If you think The Last Jedi is a worse movie than Attack of the Clones, you can't be taken seriously.
IO9: Rian Johnson Is OK With the Possibility of Star Wars: Episode IX Retconning The Last Jedi
- Thread starter Yukari
- Start date
If you think The Last Jedi is a worse movie than Attack of the Clones, you can't be taken seriously.
It is. I mean you definitely care if you came into a thread on the topic no?
Kevin Feige could plan 25 movies
Zack Snyder could plan like 4
These folk couldnt een do 3?
I both agree with you but simultaneously would prefer to hate-watch AoTC for the laughs and awfulness than watch TLJ straight
Imagine thinking something as ridiculous as this.
You would think after all this time, the more hyperbolic and embarrassing TLJ posts would lessen but apparently not.
Where did I say that? I didn't mention the quality of Episode IX once. I said Rian Johnson doesn't care if anything from The Last Jedi sticks in Episode IX and that's true. Abrams could retcon everything that happens, bring back Snoke and Luke and make Rey the daughter of Yoda, and Johnson wouldn't care.
That lack of interest in his own work is a shame because regardless of whether I like the movie or not, it does some things very well and I shouldn't care more than he does that certain things are kept.
Yeah, it makes sense when you look at it purely as a business decision. Can't really fault that at all and if it means his own trilogy is entirely his, that can only be a good thing and should guarantee it's a much more coherent and focused piece overall.
Just kind of a shame that he isn't as passionate about this movie as the people that defend it. Not sure you can even defend some of those choices if the guy that made them doesn't care if they're kept.
Dude, no.
I am very critical of TLJ and can see it has a myriad of flaws, but even I know better.
The movie is mostly solid, with some very weak spots. To say it's the "worst" of the bunch when Attack of the Clones exists...yeah, that's some really really questionable taste.
Some movies start from a desire to tell a story and have a strong artistic urge to create. It's from that vision that will put butts in seats and satisfy investors. mother! for example was definitely born from Aronofskys mind and sure to challenge audiences. Other films, particularly franchise films like Star Wars, Avengers, Harry Potter, are ways to ensure profit and offset losses on riskier films.
I get what you're both saying. And I think they had a plan/outline from the start, which is mostly still the same, but sometimes things change :/
After TLJ had to stuggle to make up for TFA's failures (and was largely successful imo), it'd be a damn shame if they came back and dragged everything back down again. It's good that these movies are made as their own things and are given the opportunity to go in different directions, but the idea of doing something like "actually turns out she's a Skywalker or a Kenobi or something after all! Don't forget, not everyone can be Spider-Man!" is just disheartening
The idea of retconning TLJ is honestly ludicrous to me. TLJ's problems (and I say this as someone who really liked TLJ) are on a micro scale - the movie struggling to execute its own ideas within its own narrative. To outright retcon TLJ suggests that these ideas are faulty on a macro scale, as in in the context of the whole franchise.
And sure, we could reverse course and have Rey actually be Luke's long-lost daughter or something like that, and have Snoke still be alive and be the master villain, and have Kylo Ren still be redeemable, and not have Leia have Force powers (not that it matters because Leia's going to be written dead anyway).
Or we could just.....not.
And sure, we could reverse course and have Rey actually be Luke's long-lost daughter or something like that, and have Snoke still be alive and be the master villain, and have Kylo Ren still be redeemable, and not have Leia have Force powers (not that it matters because Leia's going to be written dead anyway).
Or we could just.....not.
Pretty much. If JJ can fix this series while simultaneously make it cohesive, it would be one of the greatest feats of directing of the last 20 years.
If he ignores TLJ and makes half of the fans happy the folks that liked 8 will be mad and vice versa. It feels like an impossible task.
There is nothing to fix. And he isn't going to retcon anything.
I am no big fan and think it sucked. SW has become boring. Been boring since the awful prequels. JJ did the best out them other than the OT.
Of course he'll retcon the parents thing.
Kylo is a liar and he wants Himself to be the most important thing in the Universe to Rey he clouded her thoughts, thats why I think Snoke is a lie manifested by Kylo also.
Snoke is from Bens imagination to decieve the first order, to decieve the Knights of Ren to make him look the most important always, to Rey like I mentioned, to Luke and everyone else in the Galaxy, think about it without Snoke's approval how would Kylo be the Master of the Knights of Ren? how would he be anything to anyone especially given his temper issues, his insecurities and so on by using an Avatar/Projection of a Emperor like character that gives him approval over the others.
Snoke is probably Projection like in The Wizard of Oz & Ben is the little man behind the curtain, that's why Snoke was not important and Ben projects his internal conflicts through the Snoke Avatar too.
It just makes sense to me that way.
Maybe just maybe the Real Snoke does show up maybe with the Knights of Ren and then makes Kylo look like the amateur he is, the oathetic child.
So will we then have a scene of Kylo and First order fight against Snoke & Knights of Ren? or do we keep Snoke as an illusion that never existed and just the Knights themselves who figured out Snoke never existed still go after Kylo for that very reason.
Kylo is a liar and he wants Himself to be the most important thing in the Universe to Rey he clouded her thoughts, thats why I think Snoke is a lie manifested by Kylo also.
Snoke is from Bens imagination to decieve the first order, to decieve the Knights of Ren to make him look the most important always, to Rey like I mentioned, to Luke and everyone else in the Galaxy, think about it without Snoke's approval how would Kylo be the Master of the Knights of Ren? how would he be anything to anyone especially given his temper issues, his insecurities and so on by using an Avatar/Projection of a Emperor like character that gives him approval over the others.
Snoke is probably Projection like in The Wizard of Oz & Ben is the little man behind the curtain, that's why Snoke was not important and Ben projects his internal conflicts through the Snoke Avatar too.
It just makes sense to me that way.
Maybe just maybe the Real Snoke does show up maybe with the Knights of Ren and then makes Kylo look like the amateur he is, the oathetic child.
So will we then have a scene of Kylo and First order fight against Snoke & Knights of Ren? or do we keep Snoke as an illusion that never existed and just the Knights themselves who figured out Snoke never existed still go after Kylo for that very reason.
Killing like instead of Leia, Snoke's death scene and lack of background, the sub light speed chase scene silliness, Canto bight, luke's Suicide via force projection fight scene, fin's love story arc, the space hacker, all that dumb stuff would be great if JJ somehow retconned it
Ehh, the SW movies from 20 years ago were even worse. the whole movie franchise is widely uneven
Ehhh, it's hardly even a retcon since we don't know for sure that Kylo Ren was telling the truth.
But some consistency movie to movie would be nice. I feel like this trilogy had 0 planning from the jump and they're just throwing together 3 movies rather than a cohesive trilogy.
But some consistency movie to movie would be nice. I feel like this trilogy had 0 planning from the jump and they're just throwing together 3 movies rather than a cohesive trilogy.
Wouldn't even have to be a retcon per se. Could just have been Kylo saying that to mess with Rey.
And I hope IX does retcon everything it can without it feeling forced. VIII was not a good direction for the trilogy to go.
And I hope IX does retcon everything it can without it feeling forced. VIII was not a good direction for the trilogy to go.
Rian Johnson is a fan of Star Wars, and one element he likes is the surprise that the series brings with each new entry. So, like a fan and a creative individual, he is excited to see how the next movie unfolds. If that means a different reveal of Rey's lineage than the what Kylo said in his film, then he's okay with that because that's the process. This isn't new by the way, Rian's explained before that he had Kylo say those lines as part of Rey's development for TLJ. He knew people could see Kylo has a liar but that Rey had to confront the possibility that her parents were not who she thought they were. And that's a theme throughout the saga. Luke had to come to terms with Vader being his father and not having to follow in his exact footsteps. I think Rey has a strong head on her shoulders and is equipped to deal with new information about her parents should it come along. It doesn't change her arc in TLJ, just her expected development in 9, and perception by fans of the reveal in TLJ. There is a way to make sense of her being related to older characters, that's what creative people do.
Rey is the first person that said her parents are nobody.
But from this flash back scene
I think that someone might take care Rey sometime before sent her to Unkar and left from Jakku for whatever reasons.
TLJ is fine and that would be a dumb thing to retcon. why do rey's parents have to be anyone? what's with this hereditary rule bullshit?
JJ wrote a line and then ran away from it.
Rian had to fix all his shit, this included and now JJ wants his cake.
I wouldn't view it as a retcon if one or both of her parents were revealed to be someone special. All we have to go on is Kylo's word, and since when was he the most trustworthy person in the galaxy?
Plans change behind the scenes all the time. That doesn't make them retcons.
Plans change behind the scenes all the time. That doesn't make them retcons.
Rey being a nobody was seriously the best part of the movie. Her being Lukes daughter is just some fan fiction wank.
So true. It's not only the worst Star Wars movie it's one of the worst movies ever made. You take the name Star Wars off that movie and people would have walked out of the theater.
It's kind of absurd that they didn't hire someone to write the overarching story before comitting to actually filming the movies. Sure, the original trilogy wasn't preplanned, but at least those movies had the same writer. I vastly preferred TLJ to Abrams remake of the first movie, so I sincerely hope he isn't afraid to actually continue down the road that we're on now. I also hope he can write an actual ending and resist the urge of creating even more asinine "mystery boxes".