woah, thats actually nuts wtfSteam is force refunding pre-purchases of GOT now:
And you know what? I think I'm done with Sony. I shouldn't be running around trying to give them my money. They don't want it? Fine by me.
Ghost of Tsushima Director's Cut has been delisted on Steam in countries where PSN isn't available
- Thread starter Red Kong XIX
- Start date
Thanks, that makes sense. I agree it being optional would be ideal, so only people who want the trophies need to do it. But I'm pretty sure that's not in Sony's best interest, so it won't happen.Sony is gonna have an overlay that enables you to share trophies over PS5/PC. Of course this means you need a PSN account for it to work.
They really should make it optional though.
Here's the info:
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Sony’s new PlayStation PC overlay and shared Trophies arrive with Ghost of Tsushima
Sony continues to invest in PlayStation PC features.www.theverge.com
See that would be the smart thing to do. Sony is pretty dumb. Legends/multi is free on PS, so they could've just sliced it up into a free DLC that would then require PSN as they wished. Then only that DLC would've been region blocked, but not the main game. Sony, if you read this, solved it for ya.
At least they're letting people know in advance and automatically giving a refund.
This really sucks to see. They really don't want to expand their marketsSteam is force refunding pre-purchases of GOT now:
And you know what? I think I'm done with Sony. I shouldn't be running around trying to give them my money. They don't want it? Fine by me.
It's so obvious Sony's foray into PC is a PSN overlay and if a region or country doesn't have access, they don't sell there. I personally don't have an issue with this since they are stating it 1st and not letting people buy as a bait and switch. Sony should start to invest to increase psn in more countries l. It would be nice if they didn't make it mandatory but we don't live in that world and Sony has to answer to shareholders.
well i think its pretty obvious now, this will be the standar for sony games on steam, helldivers was restricted on those countries because sony doesnt have the psn support on those contries, and when the backlash happened Ghost of Tsushima was already in preorder so of course they are now refunding in the restricted countries for Ghost of Tsushima, what I believe will happen is that sony will launch preorders in steam with the countries already delisted, so this refunding problem will be avoided
god of war ragnarok will be the test, if they launch GoW Ragnarok with the pc overlay it will require psn account, if they restrict that game to those countries even if the overlay is optional, well guys, its over, move on, because if sony didnt change this in 15 years of psn , i doubt they will do it now, I could be wrong, but i think this will be the case
god of war ragnarok will be the test, if they launch GoW Ragnarok with the pc overlay it will require psn account, if they restrict that game to those countries even if the overlay is optional, well guys, its over, move on, because if sony didnt change this in 15 years of psn , i doubt they will do it now, I could be wrong, but i think this will be the case
Oh yeah, that's actually the perfect fix. Now all versions have the same content and originally the Legends MP was free DLC anyway
Right so shareholders prefer PSN account numbers to actual sales of games on PC then?
Lame that the people who aren't interested in the games post-launch side MP mode (which is probably the majority lol) don't even have the option to play the SP.
This is the real kicker, really. PSN for that overlay and Legends can be totally ignored for Tsushima, and yet they went for the nuclear option like their online-only GAAS title. Like wtf. Imagine them going back to their older single player titles now, I wouldn't put it pass them. Utterly embarrassing situation all around.
The problem that likely occured was the Helldivers backlash.
So the game is currently packaged with legends dlc. Hopefully they're smart enough to separate and give for free as dlc
Steam is force refunding pre-purchases of GOT now:
And you know what? I think I'm done with Sony. I shouldn't be running around trying to give them my money. They don't want it? Fine by me.
I expected this after GMG did the same thing.
These companies do not want to take on any liability for Sony's policies and Helldivers 2 was just the thing that called their attention to it.
I dont see this EVER, happening, not a single chance, if they put the overlay in old sony games in steam, I am 100% sure they will not ask for any account, but seeing how the overlay works, they have to require an account 100% for the implementation so they will require psn account in the old games, and by that notion, they will have to restrict again those games for non supported countries, making the biggest mistake ever made because they will have to redund millions of users, that is not going to happen, with the backlasg I´m sure any plan to add the overlay to old games was completly abandoned, thay overlay will go to new games, this problem will be solved only by no requiring psn accounts at all (doubt this will happen) or psn being supported in those countries (this hasnt happen in like 15 years) so I have this gut feeling this is a permanent restriction, time will tell I suppose
Ghost Legends already is that which makes it extra head scratching. I think they even just made it fully standalone on PS4 and PS5 not that long ago, instead of under Ghost of Tsushima.
i think this is what exactly happened, they never thought in this problem because for more than a decade people just create some psn account with other country and thats it, problem solved, but we have to remember this is people working behind the scenes, not robots so they made a mistake here, hopefully they resolve this soon, but I think this will take time, for now I think they will restrict games if they have an online component but wouldnt be strange is single players as well are going to be restricted, god of war ragnarok is coming to pc according to some leaks, I think that will show if they will do it with single players as well
PlayStation headquarters, probably: "Money? We don't like that -- unless it comes via our family of consoles."
Well this sucks but it's still entirely possible to use a VPN. I've used one to buy games that aren't available in whatever region I'm in at the time and play online/update with no issues. Payment is usually the only potential hurdle but there are plenty of workarounds (like directly funding your steam wallet)
Smugplayer fair enough.
We'll see how it goes for their next SP only game (Until Dawn/Ragnarok).
I don't think MP is the only problem here. It looks like they're enforcing the PSN overlay to all of their games going forward, including single player ones. They didn't develop it as an optional thing, they want PC players in their ecosystem.
We'll see how it goes for their next SP only game (Until Dawn/Ragnarok).
Just read through the first few pages...
Why do people keep comparing these other 3rd party games that require an account? "You can sign up within minutes, bro" doesn't even apply at all. Do some of you don't care just because you're not affected? That's 181 countries if I counted right.
Why do people keep comparing these other 3rd party games that require an account? "You can sign up within minutes, bro" doesn't even apply at all. Do some of you don't care just because you're not affected? That's 181 countries if I counted right.
So the only solution to this (asuming they care) is changing the ToS, right? They clearly can't solve their infraestructure soon enough.
Now what does that remind me of…hmmm let me think…:cough:games for windows:cough:live:cough.
I'm from Estonia. I have had a PSN account for 15 years thoufh I can't select Estonia as my region but it has never stopped me or my friends/acquaintances from using PSN.
Currently I am VERY affected because it's no longer about "2 minutes to make an account", now I need a VPN to buy these games on PC.
I'm sorry to hear about that, I feel you. That's why I don't know why some people are defending this when it's not an issue with other 3rd party accounts.
It's so weird to see so many gamers telling people to break TOS/EULA when anytime a company does something awful there are always people pointing to them as a way to defend shit like shutting down a games online service, getting paid content removed from peoples accounts with no reimbursements, or getting banned for modding a single player game.
And lets be honest, If Sony ever did decide to crack down on people outside PSN supported countries, there'd be people defending them and saying shit like "you broke the TOS what did you expect to happen?" Or" if you didn't want your games to be removed you shouldn't have broken the TOS".
There's no damn way I'd be spending money on an account that breaks TOS, especially not when it's from a company like Sony. Their customer support is almost at PopCopy bad from my experience dealing with them.
Yeah they gotta sort this out somehow as they push further into PC.
I guess there are two solutions: either expand PSN to more countries or give up on the idea that PC players will need a PSN account to play online.
The first one would probably take a lot of work but if they're serious about PC maybe it's worth it.
I guess there are two solutions: either expand PSN to more countries or give up on the idea that PC players will need a PSN account to play online.
The first one would probably take a lot of work but if they're serious about PC maybe it's worth it.
I think sony will expand into new countries but but probably not fast enough for some people.
I believe the second one would also need some work.
You would need to implement some "friend code" system and bring PSN and Steam players together.
Solution one would make the most sense.
But tbh, i believe SIE just doesn't care about those countries without PSN and Playstation support.
Yeah for Ghost of Tsushima it probably doesn't really matter that much but obviously they cared enough for Helldivers to change their plans. For future live service type games where a big, active community is important I wonder what the stance will be.
Sony and Microsoft are having a tournament to see who can make more mistakes on the month of May.
I'm pretty sure the "friend code" system in Helldivers 2 is somewhat just an left over of Hellldivers 1 that was also available on Playstation and Steam.
I would be somewhat surprised if "friend codes" and PSN-Steam crossplay becomes a thing for the SIE PC initiative.
Tbh, i wouldn't even know why some people want some "friend code" mess instead of a simple 3rd party account.
But SIE clearly messed up, by selling the games in territories without PSN.
I just can't understand how they could not know that there are countries without PSN when they started selling the PSN games.
And that PSN doesn't support every country, atleast in PC, is of course also a bad showing.
VPN won't help you to buy a game on Steam which has been locked from purchasing in the country/region of your Steam account.
The only option which could work would be to buy a key on some site and then hope that it would activate on your Steam account. It likely won't though since keys have the same geo restrictions in them.
And as I've said already that's just too much work to give money to a corporation. They can fuck right off with such attitude towards customers.
This sucks for those who now can't play the game at all even if they wanted to make an account to do so in a different region to their unsupported one. There was literally as close to 0% chance as possible (honestly 0% chance but had to give at least any tiny 0.0000001% chance in case) of bans being thrown out to anyone making different region accounts in the reality that we currently live in because it would literally go against the entire idea of what sony wants as a business in the first place, it's shit as hell that a bunch of gamers now just can't play the game legally.
Your zero chance becomes 100% if they let you buy games in unsupported regions, if you think this through
- Sony releases games that require PSN account linking
- sells games on PC Stores to unsupported regions
- customers from unsupported regions can't access part of the games they paid for and don't know about the workaround or don't want to break ToS
- customers complain to the PC stores and their countries' market watchdogs
- some EU member states are unsupported Sony regions
- EU watchdogs get involved
- Fuck! (look up the "Brussels Effect" on how EU law shapes the world)
- nobody wants the fucking EU inquisition looking at their business.
Sony would never acknowledge that they actively ignore or even encourage breaking ToS. You can't just ignore one part of the ToS. Either you enforce the ToS or you don't. If you publicly declare that one part of your written ToS is not enforced, then the whole ToS would be null and void, any purchase done on that account would be null and void.
Do you know why Guernsey, which is a part of the UK is a separate entity on Steam?
Taxation.
Buying from countries which are not supported by the store is Tax Fraud.
Buying from Estonia on a Russian PSN account is Tax fraud.
When the EU starts their thing, they will demand from Sony to close this loophole.
Putting aside that folks have done that for 15+ years without issues, no one on steam linking a psn account form other regions is buying pc games from those regions psn because they aren't buying games on psn but on steam in their own region?
The psn account people would make has literally nothing being bought on it via that account in the case of pc gamers linking an account to play their steam games. The whole reason Sony want this is apparently to boost psn active user numbers by adding in pc gamers, how exactly does that work if you go banning folks who make other regions psn accounts, who don't buy anything with it to even do the hypothetical tax fraud you're claiming, and then don't give them a way to actually make a psn account in their region to actually replace the lost active user who was banned?
It literally goes against the entire premise of why they're pushing this account linking thing for boosting numbers to ban people. It makes 0 sense they would because it hurts their entire businesses numbers.
It would be one thing if they did this on PlayStation itself, blocking folks accessing other regions because sure, they could claim some nonsense tax fraud reasons, but steam is selling games to these users in those regions. There is no tax fraud there by linking an account that was free to make and has 0 ability to do tax fraud in anyway for the pc gamer using it to link a steam account. That's why it makes 0 sense that Sony would ban anyone for making an account and linking it, "nothing illegal happened but let's nuke our active player numbers because that sure will help business for our console ecosystem and please shareholders" isn't something a business is going to do.
Fucking hell Sony
100%, it's so stupid that there are people defending Sony here lmao
Steam is force refunding pre-purchases of GOT now:
And you know what? I think I'm done with Sony. I shouldn't be running around trying to give them my money. They don't want it? Fine by me.
I can't believe Gamers would do this...
Sony is for sure to blame here. This move isn't "good" and shouldn't be defended but unfortunately it is a necessary step that has to be taken, it's just a step that should have been taken back during the early PlayStation 3 days instead of mid 2024.
I guess it remains to be seen whether Sony will be putting in the effort to expand PSNs reach to the affected countries. I would like to believe after all this they will be, because why wouldn't they want more MAUs as that's what seemed to have kicked off this whole fiasco.
Im more convinced that Sony is preparing their own launcher and trophy system and everything that psn in console has now, but in PC. It's not gonna arrive now or next year, maybe not even in all PS5 generation, but starting to mandate PSN binding now will give then a lot of ground filled when they launch it.
They probably know that the sales on those countries is not that big and prefer to keep with their plan.
People can't buy games on Playstation without a PSN account in the first place.
But they can buy games on Steam without having a PSN account.
So you have customers who feel they have been frauded and some of them will call their local watchdog.
It is not the issue of Steam selling the games.
It is an issue of pointing to the Tax Fraud going on in unsupported PSN regions.
When Steam is selling to an Estonian account, they pay Estonian taxes, no fraud going on.
When an Estonian Playstation customer buys something on the PS5 store either in, for example, Rubles (Russia) or the Pound (UK) they are defrauding Estonia and the EU. This was a non-issue for Sony because they could point to the ToS and wash their hands. While, at the same time, Estonian customers knew of the issue and wouldn't call their watchdogs for paying a game that they can't use, because they couldn't buy the game in the first place unless they broke ToS
But now, we have customers who don't have a PSN account from the Start and buy legally from the Steam Store.
If Sony lets them buy the game but blocks them from accessing the game, those customers will either refund, or call their Watchdog for fraudulent business practices.
Sony can't hide behind pointing at the ToS because they allowed the legal sale of the game on Steam.
When the EU is combing through the whole mess they will absolutely point at the issue with customers breaking ToS on Playstation, additionally to the whole debacle of selling games but not allowing 2/3 of the world to play it.
Someone at Sony saw this issue creeping up and pulled the plug.
They didn't "see" this problem before because all Playstation customers already have a PSN account, ToS breaking or not.
They oversaw the issues with the PC release, that you can buy games from unsupported regions without having a PSN account.
So they pulled the plug.