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TissueBox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,375
Urinated States of America
Again, none of this goes into effect for any existing players until June. They gave a month's advanced notice. Misinformation doesn't help anybody

OK fair. The problem is that they didn't just communicate this firmly enough from the beginning then.

I mean yes people like to whine over the smallest things. (With which I do agree somewhat, the region problem could've still been easily bypassable if ppl genuinely wanted to play, barring security concerns.) But Sony shoulda seen this and handled it with a pinch more delicacy. 🫠

Tho maybe there's just indifferent to the bad press/PR.
 
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St. Eam the 3rd

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Aug 18, 2022
2,666
my Steam friends refunded, how the hell did this mess become this big THIS QUICK, helldiver is setting all kind of records oh dear
 

Boopers

Member
Nov 1, 2020
1,596
Vermont usa
Sony has to, like, delay this policy from going into effect until they can sort all this out.

Refusing to do business in countries w/o PSN instead of simply waiving the requirement is bonkers.
 
Jul 2, 2021
16,954
I'm confused. If Helldivers 2 was going to have PSN from the beginning were it not for the initial server issues, why was it even listed in countries without PSN in the first place?
Because you can just make an account in another country (I have 4 PSN accounts) and keep playing. I have a japanese PSN account and I can buy games there. People used this as an argument against the PSN Link stuff and now Sony delisted Helldivers 2 from these countries and the offer refunds. "Problem solved" I guess?
 

Techno

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The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,518
I'm confused. If Helldivers 2 was going to have PSN from the beginning were it not for the initial server issues, why was it even listed in countries without PSN in the first place?

I think it was only supposed to be optional like the other games on Steam, but getting a lot of mixed messages.
 

Vexii

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,481
UK
No it wasn't. Creating an account in those countries is a non-issue and has been done by millions of people, even ones here on this forum. That was never a blocker until it was delisted. There's even a Sony customer support rep who confirmed it was fine to do so, the devs also confirmed it was fine to do so, so saying that alone was a big problem is just plain gaslighting
Not being able to create an account in your own region is unacceptable conduct for a product that is being sold in your region and this defence is not to be taken seriously. I would daresay call it "gaslighty" of you to claim that it isn't an issue.
 
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Red Kong XIX

Red Kong XIX

Member
Oct 11, 2020
9,035
lol at guam and puerto rico being on the list because people not from either were posting about PSN being unavailable because they didnt select US and then guam or puerto rico as the territory. like its very unfortunate and unfair for people living there but god is it funny

There was also a Vtuber from Puerto Rico tweeting this, just days after they played Stellar Blade on a PS5 you mind:

View: https://x.com/ironmouse/status/1786425841896890385
 

Rowsdower

Shinra Employee of The Wise Ones
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
17,432
Canada
I think it was only supposed to be optional like the other games on Steam, but getting a lot of mixed messages.

No, it was required. On launch day there was a splash screen for you to link your PsN account, and it did say one was required. Now, you could skip this screen, and then, very stupidly, it never popped up again!
 

St. Eam the 3rd

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Aug 18, 2022
2,666
With all the Steam refund we will get an updated Circana report:
"Helldivers 2 Top5 for APRIL without counting PC players!
Outside Top20 counting PC players"
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,968
What happens if someone buys a key from a keyseller/site and tries to activate in these countries?

No, it was required. On launch day there was a splash screen for you to link your PsN account, and it did say one was required. Now, you could skip this screen, and then, very stupidly, it never popped up again!
Yep I remember asking about that because I couldn't figure out how to get that screen back.
 

RoboitoAM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,129
Left a negative review to get the point across. This is pretty wild and a crazy case of demolishing goodwill. Feel bad for Arrowhead.
 

Cybit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,358
Why has PSN never expanded into all of those countries?? That seems the most bizarre to me of this whole thing
 

Re-Tails

Member
Aug 16, 2020
269
Hahahaha, oh Sony what are you doing...

Also, while I acknowledge people overreacted, blaming that as the reason Sony deciding to delist the game from all these regions is a pretty bad faith argument.
 

Techno

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The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,518
It clearly said required. Whether or not it was actually enforced I don't know, because I just scanned the QR code and went on my day.

No, it was required. On launch day there was a splash screen for you to link your PsN account, and it did say one was required. Now, you could skip this screen, and then, very stupidly, it never popped up again!

Oh I see, thanks for clarifying. I forgot, it was awhile ago.
 

Iwao

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,084
On the other hand, you just know Sony's pushing this because they wanna normalize their games requiring PSN accounts so that they can eventually try and charge PC users for PS+, so… lol.
"Eventually" lol. This continues to be nonsense. Assuming that a small handful of games survive this GaaS push of Sony's, there's no way they believe that PC gamers would support paying for PS+ for a library of 2 or 3 online multiplayer games, especially after Microsoft tried to do that and was met with rejection (+ they have a lot more MP games on PC already). Even a library of 50-100 would be laughed away, you know.
 

dex3108

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,227
Is not that those countries CANT make an account, maybe there are literally some regions blocked from psn but I think many of those regions can create a psn account but adding a country in the account creation like US, UK etc.. and then add that account in steam, for many years people in countries where psn was not supported, people created accounts to play playstation online, what this drama created is that sony just literally delisted the game for those countries, if people stayed quiet , those people could have easily created a psn account selecting another country and thats it, and here are the consequences, sony literally cut the problem in its enterity

For the love of God Sony should have solved issue of country support before asking players to make an account. Stop putting blame on users for corporate BS.
 

bsigg

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,798
Sony has to, like, delay this policy from going into effect until they can sort all this out.

Refusing to do business in countries w/o PSN instead of simply waiving the requirement is bonkers.
What is there to sort out? They're forcing PSN as the primary way to play the game, that was supposedly the plan originally for launch but "technical difficulties" resulted in them allowing Steam accounts to be used instead.

Since they also didn't preemptively block the countries that won't have access to PSN on the Steam version because who knows why, we ended up here.

Honestly, it seems more like the game blew up in a way Sony wasn't expecting and are seeing the numbers on Steam and want to funnel all those MAUs into PSN so they're pushing the big red button and Arrowhead Games are the ones that have to deal with the fallout.
 

diablogg

Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,519
Just because you CAN make an account if you live in a country that doesn't support PSN by lying doesn't mean that everything is all good. Especially because I'm sure there's some BS in the Sony TOS that states you can be banned for something like that. Steam and Sony def shouldn't have allowed this to be sold in territories not supported. This is 100% up to Sony to fix this shit up.
 

Cenauru

Dragon Girl Supremacy
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,174
OK fair. The problem is that they didn't just communicate this firmly enough from the beginning then.

I mean yes people like to whine over the smallest things. But Sony shoulda seen this and handled it with a pinch more delicacy. 🫠

Tho maybe there's just indifferent to the bad press/PR.
So they actually did, thing is that most people became aware by other people (such as the typical social media and youtube grifters) misconstruing it instead of going to the announcement.

store.steampowered.com

HELLDIVERS™ 2 - HELLDIVERS™ 2 Account Linking Update - Steam News

UPDATE 5/6/2024: Helldivers fans -- we’ve heard your feedback on the Helldivers 2 account linking update. The May 6 update, which would have required Steam and PlayStation Network account linking for new players and for current players beginning May 30, will not be moving forward. We’re still...
 

Fabs

Member
Aug 22, 2019
1,911
Let's Hope Arrowhead gets funding from someone else next game. There goes all of Sonys PC goodwill
 

Ingueferroque

Banned
Dec 26, 2023
1,786
New York, NY
Ouch, 23% negative now. What a fk up man lol. Sony what you doing ma boy??

This really isn't on Sony. (Except for the part about selling the game in regions where PSN isn't available, but we all know that's NOT why this frothing mob is angry)

lol at guam and puerto rico being on the list because people not from either were posting about PSN being unavailable because they didnt select US and then guam or puerto rico as the territory. like its very unfortunate and unfair for people living there but god is it funny

Massive L for Valve for including that, then.

Let's Hope Arrowhead gets funding from someone else next game. There goes all of Sonys PC goodwill

Nah, Sony are fine. We're talking about 62k angry reviews - Helldivers 2 sold millions on PC.

So they actually did, thing is that most people became aware by other people (such as the typical social media and youtube grifters) misconstruing it instead of going to the announcement.

store.steampowered.com

HELLDIVERS™ 2 - HELLDIVERS™ 2 Account Linking Update - Steam News

UPDATE 5/6/2024: Helldivers fans -- we’ve heard your feedback on the Helldivers 2 account linking update. The May 6 update, which would have required Steam and PlayStation Network account linking for new players and for current players beginning May 30, will not be moving forward. We’re still...

That's what this is - just like the Dragon's Dogma 2 situation. Rage baiting social media posts lacking context that rile people up.
 

Yzec

Member
Dec 11, 2019
271
Belgium
This is like totally to be expected right? People flood Steam's manual refund review system, a lot of people are allowed their refund because PSN isn't available in their region but Valve isn't gonna allow the sale of it either then. This had to happen the second refunds were started to be given out.
 

Askherserenity

Prophet of Truth - Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,114
Sony just handled all this terribly. Don't know how y'all out here defending them, telling people to make a PSN account when their country isn't even supported just so Sony could get there MAUs up. How the fuck is Sony even selling the game in those countries in the first place if they required a PSN account?
 

dex3108

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,227
Just because you CAN make an account if you live in a country that doesn't support PSN by lying doesn't mean that everything is all good. Especially because I'm sure there's some BS in the Sony TOS that states you can be banned for something like that. Steam and Sony def shouldn't have allowed this to be sold in territories not supported. This is 100% up to Sony to fix this shit up.

ToS explicitly says that you need to make account in your country/region of residence and that country/region then can't be changed.
 

Vexii

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,481
UK
Just because you CAN make an account if you live in a country that doesn't support PSN by lying doesn't mean that everything is all good. Especially because I'm sure there's some BS in the Sony TOS that states you can be banned for something like that. Steam and Sony def shouldn't have allowed this to be sold in territories not supported. This is 100% up to Sony to fix this shit up.
But a rep said it was fine! Ignore the fact that Sony can suspend your account for not providing accurate personal information, I'm sure that part is just a joke 🫠
 

Nzyme32

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,323
Man I'd be so pissed if I worked for Arrowhead. One of the biggest feel good stories in gaming in a long time and suddenly someone else goes and fucks it up for you for no reason.

Yeah, must be pretty frustrating to have another party effectively cast their shadow over your efforts and not really have a way to course correct without their decision making.

I've said this in threads Before but Sony would not want to invest in PC unless it fits in with a wider growth strategy.

In the short term I imagine this will be mandatory accounts, but in the longer term they will pursue their own launcher. Their business model thrives off of the 30% cut that they receive from third parties, they would not forgo that unless they anticipated wider growth. It might be 10 years from now but they will have their own launcher.

Also the PSN account requirement is super weird when it's applied post-hoc like this, really poor optics but I do suspect it has a lot of benefits when it comes to cross platform play and interaction, as well as cross save. Playing with PC players on PS5 has not been without its issues, and features like their upcoming invite link feature designed for discord will work much better with people under one ID system. I think the main issue here is how this is being handled post release.

Lots of these companies have switched back to being on Steam whilst having account linking to effectively meet the players they can't reach where they are already, for as frictionless a process as they can vs how the older "launchers" approach has failed. I think only Ubi and RSSC are left on that front.
Account linking is their route for both attaching these players to their wider ecosystem and trying to retain them.
I'm certain they will have their own app/launcher along the way same as MS and many others, and find ways to offer recurring revenue services/subs and games through there, but it will ultimately be an additional option rather than the "launchers" of old attempting exclusivity, which hasn't worked out on PC.
That's why account linking is at is currently is.

For this current topic though, it's pretty irrelevant. The whole issue is around player response to a sudden change which isn't documented particularly well.
I myself didn't even know account linking was shut off. I just assumed it was working since I previously linked my account.
For my friends in Isle of Man and Guernsey, it was working so no one questioned it. Now they might not be able to play, but we don't really know that yet.
To me it seems more a poor communication issue. Also seems at least from some of the reviews, some people don't even know what data would be involved.

From my perspective I'm mostly fine with account linking so long as I have some control over what is sent and whatever implementation is used is light and frictionless - which has been my experience to date with PS games on PC at least. With account linking in Steam, from the Steam side at least the data given out is pretty limited. From the game itself however iirc it's just "minimal / diagnostic" or "full" as your choices.
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
45,498
Let's Hope Arrowhead gets funding from someone else next game. There goes all of Sonys PC goodwill

Honestly, it is very possible that now Arrowhead wants to get out of any deal with Sony ASAP lol

I could see HD2 support being cut very short.

And now every studio making a Sony GAAS is likely losing their mind right now.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,023
I had to do a bit of background reading, when did Valve implement its refund policy and what - if any - particular game/event/etc was the one that could have been pointed to as a flashpoint of sorts?

For instance, the argument of "We do not do business there so your law does not apply to us" seems to have been abandoned.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,070
People don't want to make accounts for products that don't require them, and being upset about that is perfectly reasonable
Let's be real, almost every game out there could be working perfectly fine without an additional account if their publishers wanted to. But companies want their metrics. And everybody does it, and everyone accepted this ages ago. The only real problem here is Sony's Legendary Incompetence™ with anything involving some servers and routers. It's like they feel proud in sucking at everything online, be it the technology itself, their policies, PR or whatever, and now they're paying the price.
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
28,047
For the love of God Sony should have solved issue of country support before asking players to make an account. Stop putting blame on users for corporate BS.
Pretty much. Telling people to make an account in a different territory and hope sony never changes their stance on PSN accounts in different regions doesn't exactly strike me as the most consumer friendly option.
 

nDesh

The Three Eyed Raven
Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,175
User Banned (2 Weeks): Trolling
Sony fucked up by not knowing that gamers are the dumbest people of the planet, now the game is ruined, congrats to everyone.
 

AshenOne

Member
Feb 21, 2018
6,330
Pakistan
This is like totally to be expected right? People flood Steam's manual refund review system, a lot of people are allowed their refund because PSN isn't available in their region but Valve isn't gonna allow the sale of it either then. This had to happen the second refunds were started to be given out.
Valve isn't restricting the game's purchase for God's sakes. IT IS SONY's people on Steam's Back end doing it. They manually themselves do it. They are incharge of their own game's settings on Steam's Back end.
 
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Red Kong XIX

Red Kong XIX

Member
Oct 11, 2020
9,035
Lots of these companies have switched back to being on Steam whilst having account linking to effectively meet the players they can't reach where they are already, for as frictionless a process as they can vs how the older "launchers" approach has failed. I think only Ubi and RSSC are left on that front.
Account linking is their route for both attaching these players to their wider ecosystem and trying to retain them.
I'm certain they will have their own app/launcher along the way same as MS and many others, and find ways to offer recurring revenue services/subs and games through there, but it will ultimately be an additional option rather than the "launchers" of old attempting exclusivity, which hasn't worked out on PC.
That's why account linking is at is currently is.
I don't' even think they'll ever pursue their own launcher, honestly. Them using account linking instead seems like a "lesson learned" from other publishers who tried the same and ultimately failed.
 

Rowsdower

Shinra Employee of The Wise Ones
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
17,432
Canada
But a rep said it was fine! Ignore the fact that Sony can suspend your account for not providing accurate personal information, I'm sure that part is just a joke 🫠

The fucked up thing is this was Sony's "official" policy. They told numerous people to break their TOS if PSN wasn't in your region. The honestly did not care how many accounts you had or what regions you were in.

Hell, my UK account, which I've had for ten years, the first and last name is The Queen. Sony has done jack about it.
 
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