Honkai: Star Rail 2.0 |OT| Tick-Tock! Come Dream With Us!
- Thread starter SubvertedTrope
- Start date
- OT
For a dream land story they sure went with the obvious never ending dream plot line. The murder mystery had me thinking there would be something else to it. I saw this exact same thing done much better not long ago in a certain Atlus game which I won't name because I don't wanna put a spoiler in a spoiler
Event will make Robin contribute more self and team damage while her buffs are up, Bronya's will make her ult come online faster. If you're running Robin without a FUA team or Huohuo/Tingyun to boost her energy you'd probably rather have Bronya's.
Act 1
Ode to agreeing
In the past, something happened which relates to the subject at hand...
I think I'm most of the way through the 2.2 story now, I have a quick question.
Should I be using HMC? I have made a quick team around them, not super effective though so I keep swapping back to my usual teams. Unsure if the last battles are going to be built around their mechanics though.
You can spoiler tag the answer if needed.
Should I be using HMC? I have made a quick team around them, not super effective though so I keep swapping back to my usual teams. Unsure if the last battles are going to be built around their mechanics though.
You can spoiler tag the answer if needed.
So then are we to assume that (late story spoilers)
the dream version we experienced is mostly a reflection of the events that happened in actual reality in the past, shaped by our memories?
Also what did black swan mean by everything we experienced was real? Or is what I wrote above what she meant?
Wondering because if everything we experienced was a dream that would remove a lot of the impact of what happened.
Also what did black swan mean by everything we experienced was real? Or is what I wrote above what she meant?
Wondering because if everything we experienced was a dream that would remove a lot of the impact of what happened.
If there is a fight you are required to use a character for, there will be a trail version of the character to use, so don't worry about needing to build specific characters for required fights.
Dreams are real, that is the crux of the problem and the main conflict by the end.
per Firefly we play the 12 loop of the dream
Sunday's goal being "let's make everyday Sunday" is so delightfully dumb I love it. Makes me wonder if he was actually born with this name or did he change his name later.
He should've led with that instead of all these trauma dumping and freedom/cage speech and I'd be fully on board.
He should've led with that instead of all these trauma dumping and freedom/cage speech and I'd be fully on board.
Of course! but before that I have a story to tell you, you see once upon a time there was a bird...Come on, Vylash. Write that fire explanation.
New MoC was easy
Although the Kafka side felt like the devs were going 'oh you think Fu Xuan's 1-time CC block is more useful than 50% eff res? How about every mob just throw out CC all the fucking time?' (still easy but definitely malded when it cost me at least 1 cycle)
anyway huo huo stonks (i don't have her)
Although the Kafka side felt like the devs were going 'oh you think Fu Xuan's 1-time CC block is more useful than 50% eff res? How about every mob just throw out CC all the fucking time?' (still easy but definitely malded when it cost me at least 1 cycle)
anyway huo huo stonks (i don't have her)
I don't understand what the basis for thinking this is. It's not how I took it at all.
one of the first things that happens in 2.0 is Misha meets us at the Reverie which is in reality. But Misha can't actually be in reality, which means when we experience it we're already inside the dream
When the Trailblazer and their crew first stepped foot onto Penacony and entered the hotel, Misha was there to greet them. Since he can only exist in the dreamscape and not reality, it would have had to already be a dream at that time.
So yeah, basically everything in 2.2 (up until you defeat Sunday) is/was a dream.
So yeah, basically everything in 2.2 (up until you defeat Sunday) is/was a dream.
Lord Sunday please grant me the strength to forgive those who speak ill against you while shielding their ears, slandering your holy majesty as they fall deeper into misunderstanding and fear. Bless them with hope and joy, so that they may repent rather than seek to destroy. Carry me to bright dreams of paradise on silver wings, away from the chaos such destruction brings. Speak endlessly if you wish and I'll stand in awe, bathed in light, awaiting the day your banner graces us with its might. Amen. 🙏
... that's it, I am going back to sleep.
I think technically it's kind of an....
inception situation.
There are multiple layers to Penacony - the overarching 'reality' of the Reverie hotel (and likely, most/all of Penacony as a planet/system has become intermingled/interwoven with Ena's 'Order-dream' infection, so as soon as we step foot onto Penacony into the Reverie Hotel (and see Misha), the 'Dream Reality' of Ena's Order has affected us - I think that BS/Acheron even infer that as soon as the TB has their strange dream right when the warp ends, and is forcibly woken up by Acheron, that's part of it.
Then the 'dream within a dream' of the 'ACTUAL' dreamworld still occurs as normal through 2.0-2.2, until we get 'ejected' from Ena's order dream thanks to BS telling us about our memories/the light cone being blank.
I don't think the game is saying, or at least intending to say, that all of the stuff we went through was 'fake' in the typical dream context
There are multiple layers to Penacony - the overarching 'reality' of the Reverie hotel (and likely, most/all of Penacony as a planet/system has become intermingled/interwoven with Ena's 'Order-dream' infection, so as soon as we step foot onto Penacony into the Reverie Hotel (and see Misha), the 'Dream Reality' of Ena's Order has affected us - I think that BS/Acheron even infer that as soon as the TB has their strange dream right when the warp ends, and is forcibly woken up by Acheron, that's part of it.
Then the 'dream within a dream' of the 'ACTUAL' dreamworld still occurs as normal through 2.0-2.2, until we get 'ejected' from Ena's order dream thanks to BS telling us about our memories/the light cone being blank.
I don't think the game is saying, or at least intending to say, that all of the stuff we went through was 'fake' in the typical dream context
Finished 2.2 story as well, and while I don't feel like doing a major write up on it, i will say that...
Outside of that, a lot of messy dialogue and pacing issues still has this behind the straightforward Belobog storyline. Mass improvement over Loufu though, but that's not hard.
The fake out ending got me. I thought it was a flaccid as hell ending, but that was the point and we were s till in a dream. Good shit on the writers.
Outside of that, a lot of messy dialogue and pacing issues still has this behind the straightforward Belobog storyline. Mass improvement over Loufu though, but that's not hard.
It's all in the dream, yes. The entire Penacony story did not take place after the battle with Sunday though.
Right, but
I don't see why we'd think this is Ena's dream. Penacony is a dream world. Trailblazer finds themselves in a dream before they even get to the hotel. Memoria is everywhere and very strong there.
Ena's dream is specifically a blissful "everything is going great but there's no opportunity for striving or heroics" thing. That's what's indicated by the drugged-out "Satisfied" people. The alternative isn't reality -- that's not the disagreement between Sunday and Robin. The alternative is still a dream world but one that spans the range of human experience. The false dream that's imposed on you is the one you see after the fake ending -- where people act weird and (odd word here but) harmonious with no conflict.
I feel like reading everything since 2.0 as basically a hallucination triggered by Sunday raises a lot more questions than it answers. Like, he didn't have the power to do that before the Charmony festival, so what happened that got you there in the first place? Why does Ena's dream have Gallagher and Mikhail and Dreamflux Reef at all?
My read of the thing at the end is that Black Swan is able to realize that the dream extends to what was thought to be the fully-physical hotel, and that therefore what's going on could all still be a dream. Not that the entire thing was all the same dream, retroactively.
I thought Acheron made this pretty clear. She's not affected by Sunday's thing. So she wasn't present in the fake dream. But you see her in the hotel in 2.0.
Edit: Also, maybe an obvious point but the story's wrapped up and Sunday's thing is done, and we can still go back to everywhere in the dream and all the stuff that supposedly happened in 2.0-2.2 still happened. The only stuff that didn't actually happen as far as the world is still concerned is the post- first fight hotel sequence.
Ena's dream is specifically a blissful "everything is going great but there's no opportunity for striving or heroics" thing. That's what's indicated by the drugged-out "Satisfied" people. The alternative isn't reality -- that's not the disagreement between Sunday and Robin. The alternative is still a dream world but one that spans the range of human experience. The false dream that's imposed on you is the one you see after the fake ending -- where people act weird and (odd word here but) harmonious with no conflict.
I feel like reading everything since 2.0 as basically a hallucination triggered by Sunday raises a lot more questions than it answers. Like, he didn't have the power to do that before the Charmony festival, so what happened that got you there in the first place? Why does Ena's dream have Gallagher and Mikhail and Dreamflux Reef at all?
My read of the thing at the end is that Black Swan is able to realize that the dream extends to what was thought to be the fully-physical hotel, and that therefore what's going on could all still be a dream. Not that the entire thing was all the same dream, retroactively.
I thought Acheron made this pretty clear. She's not affected by Sunday's thing. So she wasn't present in the fake dream. But you see her in the hotel in 2.0.
Edit: Also, maybe an obvious point but the story's wrapped up and Sunday's thing is done, and we can still go back to everywhere in the dream and all the stuff that supposedly happened in 2.0-2.2 still happened. The only stuff that didn't actually happen as far as the world is still concerned is the post- first fight hotel sequence.
Last edited:
The whole "Death" reveal makes 2.0-2.1 even funnier in hindsight.
"Death? No that's just a bus we take to and from work. He's just a bit aggressive sometimes."
Aventurine made a super elaborate plan and even had to lure an emanator to "kill" him when he could just walk around in some shady parts of the town and he'd have gotten picked up easily lol.
I think Firefly said that she found a way to lure the meme out but I kinda forgot about Robin. Why did she get "killed"? Also, I don't remember but was that TB's room we found her "dead"? Why was she there if that's our room and if it's not, how did Aventurine get into the room and how did he find her? Did the meme kill her there? Can the meme even go to that zone?
Also, I've been wondering since 2.0 but how do the stowaways get into the dreamscape anyway? You have people spending their entire fortune to get in officially and even Firefly had to use someone like Silver Wolf (I think?) to get her in but then there are all these homeless or orphans just getting in and live inside the dream for most of their lives.
"Death? No that's just a bus we take to and from work. He's just a bit aggressive sometimes."
Aventurine made a super elaborate plan and even had to lure an emanator to "kill" him when he could just walk around in some shady parts of the town and he'd have gotten picked up easily lol.
I think Firefly said that she found a way to lure the meme out but I kinda forgot about Robin. Why did she get "killed"? Also, I don't remember but was that TB's room we found her "dead"? Why was she there if that's our room and if it's not, how did Aventurine get into the room and how did he find her? Did the meme kill her there? Can the meme even go to that zone?
Also, I've been wondering since 2.0 but how do the stowaways get into the dreamscape anyway? You have people spending their entire fortune to get in officially and even Firefly had to use someone like Silver Wolf (I think?) to get her in but then there are all these homeless or orphans just getting in and live inside the dream for most of their lives.
There's also Black Swan saying that dream bleeds into reality or blend together or something and I took it as the writers saying "we don't fucking know so it's up to you to interpret however you want".
About Aventurine and Robin:
Aventurine says at the start of 2.1 that that wasn't actually Robin you saw but some kind of recreation he'd done. The exact circumstances and timing of her "death" are uncertain, I think.
But yes, it's pretty funny that Aventurine went to all this trouble to try to get to the deeper dream, and in the end he went too far and Acheron hit him so hard he was knocked out for a patch.
But yes, it's pretty funny that Aventurine went to all this trouble to try to get to the deeper dream, and in the end he went too far and Acheron hit him so hard he was knocked out for a patch.
About stowaways:
There are some readables you can get that make clear that lots of people enter the dreamscape without going through the hotel by rigging up bootleg dreampools in their ships while in-system, basically. These are supposed to be unreliable and dangerous. Sunday references this in talking about the guy who sold his kids and why actually letting him go wouldn't even work out great for him probably.
If you asked Acheron and Black Swan whether you went back to the beginning, they said everything you went through was real except for the contradiction.
I feel like people overly gas up belebog due to the vocal song at the boss battle. Outside of that you have a lot of paper thin characters and an underdeveloped villain. Only thing it's got going for it is how short it is, but that's only cause it was the first world in the game. I dont think people would be kind to it if it came out next.
Neat. But really, it seems way too easy (even if dangerous) for these people to get into this luxury place that you have to spend a fortune to get in from the front door. Though I guess they don't really care about those "slum" dreamscapes that much especially when you can get into them from anyway in the star system.
Talking about this made me think about another question I had:
Is Argenti an official guest? I'd assume so if he got that far into the audition without getting arrest but then he also went into the Reef and met Aventurine there. Why and How? Are we ever gonna get answer to this (and what Aventurine was doing there)? Aventurine companion quest? I guess 2.1 is almost like his companion quest that I kinda forgot he (and most of Penacony's characters) still hasn't gotten one.
Anyone tried out Super Break in MoC 12 yet? It was surprisingly F2P friendly on Kafka side, Gallagher/Luka/E0S0 Ruan Mei/HMC cleared it in 5 cycles.
To answer some of that part....Argenti, iirc, is mentioned as the 'red-haired champion', i.e. he was the winner the previous year, of the contest you and Firefly go through to get access to the concert hall.
He, at some point, went and rescued Aventurine - I thiiiiink it's before he fights you (or lets you pass), it comes up in his dialogue, I think?
Not 100% certain on that bit- I tuned out because his lines weren't voiced, lol
The plot wasn't anything special, but it helped a lot that it wasn't so damn wordy and it was very straightforward instead of everyone talking in riddles. I think Dan Heng and March also played off each other pretty well. Welt and Himeko don't feel like they've brought much to the table, and March on her own is either gratingly stating the obvious or just constantly annoyed at the TB being a weirdo.
As well you should. To quote the chaddest Dragon in existence:
"The rantings of an upjumped zealot make for tedious listening."
If there was anything disappointing about Penacony (which overall is fiiiire), it's that loser.
People like Belebog because short, direct, fun stories with cool climaxes are hoyoverse's wheelhouse, whatever crap they've been putting out since isn't it, hopefully the experiment is over
It feels far closer to what we usually get in HI3rd for the arc-ending songs.
I think it was only mentioned during the ending by Aventurine or other IPC folks. I don't remember Argenti himself talking about this at all (I think the first time they brought up Aventurine this patch was when you met him during the fake ending). They made it sound like he randomly stumbled upon Aventurine when he was in the Reef and we don't know why or how he was there in the first place.
I guess his EN VA wasn't available or something? He's voiced in JP.
I'll be honest, I agree with this. I wanted to agree with the others here since so many seem to be blown away by Penacony, and I just don't see it.
Don't get me wrong, as a whole the story is "fine", but I had bigger hopes and expectations after 2.0 ended. The story was a lot more simple and streamlined there, but they just had to keep taking things further and further with each subsequent patch, throwing in terms and names that you probably wouldn't know unless you live and breathe Simulated Universe and read every single one of the detailed notes scattered throughout the game. Also, the dialogue...God the dialogue. It just felt like it was going in circles at times (damn you, Sunday). How many times did we really need to see Robin holding the small bird talk about setting it free or caging it? I get it, it's a euphemism for Order and Sunday wanting to "protect" those in the "Cage" from harm and ill-pleasant feelings. I. Get. It. Once was enough, just please stop. It didn't help when the game just kept having cut-scene after cut-scene after cut-scene with little or no input from the player. For a lot of it, it was literally "Walk here, watch 15 minutes of cut-scenes, regain control of character, walk over here, talk with this person, and get another 15 minutes of cutscenes. Rinse and repeat. Which is okay, if the story and dialogue were interesting. But it kind of wasn't?
Visually, I loved Penacony. The dreamscapes were a pleasure to traverse with a lot of varied locations.
Character-wise, I loved Penacony. Acheron, Black Swan, Aventurine, Firefly and Hanabi were great. Even though the former two, especially Hanabi, were barely in it at all. Boothill was...eh. Fun I guess.
Story-wise, I COULD have loved Penacony, if they just cut down on 50% of all of the fluff and filler text. Trim the fat, focus on the important stuff, and give the story a brisk (not not too brisk) pace.
Similar to you, I really hope they go back to a more Belobog-style design for the next planet (which could be Edo Star). I'm going to be really disappointed if we get even more of a "word salad" for that one, since it's the planet I'm most excited for. Well, Edo Star or Punklorde.
Don't get me wrong, as a whole the story is "fine", but I had bigger hopes and expectations after 2.0 ended. The story was a lot more simple and streamlined there, but they just had to keep taking things further and further with each subsequent patch, throwing in terms and names that you probably wouldn't know unless you live and breathe Simulated Universe and read every single one of the detailed notes scattered throughout the game. Also, the dialogue...God the dialogue. It just felt like it was going in circles at times (damn you, Sunday). How many times did we really need to see Robin holding the small bird talk about setting it free or caging it? I get it, it's a euphemism for Order and Sunday wanting to "protect" those in the "Cage" from harm and ill-pleasant feelings. I. Get. It. Once was enough, just please stop. It didn't help when the game just kept having cut-scene after cut-scene after cut-scene with little or no input from the player. For a lot of it, it was literally "Walk here, watch 15 minutes of cut-scenes, regain control of character, walk over here, talk with this person, and get another 15 minutes of cutscenes. Rinse and repeat. Which is okay, if the story and dialogue were interesting. But it kind of wasn't?
Visually, I loved Penacony. The dreamscapes were a pleasure to traverse with a lot of varied locations.
Character-wise, I loved Penacony. Acheron, Black Swan, Aventurine, Firefly and Hanabi were great. Even though the former two, especially Hanabi, were barely in it at all. Boothill was...eh. Fun I guess.
Story-wise, I COULD have loved Penacony, if they just cut down on 50% of all of the fluff and filler text. Trim the fat, focus on the important stuff, and give the story a brisk (not not too brisk) pace.
Similar to you, I really hope they go back to a more Belobog-style design for the next planet (which could be Edo Star). I'm going to be really disappointed if we get even more of a "word salad" for that one, since it's the planet I'm most excited for. Well, Edo Star or Punklorde.
energy regen is just a really strong buff this round, even acheron benefits from it from everyone else feeding her stacks quicker. Those new dream/cage enemies have some real annoying effects, definitely they should be priority one to get rid of first on any stage. With robin out the element spread is obviously very kind to the fua team as well lol.
It really is Robin's worororold now
It really is Robin's worororold now
imo Robin is a good bit better. The ramp up of damage during her ult phase just blows mei out of the water. Mei is still probably the stronger overall character because of how universal she is but not for that team specifically. Cant go wrong with either really though, i guess robin frees up mei for your other team is one way to look at it.
I've been thinking about picking up Robin for my FUA team, now that I know my Break team will need Ruan Mei.
I'm still leaning against Robin for now, because Sparkle and/or Bronya can slot in for support on my FUA team pretty well. And if Robin seems like she'll be still worth it on her rerun, I'll pick her up then.
And hopefully they'll have a way to disable her song by then, too.
Robin can shave a cycle off MoC runs in a FUA team compared to Ruan Mei. In PF they are pretty comparable. Robin's personal damage is actually a pretty significant contributor to the team damage, which is why the difference is bigger in MoC than in PF.
But I do not think that is the main reason to pick Robin. Robin is valuable because she is significantly better than anyone other than Ruan Mei in dual dps compositions (where they have tradeoffs depending on situation). Do you plan to pick up Boothill or Firefly? Those 2 lose a lot more than normal from not being with Ruan Mei, because they rely on breaking enemies. What happens if you do not have Robin but field both a break team and a DoT team? Now your best DoT buffer is Asta, and the downgrade from Robin to Asta is enormous. Same problem if you want to run Break + FUA or FUA + DoT.
