I'll happily play a Final Fantasy singleplayer game set in Ivalice or Eorzea. Those are the two hands down best realized worlds of the series so far.
I hope for Final Fantasy 16 to come back to Ivalice. Or at least to come back to a believable and well-crafted world again
- Thread starter Dreamboum
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There is no reason why getting tackled by a giant, physically impossible monster wouldn't also immediately kill him, no?
Except he saw it coming and could brace/defend with magic. The fundamental difference with firearms is that you can't always see it coming and the bullet moves faster than sound. This is demonstrated beautifully in the FFXV prequel movie Kingsglaive.
I mean, almost all of King Regis' court was killed in less than 10 seconds via firearms. The strongest people in all of Noctis' kingdom. Dead in seconds. They couldn't cast protect fast enough. And the same should have been true for Noctis and party, especially in a world where Sniper Rifles exist.
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The difference is that Ivalice actually evolved and has a legacy and is Square's only persistent world. It is also well received, and comes from several games that are million sellers.
Ivalice is also the world in which two of the games are known to have had earned a perfect score on Famitsu and stands as two of the most critically well received in the history of the company.
That's why people wants Ivalice and not Gaia. One has potential and has expressed itself in several games, the others doesn't exist outside of the games they come from
My one criticism of Ivalice is that I don't think it's varied or colourful enough. Outside of the Golmore Jungle, it's basically all desert or plains with varying shades of brown and green and a bit of blue in the underground caverns.
I now consider Hydaelyn as the gold standard for Final Fantasy game worlds. Nothing comes close to it in terms of history, lore, and worldbuilding. But being an ongoing game, it has a very unfair advantage.
I now consider Hydaelyn as the gold standard for Final Fantasy game worlds. Nothing comes close to it in terms of history, lore, and worldbuilding. But being an ongoing game, it has a very unfair advantage.
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Thank you. It's a good point.
Ivalice is a great drawing board you can expand upon. So people saying it is sci-fi (which is like, wrong) have to know they can go back to medical fantasy of high fantasy at any point because Ivalice is just something that has a history you can tap into to make things more fascinating. And it's a history that was told through games, not just ultimania guides, so it is always interesting to see where they could go with this
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That was 20 years ago though. When having a perfect score was actually an event and a huge rarity
The Salikawood, Phon Coast, Feywood, the Great Crystal, Sochen Cave Palace or the High Waste are all wonderful non desert or plains areas. Plus they felt like they could realistically exist alongside each other which gave Ivalice a real sense of place.
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That's a great post and I agree 100% and it is a big reason I want to come back to this. It's a world that is bound by systems and the people living there are part of those systems that informs who they are, how they speak and how they act to a certain degree.
Ivalice excels at providing that because the architects behind Ivalice shaped it not like a playground but z set of rules that allows them to provide context that is central to the development of characters rather than breaking those rules whenever they saw fit for the sake of fun, or story development. They worked around the world they had built, they didn't change the world itself when they had to made changes to things
Also why do people straight up ignore the tons of "sci-fi" elements in earlier Final Fantasy games?
Every Final Fantasy game has featured airships, a technology that we humans didn't develop until the early 20th century. VI was steampunk with a lot of advanced technology. IV and V had straight up space travel. IV even opens with a show of how one nation achieved military superiority by having a dominant air force. I understand what people mean when they say they don't want something like XIII or XV that are pretty much modern day or near-future, but the classic Final Fantasy setting was definitely never strictly "medieval." They've always been retro-futuristic.
I think that one of the most interesting things about Final Fantasy games have been that the existence of magic has far-reaching implications for the technology and warfare of the time. Like, how much of a wrench would it through into our timeline if 500 years before Thomas Edison was even born, people could simply use magic to illuminate rooms and cities?
Every Final Fantasy game has featured airships, a technology that we humans didn't develop until the early 20th century. VI was steampunk with a lot of advanced technology. IV and V had straight up space travel. IV even opens with a show of how one nation achieved military superiority by having a dominant air force. I understand what people mean when they say they don't want something like XIII or XV that are pretty much modern day or near-future, but the classic Final Fantasy setting was definitely never strictly "medieval." They've always been retro-futuristic.
I think that one of the most interesting things about Final Fantasy games have been that the existence of magic has far-reaching implications for the technology and warfare of the time. Like, how much of a wrench would it through into our timeline if 500 years before Thomas Edison was even born, people could simply use magic to illuminate rooms and cities?
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I genuinely don't understand people claiming a return to high fantasy as if FFXII isn't. The textbook medieval fantasy story is also FF Tactics, another Ivalice game.
People forgets that games like FFIV you go to the moon with a futuristic airship. They're clamoring for something the series have never provided outside of like, FFV
People forgets that games like FFIV you go to the moon with a futuristic airship. They're clamoring for something the series have never provided outside of like, FFV
It's been a very long time, since i played FFXII, but i don't remember that world being that good. On the Artworks it looks really cool, but all i can remember is desert, more brown/yellish places, and that's it xD.
It would be nice to see, what they could do with the Ivalice on NextGen, but i would rather prefer a new world.
It would be nice to see, what they could do with the Ivalice on NextGen, but i would rather prefer a new world.
Something entirely new, as much as I like Ivalice and XII.
One of my favourite things of the series is getting to know a new world and cast every entry (which is why I really dislike sequels to numbered FFs). As exciting as the prospect would still be, I don't want to watch the announcement trailer and go "oh, it's Ivalice". I want to be curious about the setting in more than just "I wonder how they're gonna update it for PS5 and this particular era".
This hasn't really happened since 2006 (if we disregard MMOs), because XV was set in a world we more or less knew things about and VII-R is a remake. Same reason I don't want Agni's Philosophy to be XVI (apart from the fact that I think it's boring and bland beyond a few designs or concepts here and there).
Not European Middle Ages as the biggest inspiration either if possible. There are more cultures and eras to draw inspiration from.
One of my favourite things of the series is getting to know a new world and cast every entry (which is why I really dislike sequels to numbered FFs). As exciting as the prospect would still be, I don't want to watch the announcement trailer and go "oh, it's Ivalice". I want to be curious about the setting in more than just "I wonder how they're gonna update it for PS5 and this particular era".
This hasn't really happened since 2006 (if we disregard MMOs), because XV was set in a world we more or less knew things about and VII-R is a remake. Same reason I don't want Agni's Philosophy to be XVI (apart from the fact that I think it's boring and bland beyond a few designs or concepts here and there).
Not European Middle Ages as the biggest inspiration either if possible. There are more cultures and eras to draw inspiration from.
It's a testament to the richness of the world of Ivalice that it was able to tie together the two worlds of Tactics and FFXII, despite each being really quite different both in terms of characters, locations, races and monsters, art and world design, their contradictory lore and narrative approaches, simply by re-using a few summons and slapping a few familiar terms in the marketing. Such a contrast to the rest of the Final Fantasy series.
I don't think Square Enix has the gumption to attempt the following idea nor the ability to pull it off successfully. However, I would absolutely love it if they diverted from full-blown 3D environments and enormous set pieces and summons and instead went for a highly stylized, traditional turn-based game that brings the concept art of the older games to life.
Give us smaller, heavily-detailed areas. Give us more areas. Give us the freedom to explore a beautiful world and have it be full of life. Hell, have it be isometric again. Basically give us the opposite of FFXV. Take the old style of the games and work the next-gen consoles to the bone to render the most detailed cities and locations in gorgeous isometric glory.
Give us smaller, heavily-detailed areas. Give us more areas. Give us the freedom to explore a beautiful world and have it be full of life. Hell, have it be isometric again. Basically give us the opposite of FFXV. Take the old style of the games and work the next-gen consoles to the bone to render the most detailed cities and locations in gorgeous isometric glory.
I found XII and its world to be dull and uninteresting. As others have said, it's time to revisit the FFIX style, but in a totally new and different world.
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The world of FFXII was already hinted at and put into lore in FFT. It was already shown in cutscenes how FFT's Ivalice was built on the remains of a technology-advanced civilization that was before the great cataclysm. FFXII also features St. Ajora and the light of Kiltia that are both featured in FFT and showcases as the why the events of FFT could have happened through the Empire's action in destroying the last bastion of the benevolent light of Kiltia and allowing the separate sect of St. Ajora to thrive with the church of Glabados (which is at the center of FFT)
This is simply wrong. Hironobu Sakaguchi personally approved Final Fantasy XII to be directed by Matsuno and supervised by his team. Why would they just use for marketing purposes? As if Ivalice was a Squaresoft powerhouse name.
Well you are wrong and your opinion is bad :p
And this is coming from someone who is currently wrapping up Zodiac Age on my Switch
Still an amazing game and one of the best FF's ever made. It holds up amazingly well and has been immensely satisfying to complete from a gameplay perspective
That said... As much as I love Ivalice...
The very people that made it something special in the first place will most likely not be the ones making the next generation of games. I would be happy for 16 to simply take inspiration from some of the best elements of Ivalice and incorporate that into something new
Hope dies last OP. Ivalice is done outside of crossovers and i can live without it but a true fantasy game with a wide-open world is what I think FFXVI should go for. See you in.... I don't know. 2024? Later?
Lightning became a RL fashion model lvl 99 Pixel. That trilogy. What a ride on a derailed train but I like FF XV: Royal Edition.
I don' think there is a FF game where I found the world's lack of believably was a mark against it. FF12 has one of the least believable worlds in the series, but I still loved that game.
Well, they did come up with the label "Ivalice Alliance" for marketing purposes, even went as far as retconning Vagrant Story into it, so yeah, kinda.
Thank you. I personally don't like traditional fantasy much so I love the magitek/sci-fi elements. VI was my first FF and my favorite parts of the earlier games were the ancient civilizations and going to the Moon and so on. Ivalice is a great mesh of magitek and fantasy.
New FF, new world. Period. Also I have no idea why you're citing Famitsu. You do know XIII-2 got a perfect score from them as well? And plenty of FF's have sold better than any Ivalice game?
As I said in another post, it's always only Ivalice stans that ask for new FF's to be set in the same world; fans of other FF's never do this. It's annoying. It's not even that unique (and even if it was, I'd still want a new world with every mainline game).
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Ivalice Alliance only became a term in 2007 though. Kawazu coined it when he became a producer in 2005
Your condescension is ridiculous. You don't need to interact if you're not willing to engage. Everything I've said is literally visible and written in both games.
None of your contributions have been interesting. You're just trying to be smarmy because you have absolutely no relevant rebuttals.
People wants different things, believe it or not. Fans wants to come back to Ivalice and that's perfectly fine for them because it is a persistent world that is known for its intricate world-building and people associates with complex geo-political stories that they enjoy.
I've cited Famitsu because it was still a big event at the time the scores were assigned and a huge rarity. I've already said this in another post.
From 1986 to 2006 only *six* games were awarded a perfect score and Vagrant Story + FF12 were a part of it. FFXIII-2 is a 2012 game, by that time 18 games were awarded a perfect score. Context and time matters in this case.
Probably because the worldbuilding of Ivalice -- in either era -- stands head and shoulders above the rest of the games, for which worldbuilding usually wasn't a huge priority. Even FFX's Spira, which was one of the more unique settings, only had worldbuilding insofar as it directly informed the main story -- look beyond that, and there are major holes and inconsistencies.
Ivalice is also one of the relatively few Final Fantasy worlds where the the player doesn't explore the entire globe. There's a huge amount left to see without recycling.
It's easy to reduce people's validity by referring to them as "Ivalice stans," but I say all this as a fan of most Final Fantasies.
Literally always only Ivalice stans who do this. It feels like an English teacher meme "this character's blue clothing is a metaphor for the struggle they had to endure and it ties into every interaction"
Everything Dreamboum said is directly supportable by text. You guys are insufferable.
Dreamboum If you're as big a fan of Final Fantasy XII and Ivalice as you say then you'll already know the inconsistencies and mental gymnastics you have to play to weave the Ivalice stories into a single narrative. And even then you have to ignore major issues. You bring up Ajora but his existence in both the histories of XII and Tactics contradicts the idea that XII is the ancient technologically advanced civilisation before the calamity. References to Riskbreakers and Leamonde millennia before they supposedly exist turns that on its head. The existence of Goug in both the Ivalice of XII and Tactics also contradicts this. Not to mention the fact that Balthier appears in Tactics, presented as a canon-storyline character.
The truth is that most Ivalice games actually take place at around the same time. It's just the developers never cared to make a world with a consistent narrative or world.
The truth is that most Ivalice games actually take place at around the same time. It's just the developers never cared to make a world with a consistent narrative or world.
The Final Fantasy series is known for having a completely new setting with every mainline game, and you're asking to break that.
The stuff you're stating about Ivalice isn't unique and can be done in a new world. I'm sure there can be a new mainline FF with a politically-focused story in a new world.
And not sure why you're still insisting on randomly using Famitsu as if it means anything. Every FF has received perfect scores and FFXII isn't the only FF with a Metacritic in the 90's. If that's supposed to be reason for SE to revisit it, it isn't. If anything, sales would entice a revisit and FFXII isn't one of the best sellers in the series.
..."Nice fanfiction" indeed.
There is literally nothing to support this idea, and much to categorically disprove it. FFXIV's depiction of Ivalice is not canon. It's not the same Ivalice. It's celebratory fanservice.
Anyway, to answer the question: hell no. We're already revisiting old worlds via the FFVII remake next year (plus it's getting multiple parts) so I don't want the next world in a mainline FF game to be one we've already been to before - especially when it was one we had only 3 mainline titles ago. That's not a long time. At all. We should be encouraging SE to try new things, not recycle old stuff smh.
It was still used for marketing purposes, that was my point.
Yes! I love Ivalice in FF12. I really want to see what happens to the characters and world after that game. It's a shame we never got a sequel.
The FF series is at a point now, though, where that isn't really true anymore. We've had a number of mainline sequel games, a very popular ongoing online FF with expansions continually coming out, and FF7R is the most anticipated Final Fantasy thing coming out, point blank. It isn't exactly an iron rule, and creating new worlds seems to be making for longer delays and diminishing returns (see FF15).
With that said, I want to restate that Ivalice is more of a framework and a style for the artwork and game mechanics, which I compared to a game system like Dungeons & Dragons, which can be worked into a variety of things. Ivalice games aren't direct sequels to each other, and deliberately jump around a vague timeline to do different things with the setting, characters and game mechanics.
You gave examples that were fanservice rather than canon. FFXIV's Ivalice is neither FFT nor FFXII's Ivalice, but rather non-canon celebrations of them. Balthier's presence in War of the Lions is, again, time traveling fan service rather than canon for FFXII's Balthier. This is abundantly clear by Cloud's hodgepodge characterization in FFT.
I didn't mention XIV at all. I was talking only about actual Ivalice games. And Balthier having to be classified as non-canon despite no evidence of this being the case was part of the mental athletics I was talking about. Oh and Cloud is canon; it's just not THE Cloud.
I'm obviously not referring to sequels or remakes. Name two mainline games that take place in the same world.
FFXV taking place in a new world has absolutely nothing to do with its development woes. Using that logic why did FFXII go through numerous delays and a director change even though it takes place in an already established world?