works for non privileged people.

Saying that 'this is no one's fault but Sony's' just is so devoid of reality.

Just because what you are saying seems and IS logical, it doesn't mean Sony remains consistent with them and thats their problem but in order to correct that problem they need large scale changes possibly to ensure they support 100s of more of these countries. Do you really believe they'll do that overnight or in a week? This will take years and even then its not a fucking guarantee that it'll cover all the countries.

Ultimately just now because they enforced those ToS, who suffers because of that? Certainly not you lot.

Mate things have consequences no matter if its the responsibility of the company. It also depends WHO made them enforce those Terms of Service which renders all these people unavailable to play these games.

I'll say it again.

It takes two to clap. All of this crap didn't happen cause Sony one day decided that they'll just delist the game from these countries..

You lot made it happen for reasons only you care and because of that the game is unavailable to buy for those people.

Iam not saying this is all on you but at least accept your part in it.

Saying this isn't logical and this and that etc, conveniently ignores the consequences of your actions.

Same shit I read when i read defenders of region hopping for getting cheaper.. 'It is or it should be a free market and its on the company to provided the users with proper and equal priced products!'
or...the multi billion dollar and leader of the console gaming could have expanded their network and support to the rest of the planet and avoided this whole mess in the first place.
 

Bossking

Member
Nov 20, 2017
1,647
They don't even have to expand it! Just drop the fucking account requirement for PC! That's what people were asking for! No one asked to delist! If they can't or won't expand for whatever stupid reason, then just drop the account requirement so people around the world can play the goddamn game!
 

AshenOne

Member
Feb 21, 2018
6,331
Pakistan
or...the multi billion dollar and leader of the console gaming could have expanded their network and support to the rest of the planet and avoided this whole mess in the first place.
I've already talked about this sentiment in that response. Putting it all on the company is an extremely convenient excuse for someone having a privileged life and brigadding against something simply because they don't want to make an account for a Live service game.
 

Kerwop

Member
Dec 15, 2017
461
Yes I really did write that because thats how the reality works for non privileged people.

Saying that 'this is no one's fault but Sony's' just is so devoid of reality.

Just because what you are saying seems and IS logical, it doesn't mean Sony remains consistent with them and thats their problem but in order to correct that problem they need large scale changes possibly to ensure they support 100s of more of these countries. Do you really believe they'll do that overnight or in a week? This will take years and even then its not a fucking guarantee that it'll cover all the countries.

Ultimately just now because they enforced those ToS, who suffers because of that? Certainly not you lot.

Mate things have consequences no matter if its the responsibility of the company. It also depends WHO made them enforce those Terms of Service which renders all these people unavailable to play these games.

I'll say it again.

It takes two to clap. All of this crap didn't happen cause Sony one day decided that they'll just delist the game from these countries..

You lot made it happen for reasons only you care and because of that the game is unavailable to buy for those people.

Iam not saying this is all on you but at least accept your part in it.

Saying this isn't logical and this and that etc, conveniently ignores the consequences of your actions.

Same shit I read when i read defenders of region hopping for getting cheaper.. 'It is or it should be a free market and its on the company to provided the users with proper and equal priced products!'
Unless you have some idea how to get thousands of players to agree to not complain I really don't understand how you can be more upset with them over Sony. Any publisher forcing a sign in/launcher after launch is going to face predictable backlash. When Sony announced their plan I don't see how anyone could have predicted it would end up with people losing access entirely.